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Damon Griffin's page

Goblin Squad Member. RPG Superstar 6 Season Marathon Voter. Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Roleplaying Game Subscriber. 1,713 posts. No reviews. 5 lists. 1 wishlist.


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Thanks for the US link. Script/dialogue wasn't bad (to be expected with Ben Edlund writing), but...

I found the Tick as cast...underwhelming, in terms of both physical presence and most of his oratory. The patterning on his costume off-putting; made me think he was dressed in a giant rubber bathmat. Fighting style? Decidedly un-dynamic.

The Terror just looked ridiculous.

The alarm clock/wakeup/"crime lab" scene was a nice callback to the cartoon series.

I probably don't want to see any more.

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Kalindlara wrote:
I did my darnedest to kill my players and never got a single kill.

There are some that would say that makes you a bad GM on two counts. :)

(Three if you count trying to kill your actual players rather than their characters.)

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Kalindlara wrote:
** Ashes At Dawn **

That was in fact tempting, and we had a tentative plan to do just that as a post-AP action. But we couldn't be sure that we'd get the information we needed in that way, and it seemed highly risky given how little we knew about their strengths and resources.

We suffered a number of PC deaths as it was; it's hard to believe we'd have done better taking on even more opponents.

Kalindlara wrote:
** Shadows of Gallowspire **

What the---? Motherfu-- @#&!!%$^#%

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Amazon sez:

Service Area Restriction

This video isn't available due to geographical licensing restrictions. For more details, please refer to Amazon Video Terms of Use.

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Kalindlara wrote:
Damon: just so you're aware, there are multiple things in your post that don't line up with the AP as printed.

Such as? Looking back at my post, I'm only aware of these deviations:

- staff of life, which I said was planted by the GM as extra treasure

- NPC item crafting, which I noted was something the GM did

- Mythic Tier, which perhaps I wasn't clear about: we knew it wasn't in the AP, but it was an attempt to slow the rate of dying

- combo group of spectres and greater shadows, which was a miscalculation on the GM's part: he rolled twice on the random encounter table because he thought either one of those would be too easy for a 14th L group.

Pretty sure I can cite references for everything else.

@Gorbacz That GM had been part of our core gaming group for over 13 years, but after that TPK he quit the group and cut off all contact. My wife is still in the group but flatly refuses to ever play Pathfinder again. A third member won't completely rule out the possibility of playing Pathfinder again at some point years down the road, but swears he will never run or play in another Pathfinder AP. For the moment we're reduced to board/card games and Ars Magica.

@Purplemonkeydishwasher PuppyMonkeyBaby to you, too. :)

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SnowHeart wrote:
Damon Griffin wrote:
Perhaps copies are being rounded up and destroyed to protect the gaming public? That AP was toxic. It ended Pathfinder for our group, and cost us a group member and friend who'd gamed with us for over a decade.
Really? How so? Does it pit PC against PC? Feel free to reply via PM if you're worried about spoilers in the thread. Thanks!

I've discussed parts of it in the Carrion Crown Obituaries thread. One of the "buttons" Carrion Crown and Serpent's Skull both pushed for our group was the need to ally with evil NPCs to make progress. Neither all the players nor all the PCs were Lawful Good, but in any given campaign our players tend to skew pretty strongly toward Never Evil.

Imagine that in the same tone you might hear "Never Trump" or "Never Hillary", depending on your political preference.

In Carrion Crown, we had 6 PCs including a Cleric of Pharasma and a Ranger with undead as a favored enemy; plus another PC with a LG cohort. You can imagine how pleased we were at the prospect of doing favors for vampires.

A much smaller, but similarly annoying bit earlier on, put us in a situation where we'd taken an NPC up on an offer to visit his master's home, and while exploring the place it became clear that the PCs were expected to loot the furnishings of the host's home in order to keep up any semblance of wealth by level. That's not us, so we ended up even poorer than PCs in this AP normally are, and that's saying something.

Things started to go downhill for us near the end of Book Three. Our GM had less experience behind the screen than some of us, but wasn't a complete newbie. He'd played in two Pathfinder APs before running this one, and had DM'd us in multiple D&D games before (2.0 and 3.0) All the players had decades of RPG experience each. Each of the three players was running two PCs, and we had one cohort and an animal companion in the mix as well, so we were a strong party.

Despite all this, and notwithstanding the different experiences other groups have had, we began getting our asses kicked regularly starting at Feldgrau. At this point I should mention that our group tends to invest themselves in their characters, so if and when they die, the response is always to try to raise/resurrect that character rather than shrug and roll up a new one.

