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Danse Macabre

DrDeth's page

5,322 posts. 18 reviews. No lists. 1 wishlist.


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Zhayne wrote:
the secret fire wrote:
Zhayne wrote:
Spook205 wrote:


2e used to balance its good spells by giving them non-mechanical, or non-obvious drawbacks. Haste was great. Improved your speed, made you made of win but...

Each casting of it on you ate a year of your life.

Which was no drawback or balancing mechanism at all, since you were most likely to die LONG before all that became an issue, or you were an Elf. Lose a year, big whoop.
I take it you didn't play earlier editions.
I played all of 'em, from the original Red Box where elf was a class.

Darn Kid! Get off my lawn!


johnnythexxxiv wrote:
Diego Rossi wrote:
Xexyz wrote:
Zhayne wrote:
So you use that slot for a spell that breaks the game by itself.
Kinda curious which 3rd level arcane spell "breaks the game by itself" so my sorcerer knows to pick it up next time he levels.

You don't know that even cantrips break the game?

:P

Yup, create water wreaks havoc on survival stories. And anywhere else where being able to summon forth thousands of gallons of water a day could be problematic.

Altho it is true that the board for Outdoor Survival was used heavily in early D&D, this is a Fantasy RPG, and playing a survival game is best left to other venues. Not to mention being boring as hell.


Undone wrote:
Perhaps a better question line would be why on earth do you like low magic is more fun? Even Aragorn has a magic weapon.

So did Frodo, Sam, Merry, Pippin, Gandalf, likely Legolas (Galadriel gave him a "special" bow, but remember the elves rarely say anything is "magic"), and if you beleive the Official Licensed RPG,also Boromir and Gimli.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

Actually, I think few games of whatever level of magic are played a lot beyond 14th level.

Our main game got to 15th, then ended.

I did have a 3.5 game get to 18th, and a 3.0 game get Epic.

And of course some of our early AD&D and OD&D games got crazy high.

This is why I am not terribly concerned there are some issues with very high level games.


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Avatar-1 wrote:
There's a bit of talk about how other editions did it better - I'd love to know what the wording was in those editions. Can someone quote them?

http://deltasdnd.blogspot.com/2010/04/spells-through-ages-haste.html

(AD&D spell) Haste: ... When this spell is cast, affected creatures function at double their normal movement and attack rates. Thus, a creature moving at 6" and attacking 1 time per round would move at 12" and attack 2 times per round. Spell casting is not more rapid. The number of creatures which can be affected is equal to the level of experience of the magic-user, those creatures closest to the spell caster being affected in preference to those farther away, and all affected by haste must be in the designated area of effect. Note that this spell negates the effects of a slow spell (see hereafter). Additionally, this spell ages the recipients due to speeded metabolic processes. Its material component is a shaving of licorice root. [1E AD&D PHB, p. 74]

3E:
Haste: ... The transmuted creature moves and acts more quickly than normal. This extra speed has several effects. On its turn, the subject may take an extra partial action, either before or after its regular action. The subject gains a +4 haste bonus to AC. The subject loses this bonus whenever it would lose a dodge bonus. The subject can jump one and a half times as far as normal. This increase counts as an enhancement bonus. Haste dispels and counters slow. [3.0 SRD]
http://dnd.wizards.com/articles/features/basicrules?x=dnd/basicrules
5th ed
Haste
3rd-level transmutation
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: 30 feet
Components: V, S, M (a shaving of licorice root)
Duration: Concentration, up to 1 minute
Choose a willing creature that you can see within range.
Until the spell ends, the target’s speed is doubled, it
gains a +2 bonus to AC, it has advantage (this means roll twice take the best, which is HUGE) on Dexterity
saving throws, and it gains an additional action on each
of its turns. That action can be used only to take the
Attack (one weapon attack only), Dash, Disengage, Hide,
or Use an Object action.
When the spell ends, the target can’t move or take
actions until after its next turn, as a wave of lethargy
sweeps over it.


