Quick note: Signature deed doesn't work with Opportune Parry and Riposte. "This deed’s cost cannot be reduced by any ability or effect that reduces the number of panache points a deed costs."
I assume your custom race includes the bonus human feat. Otherwise you will need the inspired blade archetype to have both weapon focus and fencing grace at first. Since you are specializing in rapier, it might be worth it to look at the archetype anyway.
If you are planning on taking Greater weapon focus, I'd take it at 8th instead of 9th, since the 9th can be any feat as opposed to just a combat feat.
Extra Panache might not be worth it, depending on how often you are spending per day. Check to see how often you are running low by that point.
Outflank is a teamwork feat. Make sure that you have a teammate willing to take it or it is a wasted feat for you.
From your point spread, it looks like you are doing 15 point buy. Is that correct? Be careful about your strength, unless your group place fast and loose with encumbrance. If strength is not a concern, perhaps drop it to 8 to boost your wisdom to 12.
Don't forget greater weapon specialization at 12th.
The rogue dip is almost certainly not worth it, unless you really want trapfinding or the skill points for some reason. Especially at 5th, as that is when you get your weapon training (including the free improved critical). The only exception I can think of is if you are planning on focusing on menacing swordplay, in which case the Thug archetype might be worth it. Even in this case, I would still wait until 6th.
Wands will likely be cheaper per charge, yes, but how many charges of the wand will you use before you should be using the next higher level of item? Say I have a wand of a first level spell. Since it sounds like I am only going to be able to use it once or twice a day, I might end up using only 5 to 10 charges over the life of the wand until it is no longer an effective use of an action. If that's the case, the scrolls are actually the better deal, depending on pricing.
So now that prestige classes are now apparently a series of feats, I was looking at how to convert some of the classes from PF1.
Horizon Walker: Pretty easy. The dedication feat would give you a favored terrain. Additional feats lets you get more favored terrains or upgrading them into Terrain Mastery and then Terrain Dominance. There may be some power issues involved, though, as having feats that give you immuntity to fatigue, the abilty to fly or darkvision will need to be balanced.
Stalwart defender: The dedication feat is obviously Defensive stance, with the various defensive powers becoming feats. Since the math is tighter it would probably lose the flat AC Bonus. Damage Reduction would likely be a defensive power. You will likely get less bang for your buck compared to the PF 1 version.
Arcane archer: Until we see how multiclassing is going to work, this will mostly be a wizard or sorcerer class only. The dedication feat would be the enhancing arrow ability, with the various other arrow abilities being feats. The issue is that it also has a 7/10 spell progression, which almost certainly will not be done with feats, thus restricting it to classes with arcane spellcasting.
Mystic Theurge: I have no idea how they will be able to do this one. The only way I can think of is if class feats can be used for spell progresson, and even then you would be more of a dabbler in the other magical field.
Ride desert boats, skidded and pulled by camels.
Or maybe ice boats with skis sailing across the glaciers.
Maybe the dreaded saurian land boat, a wheeled monstrosity powered by dinosaurs on treadmills.
Finally, the favorite of Final Fantasy fans, the sky boats, soaring through the clouds with the energy of air elementals.
I am... concerned. From what I can tell, compared to PF1 monk, PF2 monks lose all weapon proficiencies, increasing damage dice past the first level, stunning fist, bonus feats, wisdom to AC and fast movement. Some of these can be bought back as class feats I presume, but doing so means you don't get ki powers at the appropriate levels. Flurry seems worse as well, going from -1/-1 to 0/-4.
In PF 1, based on what most mundane gear is worth, 1 copper piece is worth approximately 1 dollar in modern terms. (There are some weird exceptions, of course.) The 1 silver per day for "untrained" workers is how much it costs to live at a poor lifestyle (3 gp/month). So this is basically what it costs to pay for your worker's room and board (i.e. apprentices and slaves). The actual beginner's wages is about 4 to 6 gp a week (about $400-$600/week in modern times).
