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Thief

Air0r's page

Goblin Squad Member. 423 posts. No reviews. No lists. 2 wishlists.


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bump


fair enough.


@Ryze Kuja
Since technically level 20 is the cap (yes, you can go higher, and there is some advice for it, but it isn't supported in any way), that is a lot of what if.
It's bad enough that few games seem to make it to level 20, but finding a DM (like me) who would allow you to keep going beyond 20 seems to be equally rare.
Anyway, you have put a lot of thought into this... like, munchkin levels of thought. A part of me wants to congratulate you. But another part is considering banning that surge type, but I'd have to check to see how great are the drawbacks.


Lady-J wrote:
zza ni wrote:
1d10-4d10 at level 1? please share.
while not d10s 4d4+12 aoe or you could focus on single target for 4d6+12 while not as bursty as rolling 4 10s it has a significantly better average damage and that's assuming no meta magics

How are you doing that at level 1?


Frogsplosion wrote:


my personal favorite toy is Concussive Onslaught. Lock someone down and then for 17 power points drop them in an area that deals 14d6 force damage per round for 20 rounds. If they're locked down for the whole duration, average of 840 damage.

Your math appears to be wrong (assuming you are NOT looking at chaotic surge wilder). at 19th level you could spend 19 Power Points to pull off 10d6, and it would last only 19 rounds. At that level? that math is fine, especially considering that power resistance (and thus spell resistance by default) applies AND you get a fortitude save for half damage. if you have stalwart or improved stalwart (or similar feature), you could be taking 0 damage.

Now, looking at a normal wilder, this COULD be pulled off at an earlier level, with the risk of enervation.

Frogsplosion wrote:


or if you want something even stupider, let's use Energy Current. would be a different build, but the power is still absurd. Crossblooded Sorc 1 / Psion or Wilder 19 for +2 dmg per die on fire spells. Wilder would need to pick up a feat @ 11th to actually learn energy current, but the results speak for themselves. augment 6 times then empower for 17 PP to deal 22d6+66 every round for 20 rounds, if you get hits in every round it averages out to 2760 damage.

even here you math is wrong...

to get 22d6, you are going to need to get yourself 22 levels of psion. and if you ALSO want to empower it, you'll actually need to be a 24th level psion. on top of that evasion (or stalwart, depending on energy type chosen) could negate that damage entirely, and by those levels, likely will. AND you are stuck concentrating on the power every round, so getting hit could stop you power completely.
Technically a lower level with the wilder could pull this off, but again, enervation chance.

Frogsplosion wrote:


yeah, psionic damage is pretty insane.

outside of the chaotic surge wilder, I am going to have to disagree.


have you checked out Psionics Augmented: Wilders?


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Thanks for the fast answer.


So, I thought i understood magic weapons and armor. but I think I may have misunderstood the rules.

Say I have a +1 longsword. How much does it cost to add an enchantment such as flaming to it?

My understanding has always been this would cost 6,000 GP (the total cost of a +2 weapon). am I right, or does it cost 2,000 GP?

Additionally, would I be able to add vorpal to that +1 longsword?


I was going over the math thinking those numbers seemed odd, but they all math out right. huh. not sure if empower power would effect both rays or just the original.
you built it solidly. but oh man those enervation chances or that chance of rolling 1 on that chaos surge roll could bite you pretty hard, but that is the risk with that surge type.


Would the Limit Break Shadow Talent allow your shadow to use a maneuver gained through the Combat Training trait?
Related: Would your shadow gain the benefits of your traits? Example: Could my shadow use the Sacred Touch trait to stabilize a party member?


slight nitpick: Psionic Meditation cannot be taken at level 3, as it requires 4 ranks in autohypnosis. it is late, so I'll look at this when i wake up.


Thanks for the prompt answer!


Many of the swarm master's abilities seem to be based on the Pestilence Cloak veil. Veils can be sundered. if a Swarm Masters Pestilence Cloak is sundered, do is their swarm temporarily dissipated? I imagine the answer is yes, but thought it was fair to ask.


So, my wife wanted to try making a character using the Superior Psicrystal (Crystallized Creature) feat. at a certain point you are able to choose small and eventually even medium elementals as you crystallized creature's base form. But many questions began coming up, mostly involving which set of stats would override what?
1) How would BAB work? would you use the base creatures BAB, or something else? would it increase over time?
2) If the base creature had feats, does it keep them?
3) Skill Points: would it keep it's skill points, or use standard psicrystal skill points rules?
4) If the creature had a fly speed, would the flight gained through the psicrystal progression take hold over their normal flight, have no effect, or combine the best of both worlds if this was the case.
5) Finally, when the chart says "any small elemental" or "any medium elemental", does this mean she can literally google 'pathfinder elemental' and just find one of the right size category (I doubt it, but figured i ask for the sake of completion and general clarity)?


