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Damon Griffin's page

Goblin Squad Member. RPG Superstar 2013 Marathon Voter. Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber. 1,276 posts. No reviews. 5 lists. 1 wishlist.


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Krensky wrote:
Well, if we're going to list all the people who did archery stuff and are not dead, you left off Diggle/Freelancer.

Yep, I forgot him. Been a while since John picked up a bow, I think.

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What Glenn does now is march Nicholas back to the community and insist he confess everything: how Nicholas and Aiden were the ones who panicked and broke protocol, not the earlier batch of new recruits; how Nicholas got Noah killed and tried to leave Glenn and the others behind immediately after; how he lied about that, and now tried to murder Glenn.

Glenn knows he needs to show Deanna and the others that Rick's group is more than just a bunch of hardened killers. He's had reason and opportunity to kill Nicholas more than once, and hasn't. Holding back is the difference between "we were almost out there too long" and "it's too late, we were absolutely out there too long."

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Starling City needs to issue Visual Archer Recognition Cards to all law enforcement types. Similar to visual aircraft recognition cards used since WWII, these might allow officers to distinguish between the ever increasing number of them in town:

The Arrow
Malcolm Merlyn/Al Sa-Her/The Magician
Thea Queen
Ra's al Ghul
Nyssa al Ghul
Maseo Yamashiro/Sarab
Carrie Cutter/Cupid
Helena Bertinelli/Huntress

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A TV Guide article in early February confirmed shrinking in A.T.O.M.'s future, though hints it wasn't part of Palmer's original design, but the result of an epiphany he gets after Felicity's input on the chip.

Can't find any trace of that article online.

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I want to say that's an ability from a prestige class, suitable for bards and rogues. Similar to Master Spy or Master of Masks, but maybe leaning more toward the theatrical than -- wait, is it Epic Infiltrator?

...perhaps Zhentarim Spy

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Yes, he's been around since the early '60s but was never an A-list character. In the comics, Ray Palmer was a graduate student in physics who discovered a way to shrink things using a piece of a white dwarf star. He got trapped in a cave-in, and was forced to risk the process on himself to get out.

He created the superhero identity of The Atom. He's able to shrink to submicroscopic size, but as a rule switches between his normal height and about six inches.

DC comics continuity being what it is (non-existent, over the long term), Palmer has been replaced as The Atom, come back, had his backstory changed, etc.

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Welcome, Julie!

"...playing tabletop games since 2006." God I feel old.

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Set wrote:
So, ages ago, watching an episode of Buffy where two characters switch minds and learning that an actress I liked was not good playing the other actresses character, while the other actress *rocked* at playing the other character. It kind of completely changed my view of those two actresses.

"Witch" where cheerleader and rat-to-be Amy swaps minds with her mom? Robin Riker as mom; Elizabeth Anne Allen as Amy.

Set wrote:
Tonight, more of the same, with Ming-Na Wen doing an incredible job playing Agent 33, really selling her insecurity and lack of self-confidence, while Chloe Bennett didn't really rock my world in her scenes as Agent 33.

Completely agreed. Bennett was lame there. Agent 33 was played by...six people in that episode? The major she impersonated after Talbot's wife *may* have had less personality, by virtue of having no lines (as Agent 33.)

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I know from past experience how difficult (and sometimes demoralizing) job hunting can be, even for just a few months.

It's good you have a plan.

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For those who believe consumables should "haunt the character forever" as part of his WBL, consider the problem from this angle: your 5th level Wizard just died (in a Medium advancement game, where the GM pays attention to WBL) with no hope of being raised. You need to create a 5th level replacement.

The table indicates you're entitled to 10,500gp worth of gear, but realistically over the course of his career to date, that Wizard will have burned through a number of potions/oils/elixirs, alchemical items, scrolls, a wand or two, maybe a couple of feather tokens. Just to put some numbers to it, let's say...

6 potions of 1st level spells - 300gp
6 scrolls of 1st level spells - 150gp
2 potions of 2nd level spells - 1,200gp
2 scrolls of 2nd level spells - 600gp
2 elixirs (hiding and vision) - 500gp
2 wands of 1st level spells - 1,500gp
10 flasks of alchemists fire - 200gp
5 tanglefoot bags - 250gp
1 feather token (bird) - 300gp

If you assume your replacement 5th level PC has already used these up, is he still entitled to 10,500gp in combined permanent and [unused] consumables when you create him, or only 5,500gp worth?

