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Othlo

ElyasRavenwood's page

Goblinworks Executive Founder. Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Cards, Maps Subscriber. FullStarFullStarFullStarFullStarFullStar Venture-Captain, Vermont—Brattleboro. 2,481 posts (2,571 including aliases). No reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 28 Pathfinder Society characters.


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Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder is based on Classes. It is one of its defining features.

While I have never played Gurps 3rd edition. I'm sure Hama's suggestion is a good one.

I would also suggest taking a look at Mutants and Masterminds.

They have a point system where you purchace things like base attack bonus, saving throws, hit dice, and powers skills etc.

That might be worth taking a look at.

Silver Crusade ***** Venture-Captain, Vermont—Brattleboro aka ElyasRavenwood

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I'm torn between the summoner and the gunslinger.

I suppose If I was going to pick, I'd pick the gunslinger.

Silver Crusade

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claudekennilol wrote:
I see a lot of posts implying that rogues aren't worth playing, why is that?

Allot of people will tell you rogues are sub Par. From my granted limited perspective to me It doesn't matter if a class is "above par" or "below par".

As a GM, I do my best to tailor the game to my players. So there isn't really any "above par" or "below par" in my games. If someone wants to play a rogue, I will for example, make sure there are traps to disarm and also magical traps to disarm. I try to make sure every character has a chance to shine.

This is a repost from a thread where someone was asking if it was worth playing a rogue:

I am currently running a home pathfinder game on "google hangout" with some of my old buddies. I'm in North Carolina, and my old friends are in New York City. We played 2nd edition together and some 3rd and 3.5 D&D as well. They haven't had a chance to play for a while, and they are just getting introduced to Pathfinder.

I am running a game with Core Rule Book only. For ability scores, Roll 4d6 assigned as desired re roll 1s. My players have picked:

an Elven Cleric of Iori

a Human (Ulfen) Paladin

a Human Rogue.... (The paladin and rogue are 1/2 brothers)

and a gnome sorcerer.

From a GM's perspective I am quite happy with my player's choices. All the bases are covered.
In this party everyone has a part to play. The party is now 2nd level

In the current adventure, a dungeon crawl through an egyptian themed pyramid, the rogue has been very helpful. He had to deal with 4 traps, either by disabling them, or setting them off on himself. I made sure one of the traps was a big rolling stone ball ! as a nod to Indiana Jones.

Later in the adventure, the party had to face a giant scorpion. Everyone contributed to the fight. The paladin and the rouge flanked. The sorcerer used his ranged magic spells, and the cleric blessed, channeled positive energy, and moved about and healed as necessary. The paladin was torn apart by the scorpion's claws stung, poisoned, and dropped into unconsciousness. After stabilizing the paladin. the cleric stepped in to flank with the rouge. The rogue's sneak attack was what dropped the scorpion. Everyone contributed to the fight.

As a GM, I want to make sure each of the player's character's has a chance to shine and contribute to the success of the party.

I put traps in the dungeon for the rogue to disarm. I thought a scorpion would be a nice desert themed monster to fight. Also the scorpion could damaged by a sneak attack.

I know people say rogues are not useful because everything else can do its job better.

In the game I am running the rogue will be useful. I can tell you this rouge will be dealing with the "grey market" to help sell antiquities for the party. He disables traps, helps with fights and he scouts ahead to report for trouble.

I can also tell you my player is enjoying the game and he is happy with his rogue. Does my party have "optimized" characters? Well the cleric has selective channeling....the rogue trap finding.....etc. It doesn't matter if my players characters are optimized. I tailor the game to my players and their characters.

So I would encourage you to have fun. This is a game. You win by working together with the other players and their characters. So have fun. Try the rogue.....try the bard.....try the barbarian....try whatever you would like to try and have fun.

Good luck with your rogue!

Silver Crusade

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BlackOuroboros wrote:

So I was driving on my way home from work today, and I was thinking about a campaign I want to run and I began to wonder why arcane magic wasn't completely ubiquitous in Golarion yet. What I mean by that is that arcane magic has been studied in the world for something like 10,000 years, so why isn't a magic a bigger force in everybody’s life? I can understand why divine casters are rare, after all you have to appease a god, but arcane magic merely requires training and a desire to learn. Furthermore, it seems like even low-level arcane magic would solve a lot of civic problems and high level magic would solve the rest.

Ray of Frost provides means for both food preservation (refrigeration) and climate control (air conditioning). Continual flame provides a cheap means of keeping an area lit at all times. Access to a magical item that casts fabricate at will (costs around 90,000 gp) and a competent craftsman will make a factory that would make modern production lines weep with envy. A little work with create demiplain and permanent gates will create transport hubs will make goods and people a breeze to transport. Disintegrate makes garbage and sewage concerns non-existent. Unseen servant could handle a majority of labor jobs that don't require a large amount of strength (such as harvesting and plowing fields); golems and elementals can solve the rest.

Long story short, arcane magic’s ability to flip physics the bird and solve so many problems means that, by all rights, Golarion should make the modern world look like a bunch of ants scratching in the dirt. Is there an in-game reason why it seems to be permanently stuck in the Renaissance? I mean, I understand that it’s a fantasy game and that’s what we want to play; but I was wondering if there was something in the lore that explains it.

You may want to look at the Eberon Setting. I think one of its premises was "what happens if magic is very prevalent and functions as technology". The Eberon setting books might answer some of your questions.

Silver Crusade

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I suppose I am not going to say anything that has been said up thread.

I can sympathize with the OP. I am not thrilled about guns, lasers, space ships....etc.

Bah Humbug!

But as it was mentioned up thread we have a kitchen sink setting. We can take what we like, and leave the rest.

When I run a home game, I usually just say that the idiot people in Alkenstar blew themselves up, thus no guns, and in Numeria, while I don't mind it being the source of Star metal, If PCs make noises about wanting to go there, I would most likely ask them not to, and if they insist, I would have one of the technic league dig too deep, fine the reactor core of the ship, and inadvertently blow it up.

So all in all, while I am not thrilled about Iron Gods, I am curious to see what the writers have done and I will take a look at it.

Who knows I may even like the adventure path!

And If I like the Adventure Path, then I won't mind the PCs going to Numeria.

Silver Crusade

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Dragonflayer,

I have a 14 level mystic Theurge character in PFS. I have had allot of fun with this character.

The level break down is Cleric (Pharasma) 3rd level / Wizard (Necromancer) 3rd level / 8 Mystic Theurge

The character isn't optimized. This character was one of my first pathfinder characters and grew organically.

At 8th level he got access to 3rd level spells, 10 level 4th level spells, 12 level 5th level spells and 14 level 6th level spells.

You are most likely going to get lots of advice on how to build the character rules wise.

