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ArianDynas's page
Organized Play Member. 85 posts (87 including aliases). No reviews. No lists. 2 wishlists. 1 Organized Play character.
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I am a historian. I love history.
I am also a DM for my group (No, I don't care if Wizards has Dungeon Master trademarked. I'm a DM, and I claim the damn title.)
But the fact of the matter is, I need help getting excited about Golarion again. I had a few bad games, some players who overanalyzed things, picked apart what I did, the setting, and dictated to me how things should and should not happen. It wasn't a pleasant experience. I'm all for player interaction and direction, but rule 0 has gotta be observed.
In the end,one of my complaints with Golarion as a setting; I can never seem to make it "dark" or even all that "dark-agey" it's too high adventure, too renaissance; women are treated equitably, racism is at low usually, even though looking deeper it should be a VERY dark setting, but I can't seem to make it feel like such.
The setting itself is in a dark age; enlightenment; gone, hope, failing. it's called the Age of Lost Omens,the major Christ figure, Aroden, broke his promises and failed to appear when he said he would; His empire on earth collapsed into a literal hell-hole of opression and hatred, countries were swallowed by hurricanes, and others had gaping holes to the abyss ripped into them.
At least one of my players tells me it feels at the level of depth and darkness I want to give it, I enjoy dark because it makes the light stand out all the more.
But the fact of the matter is, I feel am misrepresenting the setting. It feels to nice, too pleasant; not that it needs to become a hell hole, but right now it lacks depth; it feels like I'm glossing over plenty of the stuff that's interesting.
To the synisthetic among you, right now my game feels grey, and pastel-ish; I want what I see in the art style of the books; high contrast, "Savage Sword of Conan" sorts of things.
Perhaps part of it has to do with how I think of it, because in the end, my last group of players helped make me feel this way; They divorced me of the setting so much that I can't help but think of it as being wrapped in cotton batting. I want Golarion to feel *real*. A fantastic world with all the variety and moral depth that can be attained.
I'm rather at the end of my rope. I suppose the majority of it is all based in how I feel about the setting, but I don't really know how to get that back.
Been running Entombed with the Pharaohs for a new group, and it's been a blast; thus far though, I flubbed up and showed my hand too early with Neferet Anu, and while the party doesn't know who she is, they don't trust her, so I came up with a solution where Lonicera has murdered the Mithral Scarab and replaced her, using her clothes and personal effects and such, enhancing effects with make-up and so-on, and using disguise self to alter a few minor facial features (because otherwise it seems they have the same build and general look, judging by the pictures, and anything else about her appearance could be modified by her to match the MS) as well as her skin color, so I am left wondering; what entails "interaction" when it's something superficial and neither tactile or audible, like a color change?
Hmm; I like it, but it feels like it needs a certain... punch to it; My themes I have thus far all do kind of have a consquence, a sort of, well symbolism; or at least that's the way I intend (afiac, good, suspensful Horror needs a little symbolism and subtext to work) What would you call specific symbolism for that? Since it seems rather general with the ruins and such; I suppose what I am asking for is a "period" to drive it home; to communicate The Inevitability Of Fate, I am considering having at least one if not more of the characters doomed to some end that despite their best efforts will claim them in the end (aside from me being a big fan of Planscape Torment, I also appreciate that, to an extent, Horror is about doom and powerlessness, and how one reacts in the face of that. (See Descent))
As anyone who cares enough to look through my post history can see, I'm running Carrion Crown for a group that is half "People who went through HoH" and half "People with no clue" prompting me to re-write the Haunting of Harrowstone as something different and new; I'm using The 1969 version of The Haunting as a basis, and am planning on doing a straight up haunted house with greater focus on haunts and atmosphere than on combat.
Currently, to help my writing processes, I am thinking up the "themes" of Carrion Crown; the idea came to me when I decided to look through my old 2nd Ed Vampire Storyteller's guide for ideas.
The excerpt probably explains it best;
"Have you ever really sat down and wondered what the
difference is between theme and concept? At times, they're
used interchangeably, but that's not really true or helpful at
all. They both embody story ideas, but they work in two very
different ways. When you seek to make effective, impacting
decisions on what the whole framework of what your
chronicle is going to say, think of theme as the central ideal
that you're trying to communicate. By comparison, concept is
the sensory representation - the taste, feel, look, smell and
sound, if you will - of these ideals. Neither theme nor concept
has to be singular. Your chronicle can incorporate a variety of
different themes into one big story line and can use a variety
of sensory pictures to communicate those themes. Using
theme and concept isn't exactly easy, but if you keep these
differences in mind, it becomes a much less arduous task,
because just understanding this gives you strong inferences
on why they work and why they're important. Simply stated,
theme is your message and concept is your look." - Page 69 of the Vampire: The Masquerade Storytellers Handbook, 2nd Edition, Revised.
As things stand, the themes I have are;
The Conquest of the Mind over the Supernatural (The fact that all of my PCs are intellectuals; an Archaeologist with ambitions, a Doctor with flexible morals and an end-justifies-the-means attitude, a School-Teacher turned horiffic monster, struggling with his darker nature, and a Dhampir nobleman, dealing with social politics and inherent darkness in his blood)
The Inevitability of Fate (Pharasma, the Harrow Deck, the fact that most of my PCs are doomed to tragic ends in some form or fashion)
The Warping of Good Intentions Toward Evil (Most, if not all of my PCs in some form or fashion, as well as Caromarc,)
The Inherent Evils of the Supernatural (Vorstag and Grine and the Whispering Way, the Dhampir PC)
So, throw me a few? I'd like to have one major theme for each section of Carrion Crown, if I could.
As the title says; I have need of a monster and I have only a few requirements.
It needs to have some kind of obsession with names, the power of names, true names, etc.
Preferably planar creatures and outsiders are preferred; even Cthulu beings could work as well.
Basically I'm re-writing Carrion Crown's first adventure in the path since I'm running it for a mixed group of "have been through before" and "Never even heard of its" and I'm borrowing the Splatterman as a villain for all this and want an explanation for his "obsession" since I want to throw them for a loop and not have him be the major villain, but instead a pawn.
Heaving read the recent Pathfinder comic book in which most of the party members were forced to drink the Waters of Lamashtu, we see their fears, insecurities and backstories; what would have been yours if you had been stuck in their position too?
Would you mourn if Ezren died in such a way that he could not be raised?
I've seen a few sparks between you; is there something between you and Val?
What is your opinion of the game Skyrim?
How would you feel about meeting a Katapeshi "Loss-Prevention Expert" who is in many respects a spear counterpart to yourself?
What are your thoughts on Seelah? Do you perhaps lust after her like you do with Kyra?
What are your thoughts on the *achem* fan picture of Kyra spanking you while you're both in the nude?
What are the phobias of the other Iconics?
If you had to give a "feel" to the Pathfinder society (like say "Indiana Jones Incorporated", or "The Masons as Archaeologists") what would you call them?
What would be your reaction upon meeting a shy paladin?
Oh I'm not wondering if I should allow it; if we play Council of Theives I'd be sidling out of the DM's seat for this one and letting someone else take over.
I'm just finding out this info on behalf of a friend who has a thing for aquatic races, and I figured being Low Azlanti, the Gillmen would have some kind of vogue in Cheliax, due to the relation.
Tacticslion wrote: Check out the Inner Sea World Guide, but, frankly, I'd suspect that Gillmen would likely not be fully accepted in the humanocentric Chelish society - they'd likely be looked down upon as a "lesser race", a kind of degenerate form of human, like Morlocks or Tieflings.
