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Pathfinder Society Member. 1,210 posts (1,211 including aliases). No reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 2 Pathfinder Society characters.


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Tomos wrote:

If you decide on Extra Traits, make sure you're selecting different types.

You can't have more than one trait from any single category.

You could take one each from Magic, Combat, Religion, and Social categories for example.

We start with 1 trait, so that's fates favorite .

Another 2 can add 2 to concentration, 2 to initiative, a prof. With great sword or a good reach weapon or 6 to fly ( wisdom in the flesh).
That leave room for sacred summon and divine interference .

The Eldridge heritage line will add:
6 to stealth
3 to knowledge ( local?planes ?)
1 extra non memorize spell per day
And a free magical ring .

For another feat I can add wizard spell added to cleric list


thanks for advice.
my option#1 (summon supreme) seem the "strongest" but most boring - so i think i'd pass on it . (so many great spells cant focus on summons. )

option #2 (arcane heritage feat chain) seem the most versitle but gaining the 15 cha might be too much . (although, it IS a great path..)

so, i am left with option 3, with some tips form here.
either extra traits or reach spell (reach options vs great sword and +2 to init) + sacred summon for little speed summons + divine interference to save the lives of all .


Rashagar wrote:

Just wanted to mention that if you were thinking of taking skill focus stealth and the eldritch heritage feats anyway, the shadow bloodline could be a way to get the equivalent of hide in plain sight with a bonus ally position swapping power, freeing up your 2nd domain choice.

The downside being you wouldn't get it til level 11. And charisma 15 as you mentioned. Also I don't know what else the homebrew archetype might give you, or if there is a 2nd domain you had your eye on.

basically, DM allow hide in plain sight for the giving of channeling.

the bloodline shadow - sucks. the third feat is amazing, but #2 is worthless.


Mmm.... Interesting .... Seem legit .
Is there a cleric spell worth Turing to range with reach spell ?( I mean with trait to keep the same level ) like frost bite cheese ?

What feat chain / change from my list would you pass ?


official name is Nebulous Hargrim
his angelic name is Castiel


thanks all for the advice.


ok, did ton of reading and i am down to those 3 options...

feats so far wrote:


1:dodge,mobility
3: power attack
5: free
7:spring attack
9:free
11:free
option#1-summoner wrote:


5:conjuration summoning
9: augment summoning
11: sacred summon
why? hit the hardest
why not? too focused, cleric got too many great spells - hard to leave space for summons.
option#2-eldritch wrote:


give up a feat for 2 skill focus : stealth&arcane
9:eldritch heritage arcane
11: improve eldritch heritage arcane
why? +6 to stealth, +3 to arcane
extra spell / day
free item, especially as we cant create items or buy...
one spell from wizard as a cleric spell (create demi-plane? displacement? )
why not? need charisma of 15 (wanted 12-14 tops). a lot of feats...
option#3 - all over the place wrote:


7: extra traits (we start with 1) for free weapon like great sword & 2 to initiative or 6 to fly (wisdom in a flesh)
9:sacred summon or scribe scrolls
11: divine interference

opinions?


ok, i found overland flight > teleport (especialy as greater teleport is given at lvl 7...) so i found trade > travel.
longstrider is of little use when you fly all the time...


what style are you ? melee? caster? hybrid?


i seek a normal name - with groove and meaning.
the reason i asked, is names are hard to come by and stay long in the game...
more people = more groovy name found = better fun!


my favorite = wisdom in a flesh .


Mark Hoover wrote:
Fallen angel turned human? Castiel is nice. Also Seth if you look like Nick Cage.

Castiel is a cool theme .... so-so name . but great ideas fro the background.


grimdog73 wrote:
Hargrim, Lanthos, something like that?