Matthew Downie wrote:
You could replace Haste with a spell that increases martial damage output by 33% or so - keep the teamwork aspect, but lose the weird visual imagery of everyone moving in speeded up motion. But I don't think that bothers many people anyway.

No, in fact it's rather iconic in Fantasy.


Mark Seifter wrote:
ohako wrote:
This may have been asked before, but: Is there any chance that one of these FAQ Fridays something will pop up for a player companion?
I think if we tried to pull that, other teams would tell us what Glinda told the Wicked Witch of the West right before the latter left Munchkinland.

Which was?


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Mythic Evil Lincoln wrote:


Perhaps it is too good, but in all honesty I would rather it be a spell that makes teaming up with a bunch of martials into an effective tactic.

Haste enforces teamwork, and lets the martials become over-the-top-action stars. The caster gets to know they're getting a better return on their spell investment, everyone wins.

This is one of the few intersections between magic and combat that actually doesn't completely trample on martial character types. It creates a situation where casters and martials need each other to function at peak performance, and that's good for the game.

If anything, I would say that the whole of spellcasting should be more like haste vs. fireball.

Imagine if all of the most effective spells were best used on other characters, and allowed them such time in the spotlight.

Right- Haste is a perfect spell. It is critical, yes. But it boosts martials far more than casters.

Haste is one of the reasons why the "Caster/Martial" disparity" is (at many tables) not a significant thing as the group plays as a TEAM.

Haste is one of the reasons why our Fighter in a 14th level is still by far the most dangerous member of the team

Take away Haste, and you get rid of a critical part of Caster/Martial teamwork.

Casters are back to Fireball.


Tarantula wrote:
Lincoln Hills wrote:
Mergy wrote:
I think a zombie's natural armour would probably prevent most small fish from munching. There are certainly no rules for zombies decomposing, neither in air nor water.
There are no rules for defecation either, but that doesn't mean the GM is not within his or her rights to assume that the characters poop.
There aren't rules for any non-dead creatures decomposing. Undead are not dead, and so they don't decompose. Assume the magic of the spell is holding them together, the same way that it makes them capable of acting.

Decomp or not, it's not gonna stop crabs, etc from eating it.


The croc will rot and be eaten by small scavengers. In fact in the ocean that will take a surprising short period of time. Crabs are really good at that.


TriMarkC wrote:
DrDeth wrote:

Or to put in in what really happens with a Fumble-crazy DM:

After ten rounds of combat your Epic Fighter has managed to both break and drop his weapon, not to mention critically wounding himself.

This is good as the Spellcasters dont need you anyway as they cant fumble, so you might as well be the Comedy Relief.

Next time, just bring a commoner with a rubber chicken, maxed out ranks in Perform Comedy and call him "Shemp".

Spellcasters can "fumble" - they can roll a 1 just like anyone else.

You dont even roll to start with on most of the best spells.


Or to put in in what really happens with a Fumble-crazy DM:

After ten rounds of combat your Epic Fighter has managed to both break and drop his weapon, not to mention critically wounding himself.

This is good as the Spellcasters dont need you anyway as they cant fumble, so you might as well be the Comedy Relief.

Next time, just bring a commoner with a rubber chicken, maxed out ranks in Perform Comedy and call him "Shemp".


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I have said it a thousand times "You cant solve OOC problems IC".

Or:

"I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it." - George Bernard Shaw


Tarantula wrote:
Riuken wrote:
Tarantula wrote:
Arikiel wrote:
It's almost like they'll have to treat combat as a life and death situation rather then just a stream of video game style encounters.
It's almost like they're not heroes at all, but just joe schmoe trying to survive.

Sometimes that's the point, though. Other times it's a mistake. Do you want high heroics but low magic? You'll have a lot of houseruling to do. If all you want is low magic grim, gritty, and deadly then lacking quick healing probably helps with the type of game you're trying to play.

