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Now, much to my disgust the group still hasn't managed to break out of our homebrew backlog to get into the Pathfinder Modules, which irks me on a basic level, but since I promised I'd DM this next game after our last session ended at level 15 with our party Necromancer and Fighter being backstabbed by the Paladin and it all ended in misery because of friction between the Paladin/GM/Rest of the team, and the gang likes my DMing style because I tend to be rather firm on tangents in the game that could lead to such ends.
That and I favoured 'skilled' PCs over 'niche' PCs, but that's a different rant.
Without giving too much away, since I know most of the group also lurks on these boards, the Homebrew is set on a island-continent roughly the size of texas that is separated from a continent by a short stretch of ocean. Once a volcano of massive proportions that exploded in primordial times, the island-continent is home to Hobgoblins, Goblins, Humans, a unique breed of Lizardfolk and a species of deer-like humanoids. The primary enemies are, at low-level, bandits, rogue animals, magical accidents and the occasional member of the two main aggressive races, the Elves (very expansionists, slave-taking, racial superiority-complex and completely dependants upon the arcane since they killed off their Gods during the Great Cataclysm to empower their own people with near-immortality, the Elves have enslaved many of the Human races on the continent and it will be a long-running goal in the campaign for the heroes to set out to the north and south, along the coast-lines of the continent, and help free the enslaved Human societies to help push back the Elven overlords.) and the Dwarves (A completely subteranian breed, the Duegar are the 'soldier caste' and the Gold Dwarves the 'ruling caste, with the Hill Dwarves as the 'merchant caste'. Dwarves keep everyone and everything at arm's length and tend to ignore other races' claims to ownership of resources they crave unless the other races can prove they have the might or the wit to force the Dwarves to trade with them for the resources.)
Hobs (hobgoblins) possess their Pathfinder stats but I've gone back to the old 3.5 physical descriptions and made them very much a Spartan/Roman culture, highly civilized but very much a warrior society and very anti-arcane magic that occupies the western side of the island-continent, where they wage war constantly against the Elves and their legions of slave-soldiers, but they have a few tabboos about Clerical and Druidic Magic, so they have a flat +2 Willsaves against magical effects that affect them, so they have to make willsaves against spells like most enchantment, transmutation and necromancy spells, for example. Thus the Hobs lean very much towards Monks, Fighters and other martial, non-magical classes. Acrobatics and Knowledge (Engineering) are always class skills for a Hobgoblin.
Goblins have -2 Strength, +2 Dexterity and a flat +2 Fortitude bonus, but otherwise retain their Patherfinder stats. Less comically evil-shaped and more like small, lithe humanoids with pale yellow-green skin, long wolf-like ears and large black eyes, the Goblins occupy the northern reaches of the island-continent, travelling over the steppes on their worg companions and herding vast flocks and herds of sheep, goat and cattle. I've made their society a cross between the Huns and native american-indians, and there is a cultural pressure to remain in the saddle for as long as you can. Also, Worg-mounts are a sign of greatness, and most Goblins never find a better mount than a Riding Dog. The Fortitude bonus comes from the fact that the steppes aren't the most hospitible place and only the strongest survive the long, cold winters and the starvation that accompanies it. Ride and Stealth are always class skills for these Goblins.
Humans occupy the southern part of the island continent and are mostly protected from Elven intrusions by an unbroken line of ocean-facing mountains. The soil here is quite rich and there are large numbers of natural hot-springs. The primary source of agriculture on the landmass, the Humans here are of average height with skins more dark than light, all hair-color and eye-colour ranges and a very diplomatic and practical attitude. They've survived conquest from the Hobgoblins by being openly supportive of the Hobs and giving a yearly tithe of food to the Hobgoblin's armies. Humans also have the largest number of Wizards and while the Hobs dislike spells, they do love magically enhanced weapons and armor, so the trade works out best for both parties, in that the Hobs have their magical equipment without sullying their own hands and the Humans have their borders protected without shedding any of their own blood. Diplomacy and Linguistics are always class-skills for a Human of this Island-Continent.