All I can say is have fun, and don't be afraid to try something.

Good luck,

Elyas

Silver Crusade

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Everyone will have an opinion about what they prefer die rolling for statistics or a point buy.

Through playing lots of PFS i have gotten used to a 20 point buy.

However for my home games I still prefer rolling 4d6, re rolling 1s, and assigning as desired.

Each way of character generation has its merits.

Silver Crusade

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I'm just curious. Why do people need official rulings? The rules can't possibly cover every situation. When Rules don't cover a situation that may arise in a game, isn't it the GM's job to adjudicate as best he or she can?

So I'm just curious, why the desire for an "official ruling?"

Thanks

Silver Crusade

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Here is a similar thread I started a while ago. James Jacobs posted an interesting response.

link.

I for one happen to like the idea that there is a fractured faith, that there is a hard militant side to the faith, intent much more on burning those who are "deemed" iredeamable, and those who are interested in redemption.

To me it makes sense that politics power and religion would would drive a "spread of the faith" by the sword across northern Garrund, and into Taldor.

To me it makes sense that the faith of Sarenrae is not well loved in Taldor. They have had to deal with an aggressive powerful southern nieghbor, namely Qadira after all.

Just because a nation of people Taldorans, don't like a particular church, or branch of a faith, say the cult of the dawn flower, does not mean they dislike Sarenrae, but they may be wary of her faithful all the same.

People are after all able to separate a godess from her misguided "faithful followers".

Why wouldn't she come down hard on these misguided and deluded faithful? Well for one thing

Sarenrae is Neutral Good and she most likely wants to redeem her misguided followers.

I guess all in all, it is the imperfections that has made Sarenrae's "faith" interesting to me.

So while things may be "retconned" in my own home games I will keep them as I like them....Taldor being suspicious of sarenraeite worshipers and banning open worship as being seditious. And I will also like the idea of past wars to spread the faith. From those wars we got Rahadoum. Rahadoum is another interesting place.

Anyways I am beginning to rant. I apologize.

Silver Crusade

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bookwormbabe29 wrote:

Hey there!

As stated, I'm not sure if I'm doing this right, so my apologies in advance if I botch this up.

Anywho, despite having been gaming for 20 years now, I am just joining my first ever Pathfinder game. I've never played 3.5, or 3. anything really as my old group avoided D&D mostly. After hearing so much about this kind of system, I was super excited to make my first character and experience it all for myself. We have core/base classes and races only, with a preference for Core if possible. Being new I was fine with that, and decided on a Half-Elf Rogue. It's a level one game, and we have a Fighter, a Ranger, and a Cleric as my team.

I had two weeks to prepare for this, and I've spent most of that time trying to learn the various rules of the game, while spending some learning Rogue builds. From reading stuff from here and various guides online, I knew Rogue wasn't going to do as much damage per round as a Barbarian or anything, but I figured I'd be useful for a stealth role, find traps, deal some back stab damage. That would be niche, and I'll do it well. I tried some builds, and found a dex build with a feat called Dervish dance I thought could work for the most part.

The hiccup I'm run into is the half-elf 'multi talented' ability. I didn't want this ability to go to waste, and I've been looking into the other classes. And this has just been a depressing job, as it seems every class does my job better than I do. No matter how I build my rogue, it feels another class is better at my core skills than I am, like I'd be a better Rogue if I weren't actually a rogue.

The game starts up this week now, and I'm no closer to make a decent rogue than I was a week before. The 'best' build I had was a Rogue 1/Bard 1(Dervish of dawn)/ Rogue 3/ Shadow Dancer 2 mess of a build with a BAB so low I doubt I'd hurt anything. I love stealth/shadow stuff, and Arcane casting is a bonus so I thought to combine them all, and I'm so burnt out it looked good or a while. I've looked at so many builds on so many...

I can see from this thread you are getting lots of advice.

I am currently running a home pathfinder game on "google hangout" with some of my old buddies. I'm in North Carolina, and my old friends are in New York City. We played 2nd edition together and some 3rd and 3.5 D&D as well. They haven't had a chance to play for a while, and they are just getting introduced to Pathfinder.

I am running a game with Core Rule Book only. For ability scores, Roll 4d6 assigned as desired re roll 1s. My players have picked:

an Elven Cleric of Iori

a Human (Ulfen) Paladin

a Human Rogue.... (The paladin and rogue are 1/2 brothers)

and a gnome sorcerer.

From a GM's perspective I am quite happy with my player's choices. All the bases are covered.
In this party everyone has a part to play. The party is now 2nd level

In the current adventure, a dungeon crawl through an egyptian themed pyramid, the rogue has been very helpful. He had to deal with 4 traps, either by disabling them, or setting them off on himself. I made sure one of the traps was a big rolling stone ball ! as a nod to Indiana Jones.

Later in the adventure, the party had to face a giant scorpion. Everyone contributed to the fight. The paladin and the rouge flanked. The sorcerer used his ranged magic spells, and the cleric blessed, channeled positive energy, and moved about and healed as necessary. The paladin was torn apart by the scorpion's claws stung, poisoned, and dropped into unconsciousness. After stabilizing the paladin. the cleric stepped in to flank with the rouge. The rogue's sneak attack was what dropped the scorpion. Everyone contributed to the fight.

As a GM, I want to make sure each of the player's character's has a chance to shine and contribute to the success of the party.

I put traps in the dungeon for the rogue to disarm. I thought a scorpion would be a nice desert themed monster to fight. Also the scorpion could damaged by a sneak attack.

I know people say rogues are not useful because everything else can do its job better.

In the game I am running the rogue will be useful. I can tell you this rouge will be dealing with the "grey market" to help sell antiquities for the party. He disables traps, helps with fights and he scouts ahead to report for trouble.

I can also tell you my player is enjoying the game and he is happy with his rogue. Does my party have "optimized" characters? Well the cleric has selective channeling....the rogue trap finding.....etc. It doesn't matter if my players characters are optimized. I tailor the game to my players and their characters.

So I would encourage you to have fun. This is a game. You win by working together with the other players and their characters. So have fun. Try the rogue.....try the bard.....try the barbarian....try whatever you would like to try and have fun.

Good luck with your rogue!

Silver Crusade Goblinworks Executive Founder

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Lord Regent: Deacon Wulf wrote:

When playing the Table-top has your group ever run into bandits? The only difference between Pathfinder Online and Pathfinder PnP is that the bandits are players as well.

In addition: That evil cult trying to resurrect the Whispering Tyrant? Yea, those are players as well.

Lord Regent, Thank you for taking the time to answer my concerns.

However, to me, the other bandits being other players, instead of NPCs makes a world of difference.

