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Goblin Squad Member. 61 posts. No reviews. No lists. 1 wishlist.


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Orthos wrote:
I would figure Trask is one of them. I don't believe the others are specifically named, so you could probably go through the AP, look for named important NPCs in Drelev (with the caveat that Imeckus Stroon for obvious reasons should be ignored for this) and name them off as the other officers.

I did that. A female tavern keep and a blacksmith are also named, so for now I am making them part of the 'senior officers', but that still left me 1 short (If I included Trask, which I did). So I made him up. Its still confusing not to at least have the other 4 Senior officers named though, when they did that for the Stag Lord and Varnhold.

So my players are running through Varnhold Vanishing right now, and I am reading ahead to get ready for Blood for Blood. My PC's already thought up scouting the territories to each side of them to learn about their rivals, but left it up to npc rangers and rogues to do the foot work.

But in preping for BFB, I read that Drelev had his 5 senior officers give up their daughters for hostage, and that only one, Lord Knight Terrion Numesti, refused. He was thrown in the dungeon, his daughter Tamary was given hostage anyway, and the other 4 Senior Officers aquiesed. So the big question is, who are the other 4? Are they Lord Knights? Is Aemon Trask (Captain of the Guard) one of them (for now I am making him one of them)?

It would seem that 4 potential allies to the PC's would be important enough to atleast give names to them and locations in the Fort or town. Since Ivoretti placed his mercenary guards in strategic places all around Fort Drelev, where the 4 senior officers replaced? Their daughters being held hostage was to secure their obedience, so if the PC's could promise them return of their daughters, and former posts, they would be important allies in taken Drelev and freeing Numestri, so where did they go and who are they?

I guess I'm stuck making them up myself.


B4B names the 4 other girls who are taken hostage by the Tiger Lords, but does anyone know their family names? Who are the other 4 Senior Officer's in Drelev's army? No where in the Fort Drelev description is their a mention of them, not even in the town where one would at least hope to find a few houses where the 4 senior officers lived. They should be semi important NPC's, as they are potential allies.

I was trying to figure out a reason not to do this as well. We are playing Varnhold Vanishing and the PC's have made a habit already of attacking just enough (the Kobolds, bandits, the Centaurs) of breaking the opponent and then making them swear loyalty to them and their kingdom. So my first thought is why would Drelev attack Tatzleford? At the very end of Kingmaker it says Ivoretti made him do it, but throughout the AP it says Drelev is desperate. So why wouldn't he try to get the PC's to fight FOR him? Especially since he is so weakened and has Ivoretti's men 'watching' his Fort?

My group is just about to enter Vordakai's tomb, and I realized there's one big question regarding the people of Varnhold. Xamanthe could have swam (though I'd love to see a horse cross 80 feet of water at 120 ft its deepest). Gundarson originaly had his folding boat, but then left it behind when Vordakai summoned the town.

Vordakai has Dimension Door, but no other transportation spell listed. Sooo how do the dread cyclop zombies cross 120ft deep water (ok, they walk on the bottom as they don't have to breathe?), and how do 40-100 towns people (elderly and children) make that swim? The text says they were summoned to a hillock at the edge of town, true, but it does not say Vordakai left his tomb to capture them all in the soul jars. Plus tracks lead up to the Valley of the Dead.

Any thoughts? Just want to make sure I'm not missing anything.

I was going to build a 3-d model of the Stag Lord's fort, but model making is not one of my skills. So instead I opted to have a large print-out made on vinyl (the store had a sale on vinyl and it was the same price as paper). It came out very cool. I think I blew up the image 150% (but it's been about a year so don't quote me on that).

How about, somebody (a noble or a powerful wizard for hire) used wish or limited wish to get rid of Chora's descendants?

Choral was human with an Orb of Dragonkind (red).

Some ritual spell to make Choral more powerful (or if he is a dragon in human form, more treasure) called for x-number of his bloodline to be sacrificed? and they are performing that ritual in Skywatch now?


I agree, we need more Vikings!

My group and I are still using 3rd edition, but since the 3.5 books have been sold on e-bay for cheap, some of my FTF has picked them up and we slowly converted. So my vote is I'm sticking with 3.5 and unfortunatley, if Pathfinder starts using 4e, I will be cancelling my subscription, and waiting for the gamemastery 3.5/3e stuff to come down in price.

Vic Wertz wrote:

This weekend, the public is getting their first real glimpse of 4th Edition at Wizards of the Coast's D&D Experience 2008.

