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Feiya

Caineach's page

RPG Superstar 2013 Star Voter. Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber. 5,260 posts (5,265 including aliases). 1 review. No lists. No wishlists. 1 alias.


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GreyWolfLord wrote:
Kthulhu wrote:
LazarX wrote:
Yes, they must destroy and rebuild it all from scratch... Following the same winning strategy that WOTC did when they moved beyond 3.5.
Of course you ignore that they also used that strategy when they transitioned from 2e to 3.0.

Ninja'd on this already.

Obviously, changing the underlying system does not mean failure or bad sales necessarily when seeing these items.

On the otherhand, I think PF might actually LOSE a LOT of players if they did something like this.

Honestly, a lot of the issues the system now has can be traced back to them not faithfully converting spells from 2e to 3e. They took out the drawbacks that reigned in the spam casting of a lot of spells, like haste aging you a year. This made sense from the perspective of people want to actually be able to use their toys, and made the game a lot more fun for casters. But they didn't pay enough attention to how those limitations affected the spell's perceived power. Most of the spells that are considered broken today either had expensive material components that are now trivial to find because of reworks to the economy or metagame drawbacks to reduce their usage.


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Matthias Naelaron wrote:
Can someone explain to me why Burning the Rainbow Flag is a Hate Crime and you get arrested, yet you are allowed to do whatever you want with the US Flag? Seems to me a double standard. Either they are both hate crimes or they are both protests. My opinion, individual though it is, the only flag in this country that should matter, is the US Flag, with all others being completely irrelevant. YMMV.

Burning someone else's American flag on their lawn is also a crime.


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Rynjin wrote:

Fantasy literature has largely changed in style over the years as well.

Authors like Brandon Sanderson, Jim Butcher, and Brent Weeks are the norm now, and Rule of Cool takes a bit more of a center stage than some of the more grounded series of the past.

It's kind of interesting conceptually. Currently the norm for fantasy is closer to where ancient legends were thousands of years ago. Gilgamesh and Hercules could feel right at home on the pages of some of Sanderson's works, with the deeds they perform.

Right now a lot of focus seems to be on more legendary figures as far as deeds, though generally with more character development than the ancient myths.

Likewise, many anime, cartoons, and video games have followed this style as well, though longer since in some cases (and especially in the case of comic books and manga).

You can really see this with The Name of the Wind. I try to tell people that Kvothe isn't supposed to seem balanced. For his world, he is a living Gilgamesh. He is literally a figure myths are made of. Its how they introduce him. Why are people surprised when he is good at everything?


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Terquem wrote:

You know the whole shopping thing is a topic unto itself. I don't remember anyone going "shopping" in the Hobbit, or in The Sword of Shanarra (two books I read when I was young) and in my first campaign, shopping was a very small part of the game, and no magic shopping of any kind was ever available.

I imagine that games like DragonQuest, DragonWarrior, and Final Fantasy (though I am sure they were not the first) were big parts of introducing the necessity of going shopping to constantly upgrade equipment (as an aside, my first campaign, my sister played a Cleric and he wore the same armor from level 1 through level 5, when he finally broke down and bought better armor, and it was non magical, and he wore that until he retired at level 11).

I wonder if there is a researched examination on the introduction of "shopping" in Video Games.

Not really. Shopping became a thing with the conversion from 2E to 3E. Instead of randomly priced, eccentric magic items mostly detailed in non-mainline sources (look at the Magic Item Encyclopedia), they introduced standardized rules and prices for magic items, combined with rules for player crafting, in the core rules. The introduction of the CR system and wealth by level also partially codified expected gear players were assumed to have by certain levels. I think most of this came from wanting to empower GMs with more knowledge of how to do good encounter and campaign design, but it ended up with some strong drawbacks.


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Ooh good question.

I'm 31, grew up in the 90s, and started playing d&d some time in the mid 90s when I was 10-12. I didn't really start coming up with good character concepts until later though.

For me, the Nintendo and Super Nintendo JRPGs (Japanese style RPGS), like Final Fantasy (I started with 4, and absolutely loved 6), Dragon Warrior (particularly 4), and Chrono Trigger are the most memorable and probably the most influencial. To this day if you give me a character based off of Locke, Cyan, or Frog I will love it.

I read the Hobbit in elementary school. I enjoyed it, but can't really say I remember it. The Chronicles of Narnia were much more defining for me, and I absolutely love them. I was also facinated in elementary school by Greek myths, but never actually got into actual books of them, just children's summaries.
At some point in middle school I tried to read LotR. I got through the first 2 books, but just could never finish it, and have never bothered to try to read them again. I remember reading a few other things in high school, particularly The Waterborn and The Blackgod by Gregory Keyes, and Gates of Fire by Steven Pressfield, the later mostly because my brother read it and ran a campaign in Ancient Greece. I never really read for fun until I got into college.