It's been said before, but to sum it up:
People play low magic Pathfinder because they want a different feeling game, but still want to use the Pathfinder rules, whether for familiarity or cost. They also want to be able to convince people to play it by saying, "It's still a Pathfinder game, but X, Y, and Z are different."

Thats like saying, "Pathfinder is still D&D 3.5 but X Y and Z are different." That's how much you would have to change in order to get low magic to work effectively. I guess I don't see the point.

Actually, a lot more than that, depending on how Low you go.

Ultra-Low magic is more different from PF than PF is different from OD&D.


Orfamay Quest wrote:
Laurefindel wrote:
DrDeth wrote:
But since both PF and IH are D20, what do you need from PF to run a D20 low magic game?

That's a legitimate question. Iron Hero is a good product.

People like familiarity. Perhaps IH doesn't feel enough like Pathfinder; actually, IH has a very distinct vibe. Would Pathfinder still feel like Pathfinder once you remove X, modify Y and add Z is yet another legitimate question. Still people are attached to their favourite product and well, people are not always rational about that.

I like your posts and you bring some very valid point to the conversation DrDeth, but sometimes it sounds like "you'll fail, don't bother trying".

But what would a low-magic Pathfinder feel like? I don't think it would feel like Pathfinder to be honest. Pathfinder is more or less defined as a high magic game, and that is one of the things that actually distinguishes it from 3rd edition. Possibly even THE thing.

You are starting from the wrong point, basically.

You can cut back the magic. Get rid of Ye Olde Magik Shoppe. Nerf some spells, define others more tightly. Limit splatbooks.


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Laurefindel wrote:
DrDeth wrote:
But since both PF and IH are D20, what do you need from PF to run a D20 low magic game?

That's a legitimate question. Iron Hero is a good product.

People like familiarity. Perhaps IH doesn't feel enough like Pathfinder; actually, IH has a very distinct vibe. Would Pathfinder still feel like Pathfinder once you remove X, modify Y and add Z is yet another legitimate question. Still people are attached to their favourite product and well, people are not always rational about that.

I like your posts and you bring some very valid point to the conversation DrDeth, but sometimes it sounds like "you'll fail, don't bother trying".

Well, to some extent. I mean, some modifications to the PF magic system can be done without making it "Iron Heroes in Golarion". I dont like "ye Olde Magik Shoppe", but I tend to hand out cool specialized loot. I have put some nerfs on spells and spell casters. I agree that D&D breaks down when casters can do 9th level spells.

I wouldn't mind seeing a PF version of IH.

Bot too often "Low magic' means a DM who is over-reacting to some super-optimized build with some kludgy "fixes" that are worse than the problem.

Or DM's that want to run Iron Heroes type game but when they advert for the game they get no players, so they say "Low magic E2 Pathfinder' instead. To them I say- be honest. Or just try a few small fixes.


Laurefindel wrote:
DrDeth wrote:
What 1st level spell creates food?

Goodberry doesn't create food, bu it turns negligible sustenance into "no need to care about food" sustenance.

DrDeth wrote:

And yeah, PF is a Fantasy Roleplaying Game. Not a Mundane Roleplaying Game. Most people are bored to hell with survival instead of adventuring, when your encounter for the day is:

3 roots, 25 berrys and a few grubs. (Roll to see if you can keep that grub down!)

If most people want to play Pathfinder High-Magic Fantasy RPG, then most people will play Pathfinder High-Magic Fantasy RPG. This thread was made to ask why some would like to play Pathfinder not-so-High-Magic Fantasy RPG (who's talking about Pathfinder Mundane RPG anyways).

Iron Hero is nothing but a house-ruled version of d20, but low-magic (and published). Why would creating a low-magic version of Pathfinder be less viable than Iron Hero.

"Why don't people play Iron Hero instead" is a valid question however.

You need to have fresh picked berries for goodberry, thus you need to hunt for food. And it will take 3 castings a day for most parties.

Why would creating a low-magic version of Pathfinder be less viable than Iron Hero? Well sure, if the Devs want to publish such a book. But usually it's a kludge of houserules.