I use this as a price guide when someone wants to buy gear that doesn't have a price listed, and have modified some prices (mostly down), especially for alchemical and masterwork items.
What this means is that magic gear is fantastically expensive, and rare. Most commoners will never see it, beyond maybe a low level potion. It's one of the ways to have a mostly mundane world at the base, while still having high level gear. Sure, those powerful nobles (or oil execs and CEOs) might be able to afford things like carpets of flying (or helicopters), but the commoners won't bother.
So if PF 2 has redesigned the item price list, they need to make sure they base it on how much a silver piece is worth in modern terms and price accordingly.
Mark Seifter wrote:
There was a mention that there was a feat that just gave you spell points. If you can take a feat that gives you both spell points and a domain, how many spell points would the non-domain feat have to give to equal the domain feat?
Seriously, alternate stat generation is an easy rule to mention and they've already said it will be in the playtest. My guess: Remove the flexible stat boost from the ancestry step (or 1 of them for humans) any all other stat boosts from the remaining steps. Use either a dice roll method or point buy method. There, done.
One of the things not mentioned is whether or not you need a high wisdom to cast high level spells. If a cleric can get by with a wisdom of 14, possibly even 12, that might open up some other options.
In fact, based on this line: "Your Wisdom still matters greatly for your spell DC and other things important to clerics, but giving it slightly less weight makes it more practical now for you to play a cleric of Gorum who focuses on Strength and uses spells that don't involve your spell DC or that have decent effects even if your enemy succeeds at its save." This implies that Wisdom is no longer a restriction from being able to cast higher level spells.
I am a bit worried at the comparison between first level clerics from 1e to 2e. Let's compare:
At first level, a 2e cleric gets 1 domain, getting one power powered by their spell pool equal to their wisdom bonus (let's say 18 wis, so 4 times per day). They get their deity's favored weapon. They get cantrips. They get 2 first level spells. They get channel energy which lets you heal 3 + cha times per day (let's say cha 14, so 5 times) that lets them cast the heal spell (1d8+4 hp).
Now for the 1e cleric. Let's assume the same stats (wis 18, cha 14). At first level a cleric gets 2 domains. Let's say they pick Travel and Trickery. From travel, they get +10' movement and the agile feet power 7 times a day. From Trickery they get to add bluff, disguise and stealth as class skills, along with the copycat power 7 times a day. They get 3 Orisons per day. They get channel energy 5 times a day (1d6 hp). They get 3 first level spells (1 base +1 from stat +1 domain spell) 2 of which can convert into cure light wounds. They also get the deity's favored weapon.
So for the 2e cleric channel energy is stronger, but you only get 1 power, compared to the effectively 4 powers for domains, and can use it less. Hopefully that one power will be more powerful than the 1e powers. You get 1 less spell and the spells are slightly less flexible. Cantrips may be more powerful than Orisons at higher levels, but what about at level 1?
That said, some of the power might be able to be made up for by rituals and more useful skills. The cleric is now effectively a full BAB class, so battle clerics should be easier to do. Ancestry and Backgrounds might also make up some of the difference between the 2 as well. Or they may not. We will have to see the rules in full to make a final judgement.
My favorite things so far are the proficiency system and the stages of success. It reminds me a lot of my favorite RPG from the 90s, Chill (with the Chill Companion). In my opinion, Chill did almost everything right, with the exception of combat. If PF2 hits those same levels, including combat, I will be satisfied.
Even with Handy haversacks, carrying capacity matters. Take a swashbuckler. Chain Shirt, Rapier, Buckler, Handy Haversack. That's it. Weight load: 37 lbs. You have to have a strength of 11, or you are now in medium load. Two more pounds (say a dagger and a torch), you now need strength 12.
Being in medium load, your max AC to dex is now +3 and you move 20' instead of 30'. That can easily be the difference between life and death.
You can invest in mithril armor to make your gear lighter, but that's the point. Carrying capacity makes it a meaningful decision. At low levels, you can (and really should) invest in a pack animal for your party. With the encumbrance rules, you understand why it is important.
