I've already seen two template names that will let me pull off some horror-themed stuff I've been wanting to try for ages. Plus, as I've been looking at the template names, evil, mean, rotten, and deliciously nasty ideas have been forming in my head based around "normal monsters" (can you even USE those two words together??) being perverted into new fell beasts (via templates) through exposure to magical forces gone wild. I can't wait!
I want to see you take on the Talented Casters, because I *think* I know how you'd approach it, after looking at Talented Rogue/Ninja. I love it when you prove to me that I know how you think.
I also want to see you tackle the Alchemist, because ... because. :) (Honestly, it could - imo - likely be worked into Talented Arcanist or Talented Gunslinger...but I definitely want to see a Talented Tinkerer, in some shape/form/fashion.)
Please don't do the huge5000000pagebookofTalentedClassUniversalAwesomeness because I can't go that long with no Owen Genius fix!!! But, whatever you do end up releasing, I'm buying it. ;)
Talented Sorcerer. Hmm. "Bloodline Transformation" could be handled like the Ki Pool in Talented Rogue - an option that can powerfully shape the very underpinnings of a character, provide some spice in her abilities, or not even be present. Now ... as to the exact mechanics ... I leave that to the Rogue Genius!
Christina Stiles wrote:
Yes. Yes, indeed.
-books of pregens/sample NPCs (NPC Codex-style) using these classes (including talented builds - any left fro playtests? Compile them and release them!)
So the NPC Codex is the preferred standard of presentation? I've got a Talented Rogue build that I'm looking to finish up and release into the wild at some point (7-day weeks being away from home 15hrs or more a day is getting OLD, I tell ya's...)
I keep seeing certain topics/titles popping up in these threads. Interesting. And encouraging.
I had an insane amount of fun playing a Scout/Warlock under 3.5 rules, both as a multiclass character concept and as a gestalt character concept. The whole "move and get extra damage on your ranged attack" was crazy cool and I was able to pay attention to developing other parts of my character beyond his ranged attack and his armor. I'd like to see that again, under Pathfinder, if it can be done in a way that remains balanced against other base classes.
Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:
So if I (for an example) write a book that takes magic items and tweaks & reskins them as technological marvels, you'd jump all over it? I've seen *some* sci-fi stuff done with the gadgets feeling more like discrete pieces, rather than being part of an integrated system.
But what are the gadgets without a setting?
While using the T/rogue, I ran into what is likely just a misunderstanding on my part. The main question, boiled down, is - how do Ki Pool (edge) and High Jumper (talent) work together? A couple of quotes:
You have to have the Ki Pool edge to have the High Jumper talent, so they are obviously intended to work together. Does a T/Rog10 with the Ki Pool/Acrobatics Master/High Jumper chain reduce the DC of a high jump by 1/2 for Ki Pool and then by 1/2 again for High Jumper? (I'm seeing Luke coming out of the carbon-freezing chamber on Bespin, here!)
Thanks, folks! You've given me a *LOT* to think about and to discuss with my players. Mr. Fishy, your list is going to be very useful in helping my players narrow down what they are thinking of when they say "low magic" - thanks for the list of examples.
One of the first questions that came to my mind was did they want to play in a world that had once had a "full spectrum" of magic that disappeared (abruptly/slowly, partially/completely, recently/aeons past) or a world where magic has not yet fully developed. Roleplaying in a world that just underwent a "manaclypse" would be very different from playing in a world on the cusp of choosing between following magic or technology.
I'm getting the impression they want a not-fully-developed growth of magic, with alchemy and alchemists (and magesmith and tinkerer types) being far more common. So for this, I'm liking the concept of "monsters as loot" where you use their body-parts as part of the magic items. Ranger-types can make a great living procuring anatomical samples for study and use.
But knowledge of magic items would have to be...spotty. Arms & armor sure, because killing things is something we seem to know on a base level. Wondrous items because, wow, I need something to do X so I'll figure one out as I go. But because the "rules of magic" aren't yet understood, "stored spells" like wands & potions & such don't exist.
My main caster player loves the idea of having to be more creative with her spell-use, figuring out how to best apply meta-magic feats to her more limited spells in order to get the best use out of them.
I'm thinking a lot of supernatural creatures will not exist, focusing more on "realistic" animal/vermin types. Creatures that take a lot of damage to bring down will be far more common than creatures that need a lot of supernatural/magical assistance to take down.
(I more like the "magic faded/failed/was forgotten" approach, where ancient artifacts still work just fine, but few know anything about making or using them any more.)
As for casting classes, we were looking at two approaches - NO base caster classes at all & tweaking the Alchemist to more of the mad-scientist rather than the magical scientist *OR* capping caster classes at 3rd level spells with higher slots available for metamagicked spells. Hadn't thought about using a feat to gain access to higher level spells.
Master Craftsman makes an interesting approach to item crafting - only arms & armor and wondrous items, but available from non-casters. This would mainly help if we removed base casters.
We were looking at things like Ki Pools, Rogue magical talents, and the like to stand in for full spell-casting in place of base casters.
My group has routinely expressed interest in playing a low-magic fantasy campaign, but there isn't any solid consensus as to what, exactly, that entails. So, as I work some ideas from my side (as the uber-storyteller/GM), I thought I'd throw the general question out to the greater Paizo world ... In terms of game-mechanics, how do you see a low-magic fantasy world working? What trouble-spots do I need to pay attention to and plan for ahead of time to keep the game from derailing?
Something I tossed out as an off-the-cuff remark caught their attention and interest - setting the game in something like the Greek Isles around 50AD (ie: the eastern Med as depicted during the events in the New Testament), where there are civilizations, great civilizations, globe-spanning trade-routes, urban sprawls, and vast wilderness areas. No "New World frontiers," as such - plenty of wilderness in everyone's back yards yet. Maybe Bronze Age arms and armor from 3.5's A&EG.