But since both PF and IH are D20, what do you need from PF to run a D20 low magic game?


Torchlyte wrote:
Pupsocket wrote:
IMO, a proper Caster Cleric is at Heavy Encumbrance in his Full Plate & Tower Shield. Neither or which he's proficient in, but proficiency's for beatsticks.
Dat -18 to attack rolls.

Not to mention a inability to cast spells and hold a weapon at the same time.


mplindustries wrote:
No, I mean stuff like simple survival stories. There are pages and pages of rules about going without food/water, drowning, long distance walking, fatigue, hot/cold environments, etc., but all of those things are easily overcome by spells (level 1 spells or even cantrips for most of those) with a 100% success rate. It's boring, and those spells do nothing else except totally remove...

What 1st level spell creates food?

And yeah, PF is a Fantasy Roleplaying Game. Not a Mundane Roleplaying Game. Most people are bored to hell with survival instead of adventuring, when your encounter for the day is:
3 roots, 25 berrys and a few grubs. (Roll to see if you can keep that grub down!)

There are such game systems. They are fun.

Why try and warp Pathfinder into one of them?

It's like trying to play Monopoly without Monopolies... or money.

I really enjoyed playing Iron Heroes, which is a nice D20 RP game- and which is even Fantasy. Wny not play a game built and intended for Low magic?


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JoeJ wrote:
Undone wrote:
The issue is that some spells are required for the game to function on a basic level. You can literally not play the game without healing magic, at least not in any significant capacity. Restoration is a pretty much mandatory spell to exist. You can play without raise dead/breath of life but high level monsters sort of expect to kill at least one player sometimes (Take a look at banshee's or demiliches). Without remove disease/curse a simple CR 5 mummy will kill at LEAST one member of the group. Heck you can't even HAVE a mission in hell/the abyss/another plane without sufficiently high magic but those are not something for everyone. The problem with low magic is the game simply doesn't function without access to specific removal/healing spells. You could however build a nearly functional system banning ARCANE magic.

First of all, low magic does not mean no magic.

Second, not having easy access to healing doesn't make the game unplayable, it makes the game play differently. Powerful monsters like the mummy, demilich and banshee you cited become challenges that require preparation and clever tactics.

Without ready access to healing, a mummy or a banshee isn't just an encounter, it's the entire adventure....

No, without ready access to healing even random orcs or bandits are "the entire adventure"

I have done this. Boring as hell.

It goes like this:
1. Encounter. Any encounter which is challenging enough to lose HP.
2. Rest.
3. Get random encounter during rest.
4. Rest some more
5. Death spiral or boredom ensues.


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That sort of stuff sometimes works, but not if he thinks he is gonna steal the stuff if he "wins". He is a newb. Newbs need to learn a very important thing about D&D- it is a TEAM game, not a PvP game, like most other games are.


Usual Suspect wrote:
I'm Hiding In Your Closet wrote:
Skeld wrote:

I dislike anyone under the age of 60 that comes to gaming wearing a fedora.

-Skeld

What about top hats?
Or Stetsons. I've had mine since long before they were considered cool.

I have a Stetson fedora, the Open Road.


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Qakisst Vishtani wrote:
DrDeth wrote:

Is this just a game to see if he can get in, or will he steal stuff from you and the party? If so, there are two answers:

Sit down and talk to him OOC, like adults, and explain this is NOT fun for you.

and

If he continues, invite his character out of the party. Refuse to adventure with him.

The GM has talked to him; but if you've never dealt with an ADHD person you won't quite understand why lessons like this are very slow to skink in.

And unfortunately his girlfriend is playing the paladin, and she's awesome. We're stuck with the package deal.

Simple, just dont let him run a a rogue. Some newbs are just incapable of understanding that it's a team game, and a rogue isnt supposed to use his skills vs the party.


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Is this just a game to see if he can get in, or will he steal stuff from you and the party? If so, there are two answers:

Sit down and talk to him OOC, like adults, and explain this is NOT fun for you.

and

If he continues, invite his character out of the party. Refuse to adventure with him.


