|Paizo Pathfinder® Paizo Games|
|About Paizo Messageboards News Paizo Blog Help/FAQ|
xavier c wrote:
Are the sahkil a new race of evil outsiders?
From Wes' post, it appears the Sahkil are the name for the corrupted psychopomps (so not a new race, per se).
Mysterious monsters revisited, in their section on Sasquatch, specifically call out a reclusive "half Sasquatch" race as being present in Arcadia. So I am guessing these are the same guys as the new 0HD race.
Maybe they're called Half-Quatches. :D
(Which means, when and if we get an Arcadia supplement, we've got these races at least that are known there: Human, Skinwalker, Halfquatch, and Syrinx.)
This is one class that seems very easily covered by existing classes/archetypes in the game already, and I'm not sure about the alignment shifting, simply because alignment doesn't really seem to have much in-game application (particularly in my games).
That said, I've been quite surprised by what Paizo has done with other concepts that seemingly were already covered (Arcanist, for one) and like more social/RP classes, so I am intrigued. (Appropriately enough for a book called Ultimate Intrigue.)
That's a good guess, David, and would fit with Erik's conjecture that Throne and Asmodeus aren't getting along.
My other notion is that perhaps it is Cheliax getting revenge on one or more of their wayward imperial nations that escaped their grasp- such as Andoran (which had its own recent sourcebook)- and bringing them back into the fold.
It's been said elsewhere about the Hell's Rebels AP that the Kintargo revolution is just one of many such uprisings taking place across Cheliax, and Hell's Vengeance looks like it will be another such, just taking place from the perspective of those who are seeking to maintain the status quo, rather than overthrow it (and Erik Mona posted something to support that idea earlier today as well).
So, for instance, if the PCs in Hell's Rebels are overthrowing the House of Thrune in Kintargo, then perhaps the PCs in Hell's Vengeance will be fighting an uprising in another city of the realm, or maybe even- given the recent Andoran book- reclaiming a portion of Andoran that slipped from the Empire's grasp in recent years (such as Augustana); that would certainly fit with the notion of "Vengeance."
I am sure that the dream dragon is one of the esoteric dragons but what could be the names of the others. Maybe astral, chakra, ethereal, esper, psychic, mind, spirit, life, nature, arcane, sacred, akashic, mystic, chi/ki, blood, bone, aether, quintessence, axiom, lore, and/or chaos.
I'd love to see a Nightmare Dragon, though I suspect the Dream Dragon is as close as we'll get.
huh. Though now I'm intrigued at the prospect of a Devils Revisited written with the prospect of those guys being your allies.
On the other end of the spectrum, all those stats for Angels, Agathions, and other like-minded good creatures won't be entirely wasted (save for the addition of possession or templates making them evil creatures to be fought).
I was just going to point that out. My recollection was that they'd moved all the other players out of the room by that point and needed someone to ask the "dumb" question. Daemonprince's memory jibes with mine.
In retrospect, they should have kept at least one of the other three there, but I think they needed Eddie and Iris elsewhere to do the whole "Screw the future! Marry me!" thing, and Joe was... I'm not actually sure why he wasn't around at the moment.
As for Lucifer? I will be shocked if this even makes it one season. At it's core it's still a show about making the devil the hero and that is a HARD sell on a good day. Claiming that it's based on a comic isn't going to make it sit better with the average viewer who's never even heard of the comic.
I'd say all you really need to do is make the devil the protagonist- there are many shows where the protagonist is not really a hero, and in fact has many despicable qualities (Breaking Bad, for instance). That would certainly be in keeping with the source material for Lucifer.
However, given the trailer here, I'd say you're pretty spot on in that they do appear to be trying to make him eminently a more heroic protagonist, and that certainly could pose problems with selling the narrative, particularly on a network show.
Cthulhudrew, I guess it is pointless, but I wanted to add something.
I wouldn't say it's pointless, just that I think there are interesting philosophical and moral questions to be asked on both (all) ends of the spectrum. Whether it is right or wrong, I don't think there are any easy answers.