In high school, I got into anime. Rurouni Kenshin in particular influenced me a lot. I had some terrible rips of Flame of Recca that I loved, though I probably wouldn't recommend the series now, especially with how disappointed I was that the show ends abruptly mid plot arc.

As for movies, Princess Bride, Labyrinth, Dragonheart, and especially Willow. Hercules and Xena were on TV, and I wouldn't miss them.

After I got into college in the early 2000's, things got a lot more complicated.


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Oly wrote:
Bandw2 wrote:

not true, as mentioned, the disparity is between the abilities capable of changing a story. a wizard can teleport and warn of an impending invasion, the martials simply have to walk back. If they say had a class choice to gain some kind of extra quick mount or other ability (maybe a rogue can have trained pidgeons to move items or messages about) to effect world changing plots.

Now, that part is true. Magic is fun, because of out of combat uses. When I started playing some time back, I was more thinking about survivability and gravitated toward martials.

I've come to see magic as more fun, and am much more likely to play casters now.

But because those I've played with (including when I GM) have intelligent NPC's usually target those easily identifiable as casters, I certainly feel more vulnerable when playing arcane casters (divine casters are less vulnerable, but that's balanced by making their spells weaker than arcane spells). I've died as casters (and eventually been resurrected), and never died in combat as a martial.

Maybe I need to use Mirror Image more, but I think people are ignoring relative danger, partially because many GM's don't have intelligent NPC's target the squishies.

As far as fun, to me that's the tradeoff: Less danger (as a martial) for less cool stuff vs. the opposite. And if you think casters are both very much stronger characters and (really to the point) more fun to play, then just play them....

I find a lot of people also don't bother to look at what percentage of their resources they are spending just to stay alive. They talk about having mirror image up, but that takes a turn to activate, wont even last you a full combat, and spends a spell slot. That's not something you want to invest in before about 7th level, and even then you can't rely on it every time.


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Kobold Cleaver wrote:
DM_Blake wrote:


In Star Wars, Han Solo is a really good "martial", even with a ranged attack, but Luke could defeat him in the blink of an eye even after training with Ben Kenobi for only the length of a single trip from Tatooine to Alderaan (where Luke learned to deflect blasters with the Force).

You know, I hear people mention Jedi a lot in these sorts of threads, and it makes me wonder if they've really thought the comparison out.

The Jedi (and Sith) focus primarily on their lightsaber duels. That's what we regard as "awesome" about them. Sure, their reflexes and stuff are enhanced by the midichlorians, blah blah blah, but that's all flavor text for things lots of action movies would just handwave because it looks cool. Jedi are martials with some spell-like abilities. Luke hardly ever uses the Force, save for the odd enchantment effect (only on the weak-minded) or a bit of telekinetics. Basically, he's a monk with one or two levels in sorcerer psychic.

With the exception of Yoda and Palpatine (and one scene where Darth Vader deflected blaster shots with his hand), the "martial" aspect of the force-users is always the side that ends battles (hell, Palpatine was undone with a grapple check). I could easily argue that Mace Windu, Obi-Wan, Darth Maul and Luke are great examples of martials done right—sure, the monks have a few showy magic tricks, but they're always melee fighters first and foremost. Why can't paladins and fighters get some of that action? ;D

This X1000

Just look at any medium to high powered fantasy and you see the martials being awesome. At best, they are some hybrid gish, but they almost always favor the martial aspects. The fact that they are more or less impossible to build in d&d style games is one reason why I'm looking at other systems.


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Kirth Gersen wrote:
I understand the love for Pratchett, but don't share it. He relies on the same general brand of humor as Douglas Adams (whose novels I also didn't like) and, to some extent, Monte Python (whom I also don't think are all that funny).

You are not alone.


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Sissyl wrote:
Oh really? Well, your opinion is noted, thejeff. That doesn't make it valid, nor does your referring to an AGW propaganda site exactly infuse your opinion with rightness. Propaganda will be propaganda. By the way, the explanation given in your precious site is inconclusive.

The site offers a clear description of what was being talked about in the emails, offers public sources for its discussion dating back more than a decade before the controversy, and you want me to believe you because you say it is propaganda while offering no counterdata?


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Sissyl wrote:

AGW may well be real, though what has gotten out about it into mainstream information is too riddled with weasel-talk, idiot soundbites and screaming nastiness to tell. Lots of people have done a miserable job at communicating it. They have also strayed from proper scientific methods, as shown by their ideas about consensus relaying truth.