In the center of the island-continent is the desert region, where the underground lake of magma still occasionally boils to the surface and the sand-dunes alternate between pale yellow, dark blood red and obsidian black. This is where the Lizard-folk Race dwells. No Racial HD, no natural armor bonus, with a sexually dimorphic build. Females are the larger of the two, and the most sedentiary, being commonly unavailable for play, being a +2 CR creature. Females have +2 Str, +4 Con and +2 to Int and Charisma along with the Powerful Build trait. Males are the most numerous and are +2 Dex, +2 Charisma. Both races have a climb speed of 10 feet and a racial bonus of +4 to the effects of heat, but take -2 penalty to innitiative and rolls in cold-weather and could roughly be described as humanoid Skinks with an endless variety of horns and frills that run from their heads down to the small of their backs with many and varied scale-patterns and colourations. Desert-dwellers, they live in small cities carved out of natural rock or failing that, mud-brick houses with fired-clay tile roofs, and are a bigamist society, with the females ruling the various houses and the males competing against each other in magic, cunning and wealth to be admitted into those houses. Outright war between these communities is frowned upon, and instead the Skinks compete by ritual combat, using blunted weapons stained with pigments to mark the 'wounded and fallen' or by comparing their wealth or other skills, but the Males of the species do form roving bands to hunt down bandits and the ever-present scourges that rise up from deep underground. Females have very earthy attitudes, while the males by contrast seem to be driven to whimsy or outright bursts of chaotic frenzy to win their place in their society. After several generations of conflict, the 'Skinks' don't get along well with the Hobs, but do trade often with the Goblins and Humans, a power-block that alarms the Hobgoblins who fear being trapped between the Elves and these strange lizards. Appraise and Sense Motive are always class skills for this race. They do not have Darkvision or Low-light vision.
Still working on the deer-folk, but they will be a very rare, very reclusive race on the far eastern side of the island-continent, where heavy forest is the norm. I'm basing the race very roughly on the Faun from the Deities and Demigods manual, but replacing the racial HD and the Fey type with the 'Fey Blood' special trait that gives them a +1 bonus to Diplomacy and Bluff and the Wild Empathy class ability, with -2 Strength, +2 Dexterity and +2 Wisdom. I'm thinking of letting them have Low-light vision and being able to use a feat to gain access to Scent. Perception and Survival are always class skills.
So, is there anything I should be watching out for with these builds? Anything anyone else can spot before I start making some hard changes to the plot?
[Might be a double post, this thread is fighting me tooth and nail...]
The Hobgoblins and 'Skinks' are statistically marginally better than the Humans and Fauns, and the Goblins a smidgen worse, but with some attractive options for the Goblins, and tempering the urge to give the Hobs and Skinks anything more (like a bunch of racial skill bonuses or something, to flavor them up), none of them seem wildly out of line.
I like that you've pretty much taken dwarves, elves, halflings, gnomes and half-orcs/half-elves off the PC menu, but replaced them with some neat alternatives. Your description of the wolf-riding Goblins was particularly cool, and the kiva-dwelling 'Skinks,' as well. While I love what Pathfinder has done with its Goblins, I feel that extending that look to the Hobgoblins and Bugbears led to some uninspiring artwork, so going back to a 3.5ish Hobgoblin look also very much is in tune with my own preferences.
In that vein,
Claudio Pozas' take on Hobgoblins was always interesting.
[Might be a double post, this thread is fighting me tooth and nail...]
The Hobgoblins and 'Skinks' are statistically marginally better than the Humans and Fauns, and the Goblins a smidgen worse, but with some attractive options for the Goblins, and tempering the urge to give the Hobs and Skinks anything more (like a bunch of racial skill bonuses or something, to flavor them up), none of them seem wildly out of line.
Any suggestions for making the Goblins a little better? I was half tempted to give Hobs and Gobs racial weapon proficiencies, such as Shortspear and Short Sword for the Hobs, given their martial, Spartan-esque bent and Lance and Shortbow proficiency for the Goblins, given the bent for mounted combat. I am also a little concerned about the racial skills for the Skinks, but given that the players will have access to the male half of society alone and thus need good social skills to increase their PC's 'Worth', I suspect the best I could do without unbalancing them would be to give a raical bonus to climbing.
On the other hand I might just scrap the climbing speed and racial bonus altogether and just give the Skinks a minor fire resistance or maybe some spell-like abilities to further expand upon the Hob/Skink issue.