We suffered PC deaths at Feldgrau, Thrushmoor, Illmarsh, under Tern Rocks, en route of Caliphas, inside of Caliphas, outside of Caliphas, and at Renchurch: twenty-three (23) deaths in all, not counting the TPK on the lower level of Renchurch that broke it for everyone. That figure does include the cohort but not the animal companions; the Ranger lost three of them along the way, not counting the one he had during the TPK.

Our GM was bending over backward to supply us with the diamond dust and large diamonds needed to keep us alive and sans negative levels. He even planted a staff of life as extra treasure at one point. But we had to use it so often that one of the two clerics in the party never got her full daily spell allotment, because she had to devote a slot every day toward recharging the staff.

Our Rogue managed to avoid being killed until we reached Caliphas in Book Five. At that point, she was killed and raised in three consecutive weekly game sessions.

Obviously, having a larger than expected party in an AP with unusually low treasure did work against us, making it hard to upgrade equipment. Our GM helped where he could here as well, with a grateful Church of Pharasma in Caliphas arranging for some item crafting to be done by NPCs at half the usual cost.

By the end of Book Five we had even taken on a Mythic Tier in hopes that would make us more survivable, but no matter what we did, we just kept getting overwhelmed. The random encounters around Renchurch are more deadly than some planned encounters should be. We had a 14th L Cleric of Pharasma on watch one night with another PC. Not surprisingly she failed a Perception check against a pair of greater shadows, so they got a surprise round. Both hit, one backed up a crit, and before she could even cry out, she was dead: drained from 19 STR to 0 in the surprise round. The three spectres with them were totally superfluous.

The invisible werewolf lich with a wand of dimension door was a huge pain in the ass. We had to kill him twice. The invisible vampire sorcerer spamming fireballs at us while we were swarmed by ghosts and shadows wasn't a lot of fun either.

The only times we had PC vs. PC situations were when PCs fell to ghosts or greater shadows and had to be destroyed by their allies a couple of rounds later.

All in all it was not a good experience.

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Did New 52 Superman fight Doomsday and survive, or was there no encounter with Doomsday in New 52?

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Thomas Seitz wrote:


Yes that's basically right. There's some other stuff about how Nu-52 created an all new set of basically EVERYONE, including the Flash but not quite. So there's that. But otherwise you're pretty much where everyone else is, Superman wise.

Okay, so the Other Superman I referred to: he's the New 52 version, who IIRC first appeared in jeans and a t-shirt, but later graduated to the high-collar uniform that all New 52 heroes seemed to prefer. He's younger, less of a Boy Scout, and was romantically involved with Wonder Woman rather than Lois Lane.

He's the one who was outed to the world by Lois Lane; the one who used a "solar flare" ability no previous treatment of Superman had ever had, and burned out his powers for a while. He was killed by Doomsday. Based on his own personal experience, Pre-52 Superdad feels like this will be temporary...but the Kryptonian regeneration matrix is inconveniently missing from the Fortress of Solitude, so New 52 Superman will likely have to stay dead.

If this is correct so far, I think I only need to sort out the third Clark Kent, and I gather that hasn't been explained yet. Where has he been seen?

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Young actors playing JSA members, old actors doing Infinity, Inc. roles?

"It's a madhouse! A madhouse!"
-- Charlton Heston, Planet of the Apes

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I think Hawkman's continuity issues predate the first Crisis, so it's hardly surprising if he's currently a mess. Hawkman, Powergirl and Supergirl/Matrix/Earth Angel..don't even try to make sense of them.

I was hoping to get Superman straight in my head because he's central to the DCU. I have for all practical purposes read no DC titles for over 8 years now (somewhere along the way I read Flashpoint as a collected GN at the library, but my regular buying stopped after Final Crisis), so I knew it wouldn't be easy.

I've never followed all titles in the DCU, and am reluctant to jump into the deep end of the pool this time. There's just way too many I don't care about.