Ellioti wrote:
Maybe you can go Human with Dual talent alt. racial trait. People should stop crying about 15-point buy, it's designed to be the standard array by the core rules.

People complain about 15 point buy because it favors spellcasters and any class that only needs to rely on one or two good stats.


Cavall wrote:


Lastly when fixing balance one usually doesn't replace the broken thing with something "better".

Perhaps you and I have very different definitions of the word broken. generally broken things SHOULD be replaced with better options whenever possible. and when it isn't possible, the broken thing should be removed.

Broken= unusable. doesn't function as intended or at all. or sometimes just excessively weak in comparison to other options.


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Frogsplosion wrote:


The only problem I have with Path of War (and psionics, actually) is I find Dreamscarred Press doesn't understand how damage scaling works, because a lot of their classes, spells, feats and abilities boil down to or combine to become "do even more obscene damage than usual".

I haven't experienced this as a DM/GM or as a player. I use their stuff a LOT.


Zautos' wrote:
Air0r wrote:

any other 3PP available?

as for a quick suggestion:
Titan Mauler Barbarian/Ranger

We don't have any more 3pp as default. But can add things. just need to show them to the gm and let here decide if it's okej to have or not.

Well, Aegis/Soulknife is a fun combo (both from Ultimate Psionics, DSP). There is a nice utility Blade skill in Psionics Augmented Soulknives that can let you turn your mind blade into some simple things like rope and grappling hooks and whatnot.


did you want to run around with improvised weapons? if so, throw anything, catch off-guard, and improvised weapon master can really fit the drunken theme.


the domain thing was just one example. it was literally just the first one to come to mind.


Can a non-spell melee touch attack be delivered through a natural attack (or unarmed strike). Emphasis on non-spell.

Example: Could a cleric's Ruin Touch domain power (an SU ability if it matters) be combined with an unarmed strike? this is a sloppy example, but it gets the idea across.


I just realized that this question is largely unrelated to DSP or even 3PP...


any other 3PP available?

as for a quick suggestion:
Titan Mauler Barbarian/Ranger


"Catra" -naruto from ninjabridged


General question: Can a non-spell melee touch attack be delivered through a natural attack. Emphasis on non-spell.

Specifics: I am building a Atstreidi black templar. Could he choose to deliver his Drain Essence ability through his natural slam attack?

Side question: Can veils with melee touch attacks have their effects be delivered through natural attacks?

Sources:
Astreidi is from Bloodforge: Infusions (the specific race is unimportant for above's questions though; any race with a natural attack can fill the spot)
Black Templar is a prestige class from Akashic Mysteries.


Deighton Thrane wrote:
Just your average clone wrote:
Just posted something about this, actually. Deadhand stylist master of many styles monk, with deadhead master at 6th level, because you don't need to meet the prerequisites for the feats. So a 6th level character dealing 8 negative energy levels with one punch from pummeling style is pretty darn scary. I only got away with it because everyone else is overpowered as well.
So first off, sorry for the slight de-rail, but I haven't really been keeping up with everything pathfinder for the last year, and already I feel like I'm forgetting some of the stuff I already knew, but I though Master of Many Styles only let you take the actual style, as in Deadhand Style, not Deadhand Master. I thought the starter feats were the only actual style feats, and the follow up feats were actually just combat feats. Anyone willing to clarify for me?

also, as far as i could tell from the feats description, if he could get ahold of it early or not, still caps out at two negative levels total. and being a swift action to use the ability, could only do it once per turn.


To further add to confusion, under the Mixed Blood trait is this line: "Unless noted in the benefit, you do not count as the chosen race for prerequisites."
On hindsight, maybe this means something else...


not to ruin this fun exercise (and it is VERY enjoyable), but Thunt has already posted a large number (possibly all?) of the shield of wonder effects. a google image search may pull it up.


sadly, soul hunter and bushi cannot be combined: they both replace the Blending and Improved Blending class features. otherwise, looks good.


Chromantic Durgon <3 wrote:
And is third party.

As is the only version of a cunning feat I could find. my google-fu may have been weak though.

Edit: This is the only version of the cunning feat I could find, by Flaming Crab Games, published 2014, according to the credits.


QuidEst wrote:


There's now Toughness, but for skill points. (The feat is Cunning.)

this seems like a different version of open minded which was published years earlier...


thoughts:
1) add evil equivalent options, and if you feel really adventurous, lawful and chaotic options. Still can only pick one side. Though maybe have a feat allowing options from another alignment that you belong to (lawful good for example). Still, disallow true neutral.

2) Perhaps have each eidolon type be able to temporarily merge with your weapons or armor and provide passive (or active or limited use, you figure that out) benefits. Each type of eidolon could have stuff typed up for this benefit, and each one should be mostly unique if you can help it.

I may come up with more ideas later.


Garbage-Tier Waifu wrote:

We also have a similar spell to this effect in Stone Call, which does 2d6 damage in an area with no save or even spell resistance. I'm not sure if a psionics level 2 power is equivalent to a 2nd level spell, but It isn't unprecedented in Pathfinder's spell lists.