I like that you've pretty much taken dwarves, elves, halflings, gnomes and half-orcs/half-elves off the PC menu, but replaced them with some neat alternatives. Your description of the wolf-riding Goblins was particularly cool, and the kiva-dwelling 'Skinks,' as well. While I love what Pathfinder has done with its Goblins, I feel that extending that look to the Hobgoblins and Bugbears led to some uninspiring artwork, so going back to a 3.5ish Hobgoblin look also very much is in tune with my own preferences.
I love Half-Orcs, I really do, they're lone wolves at best, social pariahs through no fault of their own, but I like a 'clean' fantasy game every now and again, ie one you can just play and not sit back and wonder about conflicting biologies or the deeper social stigmas, and this one will have ZERO crossbreeds. No Half Orcs, Half Elves or any other mortal crossbreeding. Half-Fiends and Half-Celestials, yeah, but other than that, NO. Also, I am a big fan of World of Warcraft (Well, before BC and the [censored] Elven Plague came to roost in Orgrimmar like genital herpes.) and I've always enjoyed 'turn about' campaigns where the players come to realise that there really isn't much difference between themselves and the so-called 'monsters' they've been hacking their way through for the past 8-9 levels.
When our Paladin first started to learn Orcish in a game many many moons ago, we actually had to hold her up at the table as she realised that "Gahmag, orthor bi'dth!", the phrase she'd heard a young Orc screaming to an older one as the females of the tribe ran away actualy translated to "Daddy, don't die!"
Claudio Pozas' take on Hobgoblins was always interesting.
Okay, that is epic. You're making me want to include Orcs in the campaign and I'm trying not to to get outta this damn rut! Hobgoblins have, after Orcs themselves, always been my favourite 'nonstandard' race to play.
Any suggestions for making the Goblins a little better?
Access to wolves, for use as mounts, with a slightly lower price than a 'riding dog,' perhaps, so that a PC Goblin has a decent chance of starting out with a wolf, either as a mount, or as a companion (just not using animal companion rules, it's a bog-standard wolf, that he has to train and direct through Animal Handling). Perhaps a Goblin who takes a wolf, dire wolf or worg as an animal companion counts as a level higher. Perhaps a Goblin arcanist doesn't need to learn Improved Familiar if he wants to call a Wolf as a familiar at 3rd level (or, if he waits until 5th level, a celestial or fiendish wolf)?
Perhaps Goblins, and only Goblins, can take the Wild Cohort feat, and only for wolves.
Instead of Stealth as a class skill, keep Ride as a class skill, and then give him a +2 racial bonus to Ride and Handle Animal (or Wild Empathy) checks vs. wolves or wolf-like critters (worgs, winter wolves, etc.).
I was half tempted to give Hobs and Gobs racial weapon proficiencies, such as Shortspear and Short Sword for the Hobs, given their martial, Spartan-esque bent and Lance and Shortbow proficiency for the Goblins, given the bent for mounted combat.
Sensible choices, and since the shortspear is a simple weapon, while both goblin weapons are martial, that gives a bit of an extra perk to the Goblins.
I am also a little concerned about the racial skills for the Skinks, but given that the players will have access to the male half of society alone and thus need good social skills to increase their PC's 'Worth', I suspect the best I could do without unbalancing them would be to give a raical bonus to climbing.
I'm not sure about the Appraise thing. I'll have to go re-read, but I didn't really see that one thematically. Climb, sure.
How do these competitions for being taken into a females 'house' work? Do they perform somehow for the females attention? Do they mock duel? Do they really duel? Do they bring expensive gifts? Do they preen and primp and look as 'seksy' as they can for her nibs viewing pleasure? Do they compete socially with each other, trying to get the most impressive reputation they can to secure an invite?
If 'yes' to all (or most) of the above, then the Skinks suddenly have an abundance of character options to play with. One might adventure to increase his fame and reputation. One might adventure for loot, so that he can buy his intended many pretty things. One might adventure for exotic exploration, so that he can bring a fussy matron an intriguing item that she has never seen before for her collection of things from around the world. One might adventure to build up his fighting skill, because the matron whose house he wants to enter requires potential new males to duel one or more of her current crop of males for right of entry. One might seek exciting new tales to tell and exotic vistas to describe, specializing in performance to entertain his lady. One might adventure because he's *already* been accepted, but his matron is suddenly at a social disadvantage compared to other matrons, and he has gone out into the world to secure his fortunes (or power, or knowledge) so that he can return and help his matron reclaim her status (and thereby, his own, as one of the mates of a socially-connected and powerful matron).