Gillmen societies are variable, from what I understand, but at least one near Absolom worships "strange" gods - really just broken, strange statues, that seem to be about mysterious deep-sea entities, if I recall correctly.
I'm sorry I can't help more, now, but I'll look into it, if I recall to do so, and laziness/procrastination doesn't set in.
EDIT: Ah, I see the entry now, and you might not get too much more than that in the Inner Sea World Guide, but I can't recall for sure. I still recommend looking at it. :)
Yeah, I wouldn't have expected them to be accepted either. I knew about the Tieflings; I suppose a better way of asking the question would have been; is there any baggage with them being Azlanti?
Thanks in advance for the promised info; I did look in the ISWG and didn't find much more, unfortunately.
Planning on joining in a game of this that a friend will be running, and I am wondering how one could incorporate a gillman character; how would Chelish society accept them? Would they? What is Gillman society like? Do they pretend to be Azlanti and trade on the name like some Cheliaxans do? Can I get some more definite info on Gillman society on Golarion than what I found in the Pathfinder Wiki?
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mechaPoet wrote: ArianDynas wrote: Yes, teenaged adventurers. We're going to have an interesting time convincing people to hire us. You should get a caravan and paint it nice colors, and call it something like the "Enigma Contraption" or the "Puzzle Carriage," so you can pass yourselves off as a traveling consulting and investigation firm. Get an awakened great dane to be your tracker, maybe eventually getting him levels in Sleepless Detective. ...
You are a sick, sick human being.
Besides; we've only got an arrogant, jumped-up prick Lore oracle, who likes to dabble in arcane magic and foretells through carvings, a tenacious albino Kobold barbarian smith, and a half-orc girl, who is attempting to become a monk.
We'd need a ditzy red-headed ranger, a pudgy dwarven-girl wizard,an unobservant cavalier with an ascot, a rogue with an appetite, and depending on which version you watch, a younger awakened Great Dane with levels in barbarian.
And I'm sure between us we've given some sick, twisted individual out there far too many ideas; it's Captain Andoran all over again.
Well... you could always specialize in whip. ;)
lemeres wrote: Since you also have a strong anti-authority plot point, you might try to act to keep the power of the region's nobility in check. Even if they gain power for legitimate reasons, it would leave headway for these types of abuses. This might seem chaotic, but in a political definition, you would be left wing, attempting to support laws restraining misconduct.
The fact that you seek out such abusers and spectacularly undo them might just be frosting on the cake. Maybe support greater educational opportunities or social mobility and the like so you do not just turn into a vigilante.
That strikes me as a bit selfless for Lawful Neutral; Lawful Good is the crusader-type, the one who could pull off a, well Batman-esque worldveiw like that.
I would personally figure Neutral would be a bit more... well selfish.
Blueluck wrote: ArianDynas wrote: Thus far, I've played this guy not so much as respectful of the law per-se, or at least, not respectful of the local ones, but more of the sort who believes the universe has an order to it, and that "what goes around, comes around." paying back equal vengeance for slights against him.
So I suppose what I am asking is; is this still lawful neutral?
This game sounds like it will be fun:)
There are different ways to look at the meaning of alignment, and "how one believes the universe works" is a valid one. However, the most important part of roleplaying an alignment is how it effects your character's actions. In this case, I could totally see your character behaving as an "agent of karma". If he has a strong belief in cosmic justice, a need to set the scales right, an "eye for an eye" mentality, he could be quite an interesting character.
As a GM, I'd tell you that if you want to play Lawful Neutral without obeying the laws of the land, you have to decide what law you do obey, and write it down. (even if it's just a single sentence)
Thus far I know that he's a refugee, and he was born on the boat, since the family was powerful there, and had the patronage of nobles, it's always been described to him as heavenly, so he respects the laws of that country, but yeah, thus far I do seem to be tending toward the "equalizer" bit on it.
That and, well, he does have a good deal of revenge on his mind; wanted criminal or not, that noble still needs to pay; at some point I fully intend on returning to that slave camp they held us in and burning it to the ground, as well as paying back each guard who handed out a beating in a very personal manner.
Either way, the DM is greatly enjoying watching me trying to play against type.
Matthew Downie wrote: Vengeance isn't inherently good or evil, so that's OK for the 'neutral' bit.
Lawful means you try to follow a set of rules strictly rather than acting upon instinct and emotion. So you should work out a consistent set of rules to govern your actions, and then try to stick with them even if it's not a good idea. Aiming for EXACTLY equal vengeance would be one way of doing this - trying to cut off the noble's hands rather than murder him, for example.
Well the logic being, my father is a woodcarver who can no longer provide for his family, nor do what he loves; he breathes, but the noble took his life from him. In fact, since he basically destroyed the one truly significant source of income that supported the family in exile, he killed my entire family.
I merely chose to return the favor.
That and of course, I forgot the caveat; we're probably the youngest adventuring party you've ever seen; sure the players are college age or older, and those of us who aren't old farts in age remain ancient in treachery and wickedness.
Our characters? The oldest PC is Harkin, my guy, at age 16. He became an attempted murderer and slave at 15.
Yes, teenaged adventurers. We're going to have an interesting time convincing people to hire us.
Ok, let me start off by saying; I am actually rather good at this; I've played all sorts of alignments as DM, when I do characters, I like being Lawful Good, I've done Neutral Good, Chaotic Good, I can even go to the other camp sometimes and be Lawful Evil, though I usually stick with good, since, well, wanting to help people and alleivate suffering is my natural inclination.
I know at least a few of the ways Lawful Neutral can be played; the soldier who always follows orders; the magistrate who cares not for mercy, merely that the law be done, even the arrogant; "I am the master, you are my servant, and thus beneath me, and not worth my consideration, sub-human" noble, who sees people as tools.
But, well, I'm stuck playing against type in an off-the cuff campaign that I'm in.
Perhaps this needs explanation; this weekend, some of my friends and I were sitting around our table, bored; we wouldn't be able to play the game I usually run; two of our players were missing. So after a rousing game of magic, one made a comment about a campaign he wanted to see at some point; everyone starts off as a level 0 commoner, sold into slavery at a young age, and must get out, the other party members determining your class.
Just for spits and giggles, I decided I would do my character for this completely randomly, alignment and all; I got a guy who was the son of a famous wood-carver, a refugee, born on a boat leaving the homeland, strongly religious, who had been trained in languages to become perhaps an interpreter, had a couple of run-ins with the arcane in his youth, as well as the divine, and then attempted to murder a noble who had cut his father's hands off as punishment for a perceived slight.
He's arrested, sold into slavery, and then gets stuck in with the other two party members, an albino kobold and a reedy half-orc girl. We eventually do manage to get out, and I get my class selected as Oracle of the goddess of magic, madness, prophecies, lore, illusions and secrets. (perhaps I'll go for Mystic Theurge at some point.)
Thus far, I've played this guy not so much as respectful of the law per-se, or at least, not respectful of the local ones, but more of the sort who believes the universe has an order to it, and that "what goes around, comes around." paying back equal vengeance for slights against him.
So I suppose what I am asking is; is this still lawful neutral?
I'm currently helping a friend out with a character he's trying to define the backstory of, but, this friend being himself, which is to say, a bit strange, chose to make himself a Kitsune Monk named Asheron who was either; raised among humans, knowing full well what he is, and looking like a fox-man the whole time, or is some mischievous spirit who ran away from home, tricked some humans into adopting him, and discovered he's actually really very fond of humans. We're currently in the Golarion setting, sitting quite pretty in Varisia in fact; and we're left wondering; what is the societal position of Kitsune in Tien?
