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Alastor Land

BlueAria's page

133 posts. Alias of Jon Heineman.


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Maybe the returing quality. But I think just treating them as thrown weapons would be fine not sure why the needed to treat them as ammo I know realistically shurikens aren't exactly going to last forever but breaking on hit seems like overkill swords axes and poll arms don't last forever in the real world either.

I use 25 PB But I'm used to upping encounter difficulties, my favorite method I've used was a set array 16,15,14,13,12,11 and gave them 7 point buy that could only be used to increase stats.

-5 he is then dieing. He will take one more point of damage a round untill he stabalizes or dies, a character dies when there negative hp is equal to there con score. In the core rule book the full rules are under death and dieing in the combat chapter.

A level 21 fighter with near all his feats focused on coup de graces. He was so excited about being able to auto crit as a standared action, the look on his face when I told him it would only work on helpless foe was priceless. The sad part is the I had only just made my 3rd character ever and he had ben playing for years.

I stand corrected sorry for the misinformation

I'm no expert but IIRA both undead lord and comand undead (thre feat) are band

RAW no but I have house ruled it, and it hasen't caused any problems yet, mass mythic fly might change my mind once I see it in action.

Edit: you have to spend a mythic point per target though, i figured it would be too much otherwise

Primus Agnarok wrote:
Oh so dont bother with still spell? that would save me a lot of actions.

In my opinion it just takes too much to use an entire spell level on a partial caster is a huge set back and you will be starved for feats as is if you like the double sword thing go with it its much easier and will be more effective not quite as cool as going double bastard swords but not uncool in its own right

Athaleon wrote:
Weapon Cords have been nerfed to a move action, because Gunslingers were abusing them.

:( if only they had just made guns normal attacks rather then touch attacks they could have saved so many problems not that weapon cords wernt alittle cheesy to begin with.

Anyway stay away from metamagic feats you wont have enough feats or spells to make them worth it

Athaleon wrote:

One other thing, I can't believe I forgot. You're a spellcaster, and hands holding weapons can't cast spells with somatic components. So you're either using move actions to draw and sheath every time, dropping a weapon, or waiting on a Glove of Storing - And who knows when or if you'll get one?

That's the ultimate decider right there. Use a two handed weapon, or if you must two weapon fight, use either a two Bladed sword or a weapon and light shield (which leaves a hand free).

Wow i cant belive i forgot about that, not having a hand to cast with is a huge draw back. Get weapon cords so you can drop your weapon and get it back more easily, i think its only a swift action it eats actions but its better then nothing

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Just an unhelpfull note my WotR game is level 9 mythic 3 and has 3 party members with 33+ ac and deal 90 damage on full attacks easaly they are mythic and all but i can easaly match the numbers with any front liner i could make bow ranger 2 hand fighter druid cleric pally barb the aps are not designed for optimized characters.

Now the helpfull stuff talk to the party if most of them arn't optimized ask if having superman in the party is a problem for them if not your good if it is ask if they would like some help or advice to buff them up or if superman would be willing to tone it down. So long as everyone is having fun it doesn't matter if one player is wreaking face just roll with it

Primus Agnarok wrote:

Man. Would having 2 B Swords out but only attacking with one give me the normal +3 to hit? Cause that would give me some convenient situational options. Also if that doesnt work i could just sheath one on the spot. the only difference is i dont get the 2 handing B sword bonus which i dont care about for the time being. And maybe i should just go with Wakizashi and B Sword. How well would that work for me? +1 to hit for both. And imbicatus, I understand that'd be best, but I do alot for cool. and eh not such a fan of biting and clawing people.


Like i said you only take the penalty if you make an off hand attack so you can make one attack at without the -4 and if you need to you can drop the extra sword as a free action 2 hand the other as a free action and get the extra str to damage if you come across a particularly tough baddie

Aelryinth wrote:

Let's go with the AC 14 Goblin.

2h guy with Weapon Focus, 16 Str, 1 mwk weapon, vs 2wpn guy with TWF.

2h Guy hits goblin on a 9 or better for d10+4 dmg, avg 9.5, ignoring crits. That's 60% of 9.5, or about 5.5 dmg/rd.

TWF guy hits the goblin on 15 or better, for d10+3 and d10+1. That's 30% of 8.5, or 3 dmg, and 30% of 7.5, or 2, 5 dmg/rd.

