In order to best rescue your friends I would suggest either use of Simulacrums or summoned monsters to get them all to the same point. With the Simulacrums you get multiple weaker yous that will have spells, and can help distract the Balor while you go about your real mission of rescue.

Each one will cost 5,000 gp to make though so it's a bit expensive.

Summon Monster 9 should be on your spell list and Trumpet Archons have the heal spell on their list.

Ghaele, and Astral Devas are both on the Summon 9 list and provide nice back up too in addition to healing abilities (getting your allies back up and backed up with celestial allies could give you all the edge you need to win this fight... if not the celestial back up may convince the Balor it's better off retreating for the moment before coming back if nothing else to see what exactly is happening).

They also have several other spells that can be of good use, and will distract the Balor even more.

On a related note, your fellow players are going to respect you a lot more if you save their characters from dying than if you take out this Balor by yourself.

I totally agree with LT... particularly since you mentioned you are new to the gaming group. This is the social aspect to the game.

You take out the Balor by yourself - they could view you as a glory hog and XP grabber.
You try to take out the Balor and FAIL - you get branded a glory-hog/fool who can't assess the risks correctly.
But if you save the other party members - you are a team player who thinks of the party first. That is worth BANK in my experience.

Protection from Evil. Don't want to have to worry about the Dominate Monster that he gets at will.

thanks for the input ppl :)
i was thinkimg all of this as a rescue mission, just want to be rdy for worst senario ;)

cheers !

hope to find the rouge on the way ;)

That Balor might be a Balor Lord for what you have said. The nastiest thing one of those can do to you is cast Quickened Antimagic Field and grapple you.

I wouldn't be so reckless to engage him without fodder ... I mean a without a party.

By the way, Shapechanging into an Ettin is a decent way to avoid decapitation's unfortunate side-effect. Also Mind Blank blocks True Seeing so is nice to learned that spell in you are planning on using true seeing.

Save the cheerleaders, save your ass!!

Humbly,
Yawar

Don't forget that if you take the forementioned leadership route, You'll also get a cohort (i.e. paladin) who can fight the balor while you save your teammates

That Balor might be a Balor Lord for what you have said. The nastiest thing one of those can do to you is cast Quickened Antimagic Field and grapple you.

I wouldn't be so reckless to engage him without fodder ... I mean a without a party.

By the way, Shapechanging into an Ettin is a decent way to avoid decapitation's unfortunate side-effect. Also Mind Blank blocks True Seeing so is nice to learned that spell in you are planning on using Improved Invisibility.

Save the cheerleaders, save your ass!!

Humbly,
Yawar

EDIT: the correction is bolded.

All this stuff and no one has mentioned THE SINGLE MOST IMPORTANT aspect of this fight!

All fights like this boil down to ONE thing:

Initiative.

If you go first and you've prepared your 9th and 10th level spells, etc, you have a solid shot at winning.

If the Balor goes first in initiative then you won't be able to cast a spell before he begins his offensive stuff.

And you're hosed.

Get a great Dex and gloves of Dexterity. Get Improved Initiative and the Trait (if traits are allowed) that gives you a +2 Init. There's a Feat in the Complete Scoundrel that lets you reroll Init once per day -- get it if you can.

This is NOT a fight you can survive if YOU DON'T GO FIRST.

All this stuff and no one has mentioned THE SINGLE MOST IMPORTANT aspect of this fight!

All fights like this boil down to ONE thing:

Initiative.

If you go first and you've prepared your 9th and 10th level spells, etc, you have a solid shot at winning.

If the Balor goes first in initiative then you won't be able to cast a spell before he begins his offensive stuff.

And you're hosed.

Get a great Dex and gloves of Dexterity. Get Improved Initiative and the Trait (if traits are allowed) that gives you a +2 Init. There's a Feat in the Complete Scoundrel that lets you reroll Init once per day -- get it if you can.

This is NOT a fight you can survive if YOU DON'T GO FIRST.

Putting your hopes in defeating a +11 in initiave is not likely a reasonable strategy. With (Improved maybe) Invisibility + Mind Blank + Ranks in Stealth its very likely to go first anyway (surprise round).

If the OP choses to go 1 on 1 against the Balor he should try to the best of his ability to determine the result before said Balor rolls for for initiative (Surprise! Time Stop + any of the strategies post above)

Humbly,
Yawar

"Mind Blank blocks True Seeing" Not so.

Mind Blank blocks See Invisibility because it is a divination spell. Nothing except fog, walls, or physical barriers will prevent the balor from targeting you.