Ultimately, I think the only real "wrong" that can be affixed is to the initial time meddler, the "patient zero" as it were, that threw a monkeywrench into the operation for whatever reason, and the consequences that range far and beyond whatever it was they set out to do in the first place.
I appreciate your sharing your thoughts; it is definitely an interesting exercise in hypotheticals, and to me- at least- this finale offered a slightly more complex take on it than many examples in the genre do.
(The 12 Monkeys tv adaptation is another one that I think has done a really good job of showcasing time travel; I recommend it if anyone hasn't seen it yet.)
Also, back to some of the specific issues brought up by this episode:
Does anyone recall what it was specifically that Eobard said about Eddie a few episodes back. I seem to recall him saying something to the effect that all the other Thawnes had extensive histories, but that Eddie's past was lost to history. Eobard took that to mean he just didn't make any meaningful contributions whatsoever that historians would note, but what if- instead- the reason he seemed to disappear from the history books was that he was literally removed from history- perhaps sent into the far distant future by the Singularity he gets sucked into? If he survives there, then he could still somehow be Eobard's ancestor- although it wouldn't explain why Eobard disappeared.
If you assume that there is one timeline, and that is where everything that has and will happen takes place, then "fixing" it is a heroic thing to do (although it raises the question of how it can be broken in the first place if there was only ever one "correct" timeline).
However- and this is something that I felt the finale addressed in one of the better ways I've seen done- there are still lives and histories that have been created, regardless of whether they were "meant to" or not, and is changing those- altering them, erasing them- the right thing to do, even if they weren't supposed to exist in the first place? Does restoring the prior status quo balance out eliminating all those new futures?
That's a much harder notion to wrestle with, much less answer definitively.
I was surprised at the way Barry dealt with it last night for that very reason, that oftentimes with stories like these (particularly on family friendly network tv) they take the easy route and don't showcase all sides of the dilemma. So it was a pleasant surprise to see it dealt with this way.
Are there still questions raised by all of the timey-wimeyness? Will they ever be fully addressed? Yes, and maybe. Either way, it was still pretty entertaining.
(Incidentally- and this is something that this show didn't address either- I've rarely found any story that takes a broader view of time travel shenanigans; one that deals with the fact that dealing with/correcting time travel in the present-day of the story's protagonists often has longer reaching consequences for the futures from which the time traveler(s) came, and all the lives that may be destroyed/altered as a result. Eobard's "you're all dead to me" attitude often seems to be the inadvertent attitude of the heroes of the present who don't realize that they're eliminating potentially millions of lives just because "they don't exist to us yet."
Time travel. Don't do it.)
xavier c wrote:
Lucifer is equal in power to Michael Demiurgos in the DC/Vertigo/Sandman comics.
As I recall, this is more or less true*. Neither one ever really demonstrates their power in the series; both tend to take a more subtle approach- Lucifer manipulates, and Michael is a pacifist.
*In this universe, at least.
It is supposed to be that Lucifer, LazarX- the show is based on Mike Carey's Lucifer series for Vertigo.
(Very, very loosely based, from what I have read of the premise and is evidenced in the trailers. Which is too bad, because Carey's series is a really excellent character driven story with a massive and tightly woven plot.)
The short answer is yes (at least one notable NPC on Golarion has made the attempt).
Long answer is, I'd imagine it would be possible to do so a couple of different ways:
1) Magical soul transfer. The Shabti are an example of this, as are the Soulbound Dolls.
Interesting. It wouldn't just have to be goblins, though- it could be focused around all goblinoids: goblins, hobgoblins, bugbears. Maybe something to do with fallout from the Goblinblood Wars?
Looks like "Wonder Woman" is getting crushed beneath the heel of the movie-making machine yet again! Link.
Honestly, I think I prefer the studio's apparent choice to make it a "character driven" movie as opposed to the previous director's apparent "Epic Braveheart level action origin" piece.