So, what is needed is INDEPENDENT research. After a serious investigation of the manners of research in the current climatology field and some serious transparency work, the field could start producing interesting results again.

These people demand the ages old dreams of the environmentalist mindset, which is a) a truly massive cost, b) won't solve the problem and c) will not get popular support. All of these mean it won't happen. Humanity is as it is, and it is possible we can't deal with this. Throwing out the good things we do have won't improve anything.

If the IPCC stopped throwing uncountable billions at the ghost of CO2 PPMs, which have not helped, and put a massive effort into developing the entire fissile cycle of uranium and fusion plants, the problem would be far more likely to be treatable. Solar and wind is cute, not a cure.

What exactly would qualify as independent research if hundreds of unrelated papers corroborating eachother using different methods wont satisfy you?


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Sissyl wrote:
So, thejeff, since you're the resident inquisitor of AGW here: What do you ACTUALLY suggest we do? Your above post makes no concrete claims to anything: You say that shutting down all fossil fuel use would be a good start, of course moderated by the fact that the consequences would be too drastic. You say we should move "much harder than we are" from fossil fuels. What does that mean? How should it be implemented? If we accept everything the AGW preachers say, you know the emission cuts needed are rather massive. At the very least, FAR more than you will EVER get people to agree to voluntarily. So, do you support forcible, massive cuts of emissions, at the individual level?

Changes shouldn't happen on the individual level. They are worthless there. They need to happen at the societal level, and the only way to do that is through government.

1. Encourage municipalities to invest in solar and wind infrastructure to replace aging coal and oil. Encourage local governmental takeover of power grids. This has drastically reduced electric costs pretty much everywhere it has been implemented and cut down on greenhouse gasses.
2. Invest in controls software to optimize power production efficiency. Some areas that have done this have decreased redundant power from fossil plants that are more reliable by as much as half.
2a. Replace oil and coal backup power plants with natural gas ones, since they have drastically lower emissions but maintain the reliability.
3. Invest in nuclear power. Tell people worried about radiation to STFU, because they have no idea what they are talking about.
4. Invest heavily in electric passenger cars. Re-institute the manditory electric vehicle requirements California had on car manufacturers to force them to start investing and developing the technology. Accept that the vehicles are still a few years away from profitability.
5. Implement a tax on emissions from large industry. Corporations will optimize to reduce costs. Right now they can ignore carbon emissions because there is no cost associated with them. Implementing a cost for destroying the environment allows us to invest in remediation techniques or encourage them to find other methods to do what they need to do.
6. Don't charge a flat rate for electric costs. Make the first X watt hours have a lower cost than the next y. Users who use more electricity get charged increasingly higher costs. Scale this also off of when power is consumed to discourage use at peak times.

Just a few ideas.


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Benchak the Nightstalker wrote:

At least in the first half, it's less stupidity and more hubris (which is thematically appropriate for a Jurassic Park movie).

They think they know what they're doing.
They think their weapons and security measures will keep the animal contained.
They think they have control.

IMO, It's only when the paramilitary dudes show up later that people start throwing around the idiot ball.

** spoiler omitted **

...
Spoiler:
Quote:

The sophisticated network of hi-tech infrared cameras told them there wasn't anything in the paddock. The cameras seemed to be in working order, and were deployed so as to cover the entire enclosure. Plus, again, the thing sticks out like a sore thumb, and they couldn't see it through the windows or on any of the cameras.

Remember, these people don't realize they're in a monster movie.

Of course they only have thermal imaging. They don't have any motion censors on the walls. No one saw or heard the monster jump over the fence... You would feel the thing landing. They have no video recording to play back to see how long it has been missing. No. These idiots first thought is to go into the paddock to examine scratches. Not to mention the only door out is dinosaur sized and they don't have a convenient human sized door right next to or in it.

But that isn't the only terrible safety design in this park. Lets not forget those gyrospheres. No automated control for the park to take over driving. What do they do when an idiot decides to start ramming the dinosaurs in their "impenetrable" ball? No invisible fence to shut the thing off if it goes out of range, to prevent people from doing stupid stuff like the kids do.

Quote:
Tranquilizers would be tough to deliver, thanks to its thick, tough hide, and on a creature that size will be slow to take effect, giving it time to eat the shooter. Shooting it with tranq snipers from helicopter is going to be difficult thanks to the jungle canopy. Overwhelming application of tasers and nets should bring the creature down (hey, it probably works on other dinosaurs).

Well, even if tranquilizers take time, delivering some from range is a hell of a lot better than trying to melee the thing. Sure, you might need something that could cause permanent damage in order to actually deliver the dose, but that is a lot better than the alternative. They let the thing run rampant for most of the day. Not to mention they could have given air support to their ground team. These are the types of situations they should be training their team to handle.

