|Paizo Pathfinder® Paizo Games|
|About Paizo Messageboards News Paizo Blog Help/FAQ|
So what if they kill Sandara?
Many ways to solve things, and above all not taking religion too seriously, specially when it's Besmara, the devil-may-care goddess.
Makes encounters blander, more difficult to prepare and design and widens the void between those with access to flight and those without.
Longer version, fly automatically destroys any encounter about terrain. Destroys any encounter with enemies without flight and without very strong range options. Destroys how believable many of the AP scenarios are, which can usually be solved by a smart use of flight.
Edit: I think using Fly should be a risk, I do not like the auto-levitate portion of the spell.
Demagogue Bard is a fantastic archetype for this...turns people against whatever you like and starts the fires no problem. Has the Charisma to pull off being manipulative and good at social interactions too. Has the skills to back it up, the escape mechanisms and an apt spell list to strengthen his role.
Had an NPC who kept washing up on the same shores after being killed. He would start his life anew, with all his memories, but his curse would slowly drive him insane, filling him with delusions of grandeur. Eventually he'd proclaim himself a living god. Then he'd get killed by either adventurers or him getting in too deep in hubris. Wake up on the shores..realise this will happen all over again and there is no escape. PCs had the option to help him out.
While they are good weapons (I think the GGuisarme is exotic though) I was referencing Swiss Mercenaries of a few centuries back in a bit of a tongue-in-cheek manner due to the thread name. However! I wrote a more concrete answer to go with it.
A few feats to consider:
You're going to need a Lucerne Hammer, perhaps a Glaive Guisarme. Feats like Lunge, Difficult Swings and the Improved Combat Maneuvres will be important. Medium armour is expected, though if you do go for light you can put it to being a rebellion fighter agaisnt the Hapsburg rather than an army or mercenary man from the later centuries.
Edit and on topic:
I would chose Human and for the feat get an extra revelation or a base feat that is a requirement that comes up often for the feat lines you want to use martial flexibility.
I would also consider looking into a way of giving people around you a Teamwork feat you posses - the combination with martial flex is then a lot of fun and powerful.
Knight Magenta wrote:
You're wondering if your AC is too high. Yes, probably, also this ability is out of whack unless it's a high level one.
Maybe it's early and I'm just not thinking correctly. I have a player who is playing an Oracle with the time mystery and two of his revelations are melee touch attacks. I know that when you use a touch spell you are considered armed and therefore do not provoke attacks of opportunity when trying to touch someone, but I wasn't sure about these melee touch attacks if they function the same way and also don't provoke attacks of opportunity .
They most likely work the same. Sorry no references. However it would be piss poor design to give a class an option to touch someone and get hit for it.
Su abilities generally do not provoke.
That Magic document wahahahahaa!
BigDTBone that's definitely the kind of system change I'd like to see, something that can be calculated easily and is open. The current system makes some players, specially veterans, get stuck into Standard-Move squareness that can sometimes threaten the bold/more imaginative options.
While we're at it, I would like to point out how a rules light-option light setting might differ and what I would look into a rules-light one.
When a player asks me if he can jump over the ledge, grab onto it, scurry to it's side, drop down to the balcony there behind the sniper aiming at a team member and trip him/disable him/point a gun pointblank a say "move and your brains'll do some out-door decor" I dont want to ask "did you take the Ledge Jumper Feat for the extra 7.3 feet, the Good Grip trait from Numerian Cat People Adventures, and the If I Shoot Point Blank It Actually Matters feat chain?". Sure, I can bend rules and omit some others, but then we're in 100% house rule territory, and we're talking about rule systems so everything can be standardised and therefore universally easy to assume things.
Question/Player - I would like to do this and that.
Answer - Roll X with Y modifiers and apply you Z to it. When XYZ are any number of dice, any fixed attribute, any spendable resource.
Yes it is simple, but with enough options that dont come down to "when they moon is half full apply +2 circumstance bonus if you're talking to butterfly people, round down, and if your bab is 14-28*2 then it is doubled but for rounds/level".
I admit that I dont know many systems apart from PF (Shadowrun, D&D), so I am open to suggestions! I heard the Starwars system is quite easy and with enough depth, albeit quite story-telling driven.
Last thread I was at the "hell no" camp. Now? I just introduced someone to Pathfinder who hadnt played ttrpgs. It wasnt easy...and it is much more to absorb than when I picked up PF 4 years ago; you can stay core only but since the rest of the table and the GM use most of the stuff it is a steep learning curve.
