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The most effective tricksters are wizards, followed by sorcerers. Bard tricksters really are a waste of time. Just play a sneaky archetype bard and be done with it. Combining bard with rogue in the trickster class doesn't do much of anything for either side of that combination, except reduce your hit points, BAB, and cancel your progression in the unique talents of both classes. What good targeted blast spells does a bard get? He could take the Arcane Blast feat at 10th caster level, but it’s pathetic, even with sneak damage. His other spells are equally unimpressive.
Think about it: A 20th level character with the sneak attack of a 13th level rogue, a BAB of 12, one rogue talent, minor bardic abilities, fewer skill and hit points, and the earth-shaking spellcasting of a 17th level bard. What, if anything, is he good at?
A 20th level sor/wiz trickster laughs at him, and not because he’s funny, then turns him to dust out of pity. If you want to play an AT in some sort of intrigue campaign, the sorcerer AT gets all the class skills a bard does, and will be more effective overall. Just because a bard can be a trickster, that doesn't mean he should.
I’m not knocking bards. PF bards are great, and they shouldn’t bother with this PrC." -A Highly Regarded Expert's Guide to the Arcane Trickster
I agree with Dragonchess Player. You lose too much and gain too little with bard as your casting class.
Yes, backstory is key here, and there are tons of ways to go with it.
I like Fafhrdnoresman's idea about rage being her main problem. She could have been the daughter of a wealthy merchant, living comfortably in a safe city, and sure to eventually marry well and live a life of coddled comfort.
Her raging temper somehow makes her prospects dwindle until no one really trusts her. She then discovers that rage can work to her advantage in the right context, so she goes off to find her fortune on her own.
Most barbs dump cha. Barbie shouldn't. She's not crude or ugly, and is personable enough at first glance. Maybe dump int to reflect that she didn't need to learn a lot of skills, since everything was done by servants when she was growing up. She loafed in school, and isn't particularly learned for her station.
Can't cook, hates to clean, etc.
All her stuff will be masterwork, as soon as she can afford it. She might wear a mace for a back up weapon when her fancy greatsword isn't ideal, and that mace must look good with her ensemble.
On days off, she wants to party at the best places she can get into, and she'll buy the nicest clothes she can find. She's certain to make a splash, particularly if someone ticks her off!
Just scratching the surface. "Barbierian" has a lot of potential to be a very amusing character.
AM OTHER BARBARIAN wrote:
PFS tends to bunch parties up in tight spaces. There, rogues can contribute. On more open battlefields, they're just not good.
Vlad Koroboff wrote:
I only faintly comprehend this issue, but weren't there protests against this action in Russia, too? I read that there were, and the Russian po-po beat and jailed hundreds of them.
Of course, most regular people everywhere don't want war and imperialism.
Still, of course, this is all my personal tastes. I certainly know people who much prefer a humanocentric setting, and even like the lack of definition humans tend to have in most settings because they prefer a totally blank slate to work with. To each their own, no?
Egg-Zachary. From start to finish, it's a tale of some characters.
All characters have histories. 1st level characters have very little. They're teenagers who just got their driver's licenses. At 20th, bards sing about their exploits (exploitation?) in taverns across the land.
It's more fantastical at higher levels. Play a character. The race is just detail. Some will care a lot about it and dwell on it, some won't.
nate lange wrote:
HRE- in my original post i had 1 guy 2WF with waraxes, and another in a reach build with a longaxe (plus one with a longhammer, and one with a dorn dergar... i'm not sure their weapons could be much dwarfier)
Good! Dwarves should have axes!
jk. I could see a dwarf using other weapons, it's just not as dwarfy.
remco- i like that list, but you have 1 too many... my personal preference is sort of to downplay arcane magic among dwarves too, but i worry that you're putting a party at a distinct disadvantage (especially at mid to high level) if there's no wiz/sorc at all...
A dwarf witch or wizard would be fun, I think. I could see a dwarf magus or EK, especially. A little fight to go with the magic.
What's with all the no-axe, no-hammer dwarves? Get some axes up in this hizzy, stat!
Nor is it a hate site. It is a place that kids can access.
The OP has an agenda. It isn't free speech.
Buffy. At the risk of sounding blasphemous, I think all the love for Firefly comes more from the lost potential (GREAT set-up for a second season and a larger universe) than how good it was on its own. Good show, but not as OMGWTFBBQ amazing as it's made out to be.
How dare you speak such blasphemy! Harumph!
Nuh-uh! No take backs! YOU'RE wrong!
GM Kyle wrote:
James Jacobs may well be the cause of the deaths of more goblins than anyone in history.
How does he sleep at night?
With the FAQ regarding racial abilities, a lot changes. I don't feel like going through all of them, but tieflings, sylphs, and a few other races look more attractive now.
"Any other race your game allows should give you benefits that up your two most important stats, and help your magic and/or sneakiness. Ratfolk make excellent wizard ATs, for example, if you’re able to play one." -My super-awesome guide
It's easier to gain early entry, so if you have bonuses to your main stats (or at least no penalties) and can start the class early, you'll be stronger sooner. I'd totally play any of the races U.M. mentioned above.
I was disappointed about the ruling on sneak attack, but, as many will agree, sneak blasting is fun, but hardly the only thing you do as a trickster.
You have a number of ways to jack over your enemies, and it doesn't have to always be direct damage, either.
My favorite part is scouting/spying. It's intense and fun to sneak past all the obstacles and get intel that will help the party win, or sabotage a trap, etc.
Mary Yamato wrote:
I agree with you.
Skills work much better. Fly? Look at the classes that have it as a class skill. They can cast Fly. Class skill, measured as a skill.
The roguish classes got devalued by this change in mechanics, but they're still useful. They're just not the only character in the party likely to have a good Bluff check.
In most parties, they still are.
Adamantine Dragon wrote:
I accept your concession and will add this: Your kids have a decent shot at a middle class income. You clearly don't have the connections to do any more for them.
If they can read the tea leaves, and have the capital, they can do better. Perhaps they'll rise to the investor class. Maybe they'll be charming enough to be accepted at the country club. Who knows?
I can speak for myself, too. Winning the birth lottery is still the statistically best way to wealth.
Where did I imply that hard work and perseverance didn't improve your odds? They simply aren't a guarantee, especially in the last few decades.
And you're still playing the class envy violin. "Bad luck" means a crappy economy with little to no chance for meaningful advancement for the majority. You can be as ambitious as Madonna, if you like. If there's nothing there for you to aim at, you're stuck.
You may know your business better than anybody, but the boss's son will be giving you orders soon enough.
This is the problem we're seeing now. Not enough decent jobs out there. Most people I know don't dream of mansions and limos. They'd just like to have enough security to get by.
If you go straight from HS to minimum wage, you're not going to see a livable income for a very long time. That's just how it is.
I'm totally in favor of raising the minimum wage. An ambitious person might be able to save enough to take a few classes, or at least keep the rent paid.