Then there is the matter of their guns. They have 1 gun on site that can even harm a t-rex from what this movie shows. That is just dumb. You should have enough that you can outfit multiple teams, at minimum. For every 5 men, you should have a specialist with an anti-tank armament.


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Sissyl wrote:

But you know... what if... what the climate scientists want to do is not make molto dinero, but have grants enough to work, travel to interesting places, and have people listen to them? What if there are certain people who want massive international influence and do want the dineros? Isn't that enough profit to motivate people to toe the official line? And as for climatologists... from what I understand, it's a case of "If you want to publish a paper on squirrels, you can forget it, unless you write about how squirrels are impacted by MAN-MADE GLOBAL WARMING". Enough subversion of scientific journal boards would quite effectively strip any possibility of even publishing a dissenting account, and indeed make sure those who did not agree with the official line do not work as climatologists. And of course, the strategy of infiltrating and taking over boards of journals that do not follow the official line was confirmed in the Climategate emails. They called it "redefining the peer-review process", IIRC. And the obedient climatologists do get their grants today. And the certain people do have massive international influence today. And a dissenting opinion is impossible, because a) there are no journals left that would publish anything that questions the official line, and b) nobody remains working in climatology that doesn't toe the official line. I find 3% dissenting is a VERY high figure, given the above.

Very neat. And hey, it doesn't even require a massive global conspiracy, just a bit of tomfoolery through the climatology field's infrastructure. The scientists support the doomsayings and grabs of influence of the certain people, and the certain people provide for grants for the scientists, through various state administrations.

It can happen to a field. It has happened before. Call it a circle-jerk or a club of reciprocal admiration, it is what happens when no other lines are allowed. For examples, consider the field of Racial biology. If someone wasn't a racial biologist, they were of course not...

Except for the fact that the people with the most disposable money are those with a vested interest in disproving global warming, and the only people they can find to publish refutations also worked on tobacco studies for cigarette companies.


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Snorb wrote:
** spoiler omitted **

Spoiler:
Don't forget the velociraptor riding the T-Rex to fight the velociraptor-T-Rex Hybrid

Overall, the kids were decent actors that didn't make me want to strangle them, Chris Pratt played Dinosaur Lord, and the female lead was forgettable. So better than I expected.

I just wish the movie didn't revolve around everyone being a complete moron to actually get the situations set up. The first movie was at least sabotage causing the major failure. Here, pretty much everyone in any semblance of charge was an idiot. I mean, whoever set up the security and safety measures could not have been more incompetent.


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She didn't just kill Immortan Joe. She humiliated him by stealing his wives, defeating 3 war parties, then driving back in his car. She didn't just kill god. She destroyed him.


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MeanDM wrote:

I think that having a non-voiced character has always felt like a means of immersion for me. It allowed me to project as I wanted onto the character. I Hope they don't change that. Won't be a deal breaker though.

I'm the opposite. I always find it annoying when everyone in the game is talking except the main character.


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Honestly, I felt like the original trailer from the kickstarter was better than the final version.


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Kajehase wrote:
captain yesterday wrote:
Monks are always Tea related, name a Monk that doesn't drink Tea, go ahead I'll wait the little guy is test driving big wheels at toys r us, so I have all damn day:-p

I'll name two! (For a given value of monk.)

Brother Cadfael
Friar Tuck

Cadfael makes plenty of herbal teas in the TV show


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The black raven wrote:

When overly frustrated, undead in Oots have a tendency to insult mortals by referring to exactly the features the undead themselves are lacking :

Durkula "you pulsing bloodsack" in 985.

Xykon "you sickening pouches of warm goo" in 661.

I wonder if it shows an envy (veiled by scorn) of what the living mortals are and have.

And I am now left wondering whether Liches follow the same "inhabited by an evil spirit" case as Vampires do.

Not that the mortal Xykon was a goody-two-shoes to begin with, mind you (as seen in Start of Darkness).

Or it is because the undead have transcended beyond those things and look down on those without.


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thegreenteagamer wrote:
Caineach wrote:
thegreenteagamer wrote:
Yeah, green tea frozen yogurt is pretty frickin' amazing.
There is a Japanese restaurant near me that deep fries green tea ice cream. So delicious.

I keep hearing about fried iced cream. How is this a thing? Physics/chemistry-wise, I mean...How do you not have liquid goop before there's any actual frying occurred?

Also, holy crap, how fat do you have to be where iced cream isn't enough, you need to fry that?! Apparently me I am, because I want it!