KenderKin wrote:
Scott Betts wrote:
DrDeth wrote:
I did a game where the Wizards are the Bad Guys. Hard to play a wizard then, eh?
Arguably the most famous, well-loved D&D character of all time is a drow in a setting where I can totally picture someone sitting behind the DM screen with a scowl saying, "No, you can't play a drow. All of the drow are Bad Guys."
Actually it was the opposite everyone was trying to play a drow elf and tsr kept saying no, until they realized the monetary error of their ways!

Actually, playing a drow in a party would still have been bad, not that Drizzt was a solo for much of his adventuring life.

It's one thing to want to play a drow, and have fun with being hunted, hated and shunned- it's another to FORCE the rest of your party to be hunted, hated and shunned. It's damn selfish is what it is.


John Kretzer wrote:
Kthulhu wrote:
I just don't get having one character concept and being totally inflexible about it. Maybe because when start up a game as a player, my toughest decision is picking one of the dozens of character concepts I generally have floating around in my head. If you tell me "No, you can't be a _____", then I'm just going to present one of my other character concepts.
And I don't get why a GM is soo inflexible with their campaigns. If you tell me "I want to play a _____" than I just change my campaign so it fits.

I want to play a Space Marine. Or Superman. Or a 9yo vampire street hooker. Or The Tarrasque.

I did a game where the Wizards are the Bad Guys. Hard to play a wizard then, eh?

I dont allow guns in my game, since it is Medieval.


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Insain Dragoon wrote:
DrDeth wrote:
Morzadian wrote:

If Pathfinder Unchained isn't edited by Erik Mona and Lisa Stevens (fantastic editing work on APG), we will have another Advanced Class Guide disaster to look forward to.

We can't have "another Advanced Class Guide disaster " as there was no disaster in the first place.

Unless you are holding Paizo to such a high level that anything short of perfection is "a disaster".

I dunno about you, but I've never seen another Pathfinder book get put down because of its cover. My friend has purchased every first printing Paizo core book, but when he saw the ACGs cover he just laughed and skipped it.

"If the front cover has that big an error I don't want to see what's inside!"

http://paizo.com/paizo/blog/v5748dyo5lgcs?A-Tale-of-Two-Covers

"And to be clear, the misprint concerns about three square inches on the front cover. The logo on the spine is correct. The logo on the cover page is correct. The logo on the back is correct. The logo on every spread in the book is correct. One image link broke, to one logo. Yes, it's the most important one, and yes, that's very embarrassing, but ultimately it makes no difference to the book's content. Many folks I've shown the book to did not even notice the difference, as the logos are very similar."

Wow, gee, gosh, that sure is a terrible, horrible error that stops that supplement from being enjoyed!

not.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pupsocket wrote:


Reasonably clear intent > semantics.

The PF devs don't write to rules lawyer standard. I think they ought to hire somebody who did, but it's an indisputable fact that they don't.

I really dont want a CRB that is 12" thick and costs $400, thankyouverymuch.


Hama wrote:
Also everything remotely useful in the "gear" section of the CRB or Ultimate Equipment becomes completely useless after level 5. Except sunrods.

Alchemist fire and Acid is useful until high level, unless all the party is spellcasters. We still use Antitoxin at level 14.

Not many spellcasters stop needing a Spell Component Pouch and some will need a spellbook thru Epic. Alchemist need a alchemy crafting kit. And so forth.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Orthos wrote:


People have been requesting, begging, and/or demanding 3.5 psionics/making Dreamscarred Press's psionics official Pathfinder material for years now as well. If Paizo hasn't bent to all that already, what makes you suddenly think they will now?

A few people. Most either dont care or are happy just to buy and use Dreamscarred Press's products as is.


Anguish wrote:


There's a third category... HAZARDS.

In the original post, there was a very thin floor designed to not support a person's weight. That's not necessarily a trap. An aptly-named trap door... that's a trap. But a large segment of floor that simply can't be walked on? That's a hazard.