I have found, the few times there has been PVP, in a home table top game, this has more often then not resulted in one of the players, (usually the one with the evilly aligned character, getting defeated, and hurt upset feelings follow. Usually this is the pre curser to a player either leaving or being booted from a group.

When I have either ran the monsters for my GM, or had a player run my monsters, they are much more competative with the other players and in short, the player often goes for the PCs Jugular.

Let me give you an example of how I think a GM would handle things as opposed to a player.

:
Last night I was GMing a home Pathfinder game. My PCs had a paladin, a rogue, a cleric and a sorcerer. They are 2nd level. The party was facing a cr3 scorpion. It was a good monster fight. The paladin and Rogue flanked the Scorpion and both damaged the monster with their weapons, the rogue getting his SA damage. The cleric channeled positive energy ( selective channeled out the scorpion) to heal, cast bless, and moved around and casted cure spells when needed. The sorcerer used his ranged spells.

In short, the party was working as a team, making good tactical choices. I was rolling more or less in the open (one player could see all of my die rolls because of where he was seated). I got a string of 18s 19s and a confirmed critical with a 20. The paladin got poisoned and while at 10 hit points, took 25 points of damage (d6s with +4 Str Mod for damage). His character at -15 and with a 16 con was very close to death. After the scorpion went last in initiative, a new round started with the paladin at the top of the initiative. The paladin failed his stabilization check. The cleric went right after him in initiative. One cure light wounds later and the paladin was stabilized. I know technically, my player's paladin would be dead, if i was sticking to the Rules as Written completely. But what would be the point of having a player with a dead character? I'm not saying I wont let my player's character's ever die, but I felt the player would be much more excited about a close shave with death then a dead character. He actually thought his character was dead, thinking that -10 killed a character as per 3.5 rules.

The sorcerer then conjured a fire beetle which attacked the scorpion. Now the Scorpion, being Neutral Hungry, I think would most likely have begun trying to eat the fallen unconscious paladin. However, I had the scorpion swivel and attack the offending bug nipping at the scorpions legs. Again I rolled a series of 19s and 20s and 18s and the scorpion killed and ate the summoned bug. This gave another character time to drag the paladin away. They brought the scorpion with a well placed backstab.

.

Now my point is, in my experience if that scorpion was controlled by another player, not the GM, that paladin would have been the scorpion's lunch.

I am not saying every GM is "merciful", but I have yet to see a player who is when opposing other players.

So in short, as a GM you can often see the larger picture, then when you are another PC fighting other PCs, or a player controlling monsters. You often just see the encounter, and how to win it.

So to me the bandits being players instead of NPCs makes a world of difference and changes the dynamics of a game.

I am willing to give Pathfinder online a try. I just think, many other Pathfinder players have similar concerns and reservations about Pathfinder online because it core dynamic is PvP.

Silver Crusade Goblinworks Executive Founder

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As someone who is and active Pathfinder player, GMing, playing, in home games and Pathfinder Society Organized play. To me Pathfinder is essentially a cooperative game where the players work together to accomplish the goals the GM sets before them.

To me introducing a non consensual PVP element fundamentally changes a cooperative game to a competitive game.

And unfortunately Eve online, which appears to be a "parent game" for PFO has a reputation for encouraging a sociopathic Machiavellian atmosphere.

I am not willing to throw the baby out with the bath water, so I helped a little bit to get the tech demo off the ground.

Perhaps I am wrong about all of this so I am also wiling to to give the game a try.

Unfortunately what I mentioned earlier is the impression quite a few friends who play Pathfinder have about PFO, and many think it will simply be Eve with swords. For many the non consensual PVP element is the deal breaker.

I think these are some of the impressions, right or wrong, the pathfinder online game will have to over come in order to draw lots of Pathfinder players into the online game.
Perhaps I am wrong.

I am willing to give the game a try. We shall see how it goes.

Silver Crusade

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I guess I also agree with Shadowkras. Can Pathfinder use improvement? of course any system can.

Here is my favorite part of the Core rule book.

"The Most Important Rule
The rules in this book are here to help you breathe life into your characters and the world they explore. While they are designed to make your game easy and exciting, you might find that some of them do not suit the style of play that your gaming group enjoys. Remember that these rules are yours. You can change them to fit your needs. Most Game Masters have a number of “house rules” that they use in their games. The Game Master and players should always discuss any rules changes to make sure that everyone understands how the game will be played. Although the Game Master is the final arbiter of the rules, the Pathfinder RPG is a shared experience, and all of the players should contribute their thoughts when the rules are in doubt."
Page 9 Core Rule book

I think people often forget about this little bit of text, which gives us the players GMs and players alike a great deal of freedom to play the kind of game we would like to play and adjust what we want to adjust.

If someone has a problem with say Wild Shape they can and are expected to address this problem in their home game. If you don't like a class, you don't have to use it.

In my home games for example, when a player asks about either guns or gunslingers, which I don't like, I inform the player that in my home version of Golarion, there was a terrible accident...Alkenstar blew themselves up, with their gun powder....so there are not any guns.

So In short, I'm happy with the incremental changes, and I'm not looking for a 2nd edition of Pathfinder. It will come eventually.....but in my opinion, I hope that is years away.

Silver Crusade ***** Venture-Captain, Vermont—Brattleboro aka ElyasRavenwood

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I'm one of those people who doesn't like sci-fi peanut butter in my fantasy chocolate. I would be quite unhappy if players showed up with nuclear resonators and gravity rifles. I don't even like gunslingers. I am not saying that there is anything wrong with playing with gravity riffles, in a fantasy setting it just isn't my cup of tea. There is plenty of room for everyone.

I understand that there will be a few scenarios that touch on Numeria which I am not so excited about. However I am excited about the society returning to its roots of recovering lost knowledge and magic. It will be nice to return to Qadira, Katapesh, the Mwangi Expanse, the Land of the Linnorm Kings, the Shackles, and Tian Xia— to see what is going on there.

I really liked the year of the shadow lodge, the Year of the Ruby Pheonix, and the Year of the Demon. I really like wrath of the righteous and I have enjoyed those scenarios dealing with the world wound the crusaders, and the war to contain the Demons.

So If there is a theme I am not overly thrilled with that's ok. While admittedly, I was more excited about Mummy's Mask then the Iron Gods, I still plan to buy and read the Iron Gods adventure path and the books that go with it. Who knows I might even like it. The writers at Paizo more often then not have pleasantly surprised me.

Silver Crusade

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Jaydar, what most people are saying does not go against RAW. When taken in context, when you read that text in the Cleric entry, "The cleric can “lose” any prepared spell that is not an orison or domain spell in order to cast any cure spell of the same spell level or lower" the text is clearly referring to cleric spells.