Physics is your friend. There is a rate that heat will transfer across and through something. Just like how you can burn a rare steak. In that time, you can fully fry the batter you use to make an outer shell of ice cream, while the ice cream is mostly unaffected. That shell becomes an insulating barrier for the rest of the ice cream. When you break into it, there is a layer that is molten goop and delicious, and you have a really interesting temperature gradient throughout. You should also do it with very cold ice cream.


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thegreenteagamer wrote:
Yeah, green tea frozen yogurt is pretty frickin' amazing.

There is a Japanese restaurant near me that deep fries green tea ice cream. So delicious.


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my god I hated the science. Run at a hydrogen particle... Seriously... SO MUCH DUMB


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captain yesterday wrote:

If I ever get to play in Kingmaker other then running it for 11 year old girls playing Brave I mean, I'm making a Cavalier that rides a miniature Horse and sinks all his starting cash into a nice tea set as well as other tea related fopperies:-D

Honestly tho I'll make him for any campaign

You mean like Harsk?


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Ceaser Slaad wrote:

To each their own. Maybe you have something of an allergy to alcohol. And depending on the brew in question some of them are acquired tastes. I drink occasionally, usually beer when I do. I'm partial to Sam Adams, but l'll drink just about anything.

Alas, with the exception of a few microbrews, if you want really good beer here in America you have to go for an import. Probably true for tea as well. I don't know if they actually grow any here. I know it was originally all imported, but that could have changed since the Revolutionary War. :-) Perhaps I should get out more ... ;-)

If you think there are only a few microbrews in the US making good beer, you need to move to a more hipster area. Even when you get past the ridiculous number of overhopped beers, there are good craft breweries all over the place. Name a style, and you can find a good one made in the US that has distribution in at least a few states.


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Watched Devil is a Part Timer last night. It has an interesting mix of seriousness and comedy that made it way more enjoyable than I was expecting.


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thesenchagamer wrote:

Green Tea Original Lemon from Pickwick, cooled down overnight and served in a glass of ice cubes.

(I am nowhere near my sencha, so flavoured green tea is a thing again)

Wait... I could pour tea in an ice cube mold and have tea ice cubes that won't dilute my tea as it melts...

Growing up we used to do it with water that we boiled mint in. Went fantastic in lemonade and the cheap iced tea we had then.


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I just finished off a blended Yunnan tea. Man I want another cup.


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Lord Fyre wrote:
Caineach wrote:
Lord Fyre wrote:

Actually, I a surprised that Freehold DM didn't point out the rather massive Chickification of Black Widow in this film.

And from a self-professed Feminist of all people.

Funny, I didn't interpret anything that happened to BW to be chickification. Apparently showing that characters have broad ranges of emotions is frown upon?

Not at all.

But the way she was "calling herself a monster" implies that she feels that she is one because she cannot have children. This has to do with the scene with Banner in the farmhouse. (Note: calling herself a "monster" because of the evil deeds she is trying to atone for would have been quite different.)

Also, the scenes would have been FAR less damaging in a larger Black Widow movie, but in an AVENGERS film (where screentime is limited) this tends to stand out more.

If that is how you interpret that scene, that is how you interpret it. Your wrong though. She is calling herself a monster because she is talking about how easy it is for her to kill people and how it helped her to not care.


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Lord Fyre wrote:

Actually, I a surprised that Freehold DM didn't point out the rather massive Chickification of Black Widow in this film.

And from a self-professed Feminist of all people.

Funny, I didn't interpret anything that happened to BW to be chickification. Apparently showing that characters have broad ranges of emotions is frown upon?


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Lord Foul II wrote:
Ross Byers wrote:

I forgot he had prestige class levels. He mentions planning to swap a 4th level spell for Cure Critical, but he's still not allowed to swap 4th level spells until he has 6th level spells, so that's only at 17th (or I guess 20th) level of Bard.

And since he mentions learning two new 5th level spells, that panel occurred just after gaining 13 levels in bard (with some unknown number of Dashing Swordsman).

Two possible conclusions here:

1) Elan is at least 17th level of bard, plus some of Dashing Swordsman (possibly making the party 20th level, nearing the end game), and we should see 9th level spells immiently.

2) Burlew forgot/deliberately ignored the rule about bard swapping spells only two or more levels below their highest spell level and Elan swapped at 14 levels of bard, making the party as a whole somewhere in the neighborhood of 15-17th level.

he has at least 16 levels of bard plus an unknown number of levels of dashing swordsman

We know this because he used song of freedom, a bardic class feature gained at level 16 near the end of the desert arc

Do we know what dashing swordsman gets for class features? I t could get song of freedom early. I was under the impression that they were only 15th-16th level. We haven't seen a 9th level spell yet that I know of.