But..the money invested..and time.
My preference would be if they started a second system and setting that was completely different (sci fi, horror, whatever, just not fantasy) with a much simpler rule set and they kept that alive through APs, which is what makes Pathfinder so great.
1. Easy to learn/run without the obsessive number crunching (which I love but it's starting to get in the way). Intuitive, rules-lite.
2. APs and stories with PF quality so you can run things straight off it with its fantastic writing.
Eventually I think people would flock to this system, and then it's a question of transfering the rules from this system to the Golarion setting, and BOOM: step wise path to Pathfinder 2.0.
The "each with its own triggering event" line, to my readying, implies that you are allowed to have each shot trigger on different things, ex. 2 shot at casting, 1 shot at moving and another at the fighter for drawing a weapon.
It is a perk, not a limitation. Without this clause we could only assume that the 4 attacks MUST happen on the same trigger, since before this we've only ever had 1 readied action per turn. Therefore, yes, you can shoot 4 times for 1 triggering event, since each shot has the "shoot at X moment" trigger.
You're giving up a full attack and the possibility that your target does something different denying you your shot, or that your shot becomes impossible when it was possible on your turn (cover, allies, modifiers, you being affected by something else), denying you your attacks again. Big trade off.
The city of London thought it was a good idea to have all of its maps with Up being the way you are facing instead of North. What a mess, there is no standard there. I know how to read maps..part of my profession, and those give me nightmares. Is it supposed to be easier to the non map trained?
What I use is a transparent laminate with squares...and put it over the map I want. I can move the laminate to better orientate the lines (if the aforementioned glasswork building is diagonal...move the laminate and now it aligns.). And then I can draw on that too.
Water rules regarding cover are good. However, it should be partial-cover-total cover say at no depth, 5 feet, 10 feet.
When a water beast has attacked the party they've had to play smart, with readied actions. In this case I let them damage the tentacles as if it was the beast, but never kill it, just enough damage piled on to make it desist.
First time you mention PFS, many on these boards play at home games..the level 12 shouldve told me that though.
Shame 2handing doesnt work, wouldve been interesting to see more variations of the use of these feats.
PS. mentioned Myrmidarch before, but scrap that, standard actions and all that.
Warpriests probably get some of the best usage out of these feats.
Making sure :) I would then stick with my previous advice. Sometimes for my group archetypes or feats/class options can bring along a lot of RP potential or flavour to a game, but we are very much into mechanics as well as RP.
I would recommend looking at the NPC gallery and at the Barbarian/Fighter npcs for fairly straight forward combat option feats (i.e. Improved Will, Power Attack, etc). These fit your description because for GMing when you throw 7 NPCs at the players you dont want to have 7 intricate builds, just straight forward ones.
You can build a Barbarian that uses unarmed strikes and is simple by picking static rage powers, the only calculation needed is rage which is doable before the game and then lasts for a long time.
Erm...straight fighter. Improved Unarmed Strike. Go to town.
Weapon focus Unarmed Strike, Weapon Specialisation..unarmed Strike, Power Attack.
Too much math: Abadars feat that lets you take average damage each time you hit. Dont need to roll damage again. Cant remember the name.
Just to be clear, you are not asking for anything fun, just simple and good at hitting stuff.
The new feats are fun. A build I was tinkering with was a cleric .
Cleric, elemental domain, whatever domain.
The reason for cleric is that after playing as the only martial in a group I felt like the BMX Bandit. Finding something else to do with Standard actions would be fun...myrmidarch for example. Or with a move action, Freebooter!
Returning weapon: Bad enchantment as written, if you throw and move, you wont get your weapon back. Blink Back Belt!
PS: While Starfall is a cool name, the build itself is nothing special. It is just a standard throwing Startoss build with the obvious feat choices and nothing else going for it. Add some flare to it? Look into VMC choices since figthers can spare feats?
I'd like to highlight 2 things here:
1. Development as a step by step process, defined by time.
2. Magic circumvents step-by-step knowledge of technology.
Case study: Glass and the world
Relevancy: Magic is porcelain, technology is glass
Similarly, because you can create iron out of the arcane ley-line harry club smoking discontinuum, you would not need to develop ore refineries or such stuff. Therefore, your advancement relies solely on magical power.