Silver Crusade

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While discussing the Sellen, this might be interesting: river bifurcation and this Casiquiare_canal. There might be some of this in the Sellen river.

Silver Crusade ***** Venture-Captain, Vermont—Brattleboro aka ElyasRavenwood

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Mysteries are often far more interesting left un explained, and the solutions are left to our own imaginations. I think the writers did something very clever. Instead of explaining the great "mysteries" of Golarion such as why did Aroden die why did the gnomes leave the first world..etc...they offered "facts" and "theories" and ultimately said, well its up to you to figure out what is best for your campaign.

I think the mystery of the test of the star stone is much more interesting left undefined.

In my opinion I think it would be a terrible idea to have some sort of module which is a "test" of the star stone and have the mystery explained.

Well that is only my opinion.

Silver Crusade

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How about a helm of alignment change?

If I may quote Bastilla from Knights of the old republic " what greater weapon is there then turning an enemy to your cause"

Silver Crusade

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I remember back in 92, I was running a 2nd ed D&D game in college. One of my friends was playing a mage. After the fighter kicked down a door, my friend with his mage told me that he would like to cast Tenser's Floating Disc under the door and take it with him. I said Ok.

I thought I was being clever. I planed to initially have a carrion crawler come into the room crawling on the ceiling and attack the party from above. and then have a bunch of kobolds attack the party while they were paralyzed.

In comes the carrion crawler. my friend says, "I squash the over grown centipede with my door." " What door?" " The one on my mages tenser's floating disc. I simply raise the door up with the disc and squash the bug." A few dice rolls later, and we had one mashed bug on the ceiling.

In come the Kobolds. My friend says, "my mage dismisses the Tenser's floating disc spell, dropping the horizontal door from the ceiling to the floor". A few dice rolls later....squashed kobolds.

Was this by RAW? I don't think we even had that term back then. The spell descriptions were much shorter then as well. I suppose strictly speaking, most likely no it wasn't by raw.

I remember a gnome illusionist I had in a game my friend ran, who wore a fez, had a big mustache sat on a tassled plump pillow which he placed on his Tenser's floating disc so he floated around. I remember he had cooking as a non weapon proficiency, and had an outrageous french accent, and complained about the quality of spices he had to cook with on the trail. He would often be given a rope to carry, across chasms, rivers etc...We had allot of fun with this character.

But 22 years later, this gameing story still gets a chuckles from me and my friend.

So Grimmerzorch, in a home game, ask your GM. See what he says. He might just say yes.

In a PFS game, Mr. OldSkool Gamer, I think is right with his reading of the rules as written.

The spell is allot of fun.....one good use for Tenser's Floating disc might be to carry lamp oil, 2 gallons of the stuff, you can then light the oil, and then send the burning oil in the Tenser's Floating Disc over a swarm....then dismiss the spell. you should have some burning bugs then.

Good luck.

Silver Crusade

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Jeremy,
I have just gotten the Ultimate Psionics book I ordered from Paizo. I am very happy with it. I will enjoy pouring over it. Thank you!

Myles Crocker

PS I get a kick out of seeing my old beloved psion character on the cover in his green robes

Silver Crusade ***** Venture-Captain, Vermont—Brattleboro aka ElyasRavenwood

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I have for the most part been quite happy with what Paizo has produced and I have been happy with the Pathfinder game.

I also have liked the adventure paths. Some I have liked more then others (King Maker, Reigh of WInter, Wrath of the Righteous) . There are a couple of APs I don't really like ( Skulls & Shackles Serpent Skull) but for the most part I have liked the APS. Now the upcoming Iron Gods AP, I'm not what to make if it. I'm not terribly excited about it because I don't really like mixing my fantasy with my sci fi, but I may be surprised. I may find it interesting, and I may like it. I am at least willing to take a look at the AP. Who knows, I really liked Fire Fly, a mixture of a "western" and "Sci FI'....six shooters and starships!

Is there anything that Paizo is publishing to be excited about? The advanced class guide looks interesting. They have just published the Inner Sea Gods hard cover, which i am happily digesting now. What's around the corner? I don't know.

But I do know that more often then not, I am surprised by what Paizo publishes.

Am I worried about 5th edition? Not really. I'll take a look at it. If I like it I may buy the core books. I will most likely play a few games to see if i like it. And if i do like 5th edition then i can play both 5th edition and Pathfinder.

Will some people leave Pathfinder for 5th edition?...sure some people will. I think there is certainly enough room for both 5th edition and Pathfinder. Besides, the competition should be good for the creativity of the developers and writers of both games.

Silver Crusade

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I'll give 5th edition D&D a look. I might buy the books if i like what I see. I''ll be willing to play a game or two to see what it is like. I will most likely stick with Pathfinder. I am generally happy with the stories Paizo is writing for the Pathfinder game (APs campaign setting stuff etc).

Silver Crusade

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In a home game, as a GM, I would not be very interested in RAW. The question I would ask is this: What is the intention of the spell? and the second question I would ask is this: what kind of advantage is the player trying to get?

From what I understand by having the invisible servant reload a crossbow or fire arm, you are trying to save actions to give you more to do in a round. The same with lifting a shield off of the ground.

So In a home game, I would not allow an unseen servant to load a crossbow for you in a quick and efficient manner, nor lift a shield for you.

Nefreet offers better raw arguments then I, and I would agree with what he suggests.

Now out of combat is a different story.

I have allowed people to use an unseen servant to

A) help them sort books in a library and take out and replace books halving the time needed to search a library for information.

B) clean a place up before a date arrives,

c) help with gardening, weeding etc, in one adventure I ran, the party had to clean a garden de weeding it trimming the bushes etc.....I allowed a couple of unseen servants to halve the time required to do the work.

D)When the ranger brought back a deer he had hunted to feed the party, I allowed an unseen servant to help dress the deer and prepare the meal.

C)When the party was retreating down a sandy underground passage, I allowed them to use an unseen servant to sweep away their foot prints so they couldn't be tracked.

D) ah last but not least...serving tea in the wizard's tower.

Well I hope this gives you some out of combat ideas for uses of an unseen servant.

Silver Crusade

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Something has changed? Sarenrae is now allowed in Taldor?

I thought the outlawing of the worship of Sarenrae in Taldor added some color to the "faded" Taldor.

Oh well. I guess I'll just ignore this bit of change to the cannon in my home games.

Silver Crusade Goblinworks Executive Founder

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I have to admit, while one of the core concepts of Pathfinder Online is PVP. From what I heard the idea is to create now what is it? "meaningful conflicts".....perhaps I am getting this wrong. you need to fight for what you have, against monsters other players etc....