The only thing I can think of that prevents implosion is Gaseous Form. But then you would need still and silent spell feats, and would not be able to use equipment.

Time Stop.
UMD a Resurrection scroll on each dead party member.
Summon/gate the best angels or archons or whatever.
UMD whatever other great cleric scrolls you can.

Kiss your ass goodbye!

"Mind Blank blocks True Seeing" Not so.

Mind Blank blocks See Invisibility because it is a divination spell. Nothing except fog, walls, or physical barriers will prevent the balor from targeting you.

Actually True Seeing is a divination spell too.

From mind blank:
"The subject is protected from all devices and spells that gather information about the target through divination magic (such as detect evil, locate creature, scry, and see invisible). This spell also grants a +8 resistance bonus on saving throws against all mind-affecting spells and effects. Mind blank even foils limited wish, miracle, and wish spells when they are used in such a way as to gain information about the target. In the case of scrying that scans an area the creature is in, such as arcane eye, the spell works but the creature simply isn't detected. Scrying attempts that are targeted specifically at the subject do not work at all."

Divination spells are prevented, True seeing is a divination spell therefore it's block. Heck the mind blank spell even blocks wish and miracle, so I don't see why you could say it wouldn't block true seeing (which is essentially super see invisibility).

Opps! Right you are Abraham spalding. How did I miss that True Seeing was also divination?

It seems like the Balor's SR isn't that big of a problem. 21(CL)+4(improved spell penetration)+2(elf racial) and you are at +27 to beat SR 31. Easy.

Energy drain would be a nice spell. Easy ranged touch, easy to beat SR, and rapidly defangs the balor. Plus, you can pretend to the the Dark Emperor, and tell the balor to join the dark side while level draining it!

Haste yourself, some gates, try a baleful polymorph. those are just some thoughts.

A nice strategy could be to Greater Polymorph youself into a Green Dragon. or, use quickened true strike with a Demon Slaying Longspear.

Demon Slaying= +5 Axiomatic Holy Bane (Evil Outsiders) Cold Iron.
Works well with pretty much any weapon, be it melee or ranged, so you could feasibly do a sling. Advise having a way to keep hold of it to protect against telekenesis. (a leather lanyard works remarkably well).

Also, Can you have artifacts?

You said Pathfinder-core, but also 21st level. On the assumption that means you have access to epic feats, I suggest you take Multispell so you can have an extra quickened spell per round.

Greater Shout is sonic damage and a small chance of stunning him. Unfortunately deafening won't help with spell-like abilities. Definitely summon if you can (quickened summons might slow him down minutely). Quickened Protection from Fire before anything though - or Form of the Dragon III (Gold).

Prismatic Sphere is also awesome.

Haste yourself, some gates, try a baleful polymorph. those are just some thoughts.

A nice strategy could be to Greater Polymorph youself into a Green Dragon. or, use quickened true strike with a Demon Slaying Longspear.

Demon Slaying= +5 Axiomatic Holy Bane (Evil Outsiders) Cold Iron.
Works well with pretty much any weapon, be it melee or ranged, so you could feasibly do a sling. Advise having a way to keep hold of it to protect against telekenesis. (a leather lanyard works remarkably well).

apply aforementioned magic affects to a havy Crossbow AND a bolt, sit back, feel BA

apply aforementioned magic affects to a havy Crossbow AND a bolt, sit back, feel BA

Unfortunately, I am pretty sure that mgical effects on a weapon AND ammo dont stack.

Otherwise, that would be a murderous combo!

Run you fools.

Cool idea´s !!
Im going for the steakth strat, and avoid fighting at all cost, BUT i i know my DM well, wich i do. :p he wont let me rescue them without a fight..

hmm make 3 wall of force in a triangle around him, transmute LOTS of mud from the seeling and the put another wall of force on top of him, transmute the mud to rock,, AND diminsion llock around hom so he can teleport,

hmmm... :)

well thanks again for all the help and input guys! :)

I'd say Gate in a Solar ASAP then hope that distracts the Balor while you hide behind something and cast something that might save your ass if the Solar goes down.
Of course, if you don't win initiative your chance of dieing increases 99%.

you're gonna have to give us at least a summary of how this end up

you're gonna have to give us at least a summary of how this end up

I think it's going to involve him throwing up a Wall of Force then the Balor teleporting behind him and throttling him to death.

Cast GATE then call another Balor to fight with the Balor.

haha Yes!
will update and tell u how it went !

friday night i guess i will die..ehrrhhmm slay the demon ;)

Cast GATE then call another Balor to fight with the Balor.