However, he only gets that when he gets a full attack. Otherwise, he's just swinging with one weapon for 3 dmg/rd.

If the 2h guy gets power attack, he's at -1 for +3 dmg. 55% of 12.5 dmg is about 7 pts.
If 2wpn guy gets Power Attack, he's at -1 for +2, so 25% of 10.5, or 3, and 25% of 9.5, or 2...his damage actually doesn't change, because he's missing so much.

And it just gets worse with levels. The only way TWF works is with massive amounts of bonus damage that apply to every attack, like, say, Sneak attack damage. Unfortunately, the only class that gets this is the rogue, and he has Medium BAB with nothing to help him hit more, so his damage sucks.


His standard attack would be higher you dont take a attack penalty just for having a weapon in your off hand so his standard attack would be higher to hit. Power attack is a poor option for a two weapon fighting build so that lets him trad power attack for twf and then he can grap weapon focus too upping his damage some too. Comparing him to the best damage build and getting 85% of the power seems fine to me

Athaleon wrote:

You have a total attack penalty of -1 right now. You already have a 75% chance of missing an opponent with 15 AC - That's 14 Dex and Leather Armor. Or 10 Dex and Chainmail.

This chance will not improve by much, if at all as you level up.

With 2 attacks it's 43.75 to hit once not optimal but not 25% either the build will never compair to a 2 hand build but being less then the best because its cool is fine at higher levels the cost of better weapons will start to add up and eventually he may be forced to switch to a smaller off hand or find a sun blade but he should be fine for early levels

Primus Agnarok wrote:

Guys, when this just doesnt seem to work, I will just flip over to using B Sword and wakizashi. I dont see me wanting many feats to help the inquisitor side very much soo yeah. but maybe you guys could suggest useful Inq feats, cause im a know-nothing with divine casters, but i would like to mess around with inflict/cure wounds and similar.


Reach spell to turn your cure spells in to ranged touch attacks is very helpful for +1 spell level it can save lives

Aelryinth wrote:

When I say -4 I mean normal TH -4, not 'base -4'.

So with a 2h you'd be at +3, 2Wpn, -1. That's easily a 50% swing in the ability to hit something at your level (avg AC of 16, you go from hitting on a 13 (40%) to hitting on a 17 (20%). Ouch, to say the least. And it just gets worse as you level and your Str and Power Attack go up.

Medium BAB doesn't help matters, either. Sure, if you do manage to hit, you'll do great. But those rounds you whiff...those are going to start weighing on you as they add up, while the full BAB, high Str, one weapon guy next to you is hitting, critting, confirming crits, and doing mondo damage with fewer swings consistently.

And the bastard sword is not a finessable weapon. A Wakizashi is. Dual Wakis mean both also benefit from Weapon Focus, if you choose to take it.


It's still an extra swing so 5% to hit twice 36% to hit atleast once and 64% to miss each hit is less damage but its not nearly half as likely to hit and on a standard attack he doesn't take twf penalties

If you are having too much trouble hitting you can just switch out the off hand to a lite weapon, it's not as cool but will work better. Flanking and any other to hit bonuses will be your best friend. I don't really put inquisiter as a front liner so with flanking, bane, and some self buffs you should be fine and helping the fighter/barb/whatever too.

Edit: i forgot getting the feat that lets you do full damage on off hand attacks is a must unless im remembering a 3.5 feat

Two weapon fighting is only slightly less effective then 2 handing its a goofy idea from a real life perspective but awsome from a style perspective i say go for it for rule of cool, it wont cost you much damage wise and is a great image. If only there was a way to one handed great swords.

I've been posting from a phone so I'm sure my grammar and spelling have left much to be desired.

But again you are referring to rules for normal regaining spells. Saying Marthkus is only responding to part of your post, why don't you respond to mine completely? Why is the ability worded differently then the ring of sustenance and do all other daily abilities get to renew with out having to wait for a new day?

Are you claiming that mythic heroes don't circumvent normal rules? Are you saying there is no was a god could grant spells more often to some specific clerics, what about the other ways to gain spells back does a magus have to chose from spells cast more then 8 hours ago for spell recall, does a pearl of power only work after 8 hours. As a rule specific rules trump general rules so the ability the specifically says you regain yours spells, witch recuperation calls out, trumps the normal rule for getting spells back normally.