Now, I suppose one way to put it is this: the Pathfinder Role Playing game, the one held in person, in living rooms, dining rooms, game stores.....I guess what people call Table Top games...where you get together with some friends. One person GMs, several others play characters who form a team, with each player and character bringing something to the team, the adventuring party. The GM then puts challenges for the players to work together and over come cooperatively with their characters. Unlike most competitive games, these role playing games, Dungeons and Dragons and Pathfinder are cooperative games where players work together towards overcoming the common goals and challenges the GM sets up for them.

I have reservations about Pathfinder Online. the biggest reservation I have is about the PVP core of the game. Now from perhaps my limited perspective, Pathfinder online seems to be entirely a cat of a different stripe. The non consentual PVP aspect that the game is built around, seems to me that it fundamentally changes what I consider a cooperative game to a competitive game.

I don't have any interest in PVP. I doubt I will. I am open to the possibility that I might enjoy Pathfinder online. I am willing to give the game a try. We shall see how things go.

I suppose the worst that can happen, is that I find the game to frustrating, to full of bullies, and sociopathic behavior. Then I'll move on.

But I may may find that I enjoy the game. I am willing to give it a try.

Silver Crusade

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Neat Idea. However, as a GM, I would nix that idea, because would i want the PCs, to uncover clues to what is going on, and to me it seems that having someone from that time period would spoil some of the mysteries.

I am not sure how much info there is out about ancient Thassilon, but I would suggest checking out Lost Kingdoms. I think there might be some information about ancient Thassilon in that book. I hope this helps.

Silver Crusade

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I quite agree, I think the rules developers are doing their best to keep some game balance int tact, and to keep the game fun.

Here is my favorite part of the core rule book,

"The Most Important Rule:

The rules in this book are here to help you breathe life into your characters and the world they explore. While they are designed to make your game easy and exciting, you might find that some of them do not suit the style of play that your gaming group enjoys. Remember that these rules are yours. You can change them to fit your needs. Most Game Masters have a number of “house rules” that they use in their games. The Game Master and players should always discuss any rules changes to make sure that everyone understands how the game will be played. Although the Game Master is the final arbiter of the rules, the Pathfinder RPG is a shared experience, and all of the players should contribute their thoughts when the rules are in doubt."

Page 9 of the core rule book.

I think people forget this little passage in the core rule book. For example, I think the Developers have mentioned in the FAQ, that Spell Like abilities could be used to qualify for prestige classes...ie Mystic theurge etc.....

In your home game you (GM) get to decide what you want in your game and what you don't. For Example, wether you want to apply this clarification the developers made to your home game or not.

Silver Crusade

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Wasn't Manimal a TV show in the 80's? I remember liking that show.

Silver Crusade

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Well if you steal a paladin's horse, as someone pointed out up thread, you will end up with an angry war horse, an irritated paladin.......oh paladins often come with adventuring buddies.....an irate adventuring party.......Well all i have to say is good luck....you will need it.

Silver Crusade

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Samy wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
Folks who want a return to more classic concepts will be delighted in the NEXT Adventure Path if they stick around. I'm looking forward to it, for sure!

As am I. I mean, I'm a fantasy guy 90%, and I think PF should definitely stick to "classic" fantasy as its bread and butter. But come on, 100, 200, 1000 issues of adventure path just gets *boring* if it's all the same genre. It's not a crime against humanity if among 15 complete adventure paths one goes Barrier Peaks. There's still 14 other APs -- plus all the classic fantasy ones to come, which will no doubt remain the majority.

It's okay to step outside to the balcony for a while when the party DJ plays a rap song you hate. But it's not the end of the world and he'll get back to playing all those infernally catchy pop songs right after.

I happen to agree with Samy. I happen to like my fantasy without Technology.

I do remember thinking expedition to the barrier peaks was very cool. I think there were a couple of other ones...temple of the frog or something like that.

So I don't mind too much if an adventure path explores something a little different. I'll buy the source books. I'll keep my subscriptions up, and I'll read Iron Gods to see what is there.

I don't plan to introduce this sort of technology into my home games, but I am curious to see what Mr. Jacobs has written.

While, I don't like guns in my fantasy games, I'm glad Paizo has put rules for guns in Ultimate combat. I may want to run a pirate game....or I may want to run a game inspired by Edgar Rice Burroughs John Carter of Mars books. I'll need guns for games like that.

So on a similar note, while I don't think i'll want plasma grenades, energy shields, blasters in my fantasy games, I'm glad Paizo is publishing rules for this stuff. I may want to crack open my Distant Worlds source book and try running a game set on one of those other planets....then I might need to know about plasma grenades and blasters.

So in summary, while I don't feel this technology stuff is for my home fantasy campaigns, I am curious to see what paizo puts together.

just my two cents

Silver Crusade Goblinworks Executive Founder

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I have largely lost interest in MMORPGs. I still play Wow every now and again, but I have largely lost interest in the game.

I have largely lost interest because of the never ending gear grind: always working for better gear. I guess what did it for me was the change from one expansion to another. I guess it is now about 4 years ago I was playing Wow almost 8 hours a day. This was during the Wrath of the Litch King expansion. I diligently worked for six months, going on weekly raids, and accumulated my "frost badges' to get some spiffy purple armor for my paladin. Then a couple of weeks later the Cataclysm expansion came out, and the "Green" gear i was picking up was better then my hard earned purple gear. I was not happy. I guess that is just how things go.
I also got tired of quests only having one solution to solve them....
I also became disinterested in MMOs because of expectation that I found amongst players that you research and know how to do a quest instance etc before you do it....you are expected to have it memorized. There isn't any room for trial and error.

I have a couple of buddies that I go do questing with, every now and again and I guess the fun I have, largely comes from "hanging out' with them. A couple of weeks ago, we went through an area in "panda land", and they helped me quest. One of my friends had warrior of some sort, I had my Frost mage named Otiluke, and my other friend had a dwarven priest. We raced from one location to another. One of my friends had been through this area 27 times, so we raced from exclamation point to exclamation point. Often I would miss some key bit, like missing one last thing to kill, or not talking to someone, and my friends patently took me back to the thing i missed which I was greatefull for. However, I don't feel I was absorbing the story. Perhaps that was my fault, and I should have taken the time to read....but I didn't want to inconvenience my friend. anyways....we did have a good time.

I will give Wow credit for writing an interesting story that I enjoy taking part in while I quest. I think they do a good job at that.

I Contrast my experience playing with my buddies online, with the Pathfinder Society Organized Play game I just played last night. We were playing the Eyes of the Ten Series, the Level 12 retirement arc. I have known the GM for a couple of years, and he is an excellent GM. All of the players at the table, likewise I have known for a couple of years, and we have played together as well. I consider them all friends. We had a great time last night. The game was challenging, the story interesting, and we had to pull together as a team, and use lots of creativity to survive. We had lots of fun and afterwards talked about the game after the game store was shut.