The assertion that consumables don't put a dent in WBL, or that no one ever spends much of their gold on them, is not warranted.

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If it went to 100 it would be the Arduin Grimoire.

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GralphidB wrote:
Does she have Use Magic Device? ...wand of greater invisibility, or convince the sorcerer to cast it on her, with either a spell known, or buy him a wand or page of spell knowledge with greater invisibility...

She does not have UMD. The wand in question would cost 21,000gp, the page 16,000gp and we don't have that kind of cash at the moment. The sorcerer is only a cohort of a PC cleric, so she gets decent handouts but not actual shares of treasure. We're at level 11.99, a single encounter away from 12th but since the cohort is 2 levels behind she won't be able to learn greater invisibility until the rest of us are at 13th.

Mark_Twain007 wrote:
Smokestick...Greater Feint

Smokestick doesn't negate a DEX bonus to AC. It obscures all vision including darkvision past 5' and grants a 20% miss chance within 5'; either way she'd be affected the same as the target. Ditto smoke pellets, and all of them only last one round.

I'm not 100% sure but I kind of think no one in the group has Combat Expertise, so anyone would need three feat slots to get to Greater Feint: at 13th, 15th and 17th level. The campaign will be over by then.

the David wrote:
Well, she does have darkvision. She could try effectively blinding her opponents by eliminating the light sources first, or she could try a wand of Darkness.

Darkvision hasn't been much of an advantage for a while. We've fought constructs, undead, outsiders, and deep aquatic creatures -- all have darkvision.

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ohako wrote:

check out the decoy ring. multiple rounds of non-fading invsibility, not to mention illusory duplicates.

combine that with some sniper goggles and a shortbow.

how's that?

The decoy ring is a nice defensive item, but useless for offense since it only functions when you either take the withdraw action or become helpless. It wouldn't help her sneak attack. Our group's sorcerer needs this ring, though.

The sniper's goggles don't create or prolong conditions where she can sneak attack, only allow her to do so from more than 30' if the conditions to allow it already exist. Still really worth getting on their own, for the added range and +2 damage on each SA die.

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My wife and I are playing a pair of Ratfolk, which allow us to occupy the same square and count as flanking an adjacent opponent; we also have Outflank and Precise Strike as teamwork feats.

She's a Rogue 11/Monk 1 who uses natural attacks almost exclusively. As a Rogue she can sneak attack any time her opponent is flanked, so we're in the same square as often as we can be, but sometimes it's just not possible.

As compared to flanking with me, when I'm not there she will lose a +4 attack bonus and +1d6 precision damage, and unless she can meet conditions some other way, may also lose +6d6 sneak attack damage -- for more than one attack per round.

She wants to find as many ways as possible to retain her Sneak Attack ability when my PC isn't around. What ways are there to count as flanking someone when you aren't, or to deny a target his DEX bonus to AC -- preferably for more than one round -- which would have the same effect?

She's got a ring of invisibilty (good for one attack) and can attempt stunning fist three times a day (good for one round each), but she's had poor luck with opponents making the DC 19 Fort save.

It's not like she can force an opponent to climb during melee; she doesn't melee with running targets; she can't easily blind them.

She doesn't have ranks in Bluff, so she can't feint (and if she did, that's a standard action that would benefit her next single attack, at a cost of an attack this round.)

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Aberzombie wrote:
One of the big problems these day, in my own not-at-all humble opinion, is (a)they refuse to kill off Crowley (who's become a idiotic wuss) and Metatron (who just needs to have the s*#* kicked out him repeatedly and forever), meaning they will keep using them as lame, worn out antagonists, and (b) resolve the f@*+ing Mark of Cain thing already!!! Or are we just going to spend the rest of the series with Sam trying to find a cure while Dean flip-flops about "I'm gonna fight it" "I'm done fighting it".

Your ideas are intriguing to me and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter.

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Several possible points of divergence to be exploited in the next episode, some of which may be mutually exclusive. The bowling alley scene(s), the coroner's murder by Mark Martin, Wells & Cisco watching an old Buster Keaton movie, all that should be fixed and unalterable.