If the guards, etc have a way to get across it, or if it was designed that way-then it's a trap.


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Morzadian wrote:

If Pathfinder Unchained isn't edited by Erik Mona and Lisa Stevens (fantastic editing work on APG), we will have another Advanced Class Guide disaster to look forward to.

We can't have "another Advanced Class Guide disaster " as there was no disaster in the first place.

Unless you are holding Paizo to such a high level that anything short of perfection is "a disaster".


3 people marked this as a favorite.
knightnday wrote:

Finally got time to do a more detailed answer.

[

Quote:
  • Employing prominent NPCs/GMPCs
  • Yes. NPCS or GMPCS are part of the GMs arsenal of toys to play with. The idea is to fill in the world or the party, to give the players people to deal with in any manner possible. Otherwise it might get boring if there was no one of interest around.

    Note there's a large difference between a NPC and a GMPC (which is a special case of NPC, true).

    Generally, when GMPC is used, what is meant is a Character similar to or more powerful than the PC's and who adventures with the party on a more or less constant basis. This can be REALLY annoying and is often abused.

    prominent & interesting NPCs= Good
    prominent & interesting GMPCs= Usually bad.


    Arnwyn wrote:
    Orfamay Quest wrote:
    So play Call of Cthulhu. Why try to develop a set of house rules to make Pathfinder into CoC instead of just playing CoC in the first place?

    Because some people might like the core 'chassis' underlying d20. d20 + modifiers vs. AC or a DC, cyclical initiative, move/standard/full-round actions, easy to use movement system, a class-based system, straightforward and easy to understand/implement multiclassing... that sort of stuff.

    Some people (inexplicably) forget that the above stuff has value to some people. The ubiquitous magic doesn't have to go along with the rest of the basic mechanics of d20. Why learn a whole new action/resolution/movement/etc system when the basic core works exactly how you want it to... and when WotC did close to no analysis of the impacts of magic when they released the 3.0 PHB?

    (With all that said - is there a CoC d20? I thought I heard that that might exist...? If that is a real thing, then yeah, I'm with Orfamay Quest - why not play CoC d20?)

    Yes, there is a CoC D20 and also Iron Heroes which is very low magic D20 D&D.


    Orfamay Quest wrote:
    DrDeth wrote:
    Orfamay Quest wrote:
    Ed Reppert wrote:


    I get the impression that in many (most?) PF campaigns, if a player wants to buy a scroll, it [u]will[/u] be in the local magic emporium and every wide spot in the road has such a place.

    Well, by the official RAW, it has a 75% chance of being in the local magic emporium, and, yes, every wide spot in the road has such a place. A single isolated farmhouse (a "thorp") will sell you a scroll of almost any zero or first level spell.

    A Thorp is not a single isolated farmhouse.

    Cite? In Pathfinder it means a settlement with a population of less than 20. 1 is less than 20.

    One person is not a settlement. One family is not a settlement.


    Orfamay Quest wrote:
    Ed Reppert wrote:


    I get the impression that in many (most?) PF campaigns, if a player wants to buy a scroll, it [u]will[/u] be in the local magic emporium and every wide spot in the road has such a place.

    Well, by the official RAW, it has a 75% chance of being in the local magic emporium, and, yes, every wide spot in the road has such a place. A single isolated farmhouse (a "thorp") will sell you a scroll of almost any zero or first level spell.

    A Thorp is not a single isolated farmhouse.

    Actually, it means the same as Hamlet, but somehow in D&D it means small hamlet of less than 20 but more than one family.


    gamer-printer wrote:
    Tarantula wrote:
    How would anyone heal in that game? Just keep rest for days until you're back to full?
    Or do what was done on tough encounters in 1e - if it looks like too much damage is being dealt - runaway. Avoid encounters that are too dangerous, and runaway if you didn't realize it was a too dangerous encounter.

    Many monsters have a faster speed.