I looked in the Dragon Empires Gazetteer; minimal info.
I looked in the Advanced Races Guide; minimal info.
I used the Wiki, both of them; minimal info.
I checked the PFSRD; minimal info.
From what I can gather, Kitsune are, I THINK, descendants of the original inhabitants that were there before the Tien peoples arrived. And if I am reading this right, they're something like spirits, similar to actual Japanese tradition, so, sort of native outsiders along the lines of Aasimar or Oni Ogre Magi? Spirits who clad themselves in flesh?
Do they hide their true shapes in all societies? Meaning that anyone you meet on the street could be a Kitsune? Or are they accepted in some places as just being "there"?
Basically what we are trying to determine is; is this character merely another of the many wild and wacky species of Golarion, who could be merely picked up by a farmer and adopted? Or are the Kitsune still trickster-Kami, who just happen to reside in the Prime Material plane and futz about with mortals for their human-esque lifespans?
Yeah... if you're planning on going Karamazov, sorry, prepare to fall; If that is what you are going for, then know you are really going to be skirting very VERY close to the line of "fallen paladin" because, well, in a phrase; "When it comes down to a choice between law and good, the proper paladin will choose good" Karamazov is... well in a word inflexible, so you might want to temper that with a bit of mercy.
But as for holy warrior weapons; a two handed sword will let you dish out alot of damage, but assuming you're using the Golarion setting, the foremost Paladin goddess, Iomedae, usually prefers the longsword, seeing as it his her holy weapon, and there can be certain feats and benefits derived from such, like Iomedaean Sword-Oath.
I would personally advise that you use the alternative racial traits (Soul Seer would be a very paladin appropriate replacement for Fiendish Sorcery and Shatter as a spell-like ability) also appropriate would be Fiendish Sprinter, in place of Skilled, or Prehensile Tail.
Ancestral Scorn, Fiend Sight and Wicked Valor would also benefit you, as far as feats go.
If you need more text info, the PFSRD will have everything you need, just look it up on google.
Darkorin wrote: The real question is to try to understand why do they think it is dangerous, and then explain why it is not.
It's not a problem for christians in other countries, why is it in the USA?
Because someone told them it was? Well just explain them that the ones who explained that game to them, did not know/read it and did not even try to understand it.
Then ask them about movies and actors. Is an actor going to hell because he was an evil character in X movie? No, well it's the same with D&D(if you play evil characters).
Is playing a Paladin who lives his live for his god, to help innocent and protect them from evil creatures, something that would compromise your faith? No.
Honestly... I just can't understand all of this, but I'm not from the USA, so...
Alot of people can't understand the USA.
Including me, and I live in it.
My Varisian wizard; Cyril "Silks" Lyric, some pretty good stats... and an 8.
I had been screwing around with my Hero Builder's Guidebook from 3.5, just rolling on some tables for backstory as I was making up the stats, and got the "Childhood Illness" result on "influential childhood events." I looked at that 8 and figured to myself; "Why not?" and stuck it slap dab in to Constitution.
I decided from then on in, he had a hacking cough, resulting from damage to his heart and lungs, ala Rastlin Majare, leaving him obsessed with curing a disease that is no longer there, and things have been growing from there.
And funnily enough? I'm the party "face" so I'm the one they stick in the lead. The sickly pretty guy. Needless to say; as the highest charisma in the party, and having a constitution easily knocked down by a swift breeze, fighting Lustspawn is fuuuun... -.-
Aside from the fact that every time I see "Pathfinder" on the back of a car, I think of my hobby, in a manner of speaking we ARE playing Pathfinder 2nd Edition.
Pathfinder 1st Edition still used 3.5 rules, and started with Rise of the Runelords.
Ended up doing some plotting for my own game, and decided to share it with the community!
I needed a "hunter" type of undead, that wouldn't be too powerful for a 2nd level character, and would be a bit more loyal to its master than say, a ghoul would.
Let me know how I've done, folks, it should be about CR 4, making it a very hard fight for 2nd level;
Guevadon
This black-furred canid appears to be an impossible size, far too large to be natural, a pair of decaying bat wings sprouting from its back. Despite its clearly decaying body, its hide matted with blood and rot, its eye-sockets gleam with a wicked cunning, matching the bleached bones of its ribcage, protruding into visibility.
GUEVADON CR 4
XP 3
LE Large undead
Init +3; Senses darkvision 60 ft., scent; Perception +8
DEFENSE
AC 13, touch 13, flat-footed 10 (+3 Dex)
hp 48 (4d8+22)
Fort +3, Ref +4, Will +3
DR 2/armor; Immune undead traits
OFFENSE
Spd 60 ft.; fly 30 ft. (clumsy)
Melee bite +7 (4d6+3 plus trip), slam +7 (1d6+3), 2 claws +7 (1d8+4)
Special Attacks quick strikes
Space 10 ft.; Reach 5 ft.
STATISTICS
Str 17, Dex 17, Con —, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 16
Base Atk +4; CMB +9; CMD 22 (27 vs. trip)
Feats ToughnessB; Skill Focus (Perception)
Skills Perception +8, Stealth +6, Survival +1 (+5 scent tracking); Racial Modifiers +4 Survival when tracking by scent
Special Qualities quick strikes, fast healing 4
SPECIAL ABILITIES
Quick Strikes (Ex)
Whenever a Guevadon takes a full-attack action, it can make one additional slam attack at its highest base attack bonus.
Collect Target (Ex)
Whenever a Guevadon takes a full-attack action against a foe it has grappled, it can attempt to rip its heart out and collect it. The Guevadon must make two successful bite or slam attacks action (its claws being busy with the issue of opening its own chest to receive the collected heart) against the same target with its full attack, and the victim must make a successful DC 12 Fortitude or Reflex save, or it is killed instantly, its heart torn from its chest.
Corpse Call (Su)
Guevadon cannot speak, but their strange calls and howls captivate the minds of their targets. Once per day, a guevadon may call out, and if their designated target is within a 100-foot spread he must succeed at a DC 16 Will save or move toward the guevadon using the most direct means possible. If this path leads them into a dangerous area such as through fire or off a cliff, the creatures receive a second saving throw to end the effect before moving into peril. Captivated creatures can take no actions other than to defend themselves. A victim within 5 feet of the guevadon simply stands and offers no resistance to the guevadon’s attacks, presenting his neck to it. This effect continues for as long as the guevadon continues its call as a standard action each round. This is a sonic mind-affecting charm effect, and has no effect on deaf creatures. The save DC is Charisma-based.
Deathless (Su)
A guevadon is destroyed when reduced to 0 hit points, but it returns to unlife 1 hour later at 1 hit point, allowing its fast healing thereafter to resume healing it. A guevadon can be permanently destroyed if it is destroyed by positive energy, if it is reduced to 0 hit points in the area of a bless or hallow spell, or if its remains are sprinkled with a vial of holy water.
Resurrection Vulnerability (Su)
A raise dead or similar spell cast on a guevadon destroys it (Will negates). Using the spell in this way does not require a material component.
Positive Energy Vulnerability (Ex)
A guevadon has a vulnerability to the energies of the positive plane causing it to take double damage from positive energy unless a successful save allows it to take half damage. On a successful save it takes half damage, and on a failed save it takes double damage.
ECOLOGY
Environment any
Organization solitary, pair, or hunting party (3–4)
Treasure none
Designed as personal bounty hunters by a particularly vindictive necromancer, who had clearly been the type to pull the wings off of flies as a child, the Guevadon is a relentless killing machine. Guevadon do not rise naturally, when one is encountered, it has a clear purpose from the moment of its creation, a single target it must hunt down and kill, bringing either its head or heart to its master.
