CuttinCurt's page

I dont have my books with me to look this up, but I thought Katapesh (the city) had a purging of all Sarenae worshipers (a witch hunt). Or is my rememberance of the history off?

Jubbly,

The large non-annotated version of Level 1 has an issue displaying. You might want tot ake a look into that. Lvl 2 is just fine.

CC

I do love the blood stain detail in the lower level. Nicely done

With the Pugwampis, any battle can take a while.

However, with the king, it is especially difficult for the AC reason given earlier in this thread.

However, the king's touch AC is only (1) point better than the regular pugs.

And, has anyone tried to grapple the thing? Talk about easy...

CMB DC King Mokknok = 7

Even a first level wizard can grapple this thing.

I am shocked that CMB so rarely gets used. I have perused these boards for a while and rarely see a DM thread that has PC's utilizing this function of combat.

The fact that this thing is tiny should set off an alarm in all melee combatants that this creature is weak against grapple, trip, bull rush and all the other CMB options.

Is there anyone that bull rushes to set off AoO's?

Anyway, that is my 2cp.

I am hoping there are a few individuals that love character creation and would like to help me tweak this concept for a beta-version bard for the Rise of the Runelords AP.

I will be as concise as possible.

General Idea: I want to play a character that has finished a career in the Coins District Token Guards in Absolom. Everything that has kept him in Absolom all these years; children, wife, and career are all gone. Children moved away to Varisia, the mother’s homeland, wife passed away, and 26 years in the coins guard was enough for anyone. So, my character sails to Magnimar from Absolom on his final life quest: To die a hero through force of arms, something he never was able to accomplish in Absolom during his tour of duty. He had wanted to be a part of the Azlanti Keep’s city guard, but his ties to the thieves guild kept such a promotion from happening. This character ended up being in charge of training new recruits for the coins guard, thus, this character has the “military drill sergeant” theme

Base character Game mechanics: Attribute modification for being Middle Aged (46 year old human), and the Rich parents trait modified to represent his savings for a career already completed (+900gp starting). I have not decided on my second character trait.

Class Progression: Bard to Level 7, (1) level of War Weaver, then Lyric Theurge for (7) levels.

Bard: Perform skills are based off Full Metal Jacket’s drill sergeant, so Oratory and Storytelling will be my only perform skills (of course, I will have Weapon Drill as a perform skill for obvious reasons). This character will not be able to sing or play an instrument. Inspire Courage is the main power focus of this bard, with alternate class features from the Complete Champion such as Hymn of Fortification and Healing Hymn rounding out the first three levels perfectly. Picture this guy in the face of the cleric, “pumping up” his adrenaline with a few chosen words before he heals, and then the cleric pushing out some fantastic healing. +1pt per rank in perform? Oh yea! And the second part of the Healing hymn goes along perfectly with the “before we go to bed” speech, prepping the group for a hard day of battle in the morning, allowing a double nights rest of healing and recovery in an 8 hour period. Very nice.

Lyric Theurge: From the complete Mage. This prestige class allows for my bardic music uses to keep increasing every level, and at the same time, gives a few extra spells and spell slots so I can round out my military spell selection with spells from the Sorcerer/wizard spell list. Spells that enhance my allies abilities and others that shape the battlefield will be reserved for these select spell slots. Also, my sonic spells increase in potency with this PrC.

War Weaver: With my military background, I can see this very basic power manifesting in my bard. Creating a web of magic that allows for pre-battle buff spells to be cast once and they affect every ally in the group. This simulates my drill sergeant’s awesome motivation skills by a simple speech. If you picture Full Metal Jacket when the drill sergeant finds the jelly donut of Pyle, the screw up recruit, you will see a follow up speech by him to the group of marines that were Pyles classmates. Well, they (the other marines) had to do pushups while pyle ate the donut. If that had been my bard in there, those marine recruits would have received cats grace so they could sneak up on pyle that night and kick the crap out of him. That’s what I am thinking here…

Spell Selection and Feats: Here is where the character is so different than other bards that I have seen and read about. For my feats, I will be taking:

1st Character: Extra bardic song

1st Human: Extra bardic song

3rd Character: Melodic Casting (required for Lyric Theurge – Comp Mage)

5th Character: Extra bardic song

7th Character: Lyric Spell (Comp Adventurer)

9th Character: Extra bardic song

I want to stop there as these feats define this character. As you can see, with this array of feats, I am building my song count so by 9th level, I will have a total of 25 uses per day of my bardic song. The Lyric spell feat allows me to use my bardic song for casting spells. If I wanted to cast a 2nd level spell, that would cost me (1) bardic song use per level of the spell +1. In this case, that 2nd level spell would cost me 3 bardic music uses.

Spell Choices: I am only going to 3rd level here for discussion.

0: level – Lullaby, Stick

1st: level – Inspirational Boost, Sleep, Improvisation, Phantom Threat, Cure Lt.

2nd: level – Iron Silence, Sonic Weapon, Tactical Precision, Spymasters Coin, Cure Mod

3rd: level – Allegro, Hymn of Praise, Harmonic Chorus, Nightmare Terrain, Listening Coin, Cure Serious.