May very well follow
The Flash
Green Lanterns
Hal Jordan and the Green Lantern Corps
Justice League

Would like to, but only if I can sort the Supermen out
Action Comics

Could get pulled in, possibly, but have read none yet
Batgirl and the Birds of Prey
Detective Comics
Justice League of America
Wonder Woman

No interest whatsoever
All-Star Batman
Batman Beyond
Blue Beetle
Green Arrow
Harley Quinn
The Hellblazer
New Super-Man
Red Hood and the Outlaws
Suicide Squad
Super Sons
Teen Titans

So, let me see if I have at least one Superman straight:

- the Superman that Doomsday killed in Death of Superman back in '92 -- on what I still thought of at the time as Earth-1, even though it was six years post-Crisis -- woke up later, eventually married Lois Lane and had a son;

- that Superman ceased to have existed (as far as the "main" comic universe was concerned) when Flashpoint/New 52 hit, but he was pulled back by Telos to participate in the Convergence;

-post-Convergence he ended up on the new or newly altered "main" comic Earth along with another Superman. (Let's leave aside for the moment who that Other Superman is.)

-since that Other Superman seemed to have things under control, married Superdad goes into hiding and enjoys his family.

-at some point that Other Superman gets himself killed, in a way that bestows powers on Lana Lang, and on a Lois Lane not married to the Superdad.

-Superdad steps up to become this world's Superman. Batman and Wonder Woman, at least, aren't 100% sure about this familiar-yet-unfamiliar Superman.

So far so good?

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@Thomas Seitz My brain still hurts, but thanks.

@jemstone Good to know about the Earth One titles.

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I'm buying small amounts of Rebirth, and mostly enjoying it, but also finding it confusing. I did that to myself.

Disclaimer: I'm one of those guys. You know, the ones who b~!@+ about every reboot/retcon/relaunch DC has done over the past 20 years or so, and who isn't 100% sure that even Crisis On Infinite Earths was a good idea after all.

Cue the obligatory complaints about past reboots:


1986: Crisis on Infinite Earths. I enjoyed the heck out of this while I was reading it, even though I'd never had any trouble with the multiverse and didn't see the need to collapse it in on itself. I did take issue with a couple of characters being killed off, and I really hated that the "rules" established by Crisis began to be ignored almost immediately afterward.
As an aside, John Byrne retcons Sumerman's origin this year.

1994: Zero Hour. Sigh. They said Crisis was going to fix everything, but it all just got worse. I had no confidence the "fix" would be any better this time. Sadly, I was right.

1999: The Kingdom Hypertime! The ultimate cop-out. DC gives up trying to fix anything ever again, and gives themselves a blanket excuse for all continuity errors, past, present and future.

In 2003, Birthright replaces John Byrne's Man of Steel as Superman's official origin.

2005-2010: The Legion of Legions. I didn't even try to follow this. Three separate versions of the LSH existed in different branches of the timeline and all could interact with the main DC timeline. That's f*cked up.
In 2009, Superman: Secret Origin replaces Birthright as Superman's official origin.
In 2010, i]Superman: Earth One[/i] replaces Superman: Secret Origin as Superman's official origin.

2006: Infinite Crisis starts not with a bang, but with a punch. Superboy Prime is punching reality in the gut, generating waves of continuity-altering energy?!? My God, they really can't help themselves, can they? So, the infinite multiverse is back?

2007: 52/One Year Later No, it's not. We now have an easy-to-manage finite multiverse, where the main DC action takes place on New Earth. AKA Earth-1. AKA Earth-0.

2008: Final Crisis. If only.

2011: Flashpoint throws everything into a blender again, and regurgitates...

2011-2012: The New 52 It was at this point DC lost me entirely. I was a victim of retcon fatigue. To many multiverse-wide reimaginings, too frequently. New 52 titles are released, cancelled, replaced and renumbered over the course of six waves.

2013: The New 52, Second Phase Waves 7 through 9 of titles coming and going. Also, Future's End. Out of nostalgia I briefly tried Earth-2 and World's Finest but was greatly disappointed by them.

2015: Convergence Almost as dumb as Superboy punching reality. Telos, an avatar of Braniac, collects 50 "domes" representing a rather arbitrary sampling of alternate universes, dimensions, timelines, and points along a single timeline and tells the heroes to fight each other for existence. So they do.

I bought and read the nine issues of Convergence out of morbid curiosity. I didn't read any of the side issues, and hadn't read Earth 2: World's End and New 52: Futures End, so that didn't help me with the details of WTF was going on. I was pretty thoroughly lost regarding the fallout from Convergence. The New 52 branding would stop, but its continuity would remain? The finite 52-universe multiverse is infinite again? Crisis On Infinite Earths never happened?

