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Humm... I feel I should clarify my original question as I have played and played with good fighter and rogue characters.By relevant, I mean it in a why would players still want to play these core classes? When there are much better and similar themed options out there?
This is not a new problem. There's already really no reason to play a Rogue rather than an Urban Ranger, Archaeologist Bard, or Trapbreaker Vivisectionist Alchemist, for example.
It is not as if the core classes are flawed or are unusable options.The Fighter and Rogue can work fine in a game, but it seems like the advanced Classes can do it much BETTER.
So can a Ranger, Paladin, or Barbarian. Or the ones I list above. Every objective analysis people do says that Slayer is slightly worse than Ranger, mechanically speaking...how much worse would it need to be for you to feel it wasn't overshadowing things?
Shouldn't the newer classes be made to complement the core classes? And not over-shadow them?
"Less powerful than a Ranger" seems to fall very thoroughly into this description actually. Trying not to overshadow Fighter and Rogue results in classes that are no good to basically anyone.
Really? I always thought that the fighter works fine... the rogue could be a little weak at times, but I have seen some scary fighters.
Like a pure crit fighter that was downing the entire room of mons. (The scary part was that is was build with just the CRB, only his weapon was from UE.)
Or the Fighter Archer, which could be mainly due to how powerful archery is and fighter gives it all the extra feats it needs to be scary.
Fighter does damage pretty effectively. Its issue is that, unlike every other class there is, it does absolutely nothing else (with the exception of decent AC, I guess). Even Barbarians can manage good saves and a decent skill selection, plus Spell Sunder and Pounce...Fighters just deal damage. They have no saves, no utility options, no nothing. Unlike every other Class that can pretty much equal them in damage, they have nothing else.