Once a guevadon has found its target and extracted its grisly trophy, it pulls open its own spiked ribcage and places it within for safe transit back to its creator, and takes flight with its horrifically grafted wings.
Despite its decaying and zombified appearance, do not mistake the guevadon for a simple mindless undead! While lacking in higher intelligence, the guevadon retains all the animal cunning its body possessed in life, as well as its ability to track via scent, its senses now sharpened by the perverse magics of the grave.
Indefatigable, and tracking on a twisted mixture of magical essence, and physical scent, no quarry can escape a guevadon for long, its ability for flight allowing it to track its quarry over any terrain, a guevadon will not rest until its target lies dead and safe within its belly, at which point it returns to its creator, and collapses into a pile of rotting flesh.
Guevadon Construction
The intact body of a prodigiously large wolf, and the wings of a dire bat are required, the wings must be grafted into the back muscles of the wolf; beyond this point, the condition of the carcass is unimportant. Following that, special unguents and bindings worth 500 gp are also required, as is a focus component of some type, such as a lock of hair, or a personal possession of the intended target; a minimum of one day must be spent chanting necromantic spells over the body as they are applied. Incorporated into the chant must be a specific target’s name, and a set of instructions that the guevadon will follow to either destruction, or success.
CL 6th; Price 700 gp
CONSTRUCTION REQUIREMENTS
Animate dead, regeneration, geas/quest, creator must be caster level 6th; creator must be evil (any); Skill Craft (leather) or Heal DC 13; Cost 100 gp
Oh and if someone can think of a better name than "Guevadon" I'd appreciate it, to coin it I ended up bastardizing the name of a French town haunted by a famous man-eating wolf.
(Note: To head the questions off at the pass, we use the "armor as damage resistance" 3.5 manuverability rules, and a simplified XP system. So both of those are intentional.)
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The worst part of this?
My players have been slowly turning themselves into the Avengers.
We've got a mad gnome, making extensive use of a pair of slippers of spider climb.
A half-elf considering the arcane archer prestige class,
and Hagmar. Dear Hagmar, a cohort I just threw out of nowhere when the guys invaded a mine full of slaves, wanted to find a blacksmith to help establish their own shop. I gave them a man who had made himself a suit of armor when the guards weren't looking, gave him a family hammer, carved in granite, one that, following the legacy progression I gave it when the player currently in command of Hagmar came in, will return to his hand and cause claps of thunder when struck.
And now said player wants to throw his shield at m&%%#!!%&$@+s.
What have I done?
I love Torment, one of the premiere games of the ages.
Maruts are also an EXCELLENT idea. >=D
As for other people, well, this character is a paladin. So I was figuring that those who had their names partially ripped are stuck in a sort of spiritual limbo, like a kind of stagnation, unable to heal, grow, ect. Have the poor bastard feel guilty about that. *evil laughter*
And I'm liking the reincarnation idea. Alot. Good thing this player hasn't even HEARD of Planescape: Torment before gaming with me. I'm wondering if it's entirely appropriate to the feeling I'm trying to give this though. Probably just go with the Planescape thing, in that he loses his memory (or perhaps just parts) when he dies, and another takes his place.
And since everyone in the party already calls this guy by his nickname, stealing his name might be an excellent idea.
Currently what I am thinking is this; He comes back from death with no issue, depending on what killed him there may be permanent stat drains to like Constitution or Charisma, reflecting scars and such. He can regenerate (veeeeery slowly, he heals injuries in half the time others do.) which does not affect combat, so it's not fast healing.
He has lost his name; meaning that he has a first name, and a last name, he knows that he has them, but no matter what he tries, he cannot say them, write them down, any time he tries to bring them to mind, they remain frustratingly elusive. Seeing as his name is Darial Silvereye, he can bring to mind every component of them, he can think of silver, and realize it's part of his name, he can think of eyes, and realize they're part too, but once he tries to string them together... nada.
Whenever he dies, someone else dies an untimely death in his stead. 7 people across the world, who had their names surrounding his in the great register, are cursed, their names partially obliterated from his being cut out, causing each one of them to be stuck in a sort of metaphysical limbo, unable to grow, change, die or anything of that nature.
When they find out about him, the Inevitables are going to want to beat him into a paste with Maruts.
I've got a character that is... in an interesting position, to say the least.
I asked one of my players to expand on the backstory of his character.
And boy did he.
The basic gist is that he ended up having an encounter where he befriended the Tien god Sun Wukong, Monkey god of Tricksters. His character had no idea who his new friend was, of course.
For those of you not in the know, Sun Wukong had been a minor spirit whom had snuck into Pharasma's Boneyard and erased his name from her records.
Here for some reason,Sun found himself in the Inner Sea Region, and is unable to return home for reasons he doesn't understand. He believes it's Pharasma's retribution for giving himself immortality (by erasing his name)
Sun leaves, visits the Boneyard again, and tears out the section with the player character's name on it, leaving a note taunting the goddess.
"I am borrowing this mortal.
I will return him when I get home.
Until then, you can just wait."
- A Being Smarter Than You
The player's idea is that his PC is effectively immortal, meaning that when reduced to his negative constitution score, he remains partly alive, and can recover if healing magic is applied to him. This being why the wizard the party had found him in the dungeons of, had kept him, believing him to be a key to immortality. I feel like that's a bit much, but I'm still trying to figure out what the effect of having your name ripped out of the book, but not erased would be.
The players I have are fairly responsible, but I'm not looking to overblow the whole thing here too much.
I'm wondering about detriments. Yeah there is the whole "You have no fate" thing, but as for the rest, this seems like something ripe for some curse-like side effects, especially for the people who had their names half-ripped out when his was pulled from the book. Something like this shouldn't be entirely just randomly beneficial.
Thoughts?
...
If it's too mundane, predictable and overdone, then why play a paladin?
That's what a paladin IS, a man defined by his ideals, one not willing to compromise them and take the easy path, someone who is willing to fight for others and be selfless.
That's what the code is there for, it's a representation of that willingness, it's not a binding contract, it's a lifestyle choice they choose to abide by.
What makes it fresh and interesting is the individual character, and how they BECOME one of these people.
Take my paladin; He's a Wiscrani, son of a minor noble from the House of Thrune and her former revolutionary husband, a wine merchant who abandoned his ethics for an easy life. They were fond of travel, feeling it made them cosmopolitan, but in turn this caused their son to develop some funny ideas about the lower classes and how they should be treated. He's nyctophobic, due to having been out on the streets after curfew and watching the Shadowbeasts shred a childhood friend.
He's not fond of fighting, due to a stint in the Chelish army where he was assigned to battlefield medic. He attempted to save an Andoren soldier who was apparently gravely injured, only to be stabbed in the gut, by the same soldier, relegating Matthias to the rear.
He returned home to the simmering disappointment of his parents, whom did accept his considerable skill as a surgeon, and sent him off to an acquaintance of theirs, a noted doctor, whom, in addition to his other talents, proved to be a powerful necromancer.
The shy paladin-to-be did his master's b~%++-work for a number of years, until in the end, he got sick of all the cruelty he witnessed at his master's hand, fled that night, stealing a stack of scrolls, including his master's personalized formula for lichdom, and has spent the last year, wandering from place to place, trying to keep ahead of his former master, in an attempt to avoid bystanders being hurt.
On his way through Lastwall, he met a group of the knights of Ozem, whom he studied with, accepting Iomedae as his new patron, and learning the specifics of being a paladin.