So not having a good idea where the DC multiverse/timeline was at this point, I didn't have a good idea of what to expect from Rebirth, only a vague impression that this was DC saying "Okay, that whole New 52 thing was a bad idea, we're going back to an earlier restore point. But, um, it totally wasn't our fault. Dr. Manhattan did it."

So far the only Rebirth titles I've read are:

  • Batman (was curious about Gotham and Gotham Girl)
  • Justice League
  • Superwoman
  • Titans
  • Flash
  • Green Lanterns
  • Hal Jordan and the Green Lantern Corps
  • and the first issue of Superman

I am totally at sea regarding everything going on with Superman. Lex Luthor is Superman now? Three Supermen, two Clark Kents? Are there two Lois Lanes? Is superkid Jonathon Kent's mom the same Lois that outed Clark as Superman to the world? (A, not The) Superman recently fought (a, not the) Doomsday and was killed. Another Superman (from an alternate Earth, who's had personal experience with post-Doomsday resurrection) steps up to replace the dead guy...but isn't that temporary, given that he expects the recently deceased Supes to get better?

Justice League isn't hard to follow so far, except for the bit where they aren't sure they can trust Superman because he's not the Superman from their universe.

I'm missing a lot of backstory in Hal Jordan and the Green Lantern Corps. The entire Corps got lost? Most of them were killed outside the universe? Sinestro has a daughter?

Superwoman...wait, I thought Doomsday killed Superman. Now we're saying he blew up and irradiated Lois (one of them, anyway) and Lana with super energy?

Flash/Titans Wally West (Caucasian edition) is not only aware that a cosmically powered being (that he doesn't know is Dr. Manhattan) removed slices of time to create the New 52, he says he has the sense that it's going to happen again. Is DC announcing the next reboot/retcon/relaunch already? Are we getting Afterbirth in 2017-2018?

Oh, also: I've seen a couple of references to Mr. Oz, who I understand is Ozymandias, but I haven't seen him anywhere. Where has he appeared and what's his agenda?

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Perhaps copies are being rounded up and destroyed to protect the gaming public? That AP was toxic. It ended Pathfinder for our group, and cost us a group member and friend who'd gamed with us for over a decade.

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Boxing glove arrow.

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Technically, age 14 (1975), D&D white box. But that was only one game.

After that, age 18 (1978), AD&D 1st Ed.

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Why are there elephants, and why are they oversized?

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Treasure comes from all the TPKs in Adventure Paths.

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I remember the Penance Stare. Maybe I did read some of the Ketch issues after all?

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SLJ is in every movie. It's a rule.

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Full disclosure, I am one of those comics grognards who frequently opines that "<civilian identity> is the one true <superhero identity>" but in this case I have no idea who Ketch and Reyes are. Johnny Blaze is the only Ghost Rider I ever read in comics. (Well, him and the Old West version, aka Night Rider aka Phantom Rider.)

Off to Google them...

...okay, "ghost of my dead uncle the serial killer?" That is seriously lame. Also not crazy about the switch from bike to car.

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If you look at Trade Goods, you can see what silver, gold and platinum are worth by the pound.

A "bar" is whatever size you want to make it, so decide whether you want to carry 1 pound bars, 5 pound bars or whatever.

Not sure why your player thinks this will be more convenient, as the weight and volume are the same either way. You might be able to pack bars more closely into a chest than coins, and thus save space within the chest even though the total volume of metal is the same...but if you pack the bars so closely you can't get your fingers between them, it's harder to get them back out.

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What happens?

Well, the djinn gets to interpret anything left as ambiguous, and it wasn't specified that wishes never have been granted, so first off, he doesn't apply the effect to the past.

Second, he reasons that even through the granting has yet to be performed, the wish itself was made in the past -- the past being any point earlier than "right this second."

If the effect of the wish doesn't apply to the past, including the immediate past when the wish was made, then the wish can be granted without violating its own provisions. In practical terms, then, the wish has become "No wishes after this one will be granted."

Next comes the fact that any wish is limited in power and scope; you can't just wish the universe out of existence. The djinn decides that if perception is reality, the current wish can cover not granting any future wish that this individual could ever become aware of. (The logic there is admittedly shaky at best, but at this point the djinn can either make every effort to accommodate the person, or just say "Nope, can't do it" -- and what fun is that?)

Okay, there are any number of sources of wishes in the world, and not only can our djinn not prevent those wishes from being granted, he can't control the spread of information from all those possible sources. So his only alternative is to keep the information from reaching this person.