    Laurefindel wrote:
    Tarantula wrote:
    How would anyone heal in that game? Just keep rest for days until you're back to full?

    With skill (heal) and rest, you can go from 0 to full in about 3 days, without houserules, alchemical substances, not-quite-magic-but-almost healing slaves and herbal remedies or campaign specific rules.

    Yeah, we tried that. Note, there's random encounters too. So you have an encounter. Rest. Get attacked. Rest for that attack. Death spiral or it takes weeks to do a three day walk.

    NOT FUN.


    Riuken wrote:

    I'm planing a low-magic campaign where spells, spell-like abilities, and supernatural abilities don't work. The only exceptions are scrolls, weapons, armor, and shields.

    Try Iron Heroes!


    Heck, I'd like a complete list of Paizo PF feats, with that as a subcategory.


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    Splode wrote:

    So, my takeaway from this thread is that I should show up to a new game wearing a trillby and hypersexualized anime girl t-shirt, then play as a Psionic Lolicon Kender Antipaladin who rants about Linux and men's rights in a creepy little girl voice.

    Got it.

    Bang!

    (drags body away to join the others)

    ;-)


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    Liz Courts wrote:
    DrDeth wrote:
    Skeld wrote:

    I dislike anyone under the age of 60 that comes to gaming wearing a fedora.

    Most of them aren't really a fedora, and a real fedora looks very cool.
    If I'm remembering my millinery correctly, the thinner brim style is a trilby; fedoras have a wider brim—example here.

    Spot on!

    Good point, Liz.


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    Skeld wrote:
    JurgenV wrote:
    DungeonmasterCal wrote:
    Jacob Saltband wrote:
    Skeld wrote:

    I dislike anyone under the age of 60 that comes to gaming wearing a fedora.

    -Skeld

    *hides fedora behind his back*
    I'll be 51 in 6 days and by golly I want a classic broad brimmed fedora!
    A real fedora not a hipster hat

    Don't get me wrong, outside of a well-dressed elderly gentleman or an actor in a period piece, I always know what to expect from a conversation with a guy wearing a fedora (especially if he isn't wearing a suit and tie): a discussion on men's rights or Linux.

    I dont get the hat hate. There's no reason to hate a person based upon their choice of headgear. That's quite superficial.

    And I have been wearing fedoras for forty years, and I never bring up "a discussion on men's rights or Linux." I think your sample size is too small.

    Fedoras are cool. They keep the sun off you face, protecting you from skin cancer. They keep your head worm in the cold and dry in the rain.

    Hating hat wearers is like hating people who wear shoes based upon the fact that one of them was a jerk once.


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    Skeld wrote:

    I dislike anyone under the age of 60 that comes to gaming wearing a fedora.

    Most of them aren't really a fedora, and a real fedora looks very cool.


    Te'Shen wrote:


    Oh yeah... I forgot. Lest we forget, Gandalf, Saruman, Ragast, and a few others aren't wizards. They are Lesser Gods.
    ...

    Not even close. The closest thing would be lesser angels. Celestials.


    Laurefindel wrote:

    Still, Middle Earth is a low-magic setting, especially in the third age.

    Middle Earth has magic, so it isn't a no-magic setting. Some of it has a rather large scope, such as ignoring winter and natural decay in a whole country, making a volcano erupt or condemning a whole nation to become ghosts. Many locales seem to be able to act according to the will of an individual, such as the Old Forest with Old-man Willow or the high pass on the Caradhras, which are typically beyond the scope of typical D&D PC.

    Invisibility is a BIG thing, and only possible with the One Ring (although Gandalf implies that such can be granted by lesser rings as well). Scrying seems to be reserved to the three individuals in the world possessing a palantir (who all end-up being antagonists).

    Well, in The Hobbit, Gandalf vanishes with a blast of bright light. He also made Bilbo look like that's how he vanished. So, apparently- a flash, smoke, then re-appear is a common enough trick. Gandalf is also known to be able to counter any spell. He used a Blinding Light and Lightning spells, as well as blasting a stone bridge to pieces in one hit.