Among other things, they've posted a sort of primer for their 4E demos, entitled "What You Need to Know About Dungeons & Dragons 4th Edition at D&D Experience 2008.".

My question to you is this: Has anything you've learned as a direct result of the D&D Experience changed your mind about 4th Edition?

(You can change your vote whenever you like.)

Please refrain from debating the relative merits of systems in this thread.

I myself have recently discovered that my 12yo nephew, and one of my neighbor's 12yo son are both interested. I entertained the idea of inviting them to join my monthly group, but have also entertained the idea of asking them each to find one other friend and starting a group just for them.

BV210 wrote:

I orginally posted this on ENWorld, but wanted to share my good fortune with my fellow Paizoians . . . Paizoites . . . Pazuzu, Pazuzu, Pazuzu . . .

Well, the day is drawing nigh, I am going to start my 15-year-old daughter and several of her friends on their initial foray into the world that is Dungeons and Dragons.

For quite some time, my wife has not been too keen on the idea, and my daughter didn't seem interested. It was only as I was preparing for my normal monthly game in October that the daughter voiced an interest and the wife relented. While playing with my normal group, some of my daughter's friends stopped by and one of them mentioned that she'd "always wanted to play D&D but didn't know how". So, this Friday, a rather eclectic group of adventurers will be coming together to begin their (hopefully) illustrious careers while tackling "Mad God's Key." (I toyed with starting with "Box of Flumph" but MGK has a better way to get them involved without the tried and true "hired to do something scene")

I call the group eclectic because the party is composed of:
- half-elf male druid (daughter)
- half-elf male druid (twin of daughter's PC, played by female) - not sure parents will let play
- halfling female monk (played by male)
- dwarf male cleric (played by male)
- half-elf male sorcerer (played by female)
- human male ranger (archer specialist, played by female)
- ?? - played by male
- ?? - played by female (possibly rogue)

I'm sticking to Core only at the start, so an not to overload them, but I'll add more as we go along (I do love psionics).

The campaign is going to be set in a world of my own design with The Game Mechanics' city of Liberty as the centerpiece. I've got a potential campaign thread in the works, but I"ll also let them decide what to do next based on the hints, hooks, and clues I plan to drop along the way.

I haven't played with a bunch of "noobs" (I guess that's the term) since I was one myself, but am looking forward to Friday night.

Nicolas Logue wrote:
I have something like this coming out soon for a different publisher. If you guys are interested I'll post back when I am allowed to announce more.

Yes, please do! Just got done going over Pathfinder #3, and you are one scary guy; would love to see what you do with a Sci-fi/Modern D20 adventure.

Yes, please do! Just got done going over Pathfinder #3, and you are one scary guy; would love to see what you do with a Sci-fi/Modern D20 adventure.

I don't know much about the Dark Matter setting, but I used to be a big fan of Alternity's StarDrive. But again, making a generic 'future' campaign would be ideal, except as the few voices here just pointed out everyone has a different idea of what would make a good setting. So I think the best approach would be a generic AP that would work for each type of D20 Future. That may seem like asking too much from the writers, but they had to make similiar descions for D&D AP's, and then include notes on conversion to campiagn specific settings.

Aidan wrote:
Actually, a d20 Modern / d20 Future adventure path would be an interesting idea, but I fear that there would not be enough of an audience for such a product.

I don't think finding an audience would be a problem. I could see that choosing a campaign setting that would appeal to a broad audience as the basis for such a AP would be difficult, but I don't see it as anymore difficult than choosing a setting for a Fantasy RPG campaign.

I was wondering if anyone, either here on the messageboards, or at Paizo, was interested in a Sci-Fi adventure path? Or any other genre AP for that matter (Wild-West AP anyone?). Is there any chance of Paizo broadening their scope with such an idea?


I have been planning an AP-esque adventure for my PC's using the Patriots of Ulek, and the Slavers! modules, and I have a question maybe someone can help me with. In Living Greyhawk gazetter, it says Turrosh Mak is looking for an ancient Suel city in the Suss Forest. So, since all three AP's so far have dealt with some sort of mass transformations that would grant the Demon Lord, or Demi-god more power, or free them from something, I was wondering what the Earth Dragon, a Demi-god itself, could want from the afore mentioned lost Suel city. Obviously, it wants to spread its power and influence, but what artifact or magic can help it attain that goal? Any thoughts?

Skech wrote:

Try here

It lists the population at 17400 and there may be more info. If nothing else try writing to them or joining.


Thanks, actually I know about that site. It doesn't have any info except for population, and that's where I found the map that shows Thunderstrike in Prinzfeld, which is why I asked.