I felt I had a much richer and more enjoyable experience playing that Pathfinder game with friends in person then i did with my other friends online on Wow.

I am not sure what the solution for MMO games is or if it is even possible to replicate the experience of a table top game, but it does seem they arn't quite as popular as they used to be.

So I am willing to give Pathfinder Online a chance, but I do have serious reservations about the game. I am looking for an experience similar to my pathfinder table top games, where we as players work together as a team towards various goals.

I never had any interest in the PVP side of WoW. I never will. I had enjoyed the questing PVE side of the game. I guess my biggest worry is that with the non consentual PVP core of Pathfider online, you will replicate the Machiavellian atmosphere EVE online is famous for.

Anyways, I am willing to give Pathfinder Online a try to see how I like it.

Silver Crusade ***** Venture-Captain, Vermont—Brattleboro aka ElyasRavenwood

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While I think it is a good idea to have a "hard mode" on some adventures to satisfy those players who have, now what do people call it? a high degree of "system mastery" ? And I'm glad there are such scenarios as Bone Keep parts 1 2 etc, for the tactically minded PFS player, I think it is also important to keep writing scenarios that cater to the role playing PFS player, such as the Disappeared, the Blackross Matrimony, Hell knight feast, and I think I would put Library of the Lion in that category.

Ideally I really like having elements of both tactics and role playing in a scenario. I think Day of the Demon did a good job at that.

I also think it is important to keep in mind that Pathfinder Society is also for many people an introduction to the Pathfinder Role playing game. I guess sometimes I worry about beginning or casual players being left behind as the difficulty of scenarios are increased. I think it is important for someone to be able to pick up the core rule book and make an effective character that they enjoy playing.

Well perhaps the leveling system already takes care of that.

Silver Crusade

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Thinking about favorite GMs makes me think of one of my favorite and first GMs. He was our history teacher. His name was Mr. Army. Our teachers didn't have first names. This was in the late 80s Boarding school. We had to wear blazers and ties, and stand up when the teacher came into the classroom. I suppose it was little like Hogwarts without the broom sticks and moving stair cases.

One Saturday afternoon we the Dungeons and Dragons group were al at Mr Army's house seated around a table. There were old maps in frames up on the wall and fire crackling merrily in the stone fire place. Some of his kid’s toys were stuffed behind an easy chair. I remember the front end of a Star Wars At At peaking around from behind the chair.

There was also a pair of brightly colored plastic baseball bats. My friend and I grabbed them, and be began “deuling” with the baseball bats, gleefully quoting “hello, My name is Inigo Montoya, You killed my father Prepare to die”. After a minute of two of laugher, Mr army smiled, and said, “The whole party has been plunged into darkness as the fighter and the mage decided to deul with the party torches…..Then Mr. Army asked us to hold up the base ball bats, because those were the “party torches” if we let them down, everyones light would go out.

Mean while, our characters had come to a chasm in the under ground cavern complex they were exploring.

I thought I could have my character, the party mage, cast a spider climb spell, take the rope and climb up the wall, along the ceiling of the under ground chamber, and come down the other wall, on the other side of the Chasm.

So I told Mr. Army “ I have my mage cast Spider Climb” and I begin climbing up the wall, carrying one end of the rope”

Mr Army replied “ all right, you go over to the wall and nothing happens, you are not sticking to the wall. “

Puzzled, I asked Mr. Army “ what happened, my Mage cast the spell didn’t he?”

And Mr. Army replied “ read the last part of your spell description”

I looked at it and exclaimed, “ my character has to eat a live spider?” Mr. Army nodded affirmative. Every one at the table exclaimed “eeeewwww”

My character ate his spider, holding his nose, and we got across the chasm.

I will never forget that moment, and after that, I always remembered to read my spell description, and to take notes on 3x5 cards.

When I later was worried about writing a term paper, Mr. Army assured me “ don’t worry you have already done research…remember looking up those spells for your character and taking notes on 3x5 cards….?”

Mr. Army also ran the Diplomacy club....which I was in. then things really got messy, playing Diplomacy, but that is another story for another thread.

There have been lots of GMs over the years. I have GMed lots over the years. As Mr Bell has said, I have learned something from all the GMs I have played under.

However, I'm not my Favorite GM. My Boarding School History teacher was one of my favorite and most influential GMs. He was also by the way a good teacher, and he brought that into the games he ran.

In PFS there have been lots of excellent GMs. Nathan Meyers, Art Lobell, Sean Hans, David Montgomery, Don Walker, Dan Donnelly, Steve Miller, Jesse Riggs, many more. Its always nice to learn something new.

Silver Crusade ***** Venture-Captain, Vermont—Brattleboro aka ElyasRavenwood

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I will have a 9 year old point out all of the holes in my egomaniacal plans, and plug them.

Silver Crusade ***** Venture-Captain, Vermont—Brattleboro aka ElyasRavenwood

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I have a 2nd level Nagaji fighter that has a 20 Str and wields a Tetsubo....the big iron studded club. No one remembered that this character did lots of damage with his big stick thumping troglodites. The other players at the table remembered that he ate 1/2 of the coy in Amara Li's coy pond at a party before being told they were not part of the buffet...........or that he carried a small cage full of little fluffy song birds...snack food....or that he slept through half of a combat snoring loudly and had to be kicked repeatedly until he woke up to fight in the third round of combat.

Gnoams your getting lots of advice......I would suggest have fun! This is a game after all.

Silver Crusade ***** Venture-Captain, Vermont—Brattleboro aka ElyasRavenwood

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you hear silence at the table when you ask " so can anyone use my character's cure light wounds wand?"

Silver Crusade

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That would be interesting running a campaign with the demons over running things, and trying to survive.

Silver Crusade

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To answer the OP's question, some of us simply like the variety of having divine magic/arcane magic and psionics.

As Dabbler pointed out, making sure there is transparency between psionics and magic, avoids an awful lot of headaches. Spell Resistance= Power Reistance etc.

I house rule and go a little further Spell craft= Psi Craft, and Knowledge Arcane = Knowledge Psionics.

So if someone has Knowledge Arcana, they can use that knowledge to identify a psionic effect.

If someone has Spell Craft they can identify psionic powers being manifested and vice versa.

I found this saves an awful lot of trouble. But each to his own.

Silver Crusade ***** Venture-Captain, Vermont—Brattleboro aka ElyasRavenwood

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I for one hope it doesn't get retired. What harm would there be if there were two "seeker" arcs?

Silver Crusade ***** Venture-Captain, Vermont—Brattleboro aka ElyasRavenwood

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I tell them not to worry, ask questions give things a try.....