Starting at 6:20 when Barry is running alongside himself for the "first" time, Barry can begin making changes, or possibly starting at 06:33 when they both stopped at the same point, saw the clock change from 9:59 to 10:00 and heard the woman screaming about being late. At that point [at least] one Barry ran off to the coroner's office.

7:15 Crime scene at coroner's office. Barry bumps into Capt. Singh and spills coffee on his new suit. If the two Barrys are still merged at this point, he will probably avoid this spill and realize he can change past events. Other than referencing Singh's fiancee, there's really no other reason to have had the coffee spill in the original scene.

7:22 Second later he's talking to Joe, only now he knows a lot more than he did originally and doesn't have to "guess" the coroner was killed by hail.

8:30 Back at STAR labs, pretty much everyone who knows Barry's secret all in the room. Barry making changes here could be complicated but the most likely point would be his side conversation with Wells about seeing himself the night before. Neither version of Barry knows about Wells being [a] Reverse Flash, or killing Cisco so there's no reason not to have that conversation again, only again, Barry knows more this time. Will the knowledge that Barry has broken the time barrier affect any actions Wells takes later in the episode?

10:10. Singh's office. Barry is present but probably wouldn't say anything to Joe until they've left the office and they "go to lunch." This time around, Barry could suggest it instead of Joe.

11:35 Eddie and Iris hash it out over the bowling alley. No reason to see this again since there's no reason it should be any different.

12:30 Joe and Barry in Joe's car. Barry would be ready for Martin's attack this time around and should be able to get to Martin's truck before the lightning strike, nabbing him instead of having to save Joe. But that would be very anticlimactic (also, anit-climatic) so either the writers will find some excuse for it not to happen, or the plot focus will shift entirely away from Martin and onto the consequences of altering the timeline. If the latter, Singh will never confine Joe to his desk, Martin won't show up at the precinct, Singh will never be injured, etc.

15:30 Iris will still get a file from her boss raising suspicions about Wells.

17:45 Iris talks to Barry about Wells and Stagg; Barry mentions it to Caitlin and Cisco. Again, neither version of Barry knows anythings against Wells at this point, so it's hard to see why this should go any differently.

19:45 (originally) Cicso tries to talk to Joe about Wells, but Joe's busy. If Barry nabs Martin out of his pickup the second time around, maybe Joe's not busy and they can actually have this conversation, which might possibly change Cisco's actions down the line.

20:15 (originally) Martin arrives at the precinct to attack Joe. Capt. Singh is badly injured. Again, if Barry captures Martin earlier, this never happens. Pretty much nothing involving Barry or Joe from the original timeline would be the same after this point. Joe doesn't go to Martin's old hideout, never gets taken to the waterfront, there's no tsunami, Barry doesn't reveal his Flash identity to Iris.

Of course, if there's no tsunami, and no reason to run back and forth really fast, he doesn't go back in time, and...

22:30 Cisco's conversation with Caitlin about Wells. Could be different based on any change with Cicso's (second iteration) conversation with Joe. But as long as he end up asking Caitlin to keep Wells out of the lab the next day, and repeats his same investigation, he should end up getting killed again. (Assuming Wells did succeed in killing him the first time around, and not triggering his transformation into Vibe.)

26:00 Barry talks to Mason about Wells. But both Barrys remain clueless about Wells's actions in the original timeline so why would he now choose to do anything differently here?

Throughout the whole plot as we saw it, there is no point where Iris, Eddie, Caitlin or Cicso are justified in changing any of their actions except (a) where directly influenced by Barry's changed actions to do so, or (b) if any of them experience a sense of deja vu during the reboot.

The first time through, Barry never actually found out anything to show Wells was bad. He doesn't know Wells effectively revealed himself to Caitlin by disappearing out of his wheelchair at Jitters. He doesn't know Wells killed Cisco. So even on the second pass, his only changes should relate to Martin and to the fact he now knows time travel is possible. I don't see how he'd end up changing anything Wells does.

Preview for next week makes it clear Cisco survives but no indication as to how. And how does wrapping up Martin more quickly result in Snart coming back?

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Reach: You use a reach weapon to strike opponents 10 feet away, but you can't use it against an adjacent foe.