Rothandalantearic wrote:

Howdy ho there

Running a campaign in Ulek myself and have yet to come across anything describing Thunderstrike (but it is there in my campaign). This one is all yours to design as you see fit! :-)

As a side note... I my campaign the town is built into the cliff sides of asteepgorgewhere no residence is closer to the ground than 50 feet. There are two trade roads that are cut into the sides of the cliff faces (one on each side)that rise through the town like main streets. Height equals statis in the town("you know what" rolls down hill).

Hope you get some inspiration. And good luck!

THanks! The reason I was asking was that it didn't make sense that Rittersmarche, a small city or large town, was the capital if there was a larger city nearby. I mean I guess there's no reason a smaller town or city couldn't be the capital, but the adventure suggests the PC's make a tour of Prinzfeld first, and again, there is no Thunderstrike.

James Jacobs wrote:

Eladrins (Celeste included) have a large role in the last two Savage Tide adventures.

To address the thread's main point... if I were in charge of D&D, there wouldn't be much of a difference between an evil god and an arch devil or demon lord. As in: Not all evil gods are demon lords, but all demon lords are evil gods. That's not the way WotC chose to go with things (possibly because they wanted to avoid the stigma of having demons be on equal footing as gods), so that's that. As far as Dungeon is concerned, at least.

In Pathfnider, demon lords and arch devils are indeed evil gods. They can grant spells and everything.

Thanks James, that was kind of the answer I was looking for. Although I would still be partial to making the Demon Lords the highest level servants of the Evil gods. After all the gods would be the incarnate version of their portfolio, they wouldn't be concerned with anything else. They would need messengers, and heralds to fulfill their desires on the material plane, and that means more than just clerics. Thank you everyone else too, Great Green God, Tiger and Saern, for your answers.

Sorry I posted three times. THere was a delay in my submitting the post and it showing up. I thought it didn't go through.

Whith all the attention given to Demon Lords and Arch Devils, I wonder just what then is the purpose of Evil gods? What is their place in the grand scheme of things of the Demon Lords and Arch Devils are the ones doing all the plotting? And what about the Celestials and Archons, the opponents of demons and devils, they seem to be unrepresented. Where are the Arch Angels?

The Adventure Paths and many other adventures seem to use the plots of Demon Lords and Arch Devils, and yet what about the Evil gods? Shouldn't some of these plots really be the nefarious schemes of Evil gods? What is the difference then between the Demon Lords, Arch Devils and Evil gods? Or just how evil are the Evil gods, if the Demons and Devils are activley plotting and scheming? Is the mortal world just that under the attention of the gods?
And what about the Celestials and Archons? The opponents of the Demons and Devils seem to be unrepresented. Where are the Arch Angels?

Hey all, I was planning on running my group through the old Patriots of Ulek adventure. In it there is a detail of the Prinzfeld province. But in more complete maps of Ulek, there is a city called Thunderstrike in Prinzfeld that is not mentioned in the adventure. Does anyone know where this city is detailed? Thanks.

I was going to run my players with new characters through the Patriots of Ulek adventure, and while I was researching Ulek, I notice that on the maps there is a city in the province of Prinzfeld called Thunderstrike. Except for in the list for major cities, I can't find any details about this city anywhere. In the adventure (Patriots of Ulek) it is not mentioned as being in Prinzfeld at all. Can anyone help me on this?


It was a thought, and the group is big (8 players most of the time). But they were determined and I didn't want to 'just say no'.

My players just ended the Demon Skar legacy. They ended with casting Raise Dead on Alec. I was going to say that Alec's soul doesn't want to return, but the players pointed out he was on a quest, and would probably want to complete it. So now they have Alec with them. Anyone else have their players raise Alec?

Actualy my group has actualy had an ethical streak and vows to return certain stuff they find to their next of kin, or organization. For instance, they were thinking about returning Zenith with his armor and weapons and all, to his father 'Davked'. They did similiar with Sacrem.

Oops. You know I even used a book mark on that page, and still missed it. Thanks!

I had been looking ahead, as my players are about to go into Demonskar after 'rescueing' Zenith, and I realized, they don't give stats or any kind of loot for the Paladin. I know it seems kinda morbid, but he would have some pretty hefty stuff on him. I'm gonna add my own stuff, but I was just wondering if anyone else noticed this, and what they did about it. After all, it is a PC's natural reaction to 'Loot the body', right?