I tell them that I learned the game by playing it....

Have fun....laugh.......Its only a game.....

Silver Crusade

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When you have a Fighter Thief Mage and Cleric....or as they are now called Fighter, Rogue, Wizard, Cleric in your party you have the "basics" covered.

The fighter can directly engage a monster, both dealing out steady significant damage, and he is able to endure a monster's physical attacks; with armor deflecting many of the blows, and with those blows that land, the fighter's hit points enable him to stay in the fight.

The Rogue's skill set can provide scouting, disarming traps, social negotiation, etc, and he can position himself so he can back stab, or "sneak attack" as it is now called to cause extra damage and further wear down the monster.

The Wizard can use his magic to deal deal direct damage via spells like magic missle etc, provide utility like the fly spell, provide now what is it called now? Battlefield control ? to take specific enemies out of the fight by putting them to sleep/ dropping them in a pit/ Walling them off with a wall of fire spell etc and provide party "buffing" with spells like cats grace bull strength etc..

The cleric can with his divine magic can provide "buffing" for the party with bull strength bless prayer etc. The cleric also provides excellent healing via the cure spells, and the cleric also can cast such spells as cure disease, cure blindness, restoration, regeneration, raise dead etc, to help the party out when bad things happen to their characters. They also have Channel positive energy which allows for healing in a 30' burst, and can damage undead and evil outsiders with the right feats. The cleric, with their D8 hit points, +1/3 Base Attack bonus, Medium Armor, Favored Weapon, the ability to cast spells in armor and "Buffing" spells can wade into combat along side of the fighter and at times surpass the fighter.

I know this is an over simplification of things, and not a direct answer to your question, but it helps to see how Arcane and Devine magic is used by their wielders in a party to see what they are traditionally used for.

One final note, with these four basic "food groups" covered your party should be able to handle just about everything the GM throws at you. You won't need to compensate. for the lack of a skill set.

Silver Crusade ***** Venture-Captain, Vermont—Brattleboro aka ElyasRavenwood

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I don't know if there is one.

The Pathfinder Society Primer is an excellent source of information about the Pathfinder Society.

Here is a quick summation of what has happened in the society thus far.

We are in our sixth season of PFS

The season are Season 0, Season 1, Season 2, Season 3, Season 4, and now Season 5.

Season 0 was written under 3.5 D&D rules.

There was no "meta plot " that I am aware of for Seasons 0 and 1 although there were a couple of linked adventures

Throughout seasons 0, 1 and 2 there was the "Faction war".
here is a paragraph of text describing the faction war on page 8 of Version 2.2 of the Guide to PFS organized play 4/6/10.

"At present, five shadowy, nation-based factions struggle for secret and subtle dominance of Absalom—Andoran, Cheliax, Osirion, Qadira, and Taldor. These ancient and powerful nations have long been major players in Absalom’s affairs, each waxing and waning with the sands of time. Now, in the year 4710, they find themselves on equal footing in the City at the Center of the World, each poised to seize control of the city through political and economic maneuvering. They have their own unique reasons for wanting to control Absalom, but they all have one goal in common: they hope to one day turn this secret war into open and total control of the Inner Sea’s most strategically located mercantile metropolis."

Your character was part of one of those five national factions, and you would go on Faction missions to accumulate what was then called Prestige, (now Fame) and Prestige points. Which ever faction accumulated the most prestige points by year end (GENCON) won. After 3 seasons,(Season 0,1,and 2) the Andoran Faction won. The The Andran faction got a new symbol for their troubles, and their faction leader was promoted from captain to major. The Qadiran faction leader killed the Taldoran faction leader, I believe both were replaced, and the Cheliaxian faction leader, whose faction came in last was told she was in hot water. Do better or else.

In Season 2 the meta plot was called "year of the Shadow Lodge".

:
This was a civil war in the pathfinder society. A group of pathfinders, calling themselves the "shadow Lodge" were dissatisfied with the governing policies of the Decemverate, the council of ten who run the Pathfinder society, The policy they were most dissatisfied with was the the Decemverates desire to have powerful magic, artifacts etc turned over to the society by their field agents, then studied and if deemed dangerous locked in the vaults. The members of the Shadow lodge felt the Decemverate felt everything was dangerous and thus had everything locked into the vaults. They wanted to use the magic and artifacts for themselves, and thus increase their own power.

As you play through the shadow lodge arc scenarios every "shadow lodge" agent you come across and confront are evilly aligned ( there may be one or two neutrally aligned ones, but I cant remember them).

It is only until "Mantis Prey" the last scenario in the shadow lodge arc, you find out that Grand Master Torch started the "shadow Lodge" because he was dissatisfied with the way the Decemverate was treating their field agents, abandoning them and leaving them to horrible fates. You learn that Grand Master Torch was on a mission that went bad in Osirion many years ago, and was cursed and left for dead. He wanted to form a group of like minded pathfinders who would look after each other and keep the Decemverate in check.

Unfortunately someone named the "spider" gained control of a large portion the rogue shadow lodge pathfinders and led them into open revolt against the Pathfinder society.

Once the Decemverate find out it is Grand Master Torch behind the shadow lodge, they bring him into the fold, granting amnesty to his Shadow lodge followers, and promise that they will treat the rank and file better. you also take down the spider.

In season 3, it is called "Year of the Ruby Phenix".
Five new player factions are introduced: The Grand Lodge, The Shadow Lodge, The Lantern Lodge, The Silver Crusade, and lastly the Sczarni. (mafia)

:
In the first half of the season you are sent on missions to gather artifacts to help with the Ruby Phenix tournament.

The Ruby Phenix Tournament is a legendary martial arts tournament held once every 11 years in the fabled city of Goka, (Goka is basically the Absolom of the Dragon empires, the "Orient" of Golarion). In the middle of the season it is assumed the Pathfinder society sends a team of agents to compete in the Ruby Phenix tournament, ( the module of the same name) and win.
The Decemverat picks a the Hao Jin Tapestry as their prize for winning it.

The within the Hao Jin Tapestry is a demiplane, where a very powerful mage had secreted away all sorts of temples, pyramids from all sorts of time sand places.

Through the latter half of Season 3, the Pathfinders explore their new demi plane. They discover an infestation of Aspis Consortium agents. The Pathfinder society then fights to drive these invaders out of their demi plane.

In doing so, at the end of season 3 they discover the existence of the Cult of Llassalla.


Season 4 takes place in Varisia. it is called "Year of the Waking Rune"
:

In this season the pathfinders are up rooting the Cult of Lassalla. They are uncovering the cults plans. They plan to awaken the Rune Lord of SLoth: Krune. At the end of the season they defeat Krune.