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Rynjin wrote:
Kirth Gersen wrote:
This thread is evidence that the riots ARE accomplishing something. Without them, it would be business as usual; another African American youth murdered by police, no notice at all by anyone except his immediate family/associates. After the riots, the whole country knows what happened yet again, especially following so soon after the unrest in Ferguson, for the same reason. Get enough of these riots back-to-back, in different cities, and at some point it will penetrate even the thickest of skulls that there is a real problem somewhere.
It seemed to be getting pretty solid coverage just from the protests already.

They were getting s@$@ coverage before the riots. Even after the riots, the coverage has been crap, but at least there.


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Hama wrote:
Old Clash of the Titans. Those skeletons were awesome.

For me, it is the old Jason and the Argonauts. The Children of the Hydras Teeth were awesome.


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Kalshane wrote:
While I love the Arkham games, I've never been a fan of their character designs. They always felt like they were trying too hard to be "dark and gritty".

Have you seen the previews for DCs new movies? They are trying to out grimdark 40K


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Interestingly, I've noticed that Arizona iced tea and sweet tea contain the same amount of calories from sugar.


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Amazing Red wrote:
I just saw it. Hawkeye is my new favorite avenger. Between him and Thor are some of the best lines.

Hawkeye easily stole the show.


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Rynjin wrote:

Obviously we're going to have to agree to disagree on this.

I think the protection of other people's property (and welfare, though as of YET nobody has been hurt) is more important than you being able to continue protesting all through the night.

I certainly think it's a better alternative than coming in with teargas and billy clubs to arrest large groups of people at once.

You disagree.

S$~! can be rebuilt. Freedom is much harder to repair.


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Criminal charges filed


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MMCJawa wrote:
I thought she had done something a little more extensive than just surgically attaching razor blades? but it's been awhile since I have seen that episode.

No. It was that bad.


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leo1925 wrote:

Guys, Matt had super senses and something quite close to synaesthisia for YEARS, i find it very hard to believe that S.H.I.E.L.D didn't hear anything about him and (at least) put his name in the Index.

Also i was talking about the case that the daredevil series takes place after the dissolution of S.H.I.E.L.D. where both Hydra and Shield(s) have kept an eye on super powered individuals
** spoiler omitted **.

Yes, but as far as superpowers go, super senses are one of the hardest to detect, especially if the person is trying to actively hide them. Hell, his best friend couldn't tell.


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got to say I like Jon Stewart's take


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God I'm glad I live in an area with amazing tap water. Besides being great for tea, I get awesome pizza, bagels, and beer!


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MLK wrote:
It is not enough for me to stand before you tonight and condemn riots. It would be morally irresponsible for me to do that without, at the same time, condemning the contingent, intolerable conditions that exist in our society. These conditions are the things that cause individuals to feel that they have no other alternative than to engage in violent rebellions to get attention. And I must say tonight that a riot is the language of the unheard


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My only real complaint about the series is that they mostly ignore the fact that he is a lawyer. I'm not a big comic reader, so I only have a passing familiarity with the a few characters from elsewhere. But I was hoping for something more paced like Burn Notice, with a solid client of the week interacting with the overarching plot. Instead, it felt like they rushed the primary plot as the only thing going on, so it felt like too much happened too quickly.

That being said, the cinematography was amazing. Others have mentioned the hallway scene, but I think one of my favorites was the episode open where they show Fisk's morning routine.


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Hama wrote:
Um Arrow fights are crap. Anyone fighting like Ollie does would be dead within seconds.

Not to mention his bow would break the first time he tried to use it after one of his melees with it.


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Hrothdane wrote:

@RainyDayNinja I'm guessing you are suggesting that the numbers being similar is somehow indicative of something.

You have given evidence of a correlation between number of votes and being affiliated with Tor, nothing more, and weak evidence at that. I don't see any evidence as to what caused it. Patterns emerge in any system of data if you look hard enough and long enough at it and feel free to cherry-pick data. Also, Day is quick to try to explain away the years in which the category numbers didnt all match up, nor does he include any kind of analysis of the overall pattern of voting data. Unless vote manipulation has been endemic from the beginning, there should be clear and marked changes in the voting data around the time the manipulation began, which would be much easier to show. He is clearly trying to find a pattern.

Extrapolating sound conclusions from data is hard enough with organized and randomized studies and actual statistical analysis tools. Expecting a non-random sample cherry-picked from all the years of data to give insight just wastes everyone's time.

Actually, the number of votes each thing got is a huge indicator and ridiculously important. It shows that people did not vote for the Sad Puppies list en mass without consideration, as 1 work on the list has twice the number of votes as another. It also shows that the previous voting had those Sad Puppies is accusing of block voting having large chunks within 10% of eachother. So, Sad Puppies, publicly announcing their slate, do not show signs of block voting but their opposition, who is denouncing the block voting, does.