Its still another source of damage i cant think of any time non energy damage bypasses dr with out meeting the requirments of the dr ex: cold iron and magic

friluftshund wrote:

Looking forward to the FAQ answer myself.

Although it seems there are two questions that frequently get muddled together, namely recent casting limit, and daily spells.

Preparing Wizard Spells wrote:

Rest: To prepare his daily spells, a wizard must first sleep for 8 hours. The wizard does not have to slumber for every minute of the time, but he must refrain from movement, combat, spellcasting, skill use, conversation, or any other fairly demanding physical or mental task during the rest period. If his rest is interrupted, each interruption adds 1 hour to the total amount of time he has to rest in order to clear his mind, and he must have at least 1 hour of uninterrupted rest immediately prior to preparing his spells. If the character does not need to sleep for some reason, he still must have 8 hours of restful calm before preparing any spells.

Recent Casting Limit/Rest Interruptions: If a wizard has cast spells recently, the drain on his resources reduces his capacity to prepare new spells. When he prepares spells for the coming day, all the spells he has cast within the last 8 hours count against his daily limit.

Some feel the mythic power overcomes recent casting limit quite fine, but that it still doesn't negate the daily part of preparing spells (daily, after all, meaning once a day).

Merriam Webster wrote:


adjective \ˈdā-lē\

: happening, done, made, used, or existing every day
: published every day or every day except Sunday
: of or relating to one day

Others feel it resets the whole mehanic, recent casting limit as well as the daily rule.

My personal feeling is that when casters don't get a second spell through amazing initiative, Pathfinder won't give them new spells every hour.

By that logic barbs get x rounds per day of rage there for they do not get more rage because they only get x per day dont bring dictionary definitions to the game world there is not a mechanical limit on geting per day or daily abilitys back because the are named as such

There has always been a limit to spells per round to prevent abuse and droping 3 or more spells a round is a fqr cry from getting extra castings a day for an hour of rest and an hour of prep

Absolutly no one with an ability to read english would suggest that recuperation cannot restore uses of daily abilities such as rage or smite because they are "daily" but some people who for some reason dislike casters or just arn't good enough gm's to deal with caster are lookilling for a way to nerf them because hevon forbid the party buffer gets the same treatment as the beat stick

Duncan888 wrote:
I well it's what I figured... Along this line mythic two wp rend says its a bonus dmg so how does this work with dr... Say u hit with both main and oh and do 1d6+11, 1d6+11, bonus 2d8+9 if something has dr10/- would it be 1d6+1,1d6+1,2d4+9 dmg done?

I would say each is a difrrent sorce so yes dr would apply to each attack separately if one weapon bypasses dr and the other deosnt i would say the rend would not bypass the dr

Example: Tom the two weapon fighter has a coldiron dagger in one hand and a silver dager in the other and hits a monster with dr5/cold iron he hits once with each dagger the one does 1d4+2 the other does 1d4-3 and rends for 2d8-3

But im not 100% sure on how dr works with rend

Rynjin wrote:

That would be the tangential rule I was referring to, yes.

But without referring to that rule, you might think Cure spells can target dead people.

Just like without reading the rules relating to magic, you might think a person can recover spells they've cast in the last 8 hours...

Still dont see why the wording is diffrent for the ring if the ability was not intended to work diffrently

Rynjin wrote:

Bad example.

Again, I refer you to Cure spells.

They heal damage, yes?

They don't say you CAN'T heal damage below -Con.

But you quite clearly cannot use a Cure spell on someone who is Dead, because of tangential rules relating to them.

You may notice that every suffocation effect in the game specifically says "This spell only affects living creatures that must breathe.", " Creatures that do not need to breathe are immune to this spell.", and so on.

So why does ring of sustenance call out that it doesnt circomvent the rule but recuperation not call that out unless it was intended work

Also healspells target creatures dead bodies are not creatures

If an ability says you dont need to breath it doesnt have to call out that you can ignore suffocation effects it doesn't need to call out that that you don t have to hold your breath it says youndont breath we infer the effects of not breathing, it says yougain your spell you infer that YOU GAIN YOUR SPELLS

DrDeth wrote:
Dekalinder wrote:

So basically, what are you saing Ryjin is that you prepare the spell at the sunrise like any normal, person. Then, at midday, you spend a mithyc point to regain your spells. But oh wait you already gained your spells once this day. So no spell for you. That would be like first print prone shooter round 2.