I'm not completely opposed to bulk, but it does need to make sense and provide those meaningful decisions. Hopefully it will do both.
How much does 1 coin take up in bulk? How about 50 coins? 5000 coins?
Does it matter if it is loose coins or in a bag? I can easily carry 5 pounds of coins (or 2 kilos) in a bag. It would be impossible to carry them loose in my hands.
Let's say 50 coins in a pouch is (L) bulk. What about 75 coins? Do I round up or down? What about 95 coins? 55 coins? 49 coins?
If 49 coins in a pouch is negligible weight, what about 2 pouches? 10 pouches? 100 pouches?
What if each pouch only had 3 coins in them?
The advantage of weight over bulk is that you simply add up the pounds (or kilos). With abstractions, you open up the possibility of people gaming the system. And if you don't think people will try to game the system, you haven't played with some of the people I've gamed with.
You can also take the extra investigator talent feat to get underworld inspiration at third.
Human with focused study vs. Half-elf: Human gets an extra two skill points per level (1 for skilled and 1 for favored class bonus) and skill focus at 8th. Half elf gets an extra +1 on inspiration rolls every 4 levels, immune to sleep, +2 vs enchantment, +2 to perception and low light vision. It depends on if you want breadth or depth. If you really want to multiclass, half elf does get multi-talented, so you get your favored class bonus on 2 classes. If you do, and you are not taking investigator to fourth, you can take the extra skill point per level for your favorite class bonus.
You do make a big deal about getting all the skills as class skills. The ones you don't get as an investigator are Fly, Handle Animal, Ride, Survival and Swim. The only one I would see dropping points into is maybe survival for tracking, and if you really want that, there is the investigator talent perceptive tracking which lets you use perception instead of survival for tracking purposes.
I'd say that even if you want to multiclass to stay with investigator to at least 4th level, especially if you are going half-elf. There are some amazing investigator talents you can get with extra investigator talent, but you need to have the class feature to take them.
With those stats and Gestalt, you can pretty much do anything. So, what is it you want to do? What is your story? When you imagine your character, what do you see? Why have you taken up the mantle of an adventurer? Are you out for revenge? Do you follow a cause or faith? Do you want to do it for the excitement? Are you in it for the money?
It seems like you want a high dexterity rapier wielder, focusing on melee. Is that correct? do you want to also have magical or supernatural powers? If so, what type? Arcane, Divine or some other source (alchemical or psychic)?
Once you answer these questions, you can decide what you want to build.
One of my house rules was that a prepared caster could cast any spell up to their max level without spending spell slots. It just took half an hour per spell level to do the casting. In a previous game, the NPC casters (Magicians and Priests, having gotten rid of Adepts) could only cast this way.
When a PC class prepares a spell, what they have learned are special shortcuts that allows them to almost cast the spell, leaving the final details of the spell so that it can go off in just a few seconds. Additional slots represent the ability to hold more and more spells.
I'd love to see something like that in 2E.
I rolled up 6 characters using the 4d6 drop lowest, and their point buy ranged from a 38 (16, 16, 16, 13, 12, 9) to a 0 (13, 12, 12, 9, 8, 4) and that's assuming the 4 is only worth -4 points.
I also tried the same thing with the 3d6 in order. Here is what I got:
So what it looks like is that unless you have some sort of floor for dice rolling, it is possible to get scores that are actually worse than a commoner.
Heather 540 wrote:
If you're going to go with the Inspired Blade archetype, you don't need to take Weapon Focus as a feat, it just gives it to you. So as a human, you can take Fencing Grace and still have a level one feat. But you lose the ability to regain Panache from a killing blow, so get Keen for your rapier as soon as possible. And you don't need Agile Maneuvers, either. The rules state that if you have Weapon Finesse, then you already use your Dex for Disarm and Trip attempts when using your rapier to do so. You only need Agile Maneuvers for Grapple, Bull Rush, etc.