So to wrap it all up, the djinn summons a daemon, who kills the person making the wish and consumes his soul, destroying it utterly.

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The outfit could be worse, but I'm going to have to echo those who feel it's...disappointing, at best...and that the topless cowl is part of the aesthetic problem. It's unnecessary for someone with close cropped hair, and that makes it stick out like a sore thumb. What about Wally's hair or scalp said to Cisco "it must be free?"

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MannyGoblin wrote:
Dunk and Egg has the biggest chance of becoming a prequel series.

What gives you the impression that anything has any chance of becoming a prequel series? Where have you heard a prequel series being discussed?

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darth_borehd wrote:
I need an RPG based on the Zootopia universe.

Shard RPG

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Krensky wrote:
She builds her own suit in her dorm room which is what gets Tony's attention. She's also not the first teenager to do so.

Haven't read the story where she appears, and have to wonder: no matter how smart she is, where does she (or any other teenagers you allude to) get the resources to build Iron Man armor in her dorm room? She can't exactly scrounge microcircuitry, fuel and other such items from the recycling bins on campus.

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Mavrickindigo wrote:
When in 4606 did Aroden die?

The day the music died.

Long, long time ago. I can still remember...

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EileenProphetofIstus wrote:
Other than showing a Flight Ring, have they done anything with Legion yet on this series?


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Marco Massoudi wrote:
I also want people to see that these things DO sell out and that they should get them before they do. ;-)

Yeah, I got that. You just seemed...really vested. :)

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Geez, Marco. PM me if you want to actually want to buy any of this. :)

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Depending on your character classes, it might be worth having your friend take the Additional Traits feat in order to pick up swarming. It's a BIG help for Rogues, since they get to Sneak Attack whenever flanking, and count as flanking when swarming.

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Perhaps they can bypass the super strong metal door by:
- breaking the stone wall around it;
- destroying the door's hinges with acid, and prying it open against the lock;
- using a 1st level break spell to break the lock;
-purchasing rusting powder (60gp, and risky)

If you apply a dose of rusting powder to a metal lock or trap as part of using the Disable Device skill, you gain a +5 alchemical bonus to open the lock or disable the trap, but there is a 75% chance that the mechanism is destroyed and cannot be used afterward. If the check fails, the mechanism is destroyed. A destroyed lock cannot be unlocked (but still counts as locked for the purpose opening the locked object).

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There are keys later on. Once the party has those, they can come back to the property room.

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TheRusty1 wrote:

I'm expecting an ugly, ugly AP.

No divine caster, no social skills to speak of. Two (Tiefling and Slayer) are on the cusp of being evil. I'm expecting villagers with torches and pitchforks by week 3.

Ugly, but blessedly short for that group. The "nearly evil" part wouldn't be a serious impediment if someone else could be the party "face", but parts of this AP are rather dependent on Diplomacy and all of it will keep a divine healer (or two, in our case) quite busy.

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BigNorseWolf wrote:

NoooOOOOOOoooooo.. why? CCGI eating too much budget?

Partly. Battles and dragons are expensive visuals, and more of both are coming.

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Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:
The Twelfth Doctor accidentally makes someone immortal in Earth's Middle Ages. As her brain is still that of a mere Human, she comes up with the problem of memory limits early on. She tries some strategies to retain her memories, then ultimately realizes that she's only going to keep the ones worth keeping and forget the ones that don't matter.... like her original name. (She ultimately just calls herself... "Me".)

Since that character was played by Maisie Williams, it was amusing that A Girl had no name. :)

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Even though this is merely a thought experiment, the question is what I'd do IRL, so my religion is a factor. But we'll bypass all that and assume than an angel of the Lord appears unto me and says "Fear not, for behold, I bring...a really weird but totally legit offer."

If my wife is still alive, then I decline; in the unlikely event she has predeceased me, then...

The next question that would need to be settled would be the question of how to replace my phylactery should it be destroyed. Craft Wondrous Item is all well and good, but where am I going to get 120,000gp worth of precious materials -- what's the fantasy-to-real-life exchange rate, anyway?

Assuming I could be satisfied on that point, I think the next thing to decide would be arcane or divine lich? Divine, probably. Arcane casters have to deal with spellbooks and don't have access to all spell on the arcane spell list(s). Do liches retain domain spells/powers from their former existence? If so I'd have to work out what domains/subdomains apply to the Christian Trinity.