Hargrim is nice, it's WOW name right?


a pilgrim, a former fallen angel that was forcefully turned to a human.
travel and glory domain - god is not a single one - it's the "heavenly court" (DM's creation) .
born in Absalom. useing stealth, and dipping 1 lvl in shadow dancer (not optimal i know..) .

so, names are hard to find - i searched many links in the internet - but could use a personal advice.
so far options are:
Nubilos (so-so)
Hakar (a little bit arabic.)
Nox (short, but nice meaning).

give me your worse people .


True. For traveling .
Overland flight is for fighting and spring sttacks.
Teleport is of little use with word of recall and plane shift


I agree exploration is the least ..
But I compare trade to travel.
Trade offer useful skill bonus in comparison to agile , so they are. About te same .
Long strider is ten times better than floating disk
But - overland flight is the best spell ever. Almost permanent flight .


True .
How about trade ? Overland flight is.... The best caster spell in re game I think.


travel exporation trade

which is the best?
a lot is similar but there are variations:
Agile Feet Vs Door Sight Vs Silver-Tongued Haggler:
about equel. i like door sight
the spells are a bit better for travel.
exept one HUGEEEEE thing.
overland flight.
this spell.... is like winning a lottery for a caster that also melee.


travel exporation trade

which is the best?
a lot is similar but there are variations:
Agile Feet Vs Door Sight Vs Silver-Tongued Haggler:
about equel. i like door sight
the spells are a bit better for travel.
exept one HUGEEEEE thing.
overland flight.
this spell.... is like winning a lottety for a caster that also melee.


It was brought to my attention - there is another interesting option for the 3 feats :
As human take 2 skill focus or te price of a feat :
Stealth, and knowledge arcane . (Lvl8).
Than lvl 9 take Eldridge heritage - arcane for either a familiar or an arcane bond ( for a neat free item and free spell per day).
Than take at 11 improve version, and take the lvl 9 power to add ANy single spell from the arcane as a known , clerical spell.

I just wonder what single spell is worth it ?
It's as good as the summon tree.


Wraithcannon wrote:

I'm building an Gnome Order of the Cockatrice Cavalier and wanted some feat selection advice. He's for PFS play so no 3rd party stuff.

Here is what I've come up with so far
.

1st Mounted Combat
2nd Dazzling Display for free (with the Braggart ability)
3rd Ride By Attack
5th Power Attack
6th Wheeling Charge
7th Spirited Charge
9th Furious Focus
11th Dreadful Carnage
12th Mounted Blade

Teamwork feats are

1st Precise Strike
9th Outflank

Since he's riding a medium mount (wolf then boar), I avoided the Trample and Mounted Onslaught feats and since Cavaliers are so feat starved compared to fighters, I skipped the Shield Focus-Mounted Shield combo. I also thought about Fearsome Finish but I'm not ready to become a worshipper of Lamashtu.

Thoughts?

if you ask me - you are too focused on charging.

you will be able to 1 shot everything, nut charges arent alwsys optional. aerial combat, terrain, allies and foe - all stand in your way. i like cavalier, but i make sure i am able to both attack beside and on my mount.
you wont be #1 DPR - but you will never be #0 as well.


ElSilverWind wrote:

What's your alignment and Diety? If you have a Diety that grants an aura with access to nice Sacred Summons (Lawful Good, Lawful Evil, Chaotic Evil) Summoning is fantastic.

Spell Conjuration, Augment Summoning, Sacred Summons, Superior Summons, 3 metamagic feats (Quicken Spell, Extend Spell, Empower Spell maybe?) so yo can grap Spell Perfection at 15 is amazing.