Spell Themes:

Infiltration / Gather Information: Based off Coins experience in Absolom

Lullaby: makes sneaking around others much easier, and, if a sleep spell is cast on someone affected by lullaby, they get a -5 on their will save.

Stick: glue small objects to surfaces. With the spymaster’s coin and listening coin, I will be able to eavesdrop on unsuspecting people and gather information I might not otherwise be able to get.

Iron Silence: Allows for me to make my armored friends have no armor check penalty on most medium armors and all light armors. It also lessens the penalties on heavy armors.

Improvisation: A spell that grants a pool of points to use on any d20 roll at any time (similar to action points).

Battefield Spells: Based off experience in Absolom and books read on tactics and rules of war.

Inspirational Boost: Makes my Inspire Courage ability have an extra +1 to all bonuses. (swift action spell as well)

Tactical Precision: +2 to hit and +1d6 damage against flanked foes. Which, I will also use the 1st level spell Phantom Threat to produce flanking as needed.

Allegro: +30ft. movement for 1min/level. There is so much this can help with, but the theme behind it comes from the long 5mi. runs most drill sergeants take their trainees through. My characters inspiration will bring my men to new feats of speed and endurance.

Nightmare Terrain: To shape the battlefield in my enemies mind. Nothing is more intimidating than a cussing nasty tempered drill sergeant scaring the crap out of people, especially when he knows they are scared, and makes things on the field of battle (in their own minds) rise up against them.

Hymn of Praise / Harmonic Chorus: These spells up the caster level of good Divine casters and arcane spell casters by +2. Very nice.

Sonic Weapon: This is the one "out of place" spell for this character. I would love if someone could help me figure out a way to weave this on in to my spells known list from the information I gave above. I have not decided if I am going to want to be a secondary melee combatant, or be ranged. If melee, then this is easilly decided upon. But mainly, this will be one of my last bard 2nd level spells known that comes at 9th or 10th level. This spell, once I get 5th level Lyric theurge, does 3d6 extra sonic damage. A very nice addition to any weapon I or my allies use.

I would love feedback on this along with any suggestions that fit this character’s theme.

Thanks in advance everyone.

CC

Luckily, my dm and I had a chat about the bard I will be running in our campaign in October. Since my bard is already fleshed out, powers selected, and feat progression relatively set, he knows that the new bard from the new rulebook will not allow this bard concept to be successful with what we know right now.

So he is going to run a beta rules campaign as we all read the new rule book and get used to the changes for the next campaign.

Remember, you dont have to change from beta if you dont want to. You could even tell your players that this will be the last campaign you run with beta rules, so they have a last hurrah with beta.

CC

Yea, I think the main concern was the Healing blast radius as a quickened action, then blowing another heal spell as a standard action.

Is this right?

If so, you should not even worry about it. The whole reason paizo changed this feature for the clerics was to give more healing to low level characters so there was not alot of resting "in game".

I think this thread shows that we are still so used to a couple of combats then finding a place to hold up till our priest gets his spells back.

What could be better for a 7th lvl cleric than having 4-6 channels at 4d6 healing in a 30ft. radius. I say that is bad ass, just as Paizo planned. And a first level cleric with extra turning gets a minimum of 7 of these blasts at 1d6 each. Much nicer than the old 3.5 clerics.

hehe.

Oh yea, just so everyone knows, the Quickened Turning feat is also in the Complete Divine.

:D

CC

Does healing pool replace turning in CC?

No. It is an alternative class feature. That means that at certain levels of a character's progression, they can give up a certain power or ability to gain something different in return.

Most 3.5 completes and many of the other suppliment books like Dungeonscape, sandstorm, frostfell, etc, have these alternate class features in their own section.

In this case, a cleric gives up (1) 4th level spell slot (forever) to get this pool. It is nice as it scales with divine caster levels. Where you would have a maximum of 4d8+20 for a cure critical wounds 4th lvl spell. When you are 20th lvl with this feature, you have 105 points to use for healing (or damage). The cure crit maxes out @ 52pts of healing only.

This is a nice addition to any player concentrating on healing.

I am still not 100% sold on the compromise allowing the extra damage/healing gained from CM levels to work on the pc's but not undead. Although, it is better than giving them the full effect.

CC

A couple of things I really like about this product were:

1) Background of the Pactmasters, the power behind Almah in LoF

2) The detail of the Church of Abadar. (did anyone else love the flavor of how this church is so integrated with the city trade of Katapesh?) I cant wait to have them show up in Kelmarane when one of my PC's sets up shop with his own business. :D

3) Pesh Trade

This product has really helped me plan some great stuff for AP#21 Price of the Jackal while the PC's are in Katapesh.

Having promised my players I would have them lvl 17 prior to entering AP#24, I must say this product has really helped me. And I look forward to utilizing the drug trade in my campaign. With the PC's I have, the drug trade will bring a nice element to the campaign.