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@koloktroni

Trying to "rock the vote" so to speak isn't the issue. My issue is with the premise of Sad Puppies that their preferred works were being marginalized by an illegitimate force and that they had to react. That narrative doesn't hold water.

Actually, It holds a lot of water with me. The works they support are frequently a different style that sells really well but does not get recognized by awards. They are the cheesy romance novels of science fiction.

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@Caineach

You don't have to convince me that the nomination process is not constructed well and leaves great potential for abuse. However, having great potential for abuse does not equate to that abuse having occurred.

As to politics, my point was that any two news sources can have a wildly different view of things. The old "politcal correctness will doom the liberals" is a shibboleth that has been circulating since the phrase "political correctness" was invented. I've probably heard we are a year away from the Republican party splintering over the libertarian and conservative Christian divide for 10 years, too. I was also thinking about one of the many other times Bill Maher has complained about political correctness. Once again, shibboleth.

Political correctness was originally a conservative push and has changed meaning since the 90s. That it has now taken over the left and is strangling it is slowly becoming more evident, from the redacted story Entertainment Weekly published on this to the death threats being sent to the pizzeria in Indiana. You can find the redacted article at the end of Coreia's response to sad puppies 3 backlash


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TOZ wrote:
jemstone wrote:
Do you have any idea how hard it is to come up with those Magical Girl "You will be punished for your wrongdoings!" monologues on the fly? Do you? DO YOU?!?
Yes.

In Samurai Flamenco they actually discuss it.


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Hrothdane wrote:

What points? As I indicated when I paraphrase one of Correia's comments, I've been to their website and read their side. Where is the evidence there was any sort of organized liberal cabal, that quality works were systematically excluded from the process because they didn't meet an arbitrary level of social conscience?

Until there is compelling evidence that such corruption existed and actually affected the results in a meaningful way, Sad Puppies has no legs to stand on. Sometimes groups are marginal because they just aren't popular.

Once again, where are the critiques of the quality of the writing of the supposedly undeserving works? Where is the evidence that a liberal elite has made attempting to tackle social issues trump writing quality? All I'm seeing from Sad Puppies is a bunch of people complaining about SJWs.

As for the political comments, if I go to a liberal news site, they will say that conservatives are imploding. If I go to a conservative one, it will say liberals are imploding. I'm well familir with Bill Maher, and in the case you mention, he was resentful because he got pushback for his attitudes towards Islam, which are hardly uncontroversial. I'm also not sure how unbiased a person would be on the subject of political correctness when they name their show Politically Incorrect as a badge of honor.

As many have said, the "cabal" didn't have to be organized because the voting public was so small that it could have been an informal friends circle that just circulated recommendations to eachother and thus dominated the voting. As was pointed out above, it could take as little as 12 votes to get on the short list in some categories, and if those groups were the active particpants in other parts of the con they could easily drive other people away from voting just by being annoying. The convention circuit is extremely cliquey, and this award could easily be dominated by the active cliques through normal social interactions.

As for the Bill Maher comments, it had nothing to do the backlash against his Islamic beliefs. It is about his comments on Elton John attacking Dolce and Gobbana and backlash against a university professor saying "all live matter" instead of "black lives matter". And your comments about going to conservative sites to see them talking about the other side imploding makes no sense with regards to me mentioning Huffington Post, since Huffington Post is one of the most liberal news outlets with respectability.


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thejeff wrote:

I'm not sure what you mean by "hitting significantly more numbers". Are you saying less people read those message boards than Scalzi's, for example?

Exactly. More people read Scalzi's message board, but he failed to conver them into voters.

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Their recommendations certainly drew more votes than anyone elses, even assuming there was anything to directly compare them too. Partly because they framed it as "Here's your chance to stick it to them."
And by "left wing ideologues", they basically mean people who write stories featuring LGBTQ characters in positive roles, right?

If that were the case, Correia would be eliminating himself, as well as a number of authors on the sad puppies list. There is a difference between people who support LGBTQ issues and people and the people who have become rabid in their attacks against anyone who doesn't support the party line. There is a reason Bill Maher of all people recently called out the left for attacking its own, and you are starting to see news articles about the left being self-destructive with its political correctness on places like Huffington Post.


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Hrothdane wrote:
This movement isn't about inclusion. It's about reactionaries attempting to exert control over a system that hasnt been favoring them. The condescending and patronizing attitude of the sponsers of Sad Puppies towards those that they believe have "stolen" the awards from "true" sci-fi becomes extraordinarily clear in the banter they have with their followers and their attacks on critics in the comments on their sites.