You get a lot of stuff back- bard song, rage, class abilities (like Sorc bloodline), and channeling. And *IF* it's been 8 hours, then spells- rather than having to sleep for 8 hours un-interrupted. Not to mention healing half your HP.

Even if it didn't effect spells at all, this would still be extremely useful. And it's free.

So, comparing this to Prone shooter is totally invalid.

I think he ment that it was prone shorter level of poorly thought out why call out regaining spells with out clearly stating how it would work or interact with the rules normally preventing regaining spells if it wasn't intending to circumvent the rules entire as you read it the regain spells aspect (an aspect called out in the ability) hardly works

I feel like you guys have spent hours combing rules to find an excuse to stop somthing you just dont like, honestly what is the problem with the ability as written, the one that gives spells back a wizard can normally only cast x spells a day and a barb can only rage x round a day this ability circumvents those limits could a barb rage untill he was out of rage sleep for 8 how rage till he was out the sleep again regaining his rage rounds 3 times in one day and if not why does recuperate circumvent this limt but not the spell limit? Why does the barb get to take naps and not the spellcasters is it just because you think casters are just too good?

The_Hanged_Man wrote:
BlueAria wrote:
Do you have the same rule for extended 1/hour per level spells? What about spells with 1/day or longer effects? main concern is about buff stacking. So a 1/day charm monster I wouldn't care about, but 1/hour buff spell I would probably count against the limit. The main intent is preventing the group from milking extra castings through Recuperation with long duration spells.

That said, I'm actually running a mythic campaign, but my group hasn't attempted to do this yet though so I haven't needed to actually address this. My group is pretty good about self-policing though, but I can see it being an issue for others.

I agree that using an entire days worth of spells to buff then spending one mythic point would be goofy and a DM should tell the players no because it's obvious metagaming but making my mage armour fall of is also kinda goofy. we are just about to hit tier 3 (i dm and run a dmpc) how have your payers used recuperation so far if they have? Did you give players all those spells back and did you find anything overly powerful because of it

aceDiamond wrote:

Hmmmmm... This reminds me of another question I had recently.

Take for example that my sorcerer grabbed up Dazing Spell at 9th level, as all the guides say it's a great feat and it looks incredibly useful. Then later on at 16th level, for argument's sake, I realize that the feat is too much and I don't wish to be "that guy" by subjecting the GM and my party to all the dazing. If I wanted to retrain Dazing Spell for Expanded Arcana, would I have to pick the extra spell I knew as if I were a 9th level sorcerer again? Or could I pick up to an 8th level spell since I'm retraining at level 16?

Furthermore, the cost to retrain a feat is generally 25gp X character level X days to retrain. Therefore, would I treat my character level as 9th for retraining the feat taken at that level or as 16th as the level I'd be at now?

I would price it as your current level and let you get the higher level spells what's good for the fighters is good for the wizard

Just my gut ruling, we have allowed retraining but never to circumvent level or BAB prerequisite but pathfinder rules seem to be OK with it

Yeah i thought that was a bit off when i read the retraining rules but it is raw and fighters can retrain feats to higher level ones without needing anything but the core book so it seems to be intended to work that way from the start

The_Hanged_Man wrote:

If the intent is to completely restore all spells, then I would probably houserule that any ongoing spells count against the daily limit to prevent stacking though.

Do you have the same rule for extended 1/hour per level spells? What about spells with 1/day or longer effects?

I dont agree with your reading but i do agree if the dm is giving players 2 hours to sit round unmolested he is doing something wrong and might as well just let them take 8

As for buff stacking i cant really think of any that would be particulary unbalanced and my wizard in wotr rarely casts more then one or spell per encounter anyway and most nights goes to sleep with atleast 2 of his higher level spells anyway unless we fought a "boss" that day most of my rounds are spent throwing out a magic missle from a wand or simply cheering on the fighters

Yeah wow i never realized how good mythic eh was i just thought it get you use the first level ability at full level, no wonder i thought it was so underwhelming. But still find me any bloodline capstone that could be emulated with 4 feat and i would buy that you could do that but i dont like letting anyone get class abilities for feats in the first place so i guess im not the one to ask but yeah RAW i think it works but RAI i dont think it was ment to get you the capstone even with 4 feats but hey its a level 17 mythic character so not realy the craziest thing you could do