-supply, demand, and more real worlds in here----
Add the fact that 10 wizards will probably go and monopolise the markets and make everyone else obsolete. This will create and environment where 1 nation/group/person doesnt have access to wizard iron defecation, and will look for an alternative because reasons/prices/revenge/loveinterests. Without the access to magic these guys either discover magic or start a step by step process of SCIENCE, B$@%$ES.
-Locke Lamora is hiding from these guys----
The magic people have limited ways to respond to this. Crush the opposition, anyone trying to do magic in the world besides you, making the step by step process miss a few steps and perhaps something not be discovered at all. Perhaps if we had never found how to make fossil fuels go boom we would've made something else and be much much farther ahead in technology than we are now and fossil fuels was our magic. Or perhaps we would all still wear funny hats and monocles instead, whatever.
If magic is unavailable for research/discovery, again the Harrys have the option to either let nations develop technology or to scorching ray their asses, in which case...yeah same thing.
A world with technology together with magic would probably look extremely different from our non-magic counter part world, so you can never assume "hey why dont they have chain-assembly factories by now?" actually even makes sense as a question.
Technology takes time and is a chain in which you can skip steps. However those steps may have lead to something awesome. But you skipped it, keep drinking tea in porcelain while I look at dying stars.
Dealing with Darkness on the cheap:
Buy a rope. Tie a knot every 5 feet. Tie a rock to the end. Cast light on each knot.
Enter dungeon, each person throws the coil along, creating several lines of light, illuminating an area where you can now fight with vision.
P--o--o--o--x x is stone/weight, o is light, - is rope, P is Player.
Buy consumables such as Lamp oil and get creative if you dont have access to the light cantrip. It also does damage when thrown and is very cheap.
Yeah, so I can't even begin to think what a wizard can do versus a party. Do you play your casters smart and survival-style or do you make them have obvious shortcomings? (like pride of a dragon or arrogance of my above cleric?).
I'm looking for ways to for example not have Adelita (sorcerer? insert any caster here) from S&S wipe the floor with them without dumb play. I think with the cleric I patched all the weaknesses a bit too much. I dont want to get into the discussion of caster-non caster, but at these levels casters can really patch their weaknesses...and if half smart, they should (they didnt get to these levels by being unprepared push overs).
Mourge40k: I had read Karzoug was actually a push over, so a nice touch to make him use his resources properly. However he is really a last last boss so it's alright that there are some casualties.
SheepishEidolon: All the game is Epic point buy, hence so are the villains. I only added a single Mythic power (reroll the SR). No especial items apart from a negative channeling phylactery. I even forgot to debuff them with variant channeling even though i did only give them half damage. It is a fun build that I had planned as a character myself...perhaps that's the moral, dont build an NPC as you'd build a character? You have a point that the more stuff you put on definitely the more deadly it becomes. Some parties I guess have trouble with some things and others dont (a gunslinger and reach martial wouldve snuffed the cleric in 2 rounds I guess).
I run some APs and have been wondering at the disparity in difficulty between one BBG and another depending on their class (sometimes on their context battle too).
Example. Skull and Shackles:
...Zaksia Galembar alchemist, Isabella the sorcerer, the wreckers, Bikendi vs Harrigan/any non caster.
The casters are a possible tpk usually with a few deaths; just from looking at the obituary threads and from personal experience
It does vary upon:
Considering this, I pit my players (party of 4, a divine nature caster, a monk/rogue, an occultist and a swashbuckler, all level 10 with decent wbl/optimisation) against a single cleric that knew they were coming and had fought against the party 3 levels before. They knew they were probably going to fight him too.
The cleric BB(g)G battle::
A level 12 cleric with 1 mythic ability (reroll spell resistance), epic point buy (25), automatic bonus progression and a little spice. No henchmen.
Focuses on channel with the aasimar feats (push/pull). Very high DC due to charisma focus, feats and traits increasing charisma and a little bump for being alone. Variant channeling but totally forgot to apply the effect even though I was halving the damage.
Seeing this and a few of the enemies I've played...casters with a little smart play are absolutely terrifying and I feel that if I dont play them a bit dull, they can absolutely tear a party down in a minute.
What sort of experiences do you have, do you find this normal too?
Yes, I like them, hence I tried to implement them. But a couple of combats later they begged to go back to squares.