Owen K. C. Stephens wrote:
I mentioned some of the Talented Class goodness to my chief non-resident player and added this exchange. His response, "O.O now he's gonna seduce MY wallet!!" (He is eagerly looking forward to the Talented Gunslinger.)
So I thought perhaps I had designed the A-Team as an all-T/Rogue party. But it seems perhaps Col Smith is a T/Cavalier with some T/Rogue milticlass. Great. T/Cav was an iffy purchase earlier ... but I should have known better. It may be #4 on the list of Talented Classes to pick up, but I'll have to pick it up.
Picked mine up and read through it last night. I worked REALLY hard at not looking at it as an editor, but simply as a GM/player/end-user. Also picked up the More Talents companion.
These two products absolutely sold me on the other three talented classes, as well as any more that show up.
I've already had so many character ideas that I may have to create a "Talented Rogues Gallery" just so I can work with all the concepts.
K-K, thanks for your time. I believe both the questions you bring up could not only be worded better/more accurately, but likely could stand to be individual full-blown surveys in their own rights.
I have 47 responses so far, which I think is a rather astonishing accomplishment. My thanks to each one who took the time to provide answers. Since I'm so close, I would love to hit 50 responses, then wrap it up and provide the response-data. That's just three more people.
Just a quick post-GenCon nudge to this and a heartfelt "Thank you!" to the folks who have taken the time to respond to this survey, both in terms of answering the questions and in providing feedback. More surveys are on the way, likely later this week.
Collected & expanded AA is high on my list. I would like to see a Tinkerer archetype added for AA, as the Inventor just doesn't really fit the mold of the guy who is always tweaking on his jalopy or fiddling with her radio-rig to get a little bit more from it...
An AA pulp setting would be keen.
More support for teaser-rules introducted in AA (guns, vehicles, PLs, etc)
A post-apocalypse rules-set and setting would be mind-numbingly awesome! ;) (SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY, WotA!!!)
(I'm trying to figure out which SGG products I'm needing - lemme get back to you?)
Kyonko, what do you mean by "Genius Guide to Advanced Guns," exactly? I ask, because I've mentioned to Owen a while back that I'm working on a "gun-building system" for real-world to sci-fi weapons. (Also nice to see some pulp and sci-fi love in this thread!)
OmNomNid, I'm working on some stuff you might be interested in. Do you GM any?
(Not trying to steal SGG's thunder, I've just been talking to Owen a bit about some high- and ultra-tech stuff already. And if there's more interest than just me, well, YAY!)
I've had 32 responses in the first 24 hours of the survey. Thanks everyone for the support and input! I think I'm going to leave it active until after GenCon, so that folks who are busy having far too much fun without us can see it when they get caught up. ;) Then I'll have a new one or two and share the results from this one. So keep passing the word about this survey!
In the meantime, I have giant mutant hermit crabs to stat up...
Thanks, DmCal! This is a really cool learning process, even if it never actually affects the projects I'm working on personally. I figure from what I learn having made this survey, I'll create some new ones in the near future to get better data. My wife regularly tells me I should have been an Intel Analyst instead of a grunt...
As part of my learning new marketing skills, I just designed my first market-research survey on surveymonkey. (Thanks to Owen for posting something on Facebook that reminded me I needed to do this!) I would greatly appreciate a few minutes of your time to answer a few quick questions about shopping for new game-world settings. Thank you very much!
Also, if you are interested in providing feedback about how I designed the survey itself, I would be more than happy to hear comments from you!
I was looking at Winged Boots as the pattern for a variant item. Now I'm confused. If the boots have a minimum caster-level of 8th and thus give a +4 bonus to the wearer's Fly skill checks (as per the Fly spell, +(1/2 caster level) bonus), then why is the duration 5 minutes per use instead of 8 minutes per use as the spell gives 1 minute per caster level?
So we have giant crabs with armored exoskeletons. But what about hermit crabs that lack the natural armor and have to hide inside something? Would it be counted as a bonus to AC or would it be an object you have to destroy before getting to the soft vermin inside? What if I made my hermit crab familiar an adamantine or mithril seashell home for special qualities? What if the PCs encounter one inside a helm of teleportation?
Doctor Necrotic wrote:
I believe Super Genius Games (anachronistic adventurers) and Game Room Creations (modern path) have enough guns and gun rules to have an anachronistic modern fantasy shootout! (Complete with +3 Uzi of Fireball spell! Okay, not really... but it's possible!)
Indeed they do. The SGG product with full-auto rules is AA: The Enforcer. Either rules-set is perfectly playable.
Owen K. C. Stephens wrote:
I'm working on something for Crossing The Black (my budding sci-fi space setting)to make "droid" characters as a race/races closer to SW characters rather than "replicants" that the "android" type from Inner Seas Bestiary (as seen on d20pfsrd.com) gives. Still working on augmentation system for them...
Crap. After many long hours of work, creating 5 "races" of droids with a total of 12 distinct variations, I just had the flash of inspiration (as I sat here writing this reply!!) which I suspect experienced designers know well and dread - not only did I made it overly complex and limiting, but it can be reduced! And in so doing, it eviscerates and invalidates almost every bit of work I've done up to this point.
On the bright side, it makes certain tasks I was dreading tackling a *LOT* easier! It'll give players far more options for building "shellheads" exactly the way they want!
(Of course, this means Owen is almost finished with his system that will not only do exactly what I just envisioned, but will do it with that spark of "WOW!!" super-genius and he'll have it listed for sale in about a week...)