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What happens when a creature with the spell-like ability to teleport (self only) attempts to escape via teleportation with another object or creature stuck to it via sovereign glue?
Does said object or creature go with it? Or are they left behind, allowing for an easy method of separating two glued creatures?
I think that's up to the GM.
But there's got to be a rule for it somewhwere! There are rules for everything! And if not, the game designers aren't doing their jobs!
J/K. :P
Seriously though, I want to glue my military saddle of resistance +5 to my eidolon so that it will go with him when I dismiss him from the material plane. Do you think that would work?
It was the flying/grappling/teleporting vrock discussion that put me on this line of thought. :)
I think that's up to the GM.But there's got to be a rule for it somewhwere! There are rules for everything! And if not, the game designers aren't doing their jobs!
J/K. :P
Seriously though, I want to glue my military saddle of resistance +5 to my eidolon so that it will go with him when I dismiss him from the material plane. Do you think that would work?
It was the flying/grappling/teleporting vrock discussion that put me on this line of thought. :)
I think you should consult your eidolon before glueing something to its back! Seriously, I think it would chafe endlessly and whenever you called him back, he'd be royally peeved at you.
As to the larger question of escaping via teleport, I've always had a minor problem with that. It would seem to me that if one is bound (ropes, grappled/pinned, "held", sovereign glue, etc) one would have a hard time getting away anyhow, and if one were to pull it off, the binding objects or persons would certainly come along (if desired).
Teleport is an act of volition, so I'd say you can bring what you want with you as long as it abides by the guidelines (I'd also say you can leave behind what you want, as well).
Summoning and dismissal is not teleport, IMO. It involves bringing something (specific) from another plane. The dismissal sends that something (specific) back to its original plane. I don't think that specifically allows tagalongs. Now, if you can have the saddle glued to the Eidolon while it's on its home turf, then I think you get different results here.
I personally would have to say the once glued the two pieces effectively become one. As for justifying it in game...look at other "permanent" effects. If your eidolon becomes blinded or turned to stone, does it keep this condition after you dismiss it? I remember in 3.5 a Paladin's mount recovered from all conditions when summoned again(I may be wrong, its been a while since that came up). So yeah you can glue your saddle to it, but then the GM can turn it into a nice statue for you to ride.
You are essentially asking 2 things.
Can a creature take a possession with it?
Can a creature teleport while being attached to something?
As to the first question...
If you are playing in a normal game, a person's clothes go with them when they teleport. I see no difference between wearing a shirt, and wearing a saddle. (no jokes please.)
As far as other items go (manacles, armor, swords, etc), I would say that a good rule of thumb is that if the object is carried or worn, it goes with the creature. Therefore, a pair of manacles would go with the teleporter (they are worn), but the mount the creature is sitting upon would not (the mount is not being carried).
As to the second question...
I would argue that if the creature were chained to a wall, the teleporter and chains would both remain behind. Effectively, the chains are part of the wall in this example. Likewise, if a creature is glued to a wall, it is effectively part of the wall just as much as each individual brick or stone is an individual item, but becomes part of the wall as a whole unit. You can't move the creature without also moving the thing it is attached to. Since it can't carry the wall with it, it cannot teleport until it is separated from the wall.
Also, I like the idea of teleporting messengers delivering sealed envelopes, or doing a quick grab-and-dash with an important item. So the "Can it be carried?" question works for plot hooks as well as combat.
Anyway, that’s my 2 coppers.
I personally would have to say the once glued the two pieces effectively become one. As for justifying it in game...look at other "permanent" effects. If your eidolon becomes blinded or turned to stone, does it keep this condition after you dismiss it? I remember in 3.5 a Paladin's mount recovered from all conditions when summoned again(I may be wrong, its been a while since that came up). So yeah you can glue your saddle to it, but then the GM can turn it into a nice statue for you to ride.
Good point, but blinded and petrified are conditions that affect the subject whereas sovereign glue and saddle are objects attached to the subject. The point I'm trying to make is summoning/dismissal involves the borrowing and return of extra-planar stuff, and the ride they take involves that extra-planar stuff, with no hitchhikers.