Zahir ibn Mahmoud ibn Jothan wrote:
BlueAria wrote:
As a dm if a pally burnt a full round and 3 lay on hands instead of taking a full attack i would be more then happy to so him why he should have just killed the monster ive been playing pathfinder for years assuming that you could use 2 or even 3 swifts a round and cant think of a single time it was overpowered or game breaking in any way we even had a eldritch knight who would "unknowingly" use arcane armor training arcane, strike and a full atack then spell critical becase he "didnt know" armor training and spell critical used swifts and it still took us about three sessions to notice how powerful it really was mind you we are a bunch of rules layer munchkins so power builds are common at our table and until we caught on to this player rules "mistakes" were rare.

The not being able to "downgrade" Moves and Standards into Swifts causes players to make decisions. Swift Action abilities are usualyl pretty powerful. As a player of a Paladin myself, there are many times it would have been great to be able to throw down three Smites in the first round of combat, or some combo of Smites and LOH. Doing so would have been pretty powerful, so I was forced to make choices.

I would not be an advocate of allowing one to expend Swifts in place of the other actions.

But you are still making decisions spend time smiting and now the baddie is tearing your wizard buddy apart and now you arnt ajacent to anyone because you didnt move last round so unless the enemy decided to attack the guy standing around smiting them that one less round of full attack actions not a big deal before 5th level but many enemies will be in a bad way from a single smite charge and now they have another round of life another chance to crit the rouge you lose action economy healing in combat is a bad trade unless its a swift action and even then there are often better things to do show me a pally that can heal more damage then he can do with an attack (much less more then an monster can do) and i will agree that lay on hands 3 times a round is better then one loh and a charge followed up by a smite and a ffa but it just isnt most swift actions make you better at doing other things so it just doesnt make sense to give yourself bonuses to attack and ac on 3 enemys then it does to just kill one of them

Also i will ask again if i can take 2 swifts around why did the call out that you cant quicken 2 spells around? I just seems redundent.

Honestly i think tracking what time of day you cast a spell is just way too much record keeping and feel that the intent is to allow dodging the recent spell limt.

So we spend a mythic power and a hour of rest to get our powers back including any spells i havent cast inthe past 8 hours i then spend an hour preparing the spells for the slots i regained so now i ask what about the spells i cast 6 hours ago do i get them back? If i do and thats 2 more spells so another half hour to prep for them now i get back from the fight we had at t-minus 5:45 so another 45 min of spell prep o god someone stop this madness anxd just let my special mythic super powers work as intended even though the dev forgot to call out on what page and line the normal rules i get to break were on

This is the first time ive heard of a limt on swift actoins per round maybe it because of comming from SWSE we have allways assumed you could trade move for swift my question is if you cant why do the rules call out not being able to use quicken 2 times in one round

As a dm if a pally burnt a full round and 3 lay on hands instead of taking a full attack i would be more then happy to so him why he should have just killed the monster ive been playing pathfinder for years assuming that you could use 2 or even 3 swifts a round and cant think of a single time it was overpowered or game breaking in any way we even had a eldritch knight who would "unknowingly" use arcane armor training arcane, strike and a full atack then spell critical becase he "didnt know" armor training and spell critical used swifts and it still took us about three sessions to notice how powerful it really was mind you we are a bunch of rules layer munchkins so power builds are common at our table and until we caught on to this player rules "mistakes" were rare.

I think a one or two tier game is a great way to use the mythic rules and hope your players enjoy it. But i dissagree that 3rd tier promotes the 15 min. day Why would a party rest to get powers back when they can just spen a mythic power and keep going yeah casters get more spells, barbs get more rage and pallys get more smites if you cant keep your plyers moving why not give them a mechanical explanation for the recharge of their spellsand abilitys

I would sugest retraining the mythic feat, i think getting the capstone is just too powerfull.