And have you looked at the banter they are responding to? The Sad Puppies have been downright civil in their response.

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The Rapid Puppies list was more successful than the more moderate Sad Puppies one. That fact alone gives an idea of what kind of person is behind this movement. The name "Sad Puppies" alone is a perfect example of the kind of self-indulgent victim complex that motivates its creators.

Yes, because using a mocking joke of a name for what started as a gag is somehow a self-indulgent victim complex. Or it is a guy with a sense of humor who understands how the internet works and how to connect with his fans. Apparently understanding how PR works is evil.

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Once again, nobody has given any evidence that there was any form of vote tampering in the past. Saying "certainly it must have happened at some point" doesn't cut it, sorry. The only evidence presented amounts to "I dont like thing and everyone in my social circle doesnt like thing so it must win awards by cheating." This mentality pops up all the time when one group feels marginalized: they characterize anyone that disagrees with them as illegitimate because CLEARLY they deserve to be in charge regardless of any facts or evidence. It's nothing but unfettered ressentiment and it's disgusting no matter what group is guilty of it.

Or it could be that the group is actually being marginalized and shut out of the conversation. Gotta love a group claiming to be open and welcoming hurling insults and vilifying a group for saying they feel like their voices aren't being heard and then doing something about it.

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People here keep saying that it's just about a group of fans trying to get more of the sci-fi they like visible, but people keep dancing around the topic of what that actually means in this context. This movement is not about quality writing; it's about censuring certain categories of content. Just like Gamergate, Sad Puppies brings along the baggage of unleashing a horde of vitriolic negativity on a group of people that have commited the apparently heinous crime of caring too much about social issues and writing about them. My God.

The leaders of Sad Puppies want to define "good sci-fi" as being free of LGBT themes and social justice issues. I have not seen one critique of the actual writing skills of an author, only snide comments on the interests of the supposed elites. This Sad Puppies group of reactionaries has declared an entire group of writers--and by extension their fans--illegitimate because of the subject matter of their stories. How does that make the field more open? How does that fight for the rights of artistic expression?

Apparently that is why the creator uses an ethnically diverse cast in his novels, and the recommendations included works with non-hetero-normative main characters from a group of authors across the political spectrum. Because they think those things shouldn't be included...

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I accept that the arts will always have works I don't like and that other people will. Camus put it better than me when he wrote that "A free press can, of course, be good or bad, but, most certainly without freedom, the press will never be anything but bad." You can dislike the works, but that is no argument against leaving the creative marketplace free and open. Creative people need an open environment to work in, to feel free to take risks. Taking risks means making mistakes, trying things that haven't been done before. How are writers supposed to feel comfortable when they know that any slight trace of social conscience will earn them a fanatical hatedom? Sad Puppies claims that they felt punished for not kow-towing to some unproven--and completely unevidenced--liberal conspiracy by being denied awards. How terrible. Correia even mentions in one of his dismissive comments on his site that he has a pile of money. I really see how marginalized he is. Not winning an award vs having people grabbing torches and pitchforks because you wrote a gay couple. I wonder which is worse for the industry. I wonder which infringes more upon the freedom of artists to follow their inspiration.

Yes. Because the traditional voters response to Correia getting his first nomination before he became popular (complete boycott of his works because of his support for the Republican party) and publicly encouraging people to refuse to read it is so open and welcoming to new authors. If you are only open and welcoming when people don't dissent with you, your not actually open and welcoming.

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Correia and Turgeson and Wright can say they are just underdogs fighting the good fight until the end of the world. It doesnt mean anything if their actions dont support that.

But they seem to be growing and converting undecided in their favor, so you may want to take a look and actually read their points before outright ignoring them.


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thejeff wrote:

At which point of course, there is no problem with voting No Award above any names on the slate, since that's allowed by the rules.

This isn't a government or giant corporation. It's a volunteer fan organization. Sure, there are basic rules, but it has run for decades mostly by the good will of those involved. It's not designed to be completely hack proof. And it probably can't be, without being changed beyond recognition.
As analogy, think of a munchkin building Pun-Pun or some similar exploit and insisting it was "rules legal and therefore...

Except that the slate didn't vote in things to troll, they voted in things that they thought were worthy but would not get consideration (at least the SP one, RP is a different story). By block voting No Award out of spite, you are telling everyone who likes those things that their opinions didn't matter, thus proving the point of the people who created the slate that the award has become an elitist clique. Sad Puppies wins either way. The only ones it hurts are the authors who got on the slate despite not having anything to do with Sad Puppies.

Scalzi has the right of it. Read the things that got nominated and make a judgement ignoring how they got on there. It is the only way to be fair to the authors.

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