If you have a magic weapon and you want to add a special property to it, can you? or do you need to start from scratch and remake the whole thing. I assume its the later, but I could find no definate answer either way. The close thing I could find, which is why I am leaning towards no, is the comment that you must decide if it will shed light before its finished. Thanks in advance.

If you have a magic weapon and you want to add a special property to it, can you? or do you need to start from scratch and remake the whole thing. I assume its the later, but I could find no definate answer either way. The close thing I could find, which is why I am leaning towards no, is the comment that you must decide if it will shed light before its finished. Thanks in advance.

I believe you can "upgrade" magic weapons, at least to my understanding.

paul halcott wrote:

If you have a magic weapon and you want to add a special property to it, can you? or do you need to start from scratch and remake the whole thing. I assume its the later, but I could find no definate answer either way. The close thing I could find, which is why I am leaning towards no, is the comment that you must decide if it will shed light before its finished. Thanks in advance.

I believe you can "upgrade" magic weapons, at least to my understanding.

See page 553 in the Core Rulebook.

You are correct! Thank you.

It depends.

If you want to add say Keen to your +3 short sword you can just upgrade it.

If you then decide you want to have an adamantine keen +3 short sword, you would have to start from scratch.

Special materials are set when you create the weapon, magical properties can be added after.

The time to upgrade would still need to be done over the course of one day per $1,000 Gold Pieces in the base price of the upgrade - but would not have to include the base price of the item before the upgrade.

How about if you had an item like an Amulet of Mighty Fists, +1, and you wanted to add Flaming or some other ability. Safe to assume the same rules apply?

You can add flaming to Amulet of Mighty Fists +1, but you would need to use the proper formula. Amulet of Mighty Fists +1 is determined by

Base Price = (Enhancement Bonus Squared) X 5

So adding Flaming to this would make the cost the same as a Amulet of Might Fists +2($20,000 Gold Pieces) less the price of the Amulet of Mighty Fist +1 ($5,000 Gold Pieces). The upgade would be $15,000 Gold Pieces and you would have you would have your Amulet of Flaming Mighty Fists. At least, that is how I have always adjudicated the price/upgrade.

Great! Thanks for the info.

You can add flaming to Amulet of Mighty Fists +1, but you would need to use the proper formula. Amulet of Mighty Fists +1 is determined by

Base Price = (Enhancement Bonus Squared) X 5

So adding Flaming to this would make the cost the same as a Amulet of Might Fists +2($20,000 Gold Pieces) less the price of the Amulet of Mighty Fist +1 ($5,000 Gold Pieces). The upgade would be $15,000 Gold Pieces and you would have you would have your Amulet of Flaming Mighty Fists +1. At least, that is how I have always adjudicated the price/upgrade.

Perfectly correct, though I'd add that in this particular case, the Amulet does not need to be +1 first. You can make a 5000gp Amulet of Mighty Fists, Flaming only.

If you have a magic weapon and you want to add a special property to it, can you?

You can add anything, but you can't change anything.

So you can't change Flame to Flaming Burst for instance, but you could add Flaming Burst.

paul halcott wrote:

If you have a magic weapon and you want to add a special property to it, can you?

You can add anything, but you can't change anything.

So you can't change Flame to Flaming Burst for instance, but you could add Flaming Burst.

As a DM I would allow a person to "upgrade" Flaming to Flaming Burst. Flaming Burst functions as Flaming except with added effects. So upgrading a +1 Flaming Weapon to +1 Flaming Burst should be possible in my opinion. It would be fairly rediculous to need to make a weapon +1 Flaming, Flaming Burst... that would cost as much as a +4 weapon and have the same effects as a +1 Flaming Burst that only costs as much as a +3?

It would be fairly ridiculous to need to make a weapon +1 Flaming, Flaming Burst... that would cost as much as a +4 weapon and have the same effects as a +1 Flaming Burst that only costs as much as a +3?

I agree, especially since the flaming burst quality is purely additive to the flaming quality.