Okay, since the reach property by definition creates a dead zone, then making a bastard sword bigger should not grant the reach property.

This alters the question to whether a sufficiently large weapon should allow attacking non-adjacent foes even though they lack the reach property. Corvino and Insain Dragon say no, and this is likely to be correct, though it flies in the face of common sense.

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Corvino wrote:
The way the rules work the length of the weapon is not important. Either it has the "Reach" property or it does not. It could be a hundred feet long but without having reach it still only attacks at your natural reach.

I won't say you're wrong, but if you're right, that rule is really bizarre, since it is the length of the listed reach weapons that make them reach weapons in the first place. Grrr!

Also, normal reach weapons don't attack at my natural (5') reach, they grant their own (usually 10') reach.

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I don't have any of them. Tacticslion?

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Insain Dragoon wrote:

It would attack at your natural reach. At huge size your natural reach is up to 15 ft.

If you were wielding a huge long spear you would not be able to attack at your natural reach, but would be able to attack squares 20,25, and 30 ft.

Typical reach weapons like longspears and tridents can't hurt adjacent foes because those weapons deal damage only from their tips. A sword that does slashing damage is a threat along the entire length of its blade so I think it's a valid question whether a sufficiently long sword blade could target either the adjacent square or the one just beyond it.

My size remains Medium, so *my* natural reach is 5'. If I were using a normal-sized reach weapon, the weapon itself would give me 10' reach even though I didn't change size, due to the weapon's length. Again, trying to determine whether a sufficiently long non-reach weapon becomes a de facto reach weapon due to its increased length.

Although this may all be moot now, if DM Blake is correct about a Huge bastard sword being 16' long. However, outside of enlarge person, the footnotes for weapon tables have a different idea about its weight, at least:

Weight: This is the weight of the weapon in pounds. The weights given are for Medium weapons. A Small weapon weighs half as much; a Large weapon weighs twice as much.

Weight: This column gives the weight of a Medium version of the weapon. Halve this number for Small weapons and double it for Large weapons.

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Once I establish the overall weapon length (assuming I can, from RAW), my next question may be: does the exta length make it into a reach weapon? Can I now hit creatures not adjacent to me, but 5' farther away?

If the game doesn't model it that way, and the increased weapon length doesn't grant an extra 5' reach, that's fine, but either way I need to know, if possible by RAW/RAI but I'll take a reasoned opinion.

If the game defies the square-cube law and says that for each increase in size category, a weapon's weight and length both double, giving me an 8' long Large bastard sword and a 16' long Huge bastard sword, then there's really no value for this cleric in the overcompensation spell -- a 6' tall character can't expect to wield a 16' long sword no matter what the spell description says.

EDIT: I did not see DM BLake's reply before posting the above.

@ DM Blake What you say about enlarge person makes perfect sense...except that enlarge person has always been problematic on its own. The affected creature's size (2x) and mass (8x) increase, along with that of his equipment, fails to be matched by the mere +2 STR increase that the spell provides.

A Medium creature with 18 STR weighs, say, 250# equipped (a 170# character lugging 80# of gear, including a 48# Large weapon.) This puts him comfortably in his Light encumbrance category, wielding a weapon that takes up roughly one-sixth of his maximum load.

Enlarged, that creature and his equipment now weigh 2000# (640# of gear including his 384# weapon)...but the character's max load is only 400#. He's shifted from Light encumbrance to "I can lift it off the ground, but not over my head, and I can only move 5' a round with it."

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Can't help you with #6 or #7, but #3 The Way of the Hoof can be had from

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My Rage-domain cleric of Ragathiel is already using a Large bastard sword. A Medium bastard sword weighs 6# and is about 4' in overall length with a blade not more than 2" wide (probably a little less.)

A Large bastard sword weighs 12# and assuming it retains the proportions of the Medium version, is about 5' in length as well as being correspondingly wider (2.5") and thicker.

I'm considering having her sorceress cohort pick up the 3rd party spell overcompensation, which "causes the weapon touched to grow to the next smallest size that would normally make it impossible to wield. The damage dealt by the weapon increases as though it were one size category larger, but the weapon can be wielded as though it were its original size." This would bring the weapon's base damage up to 3d8, with bonus damage from its enhancement bonus, from the cleric's rage-boosted STR and from the destructive smite domain ability.