Has anyone used Combat Medic from Heroes of Battle in PRPG? I have a player taking it this level, and I think it needs a little something more. I want to allow channel energy to advance with CM levels, but I'm not sure that's sufficient. Does any one have some suggestions for me here?

I can say, without any hesitation, that the combat medic is a very nice class, especially in a military campaign, which I played one in. And if you allow the channel energy to scale with the CM levels, you are granting alot.

It is a 5 level prestige class that the PC will get 2 feats while leveling it. And, this is a specialty class for battlefield healing. Why allow the cleric to gain extra power dealing with undead when this class has nothing to do with them.

The save for the fear affect on channeling positive energy is (10 + 1/2 cleric level + chr bonus). If you allow this power to scale with the Combat medic, you give a +2 on the DC of this save. In addition, the cleric gets another 2d6 healing (or damage).

Instead of giving this away on a class that, I believe, does not constitue scaling the channel energy feature of the cleric for, why not approach the pc and offer him the ability to choose the "Healing Pool" Cleric alternate class feature from Complete Champion.

For the cost of (1) 4th lvl spell slot, the cleric can get a healing pool of positive energy. This energy total is equal to 1+ divine caster level x5. So at 7th lvl, that is a 40 point healing/damage pool of positive energy that can be unloaded as fast as (1) round with a melee touch attack.

Just an Idea.

A small idea here.

1/2 flavor 1/2 cool power.

Give the Witch the ability to summon a special Cauldron 1/month that ups the power of the potions and/or alchemical items she creates at the cost of some of her other abilities.

General Idea: Witch summons the cauldron on the night of a full moon, speaking her sinister words of magic, she makes a poison out of scorpion legs, spider fangs, and bat wings that, for arguments sake, would be a DC14 ingested poison that deals 1d6/1d6 con/con damage on a normal creation day. However, this batch of poison has a DC16 save and adds +1 to the con damage done.

Mechanics: The bonuses granted to the special cauldron creation are provided by giving up a spell slot, or multiple spell slots, for an entire month. Cost is 1 level of spell slot per +1 bonus. In the example above, the witch gives a +2 to the DC of the poison and a +1 to damage. Thus, the witch would have to give up a 3rd level spell slot for a month. Or, you could give up a 2nd and a 1st level spell slot as well. (or 3 1st).

The items created in this fashion only last a month before they crumble to dust, turn to water, etc... When the 30 days has expired, the witch gets her spell slots back and any items created in this way become useless.

Just an idea.

:D

I like the idea of a Charisma prerequisite, Larry, that limits the availability somewhat...with the ability to do damage/heal with channel energy, unlimited quickened channel can be pretty powerful, especially if used by a higher level cleric. I dunno, maybe it's something that lets them be really cool and totally worth playing in that context.

Hey Dustin, I already gave the dude the Tomb-tainted soul feat. Might as well heal himself as he sucks the life out of the party!! :)

Yeah Curt, I had that thought as well. I am interested in seeing how it plays out, maybe I'll just leave it as is and go with it. Our goal this summer is to get some familiarity with the Beta rules, so it's not like it's a serious campaign with long term emotional investments. :) Think I'll let it go and see what happens.

Really, if you were to give the quicken turn any prerequisites, it might be a couple other turning feats like "Extra Turning" and "Empowered Turning". This would make taking "Quickened Turning" a 3rd level occurance at the earliest if the player were human.

At the same time, if these feats are taken that early, the player has (6+ charisma bonus) in channeling energy attempts and they affect more people or creatures. But, you can hold off the quickened part for a couple levels by doing this.

CC

After reading the description of the feat, why change it or make it have prerequisites?

You still only get one turn a round. This feat takes something you get anyway and gives more flexibility to the ability. Isnt that what a feat is supposed to do?

What you should really be wary of is the Cleric alternate class feature from Complete Champion called Healing pool.

But that aside, I wouldnt change the feat "Quickend Turning" at all.

CC

First, I had a friend that hyped it up. When he found out about my lack of enthusiam for 4.0 he asked me to join his Second Darkness AP that he was DM'ing.

From the second gaming session of that AP, to now, I have become a subscriber of several of the lines Paizo has offered, and have enjoyed seeing some great DM content threads that have really helped me prepare for my attempt at dm'ing LoF.

So, it was the AP Second darkness that made me start my path towards becoming a dedicated paizo customer.

So, now the Paizo staff can look at my order history and see that I started Second Darkness sometime in Dec 2008.

:D

Psion, I had a similar experience at that point in the adventure. Devils elbow was one of my favorite places.

A quick overview:

Playing the monk in our group, I found myself getting ready to go down in a blaze of glory by placing myself in the doorway of the tower so the blue doggies could not get by me and into the tower. Well, I didnt know they would do a doggie pyramid and get in on the 2nd level window of the tower, but I was holding them off for a bit when the tower started to give way.

The tower detatched itself, started rolling down the hill with all my companions inside, and I was standing there with about 20 of these blue mutations closing in. I turned and ran down the hill after the tower.

(Picture Indiana jones running from beloque's savages in "Raiders of the Lost arc").