It does seem reasonably strong for level, though, given that it's a 3d4 without a save, and an equivalent Burning Hands does as much damage. In addition, it seems to be scalable, and without a limit as well. Given I have no idea how psionics work I can't really comment but at the very least it fits with what Paizo deems suitable for a 2nd level spell.

Just felt it important to point out that the limit of scaling is this: You cannot spend more Power Points on any one effect than your manifestor level.


I have to agree with everyone else here. There just isn't anything really going for this hybrid class. perhaps more unique evolutions (maybe exclusive to this class) would help?


I had an NPC use Swarm of Crystals on the party, looked up the power and found that it didn't allow a save, despite being a cone-shaped area attack. I know it is in d4s and slashing for damage, but it seemed strange. not particularly powerful, just strange.


Cursed does nothing on its own. It interacts with some feats and maneuvers though.


not going to ask about the doppel, but would a smart rock be out of character/theme? COULD give you some extra spying options, if you want to burn a feat on it.


Quintain wrote:

From ulitmate Psionics:

Quote:


Talents: Each psychic warrior gains two 0 level talents
(see Chapter 5: Powers) of their choice. These talents do
not count against the psychic warrior’s powers known.

That confirms it, my PDF copy is out of date. (and I have come to realize that it doesn't appear to have been downloaded from any of the places I expected, possibly as a consequence of obtaining it as a part of the kickstarter back in... 2013?)


strange. I could not (and still can't) find this text in my copy of Ultimate Psionics (which compiles psionics unleashed and psionics expanded, along with a bunch extra). time to check to make sure my PDF isn't hilariously out of date, I suppose.


am I missing something? Why do Psychic Warriors get a 0-level power list, but gain no talents?


Tempest Gale style!


shield focus (CRB) followed by Defensive Expertise (PoW) would assist in the tanking department.
Powerful Mark (PoW) will make your Armiger's mark stronger so that could be a cool option.
Take the Blow (PoW) would let you take hits instead of your friends, so that could be nice for those dramatic scenes where you hop in the way of an arrow.

also, Path of War Expanded (and by extension d20pfsrd) has several style feats that could be very fun depending on what kinds of things you want to be doing later.


So there is a 3rd level Tempest Gale maneuver from Path of War expanded called Battering Gale. the trick herethat you will either have to burn feats on the Martial Training line, multiclass, or see if the marksman archtype in PoW:E is compatible with you already planned archetype. could still swear there was a feat though, but you'd likely spend just as many feats on it, lol.

EDIT: looking at the possibility of archetype stacking these two (adaptive gunner and Mind's Eye Disciple), seems unlikely. and not worth it even if you could. so you can ignore that particular suggestion.


1: with enough multiclassing

2: if all you doing is adding cool stylistic flare with no mechanical expectations, then I see no reason to say no to this.

3: vital strike could work for the stronger power shots, but not sure about the bull rush aspect. there is probably a feat for ranged bull rush somewhere. I could swear I have seen one.


thanks Castilonium, I just wanted to make sure their wasn't some wierd rule I was missing.


if you have levels of two martial initiating classes (say harbinger and stalker or something), is there anything preventing you from learning stances/maneuvers from the same discipline for both classes?


from page 31 Path of War:

"Counter: A counter is a fast, usually defensive maneuver that is used to prevent or respond to your opponent’s actions. A martial disciple who dodges just beyond an ogre’s reach is using a counter."
[cut some irrelevant text about iron tortoise using shields here.]
"Counters are immediate actions that you attempt during an enemy’s turn. Usually, your foe must make a specific action, such as an attack against you, for you to use a counter."

also, same page:
"CRITICAL HIT VS COUNTER
As this is bound to come up at the gaming table at least once in a while, a player or the DM will roll a natural 20 against a creature or player and the decision to use a counter will arise. Relax, here's the answer. Counters may be used against a critical hit except if the threatening attack roll was a natural 20. Critical hits from weapons with extended threat ranges (such as rapiers) can be countered if the threatening attack roll was not a 20."

that side bar is what makes me answer the way I do.


most counters come after the attack roll, but before the result is revealed, if I recall (don't have it open in front of me).


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some occasional 'side quest' style adventures have their appeal, but otherwise that home stretch to 20 would be a great place to settle into.
also, your own setting could be nice. it just needs a solid draw though. (also, leave no adventuring stone unturned; underwater, unique planes if any, heck, even some info on surrounding space just in case some starjammer inspiration hits you)


so, aegis soulknife can work really well. because of all the multiclassing you will likely be doing, Student of the Astral Suit and Fighter's Blade feats will be important as soon as possible. also, because of all the blade skills you have your eyes on, you may need to pick up Extra Blade Skill a few times to make up for lost levels and to be able to do some of that at a reasonable level. you will not have a bunch a free feats going this route though.

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