Llv11 feat should almost always be Divine Interference. Unless there's an even better feat in the ACG.

not sure yet - but not evil and not lawful for sure :)

god - we still seek a proper what - i first write all the backstory and character than me and dm decide what god fit it.
you wrote too many feats...
spring attack with power attack is, kind of a must . it's not amazing - i know. but i like the fast travel domain - filled with holy power (divine favor and heroism) spring attack. keeping you safe as well.
i tend to agree summoning sould come next in line. always fun, versitle and great.
so, i guess i will have to pass quicken divince favor - at least until high lvl...
although skill focus*2 is also nice


a cleric homebrew archetype that DM allowed.
basically i get travel domain and shadow dancer hide in plain sight as second domain.
abilities: (16,10,14,14,17,12 after racial and leveling. )
cleric lvl 9.
we start with 1 trait - i take birthmark of fate's favorite.
group has:
ranger archer
bard that boost and off-combat
fighter 2 weapon kukri critical frenzy
magus - super damage.

so, lets plan the feats to level 11 as this cleric:
human has at lvl 11 7 feats all and all.
the idea is to be a full caster that can also attack.
i love spring attack (not super optimize i know..) and power attack.
thats, 4 feats for melee. more than enough, rest should go non combat.
what among the 3 options below is the "best" :
2 skill focus (human) & more traits (fate's favorite & use magic device are solid) & quicken spell ?
Vs
conjuration focus & augument summon & sacred summon - for some summon plan B.

other stuff like divine interference? any other ideas?


Comments if dm:
No feat is required.
Keep spontaneous , but lose all channeling .
All and all, you gain 2 domains - and mini shadow dancer powers .


more logical version:
a new cleric archtype: "Pious shades" .
the basics:
most clerics are Pios casters or warriors - front liner who take the glory for themself.
a Pious shade is all about doing the worl done while making sure the glory for the work will go to where it SHOULD have gone or, will do the most.
it work from shadows both the real shadows and those of diplomacy. extreme, little b%*!$&~& and getting the job done.
a Pious shade will gladly stay behind - being annonymos to most - while the credit is given to others .
1. as long as this will better the cause
2. the god will always know who was behind it
3. the real forces of golorian will know for sure it is you, andw not the puppet.
the archtype:
other clerics of the church:
vary . a Pious shade is like medival inquisitor. most clerics resent and even hate him - thinking he is an abomonation. some however, understand it is a needed force and will protect and assit. but they are rare.

weapon and armor:
a Pious shade gain the normal cleric wepoans and the wepon of the god they serve. they dont, however, learn to use any shields.

domains:
a Pious shade is like the regular clerics. ot see below:

skills:
1. replace knowledes: arcane + history + nobility
2. add: knowledge local + perception + stealth
change of powers of cleric :
a shadow Pious god protect him, and allow him to act from the shadows when needed.
a Pious shade gain the following powers:

lvl 1:
Darksight (SP): you can cast the spell “darkvision” as per spel. You can spontaneous cast it, altering an exising spell. For the Pious shade the spell is considered a first lvl spell.

godly stealth(ex): a Pious shade use wisdom, not dex for stealth. same as "wisdom in a flesh" trait

the cost: This abilities replace the spontaneous casting . a shadow Pious DONT recive the ability to spontaneous casting. he cant change spells he momorize to any other spell. And the proficiency with shields.
option for DM : keep spontaneous casting , but instead say the follwoing:
keep the spontaneous casting but lose a lvl 1 domian power. personally i think lossing spontaneous casting will "hurt" more.... "

lvl 5:
fast stealth (EX): can move normal speed while in stealth.
the cost: This ability replace the lvl 5 progression of channel energy.

lvl 9:
Hide in plain sight (EX): as shadow dancer . - can hide even if observed. need a shadow (any shadow) - but not his own shadow.
the cost:This ability replace the lvl 9 & 15 progression of channel energy.
alternative option for DM for more balance. : "this ability replace one domain power from the second tier (lvl 8 usally) meaing, the P.shade gain a single lvl 8 power and not 2. "


a new archtype for a cleric:

a new cleric archtype: "Pious shades" .
the basics:
most clerics are Pios casters or warriors - front liner who take the glory for themself.
a Pious shade is all about doing the worl done while making sure the glory for the work will go to where it SHOULD have gone or, will do the most.
it work from shadows both the real shadows and those of diplomacy. extreme, little b$*$@#%$ and getting the job done.
a Pious shade will gladly stay behind - being annonymos to most - while the credit is given to others .
as long as this will better the cause
the god will always know who was behind it
the real forces of golorian will know for sure it is you, andw not the puppet.
the archtype:
other clerics of the church:
vary . a Pious shade is like medival inquisitor. most clerics resent and even hate him - thinking he is an abomonation. some however, understand it is a needed force and will protect and assit. but they are rare.