At the end of the season the Amara Li ,the leader of the Lantern Lodge, decides to return to the Dragon Empires to focus on the growth of the Lantern lodge in their home territory. The Lantern lodge is no longer a legal faction for PCs to belong to. they get a free faction change.

Also at the end of the season Grand Master Torch reveals his true colors. After cornering a resurgent "Spider", he gets ahold of a list of the possible identities of the Decemverate, and kills her and vanishes. it would appear that Grand Master's Torch rejoining the society was only a ploy to gain this information. He leaves, and the Shadow lodge is dissolved. The Shadow Lodge is now no longer a legal faction for PCs to belong to. They get a free faction change.

The Pathfinders at the end of the season also discovered the location of a Dwarven Sky Citadell. It lay in the World Wound.


Season 5 is called "Year of the Demon"

:
we are in the first third of the season. The Pathfinder Society is working on mounting an expedition to the newly discovered dwarven sky citadel in the world wound.

The World wound is a rift into the Abyss which is infested by Demons. Neighboring Mendev is a nation of crusaders dedicated to Iomedae. They have erected a series of artifacts called Ward Stones, which keep the Demons penned in the World Wound, unable to teleport out.

At the start of season 5, Pathfinder special #5-0" Siege of the Diamond City" , which coincides with the beginning of the Adventure Path: Wrath of the Righteous",

The Ward Stones Fail. The Demons boil forth. Currently the Pathfinder Society is helping The Queen of Mendev, and the Mendev Crusaders, defend Mendev. They are also working on mounting their expedition into the World wound to get to this Sky Citadel. I believe the Dwarves of the Five King Mountians have agreed to help the pathfinder society but I am not sure.

That is all I know so far.

Oh I almost forgot Faction Missions have been set aside. Now you have a secondary mission which you have to figure out.

Silver Crusade

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The Quite-big-but-not-BIG Bad wrote:

Good point!

Side note: while I do like Golarion, there have been a few things that I rather dislike (androids and star trek-ish civilizations on other planets, really?) and a lot of the background is becoming rather... unwieldy for newcomers. I'm really curious if Paizo is gonna publish more settings. I loved Eberron and, while a bit before my time, I loved what I heard about Planescape, Spelljammer and Dark Sun.

One thing to keep in mind my kobold head wearing goblin friend is that Golarion used a "kitchen sink" design philosophy.

Varisia, their first area, is pretty close to a traditional fantasy setting. Around it you have variations...or options if you like. To the north is the Land of the Linorm kings= vikings. Next to that is the land of Irrisien, eternal winter white witches (Chronicles of Narnia, Russian mythology) Land of the Mammoth lords (pleistocene megafauna.....cimerian barbarians?)
Next to that you have the World Wound (Demons Demons Demons). Mendev ( crusaders against the demons). Numaria (Expedition to the Barrier Peaks, Thundar the barbarian Tech space robots etc) Ustalov ( gothic horror ravenloft)

Think of all of these areas as optional....if you don't like Numeria in you home campaign you dont have to use it.

I don't like guns....which means I don't like Alkenstar. When ever I run a home campaign, i tell the players that a volcano....or some fool gunsmith, blew Alkenstar up.....no guns.

The campaign world is designed for you to put in parts you want and leave out parts you don't want. But they have lots of stuff thrown in there so everyone can have something they want to play with.

I hope this helps

Silver Crusade ***** Venture-Captain, Vermont—Brattleboro aka ElyasRavenwood

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Eric, I am sure you know, there are lots of ways to play Pathfinder, (and Pathfinder Society Organized Play) and there are lots of ways to make a myriad of characters.

I have a 14 level Mystic Theurge in PFS. This character has now been kicking around for 4 years .
Being one of my first PFS characters I made some mistakes making the character. He has the extra channel and selective channel feats, excellent for a first level cleric, but perhaps not so useful for a mystic theurge. My character's wizard levels are in necromancy, and I mistakenly chose conjuration and transmutation as opposition schools....another mistake. At the time I was tickled that I had a character (3rd level cleric/ 1st level Necromancer) whom, with the Turn Undead feat, and the Necromancer Command Undead ability, could both turn and command the undead. After a while I realized that this wasn't going to work in the long run, so I then went into the Mystic Theurge class. So as you can see I didn't map this character out 3 levels ahead.

I just played him a couple of weekends ago at a convention called Council of Five Nations (in Schectady NY, Near Albany) at the "seeker" table. He wasn't the big damage dealer, that job fell to the paladin and monks and evoker at the table, but I think my character did his job in supporting the other characters with buff spells, and some evocation spells, and lots of utility spells.

I guess Eric, all I am saying is that there is plenty of room in PFS for a character who has been mapped out for 18 levels, and one who has been more "organically" grown without allot of planning.

Silver Crusade ***** Venture-Captain, Vermont—Brattleboro aka ElyasRavenwood

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Guns are a very divisive issue in much of a similar way psionics is a divisive issue.

I think there are lots of players and GMs alike who would be perfectly happy to see guns removed from PFS play. So I think there would be by extension be a bit of a backlash if the campaign cordinators began making more "gun" archtypes and guns more available beyond the occasional boon sheet.

But again this is just my opinion.

Silver Crusade ***** Venture-Captain, Vermont—Brattleboro aka ElyasRavenwood

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This is an interesting question.

I may as well post my Seeker character. I made this character now 4 years ago at the 2009 Carnage on the Mountain convention in Vermont.

VC Fatum Aedituus Venificus ( N Cleric of Pharasma 3rd / Necromancer 3rd / Mystic Theurge 8)

1) Serve Pharasma
2) Pursuit of knowledge / philosophy / enlightenment
2) Accumulation of arcane spells / arcane knowledge/ research
3) Supporting his friends and fellow pathfinders on his missions
4) Serving the Pathfinder Society
5) eventually establishing his own lodge/ secure academic teaching &research position
6) Andoran- At the time there were only five factions. they were contesting for control of Absalalom. As a Player, I didn't want to see Cheliax win, so I thought having this character in the Andoran faction would help prevent this. In hindsight I think this character would have been better in the Osirion faction. So my character is loyal to the Andoran faction, but he isn't a zelot.

If asked to do something against the tenets of his Pharasman faith by either the Decemverate, another VC, or Major Colson of the Andoran Faction, he would refuse the request. If pressed he would resign, pointing out that he has worked loyally for the society (and the Andoran Faction ) for years, and if they want to retain his loyalty and service, they should ask him to do things he can do. After all, He could easily serve the church of Pharasma.

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Cards, Maps Subscriber

Mind shadows put out by Green Ronin has psionics in it. Its "Indian" themed. The Secrets of Sarlona, part of the Eberon Setting had psionics

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