As a result of this plethora of ways to 'impress the chicks,' an adventuring Skink wouldn't necessarily have a reason to have a racial bonus to any specific skill, since some chicks dig the fighting, and others dig the singing, and others dig the exotic gifts, and others dig the deep pockets of a wealthy boytoy. With no one route to the boudouir, the Skinks don't need to have a bonus to one specific skill (other than Climb, which would remain a racial thing).
Access to wolves, for use as mounts, with a slightly lower price than a 'riding dog,' perhaps, so that a PC Goblin has a decent chance of starting out with a wolf, either as a mount, or as a companion (just not using animal companion rules, it's a bog-standard wolf, that he has to train and direct through Animal Handling). Perhaps a Goblin who takes a wolf, dire wolf or worg as an animal companion counts as a level higher. Perhaps a Goblin arcanist doesn't need to learn Improved Familiar if he wants to call a Wolf as a familiar at 3rd level (or, if he waits until 5th level, a celestial or fiendish wolf)?Perhaps Goblins, and only Goblins, can take the Wild Cohort feat, and only for wolves.
Instead of Stealth as a class skill, keep Ride as a class skill, and then give him a +2 racial bonus to Ride and Handle Animal (or Wild Empathy) checks vs. wolves or wolf-like critters (worgs, winter wolves, etc.).
In regards to that, possibly having every Goblin start off with the chance of a 1/2 price riding dog is an interesting concept. I'll do some number-crunching to see if this will unbalance them a bit too much at low levels. I've got a Prestige Class in mind for Goblins with Worg mounts that basically toughens the Worg up and gives the Goblin access to some potent combat techniques that make up for his short reach and relatively puny martial abilties. So, as things stand now for the Goblin
Goblin Traits: Goblin Subtype, -2 Strength, +2 Dexteruity, Small size, Fast, Darkvision, Skilled (+2 Racial bonus to Ride and Handle Animal [or Wild Empathy] checks vs Wolves or wolf-like creatures [Worgs, Winter Wolves, Dire Wolves, Riding Dogs etc]), Racial Proficiency with Lance and Shortbow (and Composite version), Bonus Skill: Ride, Starting Languages Goblin and Common.
I was half tempted to give Hobs and Gobs racial weapon proficiencies, such as Shortspear and Short Sword for the Hobs, given their martial, Spartan-esque bent and Lance and Shortbow proficiency for the Goblins, given the bent for mounted combat.
Sensible choices, and since the shortspear is a simple weapon, while both goblin weapons are martial, that gives a bit of an extra perk to the Goblins.
Yeah, I thought so as well but I was also worried about overpowering Hobgoblins as the 'only' Melee Race. Nothing stopping a Human from picking up a Bastard Sword and going adventuring, but also wanted to try and keep the Hobgoblin race as a very martially-themed culture.
Damn thread ate my last post. Argh. I'll keep this one short to avoid the site nomming it again. In regards to the Skinks, I think you're right, Set. Keep the Climb speed, drop the Appraise skill and replace it with Orision-level arcane spell castable number of times per day equal to the charisma bonus and the race should be golden. Keeping Sense Motive as the main adventuring goal of the Skink is nominally to find a way to join a high-ranking Female's Harem and eventually work his way up to Prime Mate.
So that's Skink (male) Reptilian Subtype, +2 Dex, +2 Cha, Medium Size, Normal Speed. Climb Speed 10 feet, Racial bonus +4 to Climb checks, Racial Skill:Sense Motive, Spell Like Ability: Charisma Bonus/Day (Any Sorcerer/Wizard Cantrip), Languages Draconic and Common.
or goblins gain a companion (similar to animal companion)
If the companion is a riding dog, their effective druid level is their character level/2
If they choose a wolf, It is Character level-2/2
If they choose a worg, it is character level-4/2
I havent seen the stats for goblin dogs, so i can make no suggestion
This may be a bit of a power jump at low levels, but it should even out at high levels