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Anthony Kane,
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I liked the Artificer, but I never felt as though it really translated well into a steam-punk style class. That being said I began to investigate, tinker and rebuild. Thus was born the Engineer class. A class that could replicate spell like affects, but do it with points, that represented little mechanical pieces, that could be built into inventions. The ultimate goal was to create a class that could replicate any spell or psionic power as an effect that would be built into an invention, and while they possess amazing flexibility in terms of what they could learn or know, they would ultimately be restricted by the number of inventions they could build and how effective those inventions could be. Looking for questions, comments, concerns. Please note, this post is going to be rather long. Thanks
BAB: Poor
LVL Special
Level Number of Inventions
Invention Points
Theory Level
Number of Theories Known
Weapons and Armor Proficiency: An Engineer is proficient with all simple weapons, plus the light hammer and war hammer. The Engineer is proficient with all light armors, but not with shields. Engineer's Knowledge (Ex): An engineer adds half his class level (minimum 1) to all Knowledge skill checks and may make all Knowledge skill checks untrained. Minor Tools & Gadgets (Ex): An Engineer possess a tool kit of random standard and custom made tools that are used to perform a variety of tasks. This tool kit is ever changing and growing as the character advances in level. Minor Tools and Gadgets can replicate the effect of any zero level spell from any class list. They may be used an unlimited number of times per day. Further more these tools are non-magical, the produce no magical aura, are not subject to spell resistance, and function within an anti-magic field. An Engineer may only have a number of Minor Tools & Gadgets equal to his class level + Intelligence modifier. Any save DC for these items is equal to 10 + Intelligence Modifier. Trapfinding: An Engineer adds 1/2 her level to Perception skill checks made to locate traps and to Disable Device skill checks (minimum +1). An Engineer can use Disable Device to disarm magic traps. Inventions, Theories, and their game applications: 101
Invention: An invention represents an item to which a theory has been assigned with Invention Points as a Function. Inventions allow theories to work. They are nonmagical devices, and thus are not subject to spell resistance and they work even within an anti-magic or anti-psionic field. Inventions are normally large size, requiring 2 hands to wield, or take up 2 body slots of magical items if they are worn, although they can be made larger or smaller with the appropriate genius. Invention Points: These represent the use of minor tools, components, batteries, wires, and other items required to make an invention work. Often considered the “nuts & bolts” of an invention. In order for an Engineer to assign a theory as a function to an invention he must spend the appropriate number of invention points based on the theory's level, which is the same as the spell or psionic power level it is based off of. By spending invention points the Engineer assigns the theory as a function to his invention that is usable once per day for each time that he spends the required number of invention points to assign the theory as a function. Function: A function is a theory that has been assigned to an invention with invention points. Functions are usable 1 per day, for each time the Engineer spends the invention points required to assign it. Functions may be swapped out of an invention, or removed completely, and thus return the appropriate number of invention points. This concludes the basic terminology guide. Theories: The Engineer does not cast arcane/divine spells or manifest psionic powers. Instead all of his inventions are based of theories that he then builds into his inventions, at which point they become functions. An Engineer begins play knowing only 3 theories + those gained from his intelligence modifier. At each level he gains access to more theories, as shown under the column labeled Number of Theories Known. An Engineer need not immediately assign an theory to one of his theories known, he can choose to leave it open so that it may be filled with a new theory that he comes across later (see below). The highest level theory a Engineer can know is a listed under the column Theory level.
Inventions: Engineers use inventions to replicate the effects of artificer infusions, arcane/divine spells, or psionic powers. While these inventions replicate these effects they are not magical or psionic and thus are not affected by spell or psionic resistance, and they do function even within an anti-magic/psionic field. The maximum number of inventions an Engineer may have at any given time is listed under Number of Inventions, although he may add to this number by taking the genius/feat: Extra Inventions, that would increase his number of inventions by 1.