Do Huge weapons weigh twice as much as Large ones, or should there be a greater multiplier, like 4x? If 2x, then a Huge bastard sword weighs 24# and would run about 6'4" long, with a 3.15" wide blade.

Seems like they should be bigger/heavier. A Huge creature -- say 16' tall with a 15' reach -- would be wielding a weapon less than half its height, which isn't usual for bastard swords.

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No, Neil and others have already made it clear the party has options that don't mandate alliance. She won't have to play in a way she doesn't want to. I just want her to have all the information so she can have options for nuanced play. The wife is very much a roleplayer, and enjoys character immersion much more than game mechanics. At the moment she's hard set against even a temporary alliance because she assumes that what Pharasma would expect of her.

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Charles Scholz wrote:

Can't remember the title of this movie.

A rogue sun is on a collision course for Earth. There is a planet orbiting the sun, and the only way man can survive is to build a rocket and launch it to the alien planet just before the Earth is destroyed.

"...and When Worlds Collide, said George Pal to his bride, I''m gonna give you some terrible thrills..."

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Thanks, Neil. Our GM isn't on the boards, but I'll mention it to him.

Meantime, I'll pull up all the relevant history I can find and have my wife read it (she's our Pharasmin Cleric.) As players we need to stay out of the AP books; anywhere we should be looking for Ustalav/vampire/Shining Crusade background other than Rule of Fear? If it matters, the recently released setting book for Belkzen is one of the very few I don't own.

For vampires in general I might reference Classic Horrors Revisited, but I don't remember if there's anything there on the vampires of Ustalav in particular.

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Vaaaaaughn!!! We finished Book 4. Just before the end we discovered that having a high Perception check can be a Very Bad Thing. 6d6 SAN loss?!?

As been true with some of the earlier books, we're finding virtue has to be its own reward; we recovered the effigy and were given a price for which we could sell it. But we know it's stolen property, and we're not criminals. We feel obliged to return it to Lepidstadt University and hope that maybe there's some kind of reward. Also, we're not high enough level to cast regeneration so we're planning to shell out -- pun intended -- thousands of GP to pay for an NPC Cleric in Caliphas to restore the, er, preserved residents of Illmarsh we found under the lake.

On the up side, it looks like we might have some breathing room for a while. A note found suggests the cult's plans can't be completed without a certain item we have in our possession, so we can stop chasing them non-stop and take the time to upgrade our magical gear.

Our Pharasmin Cleric remains squicked out at the prospect of allying with vampires for any reason, but we'll see how it goes.

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Set wrote:

No organization, nation, etc., even if it's introduced as having been spectacularly successful for *millennia,* is going to last more than a few years once it appears in a comic book before getting blowed up / proven to be suddenly useless.

I blame it on Krypton.

It's a very old trope, and not limited to (or originating with) comics. Think about all the old movies where some hidden valley/plateau is found in modern times with living dinosaurs and "cavemen". By the end of the movie, a volcano, earthquake or other massive natural disaster that had waited millions of years to happen, suddenly hits within hours or days of our heroes' arrival.

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I was sort of on the opposite end of this problem, about 100 years ago. I was playing a Thief (AD&D 1st) and the GM's girlfriend was playing a Paladin. I wasn't stealing from the party, just doing my job as the party's proto-Rogue. At every turn the Paladin would object, insisting I not pick locks, be sneaky or otherwise behave in any way a Lawful Uptight character might find objectionable.

It got to be seriously annoying; her character would try to physically restrain mine, or intentionally be noisy when I was attempting stealth (because "good" people don't sneak around), etc. I finally told the GM our characters were going to have to come to blows and he said "You can't hit the Paladin. If you try, her god will smite you dead."

Aaaaaand, scene. My last session in that game.

@HoneyBadger: My advice is find another group, since you have a player who insists on pestering you endlessly and a GM who flatly refuses to do anything about it.

Short of that, nothing in the rules indicates that a bag of holding looks like anything but an empty sack; it has a constant weight and doesn't expand when stuff's put into it. So if it's a flat sack, roll it up and tuck it into the front of your belt during the day, then wear it under your clothes when you sleep. +26 Sleight of Hand, meet DC 60 skill check.