weapon and armor:
a Pious shade gain the normal cleric wepoans and the wepon of the god they serve. they dont, however, learn to use any shields.

domains:
a Pious shade is not like the regular clerics.

skills:
replace knowledes: arcane + history + nobility
add: knowledge local + perception + stealth
change of powers of cleric :
a shadow Pious god protect him, and allow him to act from the shadows when needed.
a Pious shade gain the following powers:

lvl 1:
Darksight (SP): you can grant darkvision 60 feet to a willing subject, lasting 1 minute \ lvl. if used in self the duration is 1\hour\ lvl. useable 3+wosdom times a day.
godly stealth(SP): a Pious shade use wisdom, not dex for stealth. same as "wisdom in a flesh" trait

lvl 5:
Hide in plain sight (EX): as shadow dancer . - can hide even if observed. need a shadow (any shadow) - but not his own shadow.

lvl 9:
fast stealth (EX): can move normall speed while in stealth.

those powers, come with a price:
at lvl 1,
no shields: as said above, the Pious shade isnt proficiant with shields
the shadow Pious MUST take skill focus -stealth. in fact to enter the archtype a character MUST either take the feat or learn it at lvl 1.
worse spell use: a shadow Pious DONT recive the ability to spontaneous casting. he cant change spells he momorize to any other spell.
slower channeling : the Pious shade progression of channling energy is slower. he DONT recive progression at lvls: 1+9+15. (he gains the channel energy at lvl 3 only and the progression is slower due to that).


Or the racing snail


Artax - never ending story


The new classes are banned in our game for now, as there are some balance issues.


Thormind wrote:
666bender wrote:


I sometimes find full bab with shadow dancer to be better than sneak attackers. Especially for survival .

Why? If you dont do sneak attacks why would you need to hide so much as to sacrifice lvl on a PrC? The pet is only useful to help flanking, especially as you advance in lvl. Shadow walking a few time per day can be done with equipment. You dont get full BAB. You get just a tiny bit of sneak dmg.

Ah, here is where you fail to see the supreme. Ability of the prestige :

Hide in plain sight - of shadow dancer ( and assassin) only need a shadow- so there isn't a place you can't hide .
So - spring attack close , attack and vanish.
You can't really get defeated as stealth bonus is easier than perception bonus.

Add a shadow that can't miss , with ton of HP ( 50% when you get half damage )
That drain str / making a armored fighter a. Scarecrow that can't Move.
You can solo kill almost any fighter in the game .

If thug lore warden you also get good bab for grapple tree and strong debuff.
If a cavalier your tiger is stronger than any rogue ...
Add spirited charge with pounce tiger when you don't need to spring attack and you are one mean machine .

The q is which mechine runs better ?
Why do you think rogues are good ?


Thormind wrote:

Any class with sneak attacks combine well with shadowdancer. You dont need to get more than 3 lvl in the PrC though. All you want is hide in plain sight, darkvision and most importantly the Shadow.

The pet gives you a flanking partner so you can get sneak attack in most of the time unless the target is immune. The penalty you get when it dies is irrelevant because it is hard to kill and when in danger it can hide in floors/walls.

I sometimes find full bab with shadow dancer to be better than sneak attackers. Especially for survival .