When I saw the tower roll off the cliff, I knew I was doomed. 20 blue dogs, me, and a cliff drop coming up. As I ran to the edge, I saw the tower had not fallen that far, so I jumped and natural 20'd the landing.

the dogs did not have the same luck. They all tried and fell in the water (except one) which I pushed off the edge. Salt water seemed to dissolve them quickly, but the fact is, it was a very intense scene, and there was a similar 20 rolled on keeping the hand hold on an unconcious team member as the tower spun down the hill.

It was quite fun. I am glad someone else loved that scene too. :D

CC

Stormrunner wrote:

My take - I reduced the disruption effect to 5 points off of DR/SR, and only ringable once/day - but let monks expend ki to increase the effect:

If the bell-ringer expends one or more points of ki, the bell's radius increases by 5', its duration increases by 5 rounds, and the reduction it inflicts increases by 1, for each ki point.

I like this modification. It certainly makes the bell more of a monk item than it already is, but if that works for the campaign/PC/NPC that uses it, rock on. I think the investment of ki points is an awesome mechanic, and is totally in-theme. The scalability your mechanic allows is also very nice because it expands the effect without being solely based on damage dealt.

I gotta be honest, I don't want my bowl rubbed.

Very cool - I salute you.

I know this is a reply that might never get read, but, as it seems the DR10 and SR10 reduction are the main issues with this, why not try something like this:

Roll a D20 to strike the bell. The skill with which you strike the bell determines the power of the chime. What ever you roll, divide that number in half (round down) and apply that to the DR and SR reduction. That number will also set the maximum amount of creatures to be affected and the amount of rounds the effect lasts. So, a roll of 15 on a D20 will give DR7/SR7 reduction that will last 7 rounds and affect a maximum of 7 creatures.

This sets the maximum SR/DR reduction, duration, creatures affected to 10.

All other powers of the item listed by the OP stay the same.

And the Ki-power use listed above is another plus that I really liked. If a bad d20 roll occures, using the Ki could make it better. Having the maximums already set at 10 keeps it from getting out of hand.

I have been here on the board for a while and I see a lot of distain for prestige classes and I am really wondering why? I think they are a great addition to the game it let players fill whatever nitch they want to fill. In my current game every single player is going into a prestige class. Of the characters I have played I would say over 75 percent were designed to go into prestige classes.

So I want to know is why people hate them so much. I understand why Pathfinder RPG made the core classes as good as prestige classes cause I agree with that you shouldn’t have to play a prestige class to be able to be a useful party member. I have said this for a long time that WOC made the core classes suck after 5th or 6th level so people would buy there Splat books to get prestige classes to use.

I have no problem with them. I actually love them. To me, Prestige classes are tools to plot character growth. I am sorry, but a Spell Sword is simply a fighter mage that has learned to cast while wearing heavier and heavier armor, not some institution that trains select individuals after being a member for a year and paying tribute.

So, although I dont take them as written, I use them all the time.

CC

I'll admit that I'm not a fan of Hellbred as originally written in FC:II. It struck me as an awkward, forced imposition of something that only really works in a two sided moral axis with Good and Evil, and makes no sense in a cosmos with a four alignment axis. It's a clumsy fit of a Miltonian dichotomy of G vs E to have devils punishing sinners, and deathbed repenting saving people from damnation in Hell and being given a second chance of sorts by being brought back as Hellbred. Only if it only applied to LE people who converted towards LG in the end, and not applying to anyone else. Hell in the absence of a two alignment system has no business trying to be the place of punishment of the wicked by default, if at all.

I'd massively rewrite the fluff behind the concept before using it in Golarion's cosmos, probably tying it in somehow with a dying soul being conflicted between two parties in Pharasma's Court, one of them being an archdevil or Asmodeus himself, and the other involved party being any other good deity. Perhaps some contractual quirk or poison pill disallows possession by the good claimant, but instead dumps the soul into round 2 as it might be, not redeemed and not damned outright, but given the opportunity to go either way a second time around, but physically marked by the conflicted status of their soul during that period.

Todd, without getting into a huge debate over the cosmos and a 4 tier alignment system, I must admit that I really like the idea of having two opposing (godlike) forces fighting over the soul by their own choice and not by any last minute confession by the mortal in question. The "round two" at life can apply to almost any situation with a PC who is killed, yet not able to be raised by magic.

What I find funny about my first impression of the Helbred compared to yours, is that I took the flavor of the text as being strictly for L-E and no other. The Good vs. Evil undertones that you mention never went through my mind. :D Paladins and Crusaders were the only classes that entered my mind as a choice for a helbred, which, as you know, must be LG.

The more I read about the gods in Golarion, the more I am leaning towards the helbred being a rare sight in Golarion. Since the Cheliax information is not out (in full), I can not make a very good background for this Helbred I want to play using Cheliax as the main part of my background.

Thank you for the thoughts. I appreciate it.

CC

Sean Mahoney wrote:

You might find the Mechanomicon a useful resource.