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baron arem heshvaun wrote:
Did you guys catch the Joker costume on the performer on stage at the Penguin/Fish's club?

No. At what point?

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Thanks, Neil, that's extremely helpful.

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Hosteling armor won't work for me; the Ranger in question is a Small sized Ratfolk and his companion is a Large wolf; hosteling only allows you to store an animal of up to the armor wearer's size (or one category larger with heavy armor or a tower shield.)

A wand of carry companion may be the solution I need.

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Lord Snow wrote:
But he didn't, right? Sousa was just pretending to hear him.

His experience with his own abilities evidently suggested to him that he should have been able to do it; this in turn suggests he has done similar things before.

We weren't shown how he whammied the black cop, or Stark, but in general it all seemed much too quick and easy for "Ivchenko" and it bugged me a lot. (I have similar issues on other shows with talented hackers being able to access a secure database they've never visited before with four keystrokes, etc.) Perhaps I should learn to accept these things, but somehow I don't.

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We have a large party (6 PCs, one cohort and a Large wolf animal compansion) and even with two arcane casters -- one of which is the cohort -- we're currently at a point where we can't move everyone via dimension door. That will change once we hit 12th, but we've already had a pair of really nasty fights in an area we had to access via DD, and so had to leave the animal companion behind each time.

Apart from using two feats (Spell Focus: Conjuration and Spell Specialization: Dimension Door), is there any way to boost the number of creatures a single caster can dimension door or teleport?

A magic item (to boost a caster's existing capacity, not replace it with, say, a CL 12 wand of dimenson door), a metamagic feat or even a spell that boosts it for a few rounds?

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I really did not like the handling of "hypnotism" in this show. Faustus has no superhuman powers, and they would have been required to achieve some of the effects he did (or attempted) here.

Yes, comic-book Faustus is able to make others do things very much against their natures, but he depends on gadgets, chemicals, disguised henchman/androids and such to pull it off, and it takes time.

He did have some time with Chief Dooley. But believing he could, in a few seconds and with nothing but the sound of his voice, convince Sousa to shoot Thompson? Beyond ridiculous. It smacks of the Mad Hatter's "super instant mesmerizer" in the '60s Batman show.

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Duly noted.

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And we did appreciate the realistic scenario, despite the extreme beating we took; too many published adventures (speaking generally, not just about Paizo/Pathfinder) assume that enemies remain in place, only activating when you actually enter the room; or at best say "if you make noise, the bad guys in Room 27 move to Room 28."

He's being tactical, changing the spells listed for some of the NPC casters, etc. This is all good. He also mentioned that a certain statuette they have at the moment allows their cleric to commune so they had some notion of what to expect from us when we went back the second time.

Yes, skum are no real threat on their own, but when they turn up in large numbers they more or less force the use of a couple of AOE spells, which then aren't available for more serious threats. I mentioned we'd only managed to kill 20 skum (of the 21 present) and *one* of the more dangerous foes, the gug. I presume any reasonable number of skum are available for reinforcements, so it's almost like we didn't kill them at all, only put them down temporarily and let them regenerate once we left. And next time there may be more than three mi-go, and/or more than three dimensional shamblers, and/or more than one gug...and/or something even worse.

The players pretty much know by now, even if the characters do not, that the mi-go will have put the mayor's brain in a cannister or done something equally nasty and prohibitively hard/expensive to reverse. This may have been done to other townsfolk or perhaps they're all dead, including the mayor, along with the Dark Rider who we have yet to find.

If there's nothing else we can do for them, and we already have the artifact weapon...well, there's been some debate as to whether we really need to make a third trip beneath the lake. In the end we decided we had to, because at this point we have no idea where to go once we leave Illmarsh, and presume that clue is down here somewhere.

First we need to raise two PCs from the dead, then go somewhere and resupply, gather protective potions and such, and make our third trip as if going to war.

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Zhangar wrote:

Depends on how many enemies the GM provides as reinforcements.

Well, yes, my question about what we'll face next time was rhetorical. I still want no spoilers; we were just shocked at the level of smackdown we were handed.

Once we're done with the AP I'm going to go back and add those 29 enemies together to see what the total effective CR of that fight was. In this last fight we only managed to kill 20 skum and the gug.