Inspired Blades get improved critical at 5th anyway, so I'd not bother with Keen.
We use 33 points for point buy. However, you don't get any points for scores lower than 10. This is the same as a 25 point buy with two stats at 7, so it helps balance the SAD characters with the MAD characters.
If a player wants to take a stat lower than 10, they still can if it fits with their concept. No one has yet.
Okay, here is the sample build of an Oread unchained monk:
Oread (Advanced Template) Unchained Monk 12 (granite skin alterate racial trait)
Str: 22/28 (+4 enhancement, +2 ability increase) Dex: 17/22 (+4 enhancement, +1 ability increase) Con: 15 int 14 Wis: 20/26 (+6 enhancement) Cha: 9
Skills: Acrobatics, Climb, Perception, Sense Motive, Stealth, Swim
Feats/Ki powers or style strikes:
Gear: Belt of physical might: +4 Str, +4 Dex (40k), Monk's Robe (13k), Boots of Striding and Spring (5.5k), Headband of wisdom +6 (36k), Amulet of mighty fists +3 (36k), Cloak of resistance +5 (25k), Handy Haversack (2k), Ring of protection +4 (32k), 10.5k in other items (be sure to have several potions of mage armor or a pearl of power if you have a friendly wizard)
Unarmed strike: +24 to hit (+12 BAB, +9 str, +3 enhancement, +1 Weapon focus, -1 fighting defensively) for 2d8+12, flurry for +24/+24/+24/+19/+14
Move: 70' (100' with sudden speed) or Abundant Step (880')
AC: 36 base (10+4 class bonus, +6 dex, +8 wis, +4 deflection, +3 natural armor, +1 dodge feat), fighting defensively +7, barkskin (+5 natural armor enhancement), mage armor potion or spell (+4 armor), +4 defensive spin, +4 furious defense for a total of 60 AC when fully defending against an opponent you hit, 56 otherwise
Saves: Fort +15, Ref +19, Will +17, Spell Resistance 22 with Diamond Soul
PF1 had rules that penalized low strength, high dexterity builds, but no one used them because they were complicated and no fun. At strength 10, if you just wore a chain shirt, wielded a buckler and rapier, and had a back up dagger, you were already at maximum weight for light load. If you carried a torch or had a belt pouch with a few coins in it, your maximum bonus to AC from dexterity was now +3.
So most people ignored the encumbrance rules.
In PF2, they just need to make the encumbrance rules easy to understand and feel right, at least by the logic of the game.
Is anyone else worried that the new power attack may be too good, epeciallly at low level?
New system: Full attack without power attack, using greatsword (for comparison purposes, we will use old rules for the greatsword).
At first level, fighter with str 18, expert proficiency, so about +6 (+4 str, +1 level, +1 prof) to hit vs AC 12, so needing a 6 to hit with the first attack.
Without power attack: hits on 6 (75% chance, crits 25%) doing 2d6+6, hits on 11 (50% chance, can't crit, crit fail 5%), doing 2d6+6, hits on a 16 (25% chance, can't crit, crit fail 30% chance) doing 2d6+6. Expected average damage 13(*.5) +26(*.25) +13(*.5)+13(*.25)= 22.75, round to 23. 32% chance of having at least 1 crit fail. (Doesn't reduce damage but may trigger a bad reaction.)
With power attack: hits on 6 (75% chance, crits 25%) doing 4d6+6, hits on 11 (50% chance, can't crit, crit fail 5%), doing 2d6+6. Expected average damage 20(*.5) + 40(*.25) + 20 (*.5) = 30 extra damage, with 5% chance of a crit miss.
So on average, power attacking is worth about +7 damage when full attacking at first level, assuming base damage per attack is similar to what it is to PF1.
Now this does assume that the fighter isn't using their third action for something else, as that third action attack isn't very valuable and may even be harmful. So the question then becomes what third action is worth giving up the extra damage from using power attack.