I think the intent was to let characters tht dont have the cha to get greater eldritch heritage take the mythic get the higher effective level

Just my take on it but yes mythic EH is useless to anyone with greater EH

As a DM I have done the opposite having monsters focus a payer using total defence as he was clearly on his last legs and the enemy would want to take him out, the guy next to him got the added benafit of not getting attaced that round and that extra ac saved the players life. Now if a player at full or near full hp used total def for more then a couple rounds the damage from other players would "aggro" the enemys and then he/she would get ignored because for me the monsters dont know what ac is but they can identify the biggest threat on the battle field and work to take it out

I would rule that dex acts as str in all circumstances so 1/2 on off hand full with double slice and I'm not sure how rend works but if its 1.5x str then it would be 1.5x dex.

Just my 2 copper

I sorry if i missed it some where but combat casting and mythic combat casting are musts. I'm dming wotr and one player is a magus he is finding it frustrating because most of the enemies have resistance or immunity to all energy types so make sure you have a way to bypass the electricity immunity.

Our magus is a dervish dancing kensei being the nice gm i am, i let him use finesse on the scimitar at level 1 but other then that he has kept up just fine and he would be adding dex to damage now anyway and has much higher ac then he would with a standard magus

I would say "this action is the type of the spell being cast" one round for one round spells, full round for full round, standard for standard and so on.

Yeah free quicken is way too much I thought it gave you more versatility not made you a super mage at level one.

I haven't played with the rules yet but I would lower the level of spells that can be cast, try one level below the max he can cast the bump it to 2 if it's still too strong. i think there are a lot of good spells level 1-3 that would be getting used for the one point option either way.

just my 2 cents

also are you letting him cast the spell for the swift action a always assumed that the swift action cost was for the ability and the spell still had to be cast as normal but haven't seen an official word

divineshadow wrote:

What is the big six now anyways as all the stat boosters are collapsed into two I'm thinking its

1belt stat booster
2headband stat booster
3 I want to say RoP but if your using magic armor then its useless.
4 BoA same as above
5 cloak of resist
6magic weapon?

Btw does anyone else dislike how RoP has been needed over the years used to be one item that stacked with everything. Now its two and they may or may not stack.

RoP? ring of protection? that would give you a deflection bonus so it stacks with magic armor.

what's a BoA?

The big six are, opinions vary but, belt and/or headband, ring of protection, amulet of natural armor, cloak of resist, armor. with casters having trouble with armor and not needing a weapon the 6 in the big six is kind of vague.

I can't find it but I believe there is something about natural weapons with a (trip/grab/whatever) not provoking.

I think the scope of the magic items available makes it a daunting task to start and with the big 6 in play there isn't really a lot to write about optimization wise. As far as "useful" there really is no way to separate the "useless" out any item can have its time to shine, bang for your gold is fairly well balanced outside of the things the CR system assumes you will have and thus "need".

I like reading about the magic items in the game and really that's about your only hope, I know that's a lot of reading. If you are looking for items that are particularly good for a specific class look for a class guide but as far a general utility most items are on par with anything else available, depending on the situation.

williamoak wrote:

I'd say my biggest issue about the XP system is that it is entirely balanced in a world of "pure combat"; if you decide to do a considerably less murder-y adventure, XP falls appart pretty quickly. If there are benchmarks for non-combat situations, I have yet to find them. XP works decently for the traditional "go in, murder some monsters, go out" type of adventure. I've felt rather undguided when I want to do otherwise.

Plus the bookeeping is just awful. My current GM spends like the last 15 minutes of every game tallying up exp, and it just seems tedious to me.

Social and other non-combat encounters are easy just assign them a CR, I just go with APL-1 and give them the exp and other awards of that level.

I only made it to the ex/cr table and had to comment.

That system is a great way to think of building encounters and I'm disappointed in myself for not thinking of it.

As a GM I just tell my players when the level up based on the story. I like to give them the shiny new abilities right before the next big boss fight so they have the cool new toys to use for the cool important battle.
It's backwards most games have you leveling up after the boss but I've always felt that the extra levels/feats/class features for the boss fight make it fell that much more important.

If you like the mythic tier rules, remember that the players tiers should be about half of the players levels. Use that as a guide line and you should be set.

As a player I have played with XP a lot and I think it really works fine so long as the GM just figures it out on his own time and doesn't wast time at the table with the math.

Thank you so much.

Are there any ways to gain domain abilities on a monk?

If not any advice on gaining healing from negative energy without changing races?

Looking for a way to gain the death domain ability to be healed by neg channel.

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