Sean Mahoney

That's a handy guide. Thanks!

I know this idea means getting your dm involved, but if the cost is really prohibitive for a less than stellar construct, perhaps some gp help would be in order.

Like this: You want to build the carrion golem listed in the spoiler in one of the above posts. The cost for such a thing is 10k for you. (this is an example). Obviously, for 10k, it doenst pack much of a punch and the base attack bonus is low for a lvl 10 group. Perhaps the DM can provide a small side quest for you to find a large Onyx the size of a mans fist that will be the creature's heart. The gpv on this is 2k, so thus, you only have to come up with 8k for your construct.

Simple, yet effective. And, perhaps the dm can sweeten the deal by offering some bonus to the construct for using the large black gem. Maybe upping the DC of the nausea power by 1, or giving it a profane bonus to attack and damage rolls.

Onyx = evil :D

Hope this helps.

CC

I guess I should put down here what book the HellBred are in. They are in the Fiendish Codex II: Tyrants of the Nine Hells as a PC race. The race is based off gaining a second chance at redemption by atoning for a lifetime of evil deeds serving an evil god or other entity.

The description of the hellbred reads something like this:

Hellbred go through a scourging. This scourging transforms the character into a hellbred as the powers of good and evil war for the hellbred's soul. They rend and twist the hellbred into his new form. A hellbred is a humanoid with dark red skin, or sometimes green scales. They usually have horns, though their exact form varies. His eyes shine with a sinister red glow, representing the phyical aspects of the hellbred's past life, and reminding him of what he had done in his past life. While a hellbred's outer body is a product of hell, his inner mind and soul are purged and cleaned by the powers of good. He retains shadowy, vague memories of his past. The sight of a one time ally or enemy triggers a sense of unease or pain, but memory details as to why, are like shards of a split second or two from the hellbreds past.

I had played (briefly) a hell bred crusader in FR before our group disbanded and I started playing PF.

I really liked the concept of playing a female priest of Tiamat (or, insert evil god / devil here) that was responsible for the turning of souls to Lawful Evil so that she could have a higher place serving Tiamat in the afterlife from all the soul power she provided.

I had her come back as a male crusader since she recanted at the last moment before her death when she was betrayed by Tiamat.

She hated men as the female priest, and they were her #1 targets for corruption. So coming back as a male was a no brainer.

Does a character like this have a basis in Golarion. (I know the gods are different and all, so I am not asking about that). I am rather seeking confirmation that this could happen in Cheliax and if the designers had envisioned the helbred when conceptualizing and fleshing out Cheliax.

It seems that the pact powers from the Book of Tyrants is what is concentrated on more than the cultivating of souls.

Please, I would love some direction here. I definately want this crusader to be Golarion and not FR in flavor. Thanks, CC

Spoilers Below for Chapter 4.

We are starting chapter 5 "A memory of Darkness".

A very cool and cinematic scene occurred during our groups stay in House Vonnarc. I felt (as a player) that we had been very good at being lowly slaves. our DM did a fantastic job of bringing out our abilities to give notice to the leaders of the house.

Since I am playing a monk, I was flogged several times for my inability to cook during the skill challenges part of our slavery. Just about any other skill option would have garnered me a +5 on any roll, but for cooking, I had nothing that could give me any synergy on a skill roll. So I failed time and time again, thus, getting flogged for ruining the food for dinner.

Since I didnt cry out or show that the flogging hurt me, I came to the attention of the second son for being a "tough guy" and so, he had to teach me a lesson.

So, I was brought to the house's sparring arena and challenged by the second son to a non-lethal style duel. I was frustrated with constantly rolling the kitchen for my skill check for the day. I was getting no points to move me to the next level of servitutde while the rest of my group was achieving their 25 ranks quickly.

So, I fought the guy instead of taking it like a man (like I should have). But, being the hot head type that was only down in the drow city for fame and recognition, I immediately shot off a Bull rush with my Ring the golden bell feat, which knocked the guy back 5ft. and prone. (I didnt even touch the guy). He had said, mockingly at me, right before I won initiative, "Come on slave... knock me down".

So, the fight was on, and the gathered onlookers were silent after that initial display of furious power.

The second son got up and attacked. I played with him for two rounds, testing out his defenses with my flurry of blows and seeing how hard he hit in return. The guy was a quick striker, and his damage was minimal, so I went with the improved disarm, and my CMB was up to the task. I wanted to see if he was a monk or a fighter, because his weapon was exotic, and I had to know what I was up against.

The second son did not oblige me and picked up his weapon for another strike against me. I disarmed again, which made him go to pick it up again. So I went into grapple mode and had him pinned in two rounds, applying damage with automatic hits for two rounds before he levitated to the ceiling, which was 50ft. up.

Since I had the slippers of spider climb from Devils elbow, I placed my feet on the ceiling thinking he had a trick up his sleve, which he did, and he broke my pin and then the grapple and fell to the ground. Of course, he stopped himself from being hurt by activating feather fall or levitate again.