So - how about the cavavlir > SD idea ? A full mount and a full shadow ?
How about the thug lore warden ?
Any better path ?
Any comments on those ?


lemeres wrote:
LeesusFreak wrote:

Have a smoke-based team of Oracle dipped classes do it. The Waves, Fire, and Winter mysteries all have revelations that allow them to see through Obscuring Mist/Fog Cloud, and if you have them cast Solid Fog, the Rogue is at a heavy disadvantage (his SA won't work in the fog). The Oracles only each need one level in Oracle for that revelation, you can have them do anything else for the rest of their levels.

There are a lot of ways to make a 3 v 1 really unfair, even if the mobs are underleved. Tucker's Kobolds are a classic example of this.

I suppose ifrits with fire sight would be the best for that if you can't go oracle.

Similar idea-Tieflings with the fiendish sight feat (twice, since it gives you See in Darkness then)

You could have an inquisitor with deeper darkness in there too (hey, there are plenty of gods of murder; at least a few of them might have their own services, or offer some personnel to the local assassins guilds).

Would shadow dancer help? Preferably, it would be [something] x/shadow dancer 1. Getting to shadow dancer 3 and having a shadow going around dealing lethal strength damage would be a problem. You just want to have the ability to use stealth in battle. You can use spring attack with restealthing, right? Maybe with some nice reach weapon?

Why a shadow dancer with shadow would be a problem ?

How is it any different than a Mage casting ray of enervation/ vampiric touch etc ?


My shadow dancer fit here ...
Thug 3 lore warden 3 sd 4.
You spring attack , from stealth attack with a great sword and blades of mercy trait .
Auto sicken, free shaken (enforcer) and 3d6 non leathal damage while the shadow companion drain the str.


I really want to play a two handed shadow dancer, I think 4 levels is perfect, (lvl 5 and up the prestige offer little).
I read the guide , but disagree with the conclusions.
Paladins I can't play as the group has poor moral code,
And after load of thinking I think one of the following options is the best .
Am I right ?
And advice ?
Important *** not every thing is combat ! We rp a lot of combats as well. Skills mean something.

Path 1: cavalier , 3 archetype : emissary, beast rider, honor guard.
Order of the dragon or sword .

Path 2: thug rogue 3, lore warden 3 .

Analysis : lvl 9 cutover :
Path 1:
Full mount tiger ( boon companion), strong debugging shadow .
Character can spring attack or spirited charge .
Tiger learn grapple tree
Shadow scout and flank.
Bodyguard protect all around.
Aid another with skills of dragon is great .
Trait offer use magic device .
Ac learn sprig attack as well or nice mobility .

Path 2:
Thug add huge debuff to spring attacks .
Sneak damage .
Free and automatic sicken.
Blades of mercy trait will make great sword non leathal, for enforcer . So free shaken / sicken.
Lore warden add the feats and cmb . For improve grapple yamminess .
But no mount .

So- thought ?


the shadow grow in HD?
the shadow recieve more skill points?

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/core-rulebook/shadowdancer


The 2 set of roles can't work together .
Not seen a FAQ on it.
Charge is direct closest line to foe .
Ride by attack allow to continue move .
Charge and movement roles block going through a squere of opponent .
How can one continue the charge ?!


making sure i got this right :

beast rider

honor guard

emissary

all 3 can be combined?


Tranquilo wrote:

The problem with Ecclesitheurge is that you can't wear any armor. Unless you're going Mystic Theurge, you might as well just play an arcane caster.

I'm playing a similar character in PFS. I think heighten spell/preferred spell are invaluable for this build. If you're going to fireball all your problems, these two feats give you Schrodinger's Fireballs--every spell slot is now three spells: Cure X Wounds, Fireball or Utility Spell of your choice.