He's being hunted by a succubus who wants to corrupt him, a necromancer who wants to tear him limb from limb, and yet all he really wants is to make sure no one else gets hurt.
I work by the exact same code I laid down, but would you call that predictable, overdone and mundane?
The code and the class are the groundwork, they are something to BE, what a character IS comes down to how they tackle being a paladin.
Your Co-GM would tire of it? Whyfor?
It's the lawful stupid who ruin things for everyone else.
Hence why personally, whenever someone at my table wants to play a paladin, I always insist they write up a code they can believably live by.
Here's mine;
Never betray the trust of another; your word is your bond.
A paladin is a man of honor. He conducts himself with honor in all his dealings, and acts with truth in all his choices.
Never knowingly speak falsehood; never misrepresent yourself in an attempt at self-enrichment.
Never take advantage of the kind or charitable nature of others. All debts owed, must be repaid in kind.
No man falls by any one action. Remember always that you are not perfect, nor will you ever be, you shall make mistakes, how you overcome them is what matters.
Grant mercy to those who ask it. Grant succor to those in need of it. Grant compassion to those who require it.
Soothe every iota of suffering that you can. Never allow another to suffer in your place. Never allow another to die in your stead.
Do not think to beggar yourself to improve the world. Live only to your needs, and not beyond or below them. A surgeon cannot cure a disease without his tools, nor can you.
Do not shirk from danger, but do not seek battle.
Unsheathe your sword only in defense; when steel is drawn, it drawn to stand between innocence and evil. You do not fight for king or country. You do not fight for Gods or prestige. You do not fight for honor or glory. You do not fight for yourself. You fight for others. You fight only to soothe suffering by curing the source.
Respect those you do not fight for. A king is ruler of his own land. A God is ruler of his own domain. Their laws are your laws.
A law that causes undue suffering is no law; do not submit to those who create such mockeries.
You are a man of ideals, not of churches or kingdoms. Ideals are your gods.
A paladin is a man of convictions, but he respects others. Do not confuse your zeal with nobility.
Do not endure those who have no respect for what you are. Accept that there are many paths, but that you are not required to walk them; provide others with an ideal to aspire to.
Love those you serve. Remember that you are one of them, and your loyalties lie to those you protect above any code.
In other words; Never betray someone's trust, never make or break a vow lightly, conduct yourself with honor and respect for others, never knowingly lie, or misrepresent yourself for your own benefit, though, realize that you are not required to answer questions completely, or correct false assumptions. Never besmirch another's reputation, never take advantage of someone's kindness, repay everything you owe, and repay every insult in kind, accept that you are imperfect, but that that is no reason not to try. Grant mercy asked of you, help others in need, be charitable and kind, as well as compassionate.
Be self-sacrificing, do not beggar yourself, temper charity and everything else with common sense, take everything in moderation,
Be courageous, but not foolhardy or arrogant, though do not be timid either. Don't go looking for fights, they'll find you, more than like,
Fight to protect others, rather than to enrich yourself, though, conversely, don't turn down a useful tool. You slay dragons and keep the magic sword because it can help you do more good, not because you're greedy (ideally)
Respect the law of the land, and the laws of your chosen god, laws that are designed to cause suffering are not laws you need respect, and you have no loyalty to the people who make them.
You have no obligation to those who do not respect you, or decry your paladinhood, accept that there are differing opinions, but that you are not required to agree. Provide a noble ideal to inspire others.
And the most important clause, these are more guidelines than actual rules /Barbossa
Don't surrender your humanity (or Dwarfanity, Elvanity, whatever)there's no reason to be aloof or an inhuman machine. (Unless of course you are an inhuman machine. I'm looking at you Warforged Paladin.)
A good paladin code, tempered by common sense (A paladin IS still meant to be a canny and intelligent warrior, as well as a noble knight after all)eliminates the people who play "Lawful Stupid" by accident, or the ones that don't know any better, since in this case, being Lawful stupid is actually against the code.
Anyone who still cleaves to lawful stupid? Well, they'd probably play an a**$*!% no matter what class they picked.
Anyone who does start to veer off their code? Simple, give 'em fatigued for the day as a representation of poor sleep from a guilty mind.
Ok, I've done a good bit of study on the enigmatic figure of the Chelish Druid Osprey, member of the Pathfinder society.
And, with him being the venture-captain my pathfinders report to, I am left wondering how my characterization of him is, from the little information provided.
Currently, as he stands, Osprey in my campaign is a good hearted, but manipulative man, who occasionally manipulates the players, feeding them limited, or sometimes even outright false information, in an attempt to avoid endangering them, or showing his hand to corrupt aspects in the society he is attempting to weed out.
He rubs up against Ambrus Valasin, who, being Valasin is loyal to the Decemvirate to a fault, even to the point of glossing over corruption and internecine rivalries in the name of "good competition".
Osprey prefers to manipulate, and work outside the system, even recruiting my party as a group of unassociated agents, leading them to believe they are pathfinders, in an effort to keep them off the rolls, so that the corrupt elements are not apprised of their existence.
A few choice quotes from my interpretation of Osprey;
“Ambrus is loyal to a fault. That’s a very good trait in retainers and dogs. Not so good in Venture-Captains. He might not trust anyone but the Decemvirate as far as he can shotput them, but he lets the corruption thrive, festering like a wound. He thinks it makes him more like the ten, allowing infighting to thrive in the name of spirited competition.”
-Venture-Captain Osprey, on the subject of Ambrus Valasin
“He’d sooner bury any evidence than bother the Decemvirate with trivialities. He hears more than a hundred rumors daily about people plotting to rob the society, slaughter us all, bring the society crumbling around us, every man woman and child in Absalom brought to their knees, blah blah blah. Usually it’s all a spectacular load of tosh. It’s just the name of the rumormonger that changes each time.” – Venture Captain Osprey, when asked why Ambrus Valasin is unwilling to take action against the corrupt elements of the society.
-Venture-Captain Osprey, on the subject of Ambrus Valasin
“They don’t do anything about it precisely because they can’t. Responding to the rumors would make the society look weak and unsure of ourselves, like we’re wide open to attack from our enemies. Starting an inquisition would be political suicide, the Society would tear itself apart in sheer outrage alone, not forgetting that we, quite simply do not have the resources to do so, resources we have to dedicate to defending ourselves from other enemies, enemies without.” – Venture Captain Osprey of the Pathfinder Society, Grand Lodge Faction
“In all honesty, that’s part of why I wanted to keep you unofficial. There was danger in letting you trade on the Pathfinder name without true registry, but it would have been simple to disavow knowledge of you, had you failed.” – Venture Captain Osprey of the Pathfinder Society, Grand Lodge Faction
"Osprey! What in the name of the ten have you been up to!? I’ve heard you’ve been harboring fugitives, we’ve got Hellknights beating a path to our door and right now you’re at the top of my list of “People most likely to be the cause of this brouhaha”!
I-well well well well. What have we here? Osprey, do you mind explaining yourself? Out of earshot?
(Osprey nods and steps out with Valsin, the PCs hear muffled shouting from both that grows fainter over time. Osprey and Valsin step back in about 20 minutes later.)
Osprey has made an interesting case for himself. He claims that you’re a group of rookies he sent to his homeland as a part of a “test” he assigned.
I believe he’s lying to my face. The masters of the Sword, Scroll and Lore don’t report having certified anyone of your descriptions to me. And I hear every certification they give in the Grand Lodge, though he claims you all to have been capable enough to attempt to earn yourselves a set of field commissions and that he wanted to give you a head start on impressing the Decemvirate. Pfah!