When I wasnt on the ground from the fall, he looked up, but it was to late, I already released myself from the ceiling, taking the full 50ft. falling damage so I could apply 1/2 that to the stike with my staff on the guy. Well, it worked out very good as I took 20 points from the fall, but he took 30pts from my staff hit plus 1/2 my falling damage. (yes, I had a crit).

We both backed away from eachother. I was down 48 out of 87hp, and I had done almost 60pts against him, so it was looking good for me.

Plus, I had looked more the master, which made the drow noble think, "what the hell?"

I was then attacked with lethal damage by the second son with a wicked slash across my chest. My character simply smiled and had in his mind, "oh.. now you pay..." But the fight was interrupted by the matron of slaves and I was hauled off and flogged again for standing up to the 2nd son.

I became best friends with the matrons whip. This was a real fun part of the adventure for me.

CC

We are starting "A memory of Darkness" Chapter 5 in our next session

Rio (me) - Human Male LE (Monk/Crane Shen 8/3)

Katin - Human Male CG (Favored Soul 11) of Cayden

Nobbin - Unknown Race Male N (Rogue/Master Thrower 8/3)

Libonelle - Gnome Male N (Sorcerer 11) Abberant Bloodline

This has been the most fun Ive had playing in a group with such diverse personalities. Plus, it is such an un-orthodox group, which makes every battle new and exciting.

Can you imagine this group in devils elbow taking on the levitating orca and two drow females that fight in a 3rd dimension? To date, that was one of my favorite battles in the AP.

Oh yea, getting chased down the hill after the rolling tower was also exciting. Those blue dogs were unnerving, Especially after seeing the tower go off the edge of the cliff and getting cornered on the edge. Thankfully, the beta has a special ki power pool that gave me a +20 on my jump check. I made a perfect landing on the slippery tower with a critical jump roll of a natural 20 while the blue dogs barked and tried to jump after me. (1) of the 6 made the jump. It was a great moment in our game.

Sorry, I sometimes get off topic with my stories.

CC

sorry to bump it but does anyone ahve any idea's of how to still include some of the missions vonnarc gets you to do? the drider hunt and the thing with teh cave geckos

Being as I just went through the portal to escape that accursed drow city, I can look back and give some ideas that might help.

First, there is no doubt that the pc's did not take to the meaning of this being a covert operation. Trying to blend in does not imply planning a frontal assault on the Vonnarc's enemies. However, instead of trying to figure out your players, allow me to give you the adventure we experienced at this point in the AP.

First off, our group is a human Monk (me), a strange 1/2 monkey 1/2 human rogue/master thrower, a gnome sorcerer abberation bloodline, and a human favored soul of Cayden.

My monk is the only evil (lawful) in the group. So, fitting in was not a problem, but my ability to take pain without crying out brought my toughness to the attention of the second son (I cant remember his name). In our campaign, he is a super fast finesse fighter that wants to teach me a lesson by wiping the floor with me. Since I was only a lowly slave, he had nothing to worry about did he...

Well, my DM set up our first encounter by utilizing the "maid" service that you roll for, every day, while in house vonnarc. I found his after hour weapons that he uses to torture his victems while I was performing maid service and cleaning his room. I was told to never mention it to anyone by the other maid. Knowing this guy had some issues, and being placed as a cook or a maid every day, instead of on patrol, or on lookout, or something else that my skills would support. My DM had my character frustrated. So, when I was yanked from my bed and brought to the arena to have a one-on-one with this guy, I went all out on him. If I were R.A. Salvatore, I could do the fight justice, but since I cant, lets just say that I have not had a fight like that ever in my playing history. I absolutely made the 2nd son look like a fool.

With many of the drow house watching, I was the talk of the house. Of course I was whipped and flogged, but my character had an internal smile. But, that was not the end of the second son. He was actually used to introduce the cave geckos fight.

Here is how:

We were called in again, (because of our usefulness), to escort the lover of this second son to her own house without being detected by anyone in house vonnarc. The escort and the second son had killed their sex toys (drow slaves), and the slave matron wanted to cover this all up.

So we were given the geckos to escort her to her house and deliver her alive. While traveling upside down on the cavern ceiling, we were attacked. I can not count how many drow and geckos went splat on the streets of city below us, but it was at least 5 of each. Plus, I had the slippers of spider climb from the Devils Elbow. So getting off the gecko and running across the ceiling dislodging all those geckos was quite fun.

That is how it happened to us. My dm did not use the drider hunt as we fought (2) driders on the surface and he was tired of the same combatants over and over.

I hope this helps. I think what it really does is show how much thought my DM put into this, and how he finally made me so frustrated that I acted like a stupid pc that can not control his emotions, and it paid off. I feel like I was played by my own DM.

I will be glad to put up some other things we did if that will help. Let me know.

Hehe, I feel like a dope.

Sean, I definately knew that. I thought it would be nice to appear like a dufus.

My superiors in the military would say, "mission accomplished".

Krome,

I am curious as to what you felt were "spoilers" in the Osirion book. Spoilers for other products like the J1 and J4 modules? Or something dealing with the AP Legacy of Fire?