In my campaign, I have foreshadowed that the Church of Wee Jas is behind SOMETHING. The PC's decided they need to get in there and snoop, but have not done so yet. Our Cleric originaly wanted to be of Wee Jas, but I dissauded him, as I did not want the conflict of PC vs his own church and or goddess. After the first adventure, they did go asking questions, and were met with closed doors such as "Sorry, we can only allow the faithfull inside" and stuff like that.

I actualy decided that the Last Laugh Hired the Tongue Eater and his gang, and the Ebon Triad was a secondary group looking for revenge, and raided the raiders. I guess either way works. I too found the Ebon's creating the Soul Cages a bit unbelievable, and it wasn't a factor after the Players left the Kopru Ruins anyway.

My party, the Company of the Westering Sun, are not as wealthy as they should/could be. They've skipped finding lots of treasure in order to progress the story. They're not really dungeon crawling as they should be. So I've been trying to increase the treasure they do find to make sure they're not undertreasured and underequiped. That said, they purchased a house in Cauldron for 20,000. One character had Magic Fang permanatly cast on himself. And several characters purchased useful magical equipment, so I guess they're doing ok.

Yeah, I realized that the series here had a few continuity errors, and to be honest, it isn't that important. Just something that hit me as I read it, and as I was re-writing events to fit what I think makes more logical sense to my players.
An official answer would be nicer, Erika?

I was just reading through the Demonskar legacy, and I noticed in chapter one, after the tax riots, in the section Fire in the Night, that Asfelkir Hranleurt the Highpriest of the Temple of Lordly Might of Kord, shows up with a Wand of Water Control. Wasn't it clear in Flood Season that the Temple of Lordly Might of Kord deemed such a wand a waste of resources? So why does he have one now? I would assume the 8 wands the PC's recovered would be spent over the week (or two) in stemming the floods.

The Company of the Westering Sun are:
Hawkstone, Human, CG, Barbarian 7
Beor Tynade, Half-Orc, CG, Cleric (Kord) 7
Krictor Stoneshoes, Dwarf, CG, Fighter 7
Cambyses Ral Athor, Elf, CG, Ranger/Fighter 7
Brymenn, Human, LN, Monk 8
And sometime character:
Osborne Underborough, Halfling, CN, Rogue 8

They are 1/2 way to Crazy Jared's in Zenith Trajectory.

I just started my players through Zenith Trajectory, and the first encounter was my first problem for my players plot-wise. They assumed that some of the goings on, like the Elf thief, was part of the larger plot for the session, and that they were supposed to investigate everything that happened and find Maavu and speak to him. I realized afterward, that that is the logical conclusion as a player, but the adventure assumes the players would just walk away from what for my players was an obvious attack on Maavu, that they wanted to solve. As for Zenith, I decided to explain his insanity with a new magic item. I removed the Sphere of the Unseen, and gave him an 'Orb of the Future' wich he got from Crazy Jared. It grants the user the ability to use Augury, and Divination, but each use drops Wisdom by 1 point (Will sv DC 17/19 respectivley) until the character is insane.


Hey Chef. I wish I read this before friday. My group just started running through Zenith Trajectory, and I already introduced Celeste as the owner of the Cusp of Sunrise. Using Lord Vhalantru himself would have been much better. I'm glad using Adric is working for you.


I like the idea of the gate tax, but I still think that a yearly or monthly tax on all citizens is not unreasonable even in this setting. It doesn't matter who 'owns' the house, the owner needs to pay taxes for at least town services. I wasn't worried about assessing income taxes or such, just property and services. Certain services are private, like fresh water delivery ( or you gotta go get it yourself) and such.

I placed my Cauldron in the Little Hills, just a thousand (?) miles north of where the 'official' placement is. The other problem I have with this placement (asside from your own) is that there doesn't seem to be any reason for a settlement there. It is almost completely inaccessable from land, unless you get a pirate ship to bring you to Sasserine. Even then, the 'area' map in several issues shows traveller's taverns and towns along a ridge of mountians surrounded by plains. But the official map shows nothing but volcanic mountains all around, and the range is travelling in a different direction. I like placing Cauldron in the Hellfurnaces, it makes sense. But I think I'll leave mine in the Little Hills. It seems closer to what the area maps around Cauldron shows.

My characters are looking into buying a grand house (4 to 10 rooms, under the DMG 3rd ed more equipment guide) at 5000 gp's. Under that I figured 100gp a month taxes, and that was 'high' considering all else. How much are you charging for taxes?

I decided Shensen would take over the Tavern. None of the PC's stepped foward on that one. Ofcourse, they're usualy pretty good about not fighting friendly NPC's.