But, he is right on one count. You managed to tweak the Cheliaxan’s collective noses and lived to talk about it. Politically dangerous you might be, useful, you might be also. It takes a great deal of skill to do that.
In that spirit, I formally invite you to join the Pathfinder Society.”
-Venture-Captain Ambrus Valasin of the Pathfinder Society, Grand Lodge Faction
A penny for your thoughts?
Alrighty then, well, I am currently running a game where one of the players has discovered (I made sure to get his permisson first, of course) that he is a "clone" of the wizard they are currently in the process of robbing, who had been his former master before they went turncoat.
The player is currently playing a summoner.
The whole situation is this; 16 level wizard establishes a tower over a lost, Jistka Imperium outpost in Southern Cheliax. He and a friend end up exploring the ruins when they are both young adventurers, and the friend is killed in the process, destroyed so utterly by something that even his soul is shattered, though the wizard clears out the ruins and builds his tower above.
Years later he discovers a scroll that he recovered from the ruins and promptly forgot about for a number of years, one written in Thassilonian, and covered in annotations written in Jistka.
This scroll describes for him a ritual, one quite similar to the creation of a Haemonculus, equal parts water and blood, along with spell components are mixed with clay and shaped into a form the creator desires, creating a blank body their soul can inhabit.
Something went wrong with the ritual, a cast off fragment of the soul of the dead friend inhabited the body, rather than the wizard being able to do so himself. The wizard, being fascinated by this turn of events, figured the problem lay in the ritual itself and chose to observe this clone to see what similarities it bore to him. Other than that the soul is something else entirely.
Due to the blood and everything else sunk into the construct, it does bear both sympathy and similarities to the wizard (who fashioned it to look like himself at about age 20.)
And, then the idea occurred to me that his Eidolon, being what it is, with the connection that it shares to him is, in a fashion his "soul" personified in an outsider form.
I've determined certain things about this whole template I am planning on applying to the player. Current things I have decided;
His Eidolon's subtype is changed to native outsider. It is able to stay on the prime material plane as long as it wishes, and is only unsummoned when the player wishes it, vanishing into the Ethereal plane, "orbiting" the character, for lack of a better description, basically becoming like a ghost, incapable of interacting with the prime material plane, but left unable to be touched by it in return. When unsummoned it enters a sort of "suspended animation" where it stays until resummoned. It does not heal while in the Ethereal plane.
Accordingly, if either the summoner OR the eidolon are killed, the other drops dead. The summon dies? So does he. The summoner dies? The Eidolon drops dead as well. Resurrecting one ressurects the other.
He's sterile, and cannot sire children,
He's Sympathetic to his master, intense feelings are shared between them, and while within 100 feet of one another, buff effects cast on one affect the other as well. The caster may also give orders to him if within physical hearing distance, with a succuessful will save negating this.
He's immune to level drain and effects that involve trapping the soul and things like that (unless his eidolon is targeted, rather than him, in which event he's effected as normal.)
He's ageless, meaning he does not lose strength, dexterity and constitution as he ages, and his appearance cannot age or change.
And he has low light vision.
Yes, this whole thing WAS rather heavily inspired by Alias from Curse of the Azure Bonds. That and Safiya from Neverwinter Nights 2: Mask of the Betrayer
I'm currently wondering however, what should I do with the template? We both want to stress his... constructness, his Promethean qualities, the fact that he appears human, but very much lacks certain things about humanity, things that before the character took for granted, but will now wonder about when he learns of all this.
So, what does the community think? How would you work a template for this? For now, lacking a better name, I'm calling this template a "Pygmalion"
I find the sheer variety and extreme opinions on this subject highly amusing.
Galt IS France, revolutionary France, under Robespierre, Andoran is an idealized mixture of France, in the sense of the ideal of what the revolution was attempting to achive, and Colonial America, post Revolution.
As I see it, many of the cultures on Golarion have their unique flavor, courtesy of the mashup of MANY things, like the Carrion Crown Adventure path, as a for instance, which I explain to players as "Dracula meets Frankenstein meets Shadow Over Innsmouth."
Let's see...
Cheliax NOW is essentially Soviet Russia meats East Germany, meets Nazi Germany.
To answer the question of germanic peoples, I'd sa, perhaps Molthune? Any number of locations where the Taldans met with slavic like peoples, since Germanic tribes arose of slavic peoples being conquered by the Romans.
Cheliax as it was established is both very English (at the height of their imperialism, something they share very strongly with Taldor, which, from what I can tell is a mashup of Imperial France with Imperial England. And well, Taldane is the source of the Common language.) and very Italian, at least in temperament, if nothing else, and most certainly in design (though Egorian architecture shows strong Germanic influence as well.)
So in short, it seems we're left with a high unholy clusterf*&~ of different cultures here. Is there a Tolkein Scholar and or linguist in the house?
As for your list Icyshadow, I'd argue that the Garundi being what they are, their accent would be Moorish, so a subtle mixture of Spanish and north african, with a smattering of Arabic.
I'd personally argue that Chelish accents would likely be a mashup of Irish, Welsh, Latin, Italian, and English, so basically, what England would be, if it were part of the continent, rather than the only dirt it shares with France being that found in the Chunnel.
At least, that's what I think now that I've read it.
I'm currently working on a Cheliaxan character, and am left pondering, what would a Chelish Accent sound like?
Vaguely Irish? Due to their association with both Taldan and Ulfen peoples?
English? Or would that be Taldan? A kind of snooty uppercrust thing?
Suggestions? Thoughts?
James Jacobs wrote: AND: To get back to the original thread title... there's some stuff in the works we haven't announced yet that will give you more information about succubi in Golarion. It's a while away still... but stay tuned! Well then, in the spirit of that, I think I'll stick to using the great Wheel and the Blood War, since, well, I just love Planescape so damn much, and the Blood War is just plane (heh) awesome, Sigil is a fantastic location and the classic D&D meshes pretty well, I think; especially since things like Spelljammer and the like would be a great excuse to explore the Dark Tapestry.
Example; I have a book that is holy to Nethys in my campaign, the players think it's really a "book of ultimate knowledge" when in reality, there's a limit, it's a recreation of a library Nethys studied at to discover his method of achieving omniscience, when he did a bit of planetrotting.
What was this library? The Final Library of Vecna, the last surviving example of which, is the Shadowed Room.
The fact that Beholders, Mind Flayers, The Great Wheel, and so many other fantastic things are closed off to Paizo and yet still in the hands of WoTC saddens me to no end.
If Wizards does decide to sell the D&D licence if (when) D&D Next fails,I would be eager to see Paizo pick it up.
As for my succubus problem, well, since Devils and Demons still hate each other, I think I'll be using the flavor about Succubi celebrating their birth with a masquerade, and this particular succubus chose to tweak the nose of a particular devil as a birthday present, hence, she goes to Cheliax and grabs a young boy this devil is eyeing.
Neo2151 wrote: Succubi as Demons instead of Devils has never, ever made sense. It was one of the stupidest changes I can remember in my gaming history. Three words;
Chaotic Evil Paladins.
You were saying?
Cut out the Blood War? Heresy.
In that event, I'm sure if you'll forgive me :D and my group for houseruling AD&D cosmology in and making the succubi swing both ways (see what I did there? ~.^)
This right here is the heart and soul of the alignment argument.
So, in situations like this, I merely apply the maxim of Albert Schweitzer;
"Good is that which promotes life. Evil is that which destroys it."
In a world where objective good and evil exist, this is a pretty good maxim to use, and a fairly simple rule of thumb.