I know the Brazzen Hills are a range of mountains that seperate Osirion and Katapesh, but I didnt see any information in the Osirion book that would spoil the AP.

Dark Markets... yes. Osirion, no.

Please explain what you found. I would like to know what I overlooked as I am about to DM the LoF AP.

Brian Cortijo wrote:

Wow, shot up to #5 on the Top Sellers almost overnight.

Come on, guys, I wanna see this baby up at #1! It's a vanguard product, with PFRPG content even before the rules release...

No, no, Brian -- *our* book is a real vanguard product. But as I've said, I'm going to buy this so that we can laugh at the poor Qadirans here at the Infernal Library of Westcrown. ;P

Great, thats all Golarion needs is another Chelaxian laughing his "sinister devil laugh" at us Genie lovers...

Remember, we have wish magic at our disposal and powers unheard of before the coming of this tomb of knowledge. Fear us.

CuttinCurt wrote:

Brian,

Would you say that Qadira is very similar to Katapesh and much of the material in there could be incorporated into the Legacy of Fire AP?

I am mainly looking at genies, janns, and other Arabian knights themed items, spells, and feats.

I would say that there is a certain level of material (particularly with regard to the genies connection) that can absolutely be incorporated into LoF. In particular, there are feats and traits that PCs in that AP might want to pick up, especially if they are Qadiran (or just Keleshite in general).

Thank you for the reply Brian.

Kirth Gersen wrote:

The very existence of Perorm (oratory) offends me.

Wow. I know some people here are easily offended, but this is too much!

*goes and creates 1d20 characters with perform (oratory)* :P

House rules be damned! With 5 ranks of perform:oratory you get a +2 synergy bonus on diplomacy and bluff checks.

There! Take that! :D

CC

I am playing a Monk in the Second Darkness AP. And I can say that playing a monk will get you very close to ninja except for the sudden strike and ki powers that focus on blinking and invis.

The jump abilitiy, and free monk feats that can be focused on ninja type moves, gets very close to straight ninja at 4th level.

And, it definately sits better in the minds of those of us that hold samarai and ninja's as two total opposites. For those that love history, that statement is a truth that can not be refuted.

So, monk/samarai might work better.

Am I the only one that likes the standard action concentration? WIth the extra feats you get from PF (every odd level) there should be no problem covering the issue with not being able to do anything while you sing, dance, etc...

I distinctly recall feats that give more uses per day, extend the effects after ending concentration, and, as you get higher in level, you affect more people per use of bardic music. Not to mention that you could use some to better your combat prowess.

The OP's original thought was that our basis for this conversation is that we keep the round based mechanic but tweak it.

If we do this, many of the 3.5 feats for bards in the Complete Adv, Scoundrel, and champion are unable to be used unless tweaking is allowed on those.

It looks like alot of tweaking going on when beta is pretty solid, in my opinion.

By the time PCs hit high levels, they've already saved the world a couple of times and often have the potential to drive adventures of their own. In my experience, PCs of that level start founding kingdoms, conducting magical research, or even searching for immortality. Having a single adventure module to plug them into becomes more difficult, and a long-term series could take them away from their own goals.

What I think would be nice for high-level play is less of an adventure line and more of a sourcebook with GMing tips on how to conduct certain types of high-level campaigns. For example, having a book focused on building and running a domain, maybe with some short sample adventures, would work nicely. Another example for the super-epic types could be focused toward divine ascension with a few example tasks set forth to accomplish such a feat.

In terms of tying into an adventure path, I think that certain adventure paths sort of nudge the PCs in a particular direction. For example, my ideal high-level followup to Kingmaker would be a book that fleshes out more of the details about running a kingdom, expanding on the information that this adventure path will provide.

I really like this alot. I did have A few ideas that shot through my brain as I read this. Magical creation and founding kingdoms can easilly be done with the material distributed up to this point in Chronicles, Companion, and the AP's, not to mention the 3.5 material from WotC. Other paths have not...

1) Divine Ascension - Absalom and Starfall Tower. Giving a more in depth look at how the four mortal gods came to pass the test, and give some details into what the challenges were and some other options.

2) Creating Artifacts - Creating an epic artifact as a life's achievement. Who would like to have the next set of the "Teeth of CuttinCurt", instead of Dahlver-nar? :D

3) Have the PC's fail the story in the Second Darkness AP. A new set of epic characters from somewhere else stop the second starfall as the meteor is crashing through the atmosphere...

Just some stuff to chew on... :D

It is good to have another PF enthusiast. What made me want to put down my 3.5 stuff and start PF3.5 was the scaling of the feats and the new class powers and special abilities.

The top 3 of these were:

1) Sorcerer bloodlines
2) Cleric Domain powers
3) Feats every odd level

I currently am playing a monk in the Second Darkness AP, and have never had as much fun. The Ki-power pool is so awsome.

Anyway, I hope your friend has as much fun as I have had.

CC

Alot of what I am reading seems to keep pointing out, "Versatile Performance, ooooo, finally a reason to take more than one perform skill"

I am curious as to why so many people out there are only taking one perform skill, especially with the beta PF version out there.