Remember, there is also a distinction between Summoning and Calling that may be relevant in this discussion as well.
Doesn't work regardless of whether it interfaces with teleport, plane shift, or the like.
The Eidolon only exists in the form of the Eidolon when it is summoned by the Summoner. It is "an aspect of a creature", not a creature in and of itself. When an Eidolon is dismissed, it ceases to exist as the Eidolon.
I would argue that if the creature were chained to a wall, the teleporter and chains would both remain behind. Effectively, the chains are part of the wall in this example. Likewise, if a creature is glued to a wall, it is effectively part of the wall just as much as each individual brick or stone is an individual item, but becomes part of the wall as a whole unit. You can't move the creature without also moving the thing it is attached to. Since it can't carry the wall with it, it cannot teleport until it is separated from the wall.
Reminds me of that cool bit from Jumper where he's stuck to his girlfriend's apartment and with a huge force of effort teleports a great big freakin' chunk of it into the river.
Very cool. Have to try to figure out how to work that into a game, it would be an awesome effect.
It was better than "Push." Much better.
Ugh. What wasn't?
The sovereign glue is a CL 20 transmutation effect, and has text stating that it joins two items in a permanent union: very strong joining magic. Only its counter-item Universal Solvent can break this bond, so I think it makes items bonded permanently, but not with the kind of give and flexibility a saddle would likely have to have. I would think yes on it surviving tport, but no on it being really viable for a mount.
It doesn't say, however, that it has to be inconvenient. My arm is permanently attached to my body, but that doesn't make it hard to use. I don't get the impression that sovereign glue is meant to make something feel like it's a cursed item.
What happens when a creature with the spell-like ability to teleport (self only) attempts to escape via teleportation with another object or creature stuck to it via sovereign glue?
Does said object or creature go with it? Or are they left behind, allowing for an easy method of separating two glued creatures?
Sovereign Glue is bonding virtually any two substances together in a permanent union. Basically, it forces you to carry whatever you are attached to. Teleport allows you bring along objects as long as their weight doesn’t exceed your maximum load.
So if you are glued to a table - or a saddle - and you can carry the said table under your maximum load, you should be able to escape via teleportation by RaW. If you are glued to the floor... good luck! A DM could allow you to depart with the flagstone or the plank of wood your are glued to however.
As for the eilodon and the glued saddle, I think this is a different issue, as this is about summoning rather than merely teleporting. I'm not sure to what extent there is a distinction by RaW. But in the case of the eilodon, I'd stand by Zurai's interpretation.
'findel
The Eidolon only exists in the form of the Eidolon when it is summoned by the Summoner. It is "an aspect of a creature", not a creature in and of itself. When an Eidolon is dismissed, it ceases to exist as the Eidolon.
Huh. I've never looked at it that way. I always thought of the eidolon as a distinct (if amorphous) creature from another plane. I guess I picked up that line of thought from all the people in the fighter VS balor threads commenting that the balor would know the eidolon due to his high knowledge checks. If the eidolon is an aspect, as you say, wouldn't that mean knowledge checks wouldn't do you any good (since every eidolon is different, and because they are essentially a magical effect/class ability rather than a true creature).
If the eidolon is an aspect, as you say, wouldn't that mean knowledge checks wouldn't do you any good (since every eidolon is different, and because they are essentially a magical effect/class ability rather than a true creature).
IMO:
A knowledge check would identify what an Eidolon was in general, that they're tied to a Summoner, and what the general capabilities of Eidolons are. Observing a specific Eidolon and making a knowledge check might enable the observer to make a guess at the abilities of that specific Eidolon, especially if they're obvious (wings = flight, etc).
Never saw it. My wife did and she didn't like it, so I never bothered to rent it.
Reminds me of that cool bit from Jumper where he's stuck to his girlfriend's apartment and with a huge force of effort teleports a great big freakin' chunk of it into the river.
At the risk of derailing the thread, I rented it yesterday. It was OK.