Then you have 2 Balors trying to kill you.

Is it too late to suggest wishing yourself and your companions to a safe location on another plane? That gets you out of the immediate danger and then you can go back with a full party, guns blazing.

Then you have 2 Balors trying to kill you.

With 21 caster levels he can control a 20HD outsider like a balor... But he couldn't control a solar, which could attack him or simply teleport back.

a) If you need more time buffing up yourself, consider maze instead of time stop - on yourself :)

b) Insane but worth a try:

Plane shift to good-aligned plane (better: demiplane with no portals), time stop, then gate in the very balor you want to fight, and while still time stopped (he cannot act yet), plane-shift back. A balor has no plane shift, so he's pretty much stranded and out.

Cartigan wrote:

Then you have 2 Balors trying to kill you.

With 21 caster levels he can control a 20HD outsider like a balor... But he couldn't control a solar, which could attack him or simply teleport back.

I suppose that's technically true. But there are some points here:

The first point is quite true. The other, I don't know... If the sorceror is evil or neutral, or if his alignement is not known, the Solar might not like being brought to fight a balor (and probably a marilith) without any preparation and a powerful, menacing figure watching his back.

If he wants to kill a balor, he can always gate it himself on his plane, and share the fun with other angels.

Telekinesis is another problem. Max out UMD and use a scroll of spell immunity for telekinesis. OTOH, your Will saves are going to be good, so you will probably not be getting telekinesed in the first place.

If you are trying to counter the Balor's tactic of using Telekinesis to either pull you into melee with him or as a violent thrust attack to hurl you where you don't want to be (into a pool of lava?), you can always cast Enlarge Person on yourself. Telekinesis has a limitation of 375 pounds. Unless you weigh under 47 pounds to begin with (including gear) then you should have no problem exceeding Telekinesis' limitation here.

This will also give you a marginal (size) bonus to CMD (disarm, grapple etc) but make you an easier target to hit (size penalty to AC).

Cheers

cast Enlarge Person on yourself

That's good advice and a use for that spell I always overlook. The bigger problem than the AC penalty, though, is that you'd occupy 4 squares instead of 1. If you're relying on mind blank/greater invis to avoid being targeted that quadruples the balor's chance of picking a square you occupy.

Unless this is a solo session with just one player and the GM, it seems to me to be in the GM's interest to allow a quick 'in and out' rescue mission; otherwise the other players are going to be sitting there polishing their dice for however long it takes a multiple summonings convoluted fight to play out so that they can find out if they need new characters or not?

Lord oKOyA wrote:

cast Enlarge Person on yourself

That's good advice and a use for that spell I always overlook. The bigger problem than the AC penalty, though, is that you'd occupy 4 squares instead of 1. If you're relying on mind blank/greater invis to avoid being targeted that quadruples the balor's chance of picking a square you occupy.

Add that to the cons side of the equation. ;)

Cheers

The first point is quite true. The other, I don't know... If the sorceror is evil or neutral, or if his alignement is not known, the Solar might not like being brought to fight a balor (and probably a marilith) without any preparation and a powerful, menacing figure watching his back.

If he wants to kill a balor, he can always gate it himself on his plane, and share the fun with other angels.

On this note, if you're good, why not try plane shifting to a celestial, balor-hating, angel-filled plane, and try convincing them to help save your mighty champions of good (based on a little inference here. dunno the actual alignments. prolly a better chance of success if you have a palading in your group.)

Mind blank to defeat true seeing.
Ring of freedom of movement in case you get grappled.
Greater Invisibility with quicken spell in case he dispells invisibility.
Start with a very high CON to try and get HP to 151+ in case balor power word stuns you.

If you can prebuff mind blank and greater invisibility, do that. Then gate in creatures. Make sure you have an ioun stone that gives you +1 caster level. You need CL22 to control solars. Cast gate to gate in 2 solars. Each gate requires 10k gp in components so you need a bunch of gold for material components. Multiple gates as needed.

Should be a simple battle after that.

Mind blank to defeat true seeing.

Ring of freedom of movement in case you get grappled.
Greater Invisibility with quicken spell in case he dispells invisibility.
Start with a very high CON to try and get HP to 151+ in case balor power word stuns you.

If you can prebuff mind blank and greater invisibility, do that. Then gate in creatures. Make sure you have an ioun stone that gives you +1 caster level. You need CL22 to control solars. Cast gate to gate in 2 solars. Each gate requires 10k gp in components so you need a bunch of gold for material components. Multiple gates as needed.

Should be a simple battle after that.

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