Divine spells I'd use routinely:


air bubble, for when I go swimming
ant haul
aura sight
create water
detect poison
discern lies
endure elements; because my 110-yr-old house isn't climate controlled
endure elements, communal
find the path
lighten object
locate object
make whole
purify food & drink
read weather
share language
wind walk
word of recall

And these at need, which would be more or less the reason for taking this on:


admonishing ray, for self-defense
ant haul, communal
breath of life
burning disarm, for the occasional gunman
cure light/moderate/serious/critical wounds
delay pain
delay poison
diagnose disease
hold person
life bubble
make whole, greater
neutralize poison
remove blindness/deafness
remove disease
remove sickness
resist energy
resist energy, communal
share language, communal
speak with dead
tongues, communal
water breathing

Arcane spells I'd use routinely:


air bubble
ant haul
comprehend languages
control vermin
detect thoughts
dimension door
endure elements
endure elements, communal
floating disc
lighten object
locate object
mage hand
magic missile, for pest control
make whole
share language
telepathic bond
unseen servant

And at need:


admonishing ray
ant haul, communal
burning disarm
delay pain
guards and wards
hold person
life bubble
lighten object, mass
move earth
overland flight
protection from energy
protection from energy, communal
resist energy
resist energy, communal
seek thoughts
share language, communal
shrink item
urban step
water breathing

*again, would need to know the fantasy-to-real-life exchange rate.

Clearly, I could do a lot more good for a lot more people with the divine spell set. I would miss things like prestidigitation, unseen servant, magic missile, fly, dimension door, and teleport, though.

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@Rakshasa: We keep a campaign journal that is decently detailed regarding most encounters. I'll look up that one and see how we handled it. I do remember it wasn't one of the more difficult ones for us.

@MannyGoblin I'll have to ask around at comic shops I don't usually go to. My FLCS and FLGS are the same shop, and they don't carry used comics. I know of Mile High Comics and online but as I mentioned, it will be a chore to sort through and grade, so finding a place in town would be much better. If I could be fairly sure they'd take whole boxes, it might be worth it to drive them up to San Marcos (40 miles) or Austin (70 miles) to either of two shops that I know carry used back issues. We've played CoC but not under Gumshoe, and we've played 5E but only as far as the introductory adventure. 5E is certainly one option going forward; we have many of those.

@Sundakan: If you were thinking my wife overreacted by calmly, with no hysterics, refusing to ever play this system again, I strongly disagree. If you think I overreacted by deciding to dump all my Pathfinder material, that's a perfectly reasonable viewpoint (with with I happen to disagree, obviously.) But last night our GM* topped us both by quitting the gaming group he's been part of for 16 years, unsubscribing from the group's messageboard, and declaring he'll have no further contact with us.

*I say "our GM", but all four of us have run campaigns in turn. Three of us have GM'd Pathfinder AP's, all of us have run D&D campaigns, some of us have run Harn, Champions, Call of Cthulhu and others.

@Zhangar: My FLGS doesn't carry used gaming material, but there may be other shops in town that do. If not, Noble Knight Games has worked for me before. As far as Pathfinder, mistakes were made on both sides of the screen, and if Ryan made it hard for us in some places, he went out of his way to help us in others. That pendulum seemed to have a wide arc sometimes. (But no, he's not bipolar.)

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Oh, nothing's going out the door tomorrow. If I'm good at anything, it's procrastinating. (I've got a couple thousand -- probably more -- comic books I should be selling, but the prospect of pulling 20+ of those long boxes out of the closet, sorting out which ones to get rid of, grading the individual issues and offering them to an online seller...)

I'm not currently set up as an Ebay seller. Seems like a lot of work, especially figuring out shipping costs. I've sold stuff to Noble Knight Games before.

I emailed Paizo Customer Service earlier and asked them to cancel all my subscription lines except (ironically) the AP; having bought 5 parts of Hell's Vengeance, I might as well get the last book. I'm a big Lovecraft fan, so I might even stick it out for Strange Aeons, but after that...

I was a Charter Subscriber stretching from Rise of the Runelords all the way to...whatever immediately preceded Iron Gods. I don't care for high tech mixing with my high fantasy, so I suspended my AP subscription to bypass it, and lost the Charter Subscriber status. Since then I think I've only skipped a Codex or two.

I am a Collector (Accumulator archetype) of a number of thins and I don't like breaking up sets or letting go of them. This is going to seriously bum me out.

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NobodysHome wrote:

I'd say you're overreacting, but your wife's reaction is nearly identical to how I was feeling about Pathfinder after our Carrion Crown fiasco... up until NobodysWife cast Mad Monkeys on the BBEG and they actually managed to steal his cape!