This quote makes no sense to me on most bard builds. Any performer would have more than one trick in them. I know there are many builds for a bard, but with so many people quoting this Versatile Perfomance in such a way, it makes me think that folks dont get the bard concept.

Even me, playing a military drill sergeant bard, has oratory and story telling as perform skills that are maxed.

CC

(bard 7 / warweaver 5)

I am of the mind that you buy what you DM as far as Adventure paths are concerned.

I am a player 75% of the time, so most of my money will go to companion and chronicles. I am currently purchasing Legacy because I am DM'ing it. Once I get the last one, I will switch it over to Chronicles.

This is also easy and simple.

And there are already multiple game mastery modules that can easilly be interwoven into a campaign that is part prewritten material, part DM created genius.

I am also preparing to utilize J1, J3, and J4 into a game I am DM'ing, and it was so easy to utilize these in such a fasion. J1, then J4 and end up with J3 to switch up the scenery a tad and introduce some different tactics in jungle warfare and adventuring.

It is my opinion that a DM can read a module and know very quickly if it will be something they want to run as a solo adventure or start a campaign with it. These 6-part AP's are all built upon some unbelievable content and, without knowing how legacy's #1 and #2 will work out, I can say that the Battle Market is looking like one of the most fun areas I will DM this year.

Anyway, have a good one.

CC

James Jacobs wrote:

As for an adventure that deals with loose ends from an AP... I would not do those as part of the module line. It would be bigger than that. Much bigger.

Now, that sounds as if you may have something in mind...

I am about to get started running the Legacy of Fire AP and instead of progressing past the end of the AP, I am planning on using some content from J1: Entombed with the Pharoh's and J4: The pact stone Pyramid to progress them (3)levels between part 3 and 4.

I wont get into all the work I will have to do to adjust the CR's in the two prison modules of the Legacy AP, but my players want lvl 18 in part 6 and I know it will be easier to work in alot of character path storylines in the middle of this to really deepen the character's personalities and build up the players with anticipation and anxiety for the last 3 modules.

This is my plan for getting my pc's to be able to cast 9th level spells and feel the achievement of progressing to the elite levels of a D&D character.

As a side note, I am currently playing in the Second Darkness AP and weaved a character background story that will be a great final adventure after we have saved the cheerleader... I mean, the world.
I admit, since we just finished part 4 of this AP, that I am salivating over what that last adventure will be like when we finally come to it.

Thanks, CC

Brian,

Would you say that Qadira is very similar to Katapesh and much of the material in there could be incorporated into the Legacy of Fire AP?

I am mainly looking at genies, janns, and other Arabian knights themed items, spells, and feats.

Thanks,

CC

(By the way, I really like the artwork)

I like Scopion_Angel's idea for a "void" where the psionic magic is within, rather than generated by a mystic force or divine entity.

Perhaps a Black Hole, where most laws of physics are thrown out the window. Nothing can exist in or around a black hole except... (insert psion world here)

just an idea.

I know Paizo did not detail every district in Absalom with a chart. But, being a DM, I figured that Paizo was allowing us to make our own charts for the other districts.

I seem to recall that Paizo was giving general information so we can shape these districts to fit our own games.

Even with the coins district very well laid out in the book, I do have it being much more hedonistic and morally bankrupt. I didnt want the "feel" of the red silk district to be self contained in a small two-three block area. With the main bazaar of trade in the center of the district, I incorporated the sexual openness of red silk into the bazaar as well. With the locals being de-sensitized to the visual act of sex, it makes for a very unique environment.

In short, I am saying that you should just make up your own costs. :D

Have a good one.

CC

Thanks for that reply. I am sure they will want to spend sometime in CoB. I was being a little dramatic in my original post by crying out ARG! But the last time I DM'd planar stuff was 2nd edition in 1991. (I am guessing there, but it was the early 90's)

The plane jump in issue #22 to the prison plane I liked. I just didnt get that same "full containment" feel from issue #23's visit to the City of Brass.

CC

City of Brass... arg!

And I thought my next foray into taking up the DM mantle would be easy...

Thank goodness I still have the last 3 modules of "Second Darkness" to get through before I have to DM this. I am greatly intimidated by this AP now. Parts 1, 2, 3 of Legacy of Fire are right up my DM alley, but the plane jumping stuff will be my main challenge.

Since I now know I will be playing in this adventure path after DM'ing the Legacy of Fire, I am wondering how a HellBred Crusader will work in this Adventure Path.

I know a Crusader will be fine, it is more the HellBred part I am concerned about. :D

I would love to hear the concerns or comments on what other DM's preparing for this AP might do if presented with a player wanting to run a HellBred.

Thanks,

CC

I am so getting this. I was pouting after reading the 2 pages of info in the campaign setting. When I turned the page and saw no more on Cheliax, tears ran down my cheeks.

Not really, but I am stoked that this is coming out and the next adventure path is in cheliax. I have so many player concepts for this place. :D