Good is protecting people, healing the sick and the injured, and fighting, and yes, even killing the villain if killing him would promote more life.
Evil is harming others, acting selfishly, that sort of thing.
Despite cultural mores, this IS an evil act if we assume objective good and evil.
Don't quote me on this, since, well, the maxim doesn't necessarily apply all that well to a reality with SUBJECTIVE good and evil (our own)
Real life is all about the shades of grey, but in Pathfinder, you got to remember that black and white are shades of grey too.
wraithstrike wrote: What classes could your campaign do without?
The above mentioned thread has GM's saying they do or would ban a class due to the flavor that Paizo gave it. I am not understanding this. A class's mechanics is just a means to an end. Nobody has to be making a character that get rages/gets angry, and hits harder due to his untamed nature. He could make a living by guiding people into dangerous area, and is able to channel some mystic force when it is time to fight. The fatigue could be a result of the force causing him a lot of strain. The ninja concept class does not even need the ninja class. I would use a ranger to do it, for those that say eastern classes don't fit.
In short banning class X does not really stop the concept from being played so why ban the class?
I say; "You don't like the flavor? That's what archetypes are for."
D&D oldtimer here, and while working on a character from Cheliax, I come across the rather interesting mention of Succubi being the sort to "invite" children from the Prime Material to their birthday masquerades, I was fascinated with the idea, and chose to work it into my Cheliaxan paladin.
However, weirdly enough, the source for this information, being a copy of Kobold Quartery (issue number 22, I think.) gives the indication that the succubi it discusses come from the Nine Hells, not the Abyss.
So I suppose my question is; Do both sides now make use of Succubi? I looked at the Erinyes, and they don't seem particularly "tempting" anymore, having gone back to their roots as the mythical furies, and knowing Devils in general, they would absolutely have someone to tempt on their side, it's in their MO, after all.
And furthermore, is the Bloodwar still on in Golarion's outer planes? To be honest, preferring the D&D cosmology to all others, I just used the classic and stuck it onto the new without really considering the new cosmology, since what I did see seemed to similar, and figured it simpler to merely graft the familiar to it. (That and, well, Golarion deserves a place alongside Krynn, Aber-Toril, Athas, Mystara, Oerth and the rest of the Crystal Spheres far more than this "Points of Light" 4th Edition b&~!&%$& does.)
Galnörag wrote: Probably have an SU effect on the house equivalent to guards and wards. Ensuring that the pcs are totally lost. I would also not map it on a battle matt so the players can't meta game their way around. If we went tactical I'd bring out dungeon tiles and take them away after.
Just push this into people's imagination as much as possible.
Keep them guessing and nervous is SOP for my Ustalav games already. :)
I mean how would you interpret this Laughing Man buisness? I get that Kytons are not technically devils, but, a "stain upon reality"? Would you call that demonesque? Cthuluish?
I'm currently running the Carrion Crown Adventure Path for my group, and In addition to the Carrion Crown Campaign itself, I'd like to explore some of the more interesting Gothic Horror elements of the country of Ustalav, and one that seized my interest was the Saffron House, detailed in both The Rule of Fear, as well as the inside cover of The Haunting of Harrowstone.
Well, The Rule of Fear got me a map and some details, the boss is known as the Laughing Man, a kyton, with it's "interpreters" whatever that means, the place is filled with gremlins, hounds of Tindalos, juju zombies, Shining Children, Totenmaskes and animate dreams, features endless rooms and halls, malingering psychic traumas and slowed time, as well as a "stained Planchette" as its most notable haunts, has been described as a blot on both nature and time, a location that "leaks wrongness" with the house feeling claustrophobic and tight, evil things skittering and crawling through the walls, with unnecessary, maze-like twists and turns, that a "Clied Thord" owned the house and that a "thousand suicides" never freed him of it's influence, every surface is covered in a sickly, pale yellow, suggested reading consists of C.P Gilman's "The Yellow Wallpaper", Robert E. Howard's "Pigeons From Hell" and Stephen King's "Jerusalem's Lot."
So, what I am asking is, how would you design this adventure? What horrible things would crawl from your mind and roost themselves upon your paper, lying in wait for hapless PCs? How would you interpret it's rather vague phrasings on some things?
Sissyl wrote: Well, considering the amount of time and money I put down in these games, I would be truly disappointed if campaigns were meant to come in one flavour only. In my case, I run two campaigns right now.
Carrion Crown, a gothic horror of Frankenstein meets Dracula, meets Shadow Over Innsmouth, meets, just about every piece of Gothic horror fiction ever. In this campaign, I scare the players, give them eerie events and creepy feelings, make the hairs on the backs of their necks stand up.
And then there's my other campaign, entirely my own creation on this count, where the group is a bunch of Pathfinders, traveling the inner sea, discovering lost cities and ancient cultures, currently they're exploring a Jistkan Ruin, underneath a wizard's tower that they have to break into and rob, so they can recover a box for a powerful information broker who will give them the information and contact they need to bust some friends out of a Cheliaxan Slave pen in Westcrown and escape back to Absalom, where they will finally be able to report to their Venture Captain.
Two very different campaigns, two very different flavors, both good.
Just because you like chocolate doesn't mean you can't like vanilla.
Set wrote: Rather than tweak spells, which, at the end of the day, kind of is like replacing all the blue with orange (since you'll need different sorts of spells to deal damage and different sorts of spells to heal injuries, etc., etc.), perhaps you could replace standard 'vancian' spellcasters entirely with classes that use other mechanics, such as the 3.5 warlock, binder, truenamer, shadowcaster, incarnate or totemist (or some combination of the above).
Monte Cook's Arcana Unearthed introduced entirely new spellcasting classes, different spellcasting mechanics (laden spells, heightened spells and diminished spells, for instance) and a huge new list of different spells, replacing tried and true spells like fireball and lightning bolt, and, at the end of the day, it really wasn't that different. Whether you've prepared fireball and mage armor or 'eldritch torrent' and 'illusory mail,' it might end up feeling like little more than rearranging deck chairs, as players get used to the new spell list and gravitate to a small subset of them that they consider the most effective or useful anyway.
Personally, I was rather fond of a class I made for a campaign I was running in my own setting. I had decided on a whim to make use of a setting I have for a novel series I've been writing a long time, but the way magic works there is far from Vancian. Instead, magic hurts. Like all hell. Doing magic hurts, casting spells hurts, strictly speaking, it's not damage per-se as much as it is just pain.
So, I created a class which could cast as many spells as it damn well pleased. But each spell required intense concentration, and even slightly going wrong... well, you can suffice to say, it wasn't good. Magi could eschew components, verbal, somatic and material alike, but doing so made the spell less "real" and therefore more difficult to realize and thus, cast.
Sissyl wrote: Thanks for your input, everyone. I am certainly going to inform people about these changes beforehand. That goes without saying. Still, some feel that these spells are so important that if I want to exclude them, I shouldn't be playing D&D or PF. Surely the current form of those spells can't be that central to the game? It's not that they're central, or necessary. It's that they're part of the flavor. To some people, this is like walking into an ice-cream parlor, asking for the hot-fudge sundae, and asking them to hold the fudge. They say, "well why not just order the vanilla icecream then?"
I say it's more like walking in, ordering the hot-fudge sundae and asking them to swap the fudge for butterscotch.
As a DM, in my opinion, there is nothing in the game that is overpowered.
You've got an Aasimar who's using Daylight? Fine, hit him with magical darkness of a higher level.
Aasimar have strong resistances to Acid, Cold and Lightning? Fine, hit them with fire, give them a nemesis who focuses on fire spells, give them a demon enemy who has a hate-boner for them.