Hilarity ensued...

I can see how anyone who doesn't know our group might easily think I'm overreacting, but Peni has said -- calmly, with no hysterics -- that she will never play the game again, and in such situations her word is as the laws of the Medes and the Persians, which altereth not.

We have a slightly larger group that we play boardgames with, but our RPG group is just us four, and has been for well over a decade (D&D, Harn, HERO System, Pathfinder.) Letting my wife quit the group, shrugging and replacing her with someone new at the table, isn't going to happen.

She's not the only one frustrated by the game. One other player (who had also GM'd Serpent's Skull for us) had stated his intention to never run another AP, and that he would need a very long break -- years -- before even playing Pathfinder again...and when that happened, it shouldn't be in an AP, either.

As far as mad monkeys goes, I feel confident that no hilarity could be expected in whatever remained of the Carrion Crown story.

All of this being true, does it make sense for me to continue buying more product month after month? Or to let a couple hundred Paizo books gather dust on the shelves, knowing most will never be used again?

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NobodysHome wrote:
So, you have a high-level cleric in the party. Why is anyone going around without Death Ward up?

We're well aware of death ward, but as I explained to Zhanghar upthread, we don't have a wand of death ward and no good way to get one at this point.

With 6 PCs plus a cohort and an animal companion, we've got a larger number of creatures that need to be buffed/protected, and every 14-minute death ward cast is one less dismissal, holy smite, communal protection from energy or restoration available that day.

We are rushing through what we can, but it's frustrating and in some ways counterproductive to do so. We haven't got food for an extended stay at Renchurch, so we have to save some 3rd level spell slots for create food and water. Our daily routine has become: dimension door to a previously explored room with a buttload of buffs in place, most recently including haste; move quickly to the next unexplored room, suffer attacks from whatever's there, kill it, and move on to the next room. We often don't get more than two rooms done in a "day" before we have to leave due to lack of resources or lack of surviving PCs.

@Zhangar: I don't think we've run into more than a couple of 8-packs of greater shadows. The last time a bunch of us got killed it was a mixed group of greater shadows and spectres, five altogether.

All of this just became moot, because my wife just told me she's never playing Pathfinder again under any circusmtances, not even to reset and replay this encounter. That would leave two players to manage a party of eight creatures, so we have no viable way to continue the AP. The TPK may as well stand, and I should stop all my Pathfinder subscription lines and sell off 8-9 years' worth of accumulated product.

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Hitdice wrote:
Think there's a chance of LSH showing up?

C'mon, the TV show can't possibly diverge to the point of bringing in the Legion of Super-Heroes! ;)

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MannyGoblin wrote:
Cheat in their favor and give them ghost touch.

Don't want to cheat. I'd been seriously considering bless equipment as my Cleric's feat next level, and we are/were pretty close to leveling up, but that's no help now.

AFAIK the only spell that can grant temporary access to a feat you don't have (but for which you qualify) is paragon surge, which is for half-elves only.

There is a single ghost touch weapon in the party, a longsword. The Fighter's +3 flaming flail will do more hurt at half damage than the longsword will at full; it's too large for the Ratfolk TWF Ranger to use; one Cleric is carrying Raven's Head and isn't inclined to put it down in favor of a longsword; the other Cleric could wield the longsword if she weren't better off channeling or spellcasting instead.

I don't believe either Cleric had ghostbane dirge or mass ghostbane dirge prepared today, but I need to double check that. Both did have anti-incorporeal shell, but neither had a chance to cast a single spell. We have a couple of Mythic tiers and one of the Clerics can use mythic power to cast any spell on her spell list, so as long as she's not killed in the first round or tied up with confusion on the do-over, we'll be a good deal better off.

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Let's call this one Schrödinger's TPK.

We're moving through the Renchurch catacombs and get hit with the double whammy of the Whispers plus 8 greater shadows. The shadows have surprise and an initiative result higher than most of the party; and two party members (our Rogue and one of two Clerics) fail the Will save vs. the Whispers and get locked into hitting themselves every round as if confused.

The other Cleric got hit by multiple shadows during the surprise round and before she could act on Round 1, and died. (This is the second time that character has been killed by shadows before she could act.) Her Sorceress cohort suffered the same fate.