1. Spell Focus, Spell Spec (Burning Hands/Fireball)
3. Heighten Spell
5. Preferred Spell: Fireball
7. Intensify Spell
9. Dazing Spell
11. Maximize Spell

Retraining feels a bit cheesy, but it's worthwhile to retrain spell focus/spell spec to jump the curve later on.

nice one!

but why take "Intensify "? you get it for free for the 2 main spells via archtype.
i would take scribe scroll for those weird spells or cures


BigNorseWolf wrote:
666bender wrote:
Bigdaddyjug wrote:
666, human heritage aasimar? If so, where in Golarion are his parents from?

not really, he WAS an angel that fell from the heavently court and now fell from grace.

Why did he fall? That would help with the thematic naming.

he thought that evil needed to be faught with actions, and the greater good is more important than a single soul - destroying a village to stop a gate to hell that was about to bring a arch demon to golorian.

he was found unjust - and than he cursed the god almighty - and was trown from heaven.


Bigdaddyjug wrote:
666, human heritage aasimar? If so, where in Golarion are his parents from?

not really, he WAS an angel that fell from the heavently court and now fell from grace.


ok, i want some advice on a name as well...
a dark knight cavalier shadow dancer who is a fallen angel (aasimar).
character is ready - no name...


Names I like:
Baliel beliard / pilgrim
Greco
Pious
Migel
Miel
Gardinel
Solaris
Dante
Arakis
Caratis
Aegis £ fang
Maligor
Melkor
Maligos
Argo / Argos
Womak
Rayden
Turk
Tiriel
Torin
Yunkai
Yellin
Urden
Pious
Portos
Hakar
Leckter
Xill
Brimar
Briar
Nok
Nur
Na-arel
Marios
Majar


Aegis


Aeiden malstrom


http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/monstrous-mount
For a cavalier . Human.
It's 2 feat for a ok mount ( tiger with lett str and str and no grab)
Bit it flys.... And with two feats - so are you


cavalier 6 (emissary, honor guard, beast rider combo)
SD4
cavalier rest .

we got 1 only trait to pick.

Armor Expert - for ACP=0 with mithral breast plate.
Defender of the Society - free ac isnt bad
Excitable - 2 to init - going first is never bad
Use magic device (skilled +1 ) - cause who dont want to weild a wand?
Threatening Defender - cause i might take swift aid
something that add knowledge local for more social skills.

i love skills, and i get 7\lvl as cavalier 9 as SD.


If one need only the shadow of your allies - it's a done easy deal .
Is there and official FAQ ? Or is it a reasoning ?


The ability of hide in plains sight reads :
"

shadowdancer can use the Stealth skill even while being observed. As long as she is within 10 feet of an area of dim light, a shadowdancer can hide herself from view in the open without anything to actually hide behind. She cannot, however, hide in her own shadow.
"
It suggest a SD CAN hide in other people shadow ?


What spell or item can create dim light so SD can hide ?


second non orthodox character: a one man army:

cavalier lvl 1-6, shadow dancer lvl 7-10, cavalier rest.
in a melee group take order of the dragon otherwise take order of the sword .
combine 3 archtypes:(no ability overlap):
Beast Rider for special AC
Emissary for movement and feats
Honor Guard for extra feat and aid.
a level 9 character will have :
hide in plain sight + spring attack for nice combat and scouting.
full animal tiger for pouncing goodness and tanking and grappling OR a spring attacking t-rex.
a shadow for de buff, and scout.
load of skills, bab -1 and load of feats and tricks.
2/day +6 damage with smite.
aid another = +3 for skill / saves etc.
swift aid feat to allow free aids for party .
bodyguard offer +4 armor 3/round, mounted combat protect the mount if you ride it.

conclusion:
you can fight ok, power attack and spring attack and mount = not the top damage, but a decent one.
amazing off combat use - aid others, gather inforamtion, track and scout.
great survival with spring attack and HIPS and a tank to hide behind.

later / alternate develop:
1. replace human with aasimar for celestial mount.
2. replace mount with a gryphon
3. if aasimar - with 2 feats you can learn how to fly

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