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Another fight like the one we just had, and Book 5 may not be an issue for some of our characters.

On our first dive below the Tern Rocks, weekend before last, we were attacked by

a sentient devilfish and his summoned eels & sharks; we skilled all the summoned creatures and eventually drove off the devilfish, but only after a significant expendature of resources. Once we reached the complex at the bottome, we fought/killed, in separate battles:

2 dimensional shamblers
14 or 15 skum
a sentient fungus ball
9 or 10 mi-go

Feeling really drained by this point we decided to head back

in the direction of the exit, but our Rogue wanted to scout ahead, flying and invisible, for just a little ways. She did recover Raven's Head as a result, but also brought down a skum Cleric, a gug and some extra skum on us as a result, and we just barely got all six PCs out with coordinated dimension doors before a couple of us were toast.

So we recharged overnight, went back the next day (in-game, a week later in real time) and

were in very short order in a massive fight. We encountered another of the fungus balls -- this one had a lot of class levels and fared better against us than the earlier one. As soon as we killed it, we heard marching feet. We found ourselves facing 21 more skum, their cleric, the gug, three dimensional shamblers and three mi-go -- one of which was armed with a cone of cold rifle! 29 opponents to our 7, in one fight! Two PCs died (our Fighter and Wizard), two more were rendered unconscious/dying (Rogue and Pharasmin Cleric) and all four were carried off by our enemies to their laboratory.

Some creative spellcasting from the surviving sorcerer (cohort of one of the two surviving/free PCs), a couple of very lucky skill checks and a certain amount of sympathy from the GM allowed the bodies to be retrieved, but still: WTF are we going to face when we go back a third time, with some of the PCs still under a negative level after raise dead and a single restoration?

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Update: over the course of the past two months, Mark --

* was diagnosed with Stage IV cancer
* had a heart attack
* contracted pneumonia
* suffered a mild stroke
* developed two blood clots (one in the heart, one in the main pulmonary artery)

At the time of his cancer diagnosis in December he was given 2-3 months to live without treatment. Since then he's had two radiation treatments, and had a single chemo treatment; all the crap with the pneumonia and blood clots left him too weak for more. Since a half dozen of each (radiation and chemo) would be more typical, it's almost like he hasn't had any, so he likely has a matter of weeks to live.


Thanks to everyone who gave, sent well-wishes, or even took the time to read this thread.

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Rynjin wrote:
Why is Barbara sticking around? I'm pretty sure Barbara/Batgirl's mom was someone else.

Barbara Gordon's background has been reshuffled several times in the comics, so there's no way to be sure who her mother will be in this show. In order to avoid a big age gap between future Batman and future Batgirl -- and there should be a gap, but not a huge one -- she'll need to be born in the next handful of years, and at this point Barbara Kean and Leslie Thompkins are the only candidates in view.

If you were "Lee" would you want your husband naming your daughter after his ex?

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Hoplophobia wrote:
"I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your way, Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon, and stand a post. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think of my methods." -Paladin Jessep

I really don't see Col. Jessup as a paladin. I see him as a LN fighter for whom the ends justify the means. A person is not LG, for example, if he can use the phrase "by any means necessary" without a qualm.

I'm not suggesting such people aren't useful; they may even be necessary. But they aren't paladins.

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Kalshane wrote:
I was referring to this look. Which seems to be part of what the movie look is based on.

I had not seen that one, but then I pretty much ignored DC after the lead-up to 52 (not the New52 Universe, but "52" the weekly comic series.)

And God, do I hate that harpoon hand he got back in...Atlantis Chronicles? Time & Tide?

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I see nothing in Iomedae's paladin code that should prevent using Blinding Critical.

If you're conflicted about it, consider Bleeding Critical (+2d6 bleed damage) or Staggering Critical (opponent can no longer take full round actions), either of which should shorten the combat.

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Kalshane wrote:

I mean, I fully support ditching the orange shirt (and it has a precedence in both the comics and the DCAU) but blacks and grays don't scream Aquaman. There needs to be some green and gold in there.

Hey, orange is the new black. :)

No, I realize the producers are going to see a need to make some characters' costumes less garish; your example of Hawkeye, and similar considerations with Mockingbird's mask and sleeves in some versions of that character, apply. One (fortunately failed) treatment of Superman some years back would have had him in a black costume. No. I'm sorry, you don't get to redecorate Superman

But I digress.