Note that these are averages, the actual results are going to be a LOT swingier. This is also assuming a critical hit simply doubles damage, which might easily not be the case.
I see Bayek more as a ranger than a slayer, mostly because of his link to Senu the eagle.
Str 16, Dex 16, Con 12, Int 10, Wis 13, Cha 10
Skills: Survival, Stealth, Perception, Ride, Climb, Knowledge (Geography), 1 pt into other skills
Saint Bernard wrote:
My hope is that the sling (war sling) will be a much better weapon in PF 2. A trained slinger should be able to put as many bullets in the air as an archer.
Here's an idea I just had for slings. Have the weapon die of the sling increase based on Proficiency.
That way you have shepherds who don't do a lot of damage while guarding their flocks, while at the same time those legendary sling warriors can exceed the damage of a longbow.
Barbarian - Invulnerable Rager: I consider this the default Barbarian.
Bard - Archaeologist: All the bard goodness without needing to sing.
Fighter - Mutation Warrior: I'm Popeye the sailor man...
Rogue - Scout: Less about robbery, more about exploration.
Wizard - Spell Sage: The ability to cast spells no other wizard can cast.
This is all speculation, but here is my guess for something like a dwarf fighter. Fighters get 3 weapon groups at skilled, 1 weapon group at expert. They get all armor and shield proficiencies. They get two skill proficiencies from their class at skilled from a small list. They also get a proficiency at Fortitutde. From Dwarf, they get 2 ancestor proficiencies at skilled from a list, including weapon groups like axes or hammers at skilled. They get a skilled proficiency per level of Int. Finally they get 1 proficiency at skilled from their background, which could be anything.
PF1 had those options. The problem was that they were so expensive, it was usually cheaper and easier to just buy the appropriate potion.
I'd just like to point out that 10 int and 7 charisma is basically 80% of the people you'll meet in real life... So if they can be funny and can have a conversation and do some limited critical thinking then so can your fighter... Roleplaying 10 int 7 Cha probably doesn't require much for most people because that matches them IRL...
This particular fighter has an Int of 5 and Cha 8. So... yeah.
Well, he is supposed to be dumb after all. It's a feature, not a bug.
One of the issues with fighters and their 2 skill points per level is that once you go below Int 10, there is no reason not to continue to dump Int, since you can't go below one skill point no matter how far down you go. So what if you take a -3 to Int skills. You don't have any Int skills to worry about in the first place.
Okay, I took the original concept of a big stupid scary tiefling fighter who wields a large greatsword to see what I came up with at level 10. I went with standard wealth by level, but included no outside buffs.
Tiefling (Qlippoth-Spawn) 10
Str 26 (20+2 level+4 enh) dex 12 con 14 int 5 wis 14 cha 8
Racial Abilities: Scaled Skin (+1 natural Armor, Fire Resistance 5), Skilled (+2 to Escape Artist and Survival), Darkvision 60', Prehensile Tail, Oversized Arms
Skills: Survival +17, Intimidate +26 (+1 skill point from favored class bonus)
Traits: Muscle of the society, Indominable Faith
Feats: 1st: Power Attack, Furious Focus 2nd: Weapon Focus (Greatsword) 3rd: Skill Focus (Intimidation) 4th: Weapon Specialization (Greatsword) 5th: Advanced Weapon Training (Warrior Spirit) 6th: Vital Stirike 7th: Corungon Smash [Adavanced Armor Training: Armored Confidence] 8th: Dazzling Display 9th: Signature skill (Intimidation), [Advanced Weapon Training (Armed Bravery)] 10th: Advanced Weapon Training (Dazzling Intimidation)
Single attack +25 to hit (+10 BAB, +8 str, +1 WF, +4 weapon training, +2 enhancement), 6d6+29 (+12str +9 PA +2 WS, +4 WT, +2 enh)
With warrior spirit (bane): An additional +5 to hit, +2d6+5 dam 5/day
So calling upon his dark power 5 times a day (making his weapon a +5 bane weapon), he does an average of 62 points of damage as a standard action and 110 as a full action. Each hit he gets a free demorallize check, and if he beats the DC by 10 they have to make a DC 20 will save or become panicked for a round or be frightened for 1d4 rounds (they will be shaken pretty much automatically). By taking a standard action, he can demoralize all enemies within a 30' radius.