The only thing I saw for sure was in Life's Bazaar, it says that his parents died in a fire 8 years earlier, and he has been in the orphanage since. That's when my players started asking where was the fire, was it suspiscious, anyone have any idea who started it, and why. Being evil, I decided, was just his demondand ancestry.

I had my player explore several possible lava tube entrances before finding the 'right one'. One cave held a Manticore and her 3 cubs (daddy's out hunting). After killing her, one player decided to keep the cubs and will try and rear them.

Yeah, the same thing happened with my players. I decided that his parents were employed by Maavu as coincidence, and that they died in a not-so-mysterious fire. I named his father Kalem Kharatys and mother was Vyki Kharatys. I didn't note anything special, like debts or any other reason someone would have to set a suspicious fire, but I did let them get wind that the Last Laugh may have done it. Also, they were intered in the catacombs under the Temple of Wee Jas, and no the PC's were not allowed in the catacombs, as they are not members of the church, and Terrem can visit the graves when he grows to adult hood, and joins the church. And no, large donations to the church did not get the PC's in either (yeah they tried to bribe). Hope that helps.

Yes, and the PC's scouted the area by looking out through the windows, and decided not to attack the baboons, lest they turn out to be more were-baboons. I figured the baboons, however were not interested in what's going on inside. Shensen will couch them out behind the scenes, and let the two dinos have them.

Yeah, that's why I changed that. It gives continuity, and yeah, I couldn't find Gortio mentioned after. What's the point of him being there as a Doppleganger if the PC's are destined not to find that out. I think seeing Adrick, pretending to be Zenith's father, and then finding out he lied, and they were duped again...

Last sunday I was missing two players (my group usualy has 5 in it), but we were able to NPC the missing characters. They rested and healed overnight at the Lucky Monkey, and then Shensen helped them find the entrance to the Ebon Triad's domain (I moved it to be on the Western slope of Cauldron). I didn't let them find it right away, and I added a encounter with a Manticore and it's cubs in there. At the end of the fight, one of the players decided to keep all three cubs and try and rear them. Aught to prove interesting. They tried to sneak into the caves, but the guards got the alarm off. Instead of charging in, they waited for a group to come investigate what happened. They set it to look like the first set of guards killed each other in a drunken fight. So, they ambushed the second set of guards, and moved down to the beach (not using the winch, but sliding down the rope). They found Triel first, and managed to kill her and 6 thugs, and are now in K37 resting over night. I figure Skaven will have all the rest of the thugs set up outside all the exits, and try and blast them before they come out, depending on how mean I'm feeling. I'm changing the undead to a Bone Claw from MM3, and a Bone Sucker, and making the T-Rex a Zombie.

I decided to drop Gortio in favor of using Adrick Garhtun, the Dwarven merchant from Lords of Oblivion. I figured it makes more sense continuit wise, giving the players the feel that they were 'played' from early on, and that Adrick would want to curry favor any way he could anyway.

In issue 104 Demonskar, it doesn mention that they were fighting against the cagewrights, and that after a great battle have loss a good number of members, hence their current need for secrecy in Cualdron. Otherwise it doesn't say what else they do. I figure since 4 of the Striders are Half-elf, that only that race my join them.

I definatley thought the EL's are over-estimating the character's abilities. I agree that it also depends on what and how the characters do. My group is very light in magic, with only a cleric who acts more like a fighter. They purchased no extra magic. They also had too much of a sense of urgency in Life's Bazaar that is carrying into Flood Season. They are rushing past exploring the dungeons,and finding loot, in order to complete the quests. They just rescued Shensen, only because I intoduced Farion and Fellion (sp?) who asked if they had seen her, and then used their conact with Meerthan to comfirm she was alive and in the Inn somewhere. My pc's aren't stopping to rest and heal enough either. But, the fight in the Lucky Monkey, even against Tongue Eater (which the Cleric made very easy by casting Hold Person on him) was easy for them, although the fight with Kazmojen,Prickles and the Hobgobs was difficult. Go figure. I was trying to decide if I should up the El of the Ebon Triad's dungeon, and am still undecided. Guess I'll have to see how that goes. I'm going to have Shensen do an 'Area Knowledge' kind of thing. It doesn't make sense to me (or the players) that they would go back to Cauldron and to Jenya and report failure, and have to rely on Shemwick for the location of the caves. But a Druid who knows the area almost as well as a ranger, now that makes more sense.
Oh, and yeah my elf player is all over Shensen.


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