The problem I have with Aquaman's costume is that with very slight variations, he's only had two costumes in the past 70-ish years: the usual orange-and-green, and that awful blue-and-white "wave camo" pattern from the mid-'80s. Anything but something very close to the orange-and-green is going to feel like a radical departure -- and we're already getting a decidedly not fair-skinned blond in Jason Momoa. I find that casting interesting, but I can only be expected to accept so much change in a long-established character.

"Martian Manhunter's skin looks stupid in bright green, let's make him a muted red."

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This is our group's third AP and we keep running into situations that make us wonder what the writers were thinking, or what kinds of PCs they imagined would be running the adventure. Earlier in Carrion Crown, for example, our exploration of Schloss Caromarc detailed the resale value of all kinds of personal if we Good Guys were expected to rob the home of someone who had (via the Beast) invited us to visit him?

Different APs, different situations, but a recurring pattern of assumptions that the PCs will be either amoral or heartlessly mercenary, or both. So we were concerned about the prospect that we'd now be expected to ally ourselves with intelligent undead no matter what our party makeup might be. Good to hear that's not [entirely] the case.

We are becoming a little hardened regarding payment for services, and may require all such payments to be made in advance from now on. Most recently

the mayor of Illmarsh offered us 4000gp to investigate the disappearances of several locals. We took on the job, and when we got back to town the mayor had gone missing; a subsequent commune as to whether he was still alive came back "unclear." So, no pay.

Our group has played a lot of Call of Cthulhu, and some of us are very familiar with Mythos stories. One of the last combats we had this past weekend below the lake was with mi-go, which leads the players -- though not the PCs, who remain puzzled about what "unclear" could mean -- to suspect that at some point we'll find the mayor's living brain in a metal cannister awaiting transport to Yuggoth or wherever. Still not likely we'll get paid.

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@Ben the Red - Not to worry, I'm not straying from this one thread into the larger forum. Our current GM isn't a Paizo subscriber never visits these boards (not that you have to be a subscriber to do so); I'll suggest it but have little faith he'll read through multiple threads. I'll make sure he finds and reads the appropriate sidebar, at least.

Xanzal wrote:
There is a viable alternative to allying with the vampires, so it doesn't hinge on an alliance. Personally, I don't like the alternative, but it is there.

Good enough.

Xanzal wrote:
Pharasma despises the undead, but she is not the mindless 'Kill 'em all' type of goddess. Gaining help from the vampires for the time being, then coming back when stronger to kill the vampires is probably something she'd be rather okay with.


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Tybid wrote:
There is an 'NPC' that is very closely allied with Pharasma in Book 4. (Your GM will know why I put quotation marks around that NPC)

If you are referring to

Raven's Head, we recovered it in last weekend's session, but nothing suggested it was intelligent.

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Matthew Morris wrote:
In the comics, at least post brightest day/pre reboot, there was a White Canary. I thought we were going to see China White take on the mantle, but a resurrected Sara would fit as well. a serial killer? White Canary was a straight up villain.

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I'm currently a player in Carrion Crown, and we'll be starting Ashes At Dawn in a week or two, so no spoilers please!

The DM running this for us has good experience with D&D 3.x in a homebrew setting, but this AP is his first time behind the Pathfinder screen, and by his own admission he's not always good about catching details in the background/flavor text in the AP volumes.

Our party includes no Paladins, but we do have a Ranger with undead as a favored enemy and more problematically, a Pharasmin Cleric. The ad copy for Ashes At Dawn suggests the party will have to ally with undead in order to oppose the Whispering Way.

That Cleric's player takes roleplaying very seriously and if Pharasma's attitude toward undead is "Kill 'em all, let Me sort 'em out" then she's going to feel like she can't participate in any such alliance.

So, your personal opinions about alignment aside, can anyone...

...cite a general reference showing that Pharasma might be okay with this given the extreme circumstance?

...point our GM to anything in Ashes At Dawn (maybe just a page number, so I get no hints) that gives Paladins or (preferably) Pharasmins this latitude?

...assure me that there's a viable alternative to allying with undead and still accomplishing our goal? (don't tell me what the alternative is)


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