Out of combat he has a few roles. He is a a quite competent tracker. He can intimidate pretty much anyone. With the adamantine greatsword he can smash most things to rubble. He can carry over a half ton, and briefly lift over a ton. He has a +12 will save to help keep from killing his friends.
There you go. A big, stupid terrifyingly effective fighter.
I know some people have a problem with the class, but I have a player who is playing a Kinetic Chirurgeon and she loves it. While they are still low level, the amount of healing she does is insane. She says that for the first time, she actually feels like a healer.
I hope that something similar is included in 2nd edition.
In my home game, charisma is how well you are liked, including by the universe. It is effectively the luck stat. If something good or bad would happen randomly to one of the PCs, they make a charisma check (highest for something good, lowest for something bad).
Needless to say, people rarely dump charisma.
Unfortunately, Katars are martial weapons, so you have to take a class that has the proficiency, unless you want to waste a feat on the weapon. I have given two possible builds below. I used the standard heroic array (15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8) and did not include any traits or favored class bonus. They are also somewhat undergeared for their level, which normally should be about 2400 gp, instead of the approximately 700 - 1000 gp I used. The first one is a single classed option which you said you wanted. The second is a multi-class option.
Halfling Swashbucker (4): Str: 12-2=10 Dex: 15+2+1=18 Con: 13 Int: 8 Wis: 10 Cha: 14+2=16, HP: 29 +6 Initiative
Tactics: If the team knows they are facing a dangerous adversary, they will drink their potions at the beginning of combat. If facing archers, 1 will use a smokestick, while the others ready alchemist fire against the nearest target. If there is an obvious magic user, one will use a tanglefoot bag against the caster. If possible, they will attempt to flank for the additional +2 to hit. Any hit will trigger Menacing Swordplay unless they have used their swift action for charmed life. If below half health, they will switch to fighting defensively (-4 to hit, +3 to AC). If badly injured (less than 5 hp remaining), they will switch to total defense (+6 AC) and attempt to flee. They will never use their last Panache point. They will almost never use their sling unless facing flying targets or cannot reach the targets in melee.
If you are willing to use rapiers, you can go with inspired blade swashbucker and add the fencing grace feat, increasing damage to 1d4+10.
If willing to multi-class:
Brawler (Snakebite striker) 1/Unchained Rogue 3: Str: 12-2=10 Dex: 15+2+1=18 Con: 13 Int: 10 Wis: 14 Cha: 8+2=10 HP: 26 +4 init
This will do a lot more damage than the swashbuckler when able to trigger the sneak attack. Tactics are similar, but flanking is much more important. I didn't include skills for this one.
At this point, probably the best thing to do is advise the player that after checking the rules he can't flurry with the dagger, but to make up for it, a merchant has heard of the weapon, and has lined up a buyer for it. Since he really wants to turn it over quickly, he is wiling to give everyone in the party credit to purchase what they want at the shop for more than the normal sale value. Depending on how many players you have, offer 6000 to each player if it's a party of 4, 5000 if it's a party of 5 or 4000 if it is a party of 6. (Normal sale price is about 16000 for the dagger.)
Yes, this is way over the wealth by level of the party, but at least it spreads it over the entire party, as opposed to concentrating it into one person's hands.
Quick note: The Childlike feat only gets a small boost to disguise, and Disguise is not a class skill for witches. If you can find a trait that gets you the Disguise skill as a class skill, definitely take it. If this is a home game, see if you can convince your GM to let you take Almost Human (normally a half-orc race trait) which gets you Disguise as a class skill and +4 to Disguise to pass as a human.
Note that Bluff is also not on the clsss skill list.