    Saruman controlled the weather, and made tens of thousands of UrukHai from slime down in pits (in others he bred them, but in the Histories it was made clear he "grew" them). He was able to Charm the WitchKing of Angmar with his Voice- a pretty good trick.

    Elrond also had the Gift of Foresight, without a Palantir. He could summon a flood.

    We actually only see one mage in action- Gandalf, who is given many limitations on usage of his power.

    Apparently there were other mages. Sauron disguises himself as "The Necromancer" and Saruman, Elrond and the rest assume he is just a rather powerful spellcaster of some sort. They simply accept that as unexceptional.

    Beorn doesnt trust magic users except Radagast- and thus he must have run into (and perhaps eaten) some of lower power (and it's clear he's never met Gandalf) . This then indicates that there are a number of adepts, hedge-casters and what not around.


    1 person marked this as a favorite.
    boring7 wrote:
    DrDeth wrote:
    boring7 wrote:


    Or, you know, power is all relative, they still could have just ridden giant eagles if the narrative hadn't demanded an epic journey of epicness,
    No. This meme keeps coming up, but it's completely wrong. The Eye and Will of Sauron would stop the Eagles and the Nazgul would make short work of them.
    band of murderhobos

    This term should be shot dead, and it especially doesnt apply to the Nine Walkers.


    1 person marked this as a favorite.

    Over time, there's no such thing as luck.

    So, your dice are simply poorly made (or your sample size not large enough). Get a few more, they are cheap.


    Trogdar wrote:

    @DrDeth - Perhaps I'm conflating the two things, but I think that the current magic system is a problem because casters have a literal garbage bag of options by mid level and the theoretical limit of those options keeps expanding with every new book WITHOUT any significant additional opportunity cost.

    When I think of mana or spell point based systems, I think of systems that grant scaling spell effects with far far far fewer spells known.

    It's true, Mana point systems can work that way, but not always* and the same with Vancian. It's not the system at all.

    * T&T is one example.


    boring7 wrote:


    Or, you know, power is all relative, they still could have just ridden giant eagles if the narrative hadn't demanded an epic journey of epicness,

    No. This meme keeps coming up, but it's completely wrong. The Eye and Will of Sauron would stop the Eagles and the Nazgul would make short work of them.

    About Bilbos Mithril shirt: it's not just a D&D Mithral shirt.
    http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Mithril
    "A kingly gift, Gandalf states that the Mithril-coat was actually worth more than the entire Shire and everything in it (though Gandalf says that he never told Bilbo, Frodo suspects Bilbo knew to some extent). Its value seems to have been even greater, however. After leaving Moria, the Fellowship has a chance to examine the shirt, and Gimli says, "I have never seen or heard tell of one so fair" and that Gandalf "undervalued it."

    It saved Frodo's life when he was nearly skewered by an Orc-chieftain in the Mines of Moria. Aragorn said the thrust was strong enough to skewer a wild boar, but the Orc's spear point could not penetrate the mithril-alloy armour coat. Yet, the leather shirt beneath the Mithril was punctured with the force of the blow and Frodo was bruised and in pain."
    http://www.henneth-annun.net/resources/things_view.cfm?thid=221

    "'Look, my friends!' he called. 'Here's a pretty hobbit-skin to wrap an elven-princeling in! If it were known that hobbits had such hides, all the hunters of Middle-earth would be riding to the Shire.'

    'And all the arrows of all the hunters in the world would be in vain,' said Gimli, gazing at the mail in wonder. 'It is a mithril-coat. Mithril! I have never seen or heard tell of one so fair. Is this the coat that Gandalf spoke of? Then he undervalued it. But it was well given!'...."

    The shirt is 100% arrow proof. Its value is not a mere 1000gps, but more than a entire county. It stops a critical hit from a mountain troll with nothing but non-lethal damage.

    The original Invulnerable Coat of Arnd was designed to mirror the shirt. I was around back then, you know.

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