If any DM would allow you to improve weapons (moving from +3 to +4, for instance) and you have the prereqs, there's no reason they'd prevent you from moving from flaming to flaming burst.

Benjamin Trefz wrote:

It would be fairly ridiculous to need to make a weapon +1 Flaming, Flaming Burst... that would cost as much as a +4 weapon and have the same effects as a +1 Flaming Burst that only costs as much as a +3?

I agree, especially since the flaming burst quality is purely additive to the flaming quality.

If any DM would allow you to improve weapons (moving from +3 to +4, for instance) and you have the prereqs, there's no reason they'd prevent you from moving from flaming to flaming burst.

That's the way I do it. Honestly, flaming burst is more like a +1 bonus that has Flaming as a prerequisite (synergy power). But, they didn't add synergy abilities until MIC, so you didn't see them in the core book.

As a DM I would allow a person to "upgrade" Flaming to Flaming Burst.

I probably would too, but it doesn't make it by the rules. RAW you can't change anything, only add.

Magic Item Compendium has rules for upgrading, including breaking down the two-part enchantments like Flaming Burst into enchantment upgrades. There's a lot of good ideas for handling magic items in that book, even if you don't even use a single new item from it.

+1, the MIC is one of the better WotC books. Plenty of great items, rules, ideas, TABLES and other crunchy bits yet (almost) nothing is overpowering/broken/abusable.

Benjamin Trefz wrote:

As a DM I would allow a person to "upgrade" Flaming to Flaming Burst.

I probably would too, but it doesn't make it by the rules. RAW you can't change anything, only add.

By the RAW, Flaming Burst is defined as: "A flaming burst weapon functions as a flaming weapon that also..."

It isn't explicitly stated, but it definitely seems like the RAI... and if not, it definitely falls under the DM's discretion to say yes. I don't know of anyone that would claim that Flaming and Flaming Burst aren't related. Under the Item Creation rules, the only change for creating one over the other is +2 CL and the extra +1 enhancement which relates to costs.

+1, the MIC is one of the better WotC books. Plenty of great items, rules, ideas, TABLES and other crunchy bits yet (almost) nothing is overpowering/broken/abusable.

It's weird that the later WotC splatbooks were some of the best books for revamping or streamlining existing mechanics or offering useful insight on how to play. In particular, PHB2 has some fantastic ideas for fleshing out characters for players new to the game and MiC has some great writing about what magic items are in 3e and how to handle them as a GM and a player.

And then the best splatbooks late in the life of 3.5 are ostensibly GM books. Dungeonscape in particular has a fighter variant that hits the right balance of power and flavor, probably the best skilly baseclass ever, and some very smartly designed feats.

Funny how life works.

paul halcott wrote:

If you have a magic weapon and you want to add a special property to it, can you?

You can add anything, but you can't change anything.

So you can't change Flame to Flaming Burst for instance, but you could add Flaming Burst.

if I was playing and my DM ruled that way, I would demand that my +1 flaming, flaming burst longsword does 1d8 +1 magic +2d6 fire damage(1d6 for flaming, 1d6 for flaming burst) and does 2d8 +2 magic +1d6 fire +1d10 fire damage on criticals

if I was playing and my DM ruled that way, I would demand that my +1 flaming, flaming burst longsword does 1d8 +1 magic +2d6 fire damage(1d6 for flaming, 1d6 for flaming burst) and does 2d8 +2 magic +1d6 fire +1d10 fire damage on criticals

And if your DM followed RAW, he would grant that demand.

grasshopper_ea wrote:

if I was playing and my DM ruled that way, I would demand that my +1 flaming, flaming burst longsword does 1d8 +1 magic +2d6 fire damage(1d6 for flaming, 1d6 for flaming burst) and does 2d8 +2 magic +1d6 fire +1d10 fire damage on criticals

And if your DM followed RAW, he would grant that demand.

I would be ok with that. Just as long as the abilities already added were not being wasted.