Over the next few rounds we not only lost our Wizard, our favored-enemy-undead Ranger, and his animal companion, but all five of them rose as shadows as well. We're down to one PC who can act normally, the Fighter. He's doing a bang-up job but his weapon isn't ghost touch, so every hit is half damage. He finally goes down, having taken out -- without very much help -- 12 of the 13 shadows we'd been assaulted by up to that point. He'll rise himself in a couple of rounds, at which point he and the one remaining original shadow can slay the helplessly confused Rogue and Cleric.

Game over, Tap-Baphon will rise, the world is doomed...until the GM realizes he screwed up big time. The shadows had reached out of the walls to attack us in the surprise round, but he'd forgotten to give us the cover (50% miss chance) their blind attacks should have afforded us.

So next week we may hit the reset button and play out that encounter again from the surprise round...or we may decide that having suffered 32 deaths over the course if this AP (18 of them within Renchurch) is too much, we let it lie and possibly never play a Pathfinder game again.

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Set wrote:
For instance, upon meeting Quicksilver, Cap could have dropped an enigmatic 'Not my first speedster' line during the fight, which wouldn't have proved anything, but served as a plot seed that could be used later in an Invaders-era flashback (or limited series, or whatever) with Spitfire or some other Invaders-era speedster.

That. would. have. been. awesome.

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archmagi1 wrote:
Grossly unsuited and under the thumb of a zealot are not mutually exclusive. The King, Champion of the Seven, purity of the Faith Embodied on Planetos, takes up the Sword of the Warrior (in this case, Widow's Wail), and lets the gods guide his hand against his sinner mother's unholy abomination. He would be executing the Stranger's vengeance upon this creature brought back from beyond death, and would be acting for both the Smith and the Father, forging a hard but true justice against the sin polluting the annals of the Red Keep. King Tommen, First of His Name, Champion of the Faith.

For about two seconds, after which he's just so much dead meat and the High Sparrow has lost a valuable chess piece.

I mean, unless his entire plan is to summarily eliminate the Crown rather than heavily influence which case, maybe your best option isn't choosing a champion who can't help but lose; doesn't speak well for the power of the gods.

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@ZombiePDG: Scenario 1 would be quite interesting. I don't believe there is any possibility of Scenario 2 playing out. That person is grossly unsuited for trial by combat for more than one reason.

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"Twang! Whoosh! Thud!" has become the sound effect for any trap we trip or spell-created pit someone falls into. The origin of this rather specific sound effect is Souls for the Smuggler's Shiv, Part 1 of Serpent's Skull. My Half-orc Ranger managed to miss (seeing) every vine/rope snare laid across a trail on that whole damn island! Thus:

Twang! vine/rope is tripped.
Whoosh! PC is pulled rapidly through the air.
Thud! PC smacks into a tree and hangs upside down.

(It is partly in response to that character's experience that the Ratfolk Ranger I'm running through Carrion Crown has a Perception check that tends to yield results between the high 30's and the low 50's.)

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This thread feels less like pulling back the curtain than it does looking at the backs of people who are looking behind the curtain: reading comments about announcements many of us haven't see yet.

My own fault, presumably, for not attending Paizo Con and not following anyone or anything on Twitter.

Where do the stationary Luddites go for information?

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BigNorseWolf wrote:
I think they need a villian that isn't just flash's evil twin for a change.

Agreed. I assume the thinking has been that only another speedster represents any real challenge for the Flash, but if that's true the show needs more creative writers.

Speedsters have always been problematic in comics because if used to full capacity, pretty much no one should be able to beat them. Granted, depending on the villain's defenses, they might have a problem taking the bad guy down, but evading an opponent's attacks should be effortless even if "surprised."

I remember a comic story not long after Wally West became the Flash. He was sitting in a movie theatre minding his own business when suddenly everyone and everything in the theatre froze. He quickly realized that his hyperfast reflexes had reacted to something and kicked him into speed mode automatically. Looking around, he saw a gunman at the back of the theatre, who's already fired several rounds from a high-speed automatic rifle or machine gun. His reflexes had kicked in the instant a bullet touched the back of his head, before it began to penetrate. He'd had no chance to hear the shots before that because the bullets were traveling faster than sound. He had time to disarm the gunman and move around the darkened room, collecting bullets from midair.

With reflexes like that, dodging Captain Cold's gun or moving behind Black Siren as soon as she leans forward to scream shouldn't be a problem. TV-Barry is unlikely to ever develop those reflexes -- he's only fast once he gets going -- so he can be challenged by almost anyone.

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