One instance that they dont work (or several) is the "chose one edge of the square" or a "chose a side of the square" for example for Tower Shields. You have a lot more sides to cover.
Also for cover hexes get very confusing.
I explored such a concept with an alchemist and asked for advice on the forums, here is the thread:
In addition, the Toxicant Alchemist is a fantastic archetype for this, dealing damage + int modifier + condition to attackers.
To expand upon this concept, you'd want a way to reduce damage or get healing. Good examples are DRs (from spells, adamantine), fast healing, Lay on Hands, Cleric Quick Channel, fast drinking potions (weapon masters book Cayden mug, potion glutton, mythic two fisted drinker, empowered discovery healing pots), self empowered healing (holy vindicator).
If you need something piraty, Razor Coast is an amazing product as stated above. It also provides a sandbox; how-to story.
While enamoured with the western view of piracy and S&S, I would chime in with the above: No more straight piracy (Freeport-Razor Coast) but many more MARITIME adventures, please.
Exploration on the coast lines.
Kingdom AP at sea.
All with strong emphasis on maritime. Expand the aquatic bestiaries, especially the amphibious. With a healthy amount of battle at sea or water around. Possibly Kingom Maker style but with sea control (Azlanti or islands domains would be best here).
...hoping. I volunteer to write some of it even :P
We are spending several feats (Vital Strike tree, Overwatch Tree) and archery/ranged is feat starved, forgoing a full attack action (no Rapid Shot, no Clustered Shots etc) and perhaps depending on wording could lose some/all of our attacks because we are readying.
Is it that detrimental for Vital Strike to be used with Overwatch style?
No it isnt detrimental, it's cool, brings potential tactical depth to otherwise straight full attacking boredrom characters and a different pathway for archery that renders less attacks than the usual. I would allow it.
I hope it flies, the wording is so here or there that it sounds like a designer would need to give this a binary answer.
Purple Dragon Knight wrote:
If APs buff up some of the sidebars to add some "if you run this as a standalone adventure" wording, I think it would go a long way to include back some of the gamers who have less time to devote to the hobby than others. I know lots of people buy the APs just for reading, but believe it or not some people will only buy that stuff if they intend to run or play it, and would rather read novels or engineering manuals on their off time... ;)
I do similarly, though I do buy some AP books here and there (City of Seven spears, Kashikon...). "Buffed" sidelines are something that are very useful for this, and even when running the AP itself, giving a little "out of the box" or "out of the path" thinking.
+ to this
"Hit me, hit me harder! More pain!" is how I like it as a player (trial by fire)
Look at rivers in the cities. The Thames in London for example. The Mersey in Liverpool. These rivers could not support any substantial life forms (fish etc) after the industrial revolution. Older people from these cities remember when these rivers were, when they were young, sludged and horrible compared to nowadays, when they are relatively clean to what they were 50 years ago.
So, here's a direct impact of trying to clean up after human environmental effects. Undeniable and clear as..haha..water. We make a difference, and efforts to clean s@$~ up do also make a difference.
A chinese artist just made a brick out of chinese city smog by hoovering up air for 100 days in a normal square.
Now, I am biased since I do belong to the scientific community that looks at these climate changes and stipulates doom upon everyone, but I believe most educated people (most of us here certainly) dont doubt there is a change and that human industry causes pollution and hence s!+$ in the air that helps with greenhouse and climate change. As noted earlier, the real questions are "how much" and "how much can we stop it/delay". Anything else is making the blind/deaf/mute monkey be ashamed on the topic of ignorance (i.e. read a bit on the subject before voicing strong opinions...everyone's INFORMED opinion should be valued).
However, the best way to reduce pollution and human effects is probably...to have less humans. Politicians and everyone are scared to voice this question since they'll be considered "anti life" or whatever funk term the media is giving to this at the moment. This is a super touchy subject to most people but it was a topic that was discussed some decades ago and now it's been dropped and mostly ignoresdyet it is one the biggest factors in this discussion.
Disclaimer; highly opinionated stuff above, due to it being an opinion.
Havent run many APs (still through our second one, S&S which we've fluffed up and added stuff to and enjoying thoroughly, yet never finished our first RotRL...which was very boring).
What is for me a killer when I read through the APs is that the setting placement and story developing are generally a lot of fun (books 1&2, though I have read that some do drop the ball here) and then the rest of the books are extended dungeon crawls. For our group, that is very boring. We much prefer the exposition, interesting npcs and then some relevant and to the point combat.