They get two languages? Fine, throw other languages at them, make them deal with Aklo.
They take Deathless Spirit? Throw the usual gamut of Orcs, Goblins and Trolls at them, lead by a Transmuter, or pump up the level on your Necromancer and throw more Skeletons at them, and have the Necromancer decide he's the biggest threat there, since he's the one who can resist his pets.
There is no such thing as OP in an RPG. There is only what the DM doesn't know how to handle. Just banning something on the basis of it being "OP" is the mark of a lazy DM, who would rather just grind out encounters, rather than think about his players and how they work.
As a DM, in combat, it's your job to challenge the players, not necessarily kill them, but challenge them. The easiest way to do that? MANIPULATE THEM.
It's worked pretty well for me for as long as I'e been DMing.
As I understand it OP, you're looking for a way of making magic feel more... primordial, chthonic, more... well elemental.
In the spirit of that, I'd advise a more low magic setting, something less, Tolkien and more Howard.
Try thinking Conan. Magic there is veeeeery difficult and takes a long time to set up, in fact, it's more ritualistic than anything else. But oh hey lordy if it ain't powerful. You want to make it rain? Make it rain, you want your enemies struck down by a thunderstorm? Call one down.
In the spirit of that, I'd advise you check out the Thieves' World Player's Guide. It's a D20 supplement focusing on the setting from the Thieves' World series of Shared World Novels, magic there is very much focused on elemental power and sheer raw might, but the caveat is that it's so hard and drawn out to do.
Owly wrote: Likely Taldan, I believe. Bear in mind that these civilizations are much longer lived than their RL counterparts (thousands of years versus a few hundred). Cheliax is 1700 years old, according to the PCS. LOTS can happen in those centuries, including ones own towns and fortifications falling into ruin.
Consider that your ruins might be left from the campaign under Chelish King Aspex the Even-Tongued against Taldor in 4081. It may have even been raised by an ambitious lord AGAINST King Aspex (remember that Chelaxians are ambitious folk).
OR...it was a barbarian ruin dating from before civilization reached it, and ruled-over by some ancient and unknown mage-lord a-la Thulsedoom...?
Good question, OP. Good seeing "deep" historical discussions on this board. I wouldn't mind seeing a history board here; somewhere to discuss the history of Golarion in more depth.
Thank you, and I will say, while I did like Set's ideas, they didn't quite hit the "mood" I was looking for, in the end, I went with a mixture of "geographical retconning" informing the players, who DO know (and appreciate for some bizarre reason) that I pull most of the stuff directly out of my rear that I had relocated the illegal mithril mine they found themselves in to a large expanse of hill country about 90 miles south of Egorian, with my own personal explanation for why it's so far out is that it's a Jistkan outpost.
I figured that the Jistkans, much like their inspiration, the ancient Greeks and Romans surely would have outposts from their empire, and that surely not every city the Jistkans had ever founded had been discovered, so I figured that this would be an acceptable break from reality. My players are highly excited by the idea of exploring this, since they're mostly Pathfinders.
All that, of course, and the fact that, since I had already previously established that the wizard they're robbing (they need to go through the ruins to sneak into his tower) was known for his famous constructs, the explanation being that he's robbing the ruins of golems with an ivory rod he stole. One that's running out. Muhahwaha.
Can'tFindthePath wrote: stringburka wrote: One thing though, it's very hard to evaluate the house rules when we don't know why they're there. It'd be nice with a little more substantial explanation of the percieved problem, the general solution, and how your house rules are steps towards that solution. I've read your first post twice now and I still don't really know why you change the skill system - other than that you don't like the system and that some skills aren't used enough. If the main issue is that skills aren't used enough, aren't there easier solutions? (such as empowering the skills, consolidating them, or turning some into level checks (profession, I'm looking at you)) It seems to me that is exactly what the OP has done, as well as adding a brilliant new system of traits. I love it. Thank you. :D The encouragement is a bit nice.
stringburka wrote: Well everything could be changed to feats, but what's the point? I don't see how it's better to make a 3-rank skill that gives +4 for every rank rather than a 20-rank skill that gives +1 for each rank.
And sense motive also works as a skill. While I could see that rolled into perception, it'd probably be too good as both are top-choice skills. You just state that perception is unnecessary without explaining why. Why is sensing someone's true intentions unnecessary? In some ways it could be integrated into perception, but perception is already the no-brainer skill for every character in existance so it doesn't need to get better. It could be rolled into bluff I guess, since it's often used to counter bluff. And it could stay separated - it's still a skill that sees much use.
Why is it unnecessary? Just stating that it is doesn't mean much.
Linguistics is a very campaign-dependant skill, and gets somewhat redundant through the use of Comprehend Languages and Tongues. That's more of an issue with spells being too good than the skill though, IMO. I do agree that skills may not be the best representation of it, and in that case I may prefer your version or something similar. It's a very odd skill in many ways, though.
In my experience, these are skills that a LOT of characters considers maxing:
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Well, then I have nothing I can say to you really, because I disagree with you as completely on every count as you do with me. There is nothing productive to be gained from this discussion.
stringburka wrote: Escape Artist lets you escape grapples even if your BaB, Strength and Dex are mediocre. About every wizard I've seen has put it at at the very least 1/2 level ranks, more often maxing it out. A lot of rogues, bards, non-stupid clerics and druids too.
In addition, anyone who enjoys flying should have this to counter Nets, which can otherwise be quite dangerous.
And let's not ever forget Entangle. Entangle is a fantastic spell that this skill nullifies.
Actually, unless the group packs a rogue, I probably see more escape artist checks (even if not counting take 10/take 20's) in the average adventure than I see sleight of hands in a whole campaign.
And I don't see the point of stating that "because you can take 20 this is irrelevant as a skill"... First they are saying that skills are too random to be useful, then they aknowledge that there is a way (actually two ways) to use them without the randomness - and then say that a skill is bad because you can often use it without the randomness? What?
I mean, if they are, say, set in manacles then the skill is very useful! If you've put nothing in it and have average dexterity, you can't escape manacles. If you're an agile rogue that's put a few points into it (dex 18, 3 ranks + 3 class) you can get out of standard manacles in 20 minutes by taking 20. If you're really good at it (+15) you can even get out of masterwork manacles in 20 minutes! As an expert escape artist (+20) you can get out of manacles in a single minute (by taking 10)!
So in what way does reducing the roll variance affect the usefulness of a skill or the design of it as a skill?
I'm all for skipping rolling the dice for something that the character can do without risk, when there's no big penalty for failing or they're not in a hurry. That is what the take 10 and take 20 rules do!
EDIT: And I mean, stupidly specific situations? We've got like half a bestiary just of grappling monsters! That monk grappling the wizard? The wizard can escape artist! The cleric being chewed on by a...
Which is why, in my case, I felt that the concept was far better represented as a feat;
Escape Artiste: You are especially skilled and capable at the act of escaping from bondage. Whenever tied up, shackled or otherwise bound, you gain a +4 circumstance bonus to checks directly relating to escaping your bonds, such as a +4 to disable device checks to pick the lock of your shackles, but not the lock of your cell, or a bonus to your reflexes to more quickly work your way out of a set of ropes. You also gain a +2 circumstance bonus to all CMD rolls to escape a grapple. This feat may be taken a maximum of three times.
But more to the point, while you can argue in favor of a single skill like Escape Artist, I highly doubt you could argue that every other skill, like sense motive or linguistics could not be better represented by other skills, or indeed, other representations entirely.
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