In general, Paizo likes these humongous dumgeon crawls, with 37 rooms with a APL minus CR7 encounters. We as a group grab these rooms and make 5 out of it with some better, more relevant combats. This helps shorten certain things about the AP. "You go in the room. It has 3 doors, which do you take? Ok the North. You go in, it has 4 doors, which..." At the 20 minute mark we've lost interest.
Things that make some APs fantastic for us, and eager to get through them, are things like the S&S captains Regatta, the Council meetings, and staged events, with fast, simple rules to get through them and add a tonne of environment, without it being a succeed or die scenario.
In short, if the AP is about having a big dungeon crawl in books 3-6, yes, the AP is too long because there obviously wasnt enough relevant content to make an interesting story for so many books.
That was very interesting, I think the Hurricane King's handling was superb and well within lines, good stuff.
You mention they deal with book 6's with scry and die. Here is where I think you might have made it a bit too easy. The Thrune people have powerful scry stuff themselves (like the fountain), employ very high caster level people (Norgorber priests, demons), so I think this tactic wouldve been thwarted or prepared for. If it was my party, they might have landed in some trap, since they'd have been scryed too at some point or there wouldve been spying agents.
Ah, very cool to read, always fun to know how something can twist and have fun results, thank you!
I was also worried about this when I ran it. However, they were smart, sneaked in and surprised Plugg. They then took the main deck with a mixture of a fight and some diplomacies, dealing with a few of the opposition fast and then trying to get the rest on board.
Then I had the storm hit them.
However, I wouldnt actually worry too much about whether if it is a challenge or not. We are in book 4..and this AP is murderous at every corner, the island they're about to embark on included. IF they are smart, do yourself a favour and roll with it.
As for the map parts, I printed out the deck of the Mans Promise and put some small die or pieces of plastic/wood to symbolise the crew, and pointed to a few who were "opposed" npcs, which they were sure would support Plugg.
I rebuilt the Sahuagin Matron into a Shaman (which was lucky, she had her spirit animal to wake her up when the Witch put her to sleep on the first round... rassaafrassin Slumber), and more recently have rebuilt Druvalia Thrune (who I introduced much earlier) into a gunslinging Hexcrafter/Eldritch Archer Magus (along with her entire crew, which I built from the ground up to be counterpoints to the party). Makes for a fun time.
I would love to see these builds, if possible?
Milo v3 wrote:
If it is involuntarily and you have no ranks in swim, yeah, then it can hurt (your ears) and I can see the rule working then. Humans can and have gone beyond 100 metres without any pressure damage. Most depth related damage is due to oxygen/gaseous intakes etc.
Milo v3 wrote:
This is such a stupid rule. 30 metres doesnt deal pressure damage to a human being.
You cant charge through your allied squares. Reach weapons are subject to cover from people in the battlefield, including your allies.
Nice list, liked the catching one, the rest I knew..especially the 5ft step one, I plan on handing my group their asses with that particular piece of information, to see if theyll learn readied actions once and for all.
2 druids and a witch. Healing should not be in that sentence. As mentioned above, use control spells, which will prevent the party from taking damage. For example, Wall of Thorns.
Another way of doing it is having them face opponents with these spells (Entangle, Fogs, Sleet storms, Pits) in a very -non- deadly encounter, where the caster is played very stupidly (any caster I play by definition..I'm terrible at them). They will feel how powerful these things are, and when they roll Spellcraft, you can tell them "it's a wiz/sorc/druid/witch spell of 2nd level" and they will "oooh- aaah!".
When I Gm I wear a metal gauntlet on my left hand. When my decree is questioned, I back-slap that heretical mouth back to the floor where it deserves to lie and bleed.
Theatricals aside, when I started gming I wasnt that good at rules yet, and if something comes up that can be delayed, I assign someone at the table to look it up while the rest of the round happens.
When it is a pressing matter, we all look into it. I ask for a minute if I need to read something to be 100% clear, otherwise i'll bank on someone's knowledge or search.
If your table wants to have that 10ft pole up their arses about your rulings (which are always right, period, for pedantic know it alls) when they've been made together, someone else can gm.
Player character deaths can and often result in some awkwardness with some players, it's how it is (jokingly, I suggest you nurture that feeling deep inside and savour it from time to time).