Normally an Engineers are the only people that can use inventions without risk to themselves. Characters from other classes who do not have levels in Engineer can attempt to use an Engineer's inventions but at great risk to themselves and others, unless the Engineer has built that invention with the “Simplify Invention” feat/genius. To use an invention, you must make a use magic device or use psionic device (this is determined by the theory that replicates the spell's or power's effect), but at a -10 penalty. If you succeed then you manage to make the invention work once. If you fail by 5 or less the invention works, but cannot be used again until the Engineer spends 1 round repairing the invention. If you fail by more than 5, the invention does not work at all, and still requires the Engineer to spend 1 round repairing the item. If you fail by 10 or more, the invention completely suffers from a catastrophic malfunction and explodes dealing 1D6 points of damage, per theory level, per theory that was assigned to the invention to all creatures within 10 feet per 10 invention points (rounded down) in the area. All creatures within the area,except for the person using the invention, can attempt a reflex save for half damage. The invention points are returned to the Engineer after he spends 1 round picking up the pieces of invention. Invention Point cost based on Theory level
Swapping Functions within Inventions: Sometimes the Engineer will find himself in a situation where none of his current inventions will serve him. At times like this he is able to “disassemble” his inventions and rebuild or modify them by swapping or changing out their functions. Swapping functions or rebuilding and invention takes time. First the Engineer must know the function that he wants to replace the existing function with. Second he may only swap functions of equal or lower invention point costs. Once the function is removed the appropriate number of invention points are returned to the Engineer (based on how many invention points were assigned to that function). The Engineer may then spend these points as he sees fit when assigning the new function to the invention. When swapping inventions it takes one 1 time increment longer to swap the function than the normal casting time for the spell or power the theory is based on. Thus if an Engineer is swapping out a function that takes standard action to activate, it takes the Engineer 1 full found to swap out the function. In cases where the new Functions activations time (aka casting/manifesting time) is not the same, the increased time increment is based on the function with the highest casting time. When totally rebuilding an invention, to serve a different function, the engineer needs to disassemble enough inventions to gain back the required number of invention points needed for each time he wishes assign the new theory as a new function to the new invention. Disassembling inventions takes their normal activation time, for each use removed. Once the Engineer has the required number of invention points back, he can then reassemble the parts of his old inventions into a new invention, and assign the invention points as needed, granted rebuilding and item like this takes twice the normal time it takes to normally activate the item. Thus to create a new invention, using parts from old ones, the engineer must first spend the required time disassembling his previous inventions, to gain enough inventions points back. If he requires 7 invention points and needs to disassemble 7 inventions all with 1 invention point, and all have functions of 1 standard action, then it takes him 7 standard actions to disassemble them all, at which point he now has 7 invention points.
While swapping or rebuilding inventions in combat an engineer faces the same problem as if he is being attacked while trying to activate or use his invention (see below). Despite not having a “caster level” (see below), an Engineer does need to concentrate to swap functions or rebuild his inventions in combat. Any situation that would cause a spell caster to have to make a concentration check, forces an Engineer to do the same. Despite not having a caster level, he is able to make a concentration check. 1D20 + Engineer class level. If he succeeds then he maintains concentration and can continue working on swapping the function or rebuilding the invention. If he fails then no work is accomplished that round, but unlike spell casters, he can attempt another concentration check next round to resume working on swapping out the function or rebuilding the invention. An Engineer can reduce the amount of time it takes to swap functions or rebuild inventions by taking the Genius/Feat: Compartmentalized Inventions. An Engineer can improve his concentration checks to maintain concentration on swapping out a function or rebuilding an invention in combat by taking the feat: Combat Engineer. Engineers and Caster Level Here is your simple rule: ENGINEERS HAVE NO CASTER LEVEL. An Engineer has no caster level, because his theories are mechanical functions of his inventions that replicate a spell or power's effect. How powerful theory that replicates a spell or power is in effect is based on the number of Invention Points the Engineer assigned to it when making it into a function of his invention. This means that inventions are not subject to spell/power resistance, they cannot be counter spelled, and will function within an anti-magic/psionic field. In the same token though, Engineer's automatically fail any check to overcome spell resistance, unless the spell/power ignores it completely. They cannot use their inventions to create counter spells. If attacked in combat, while trying to use his inventions or swap out functions, and Engineer must still make a special concentration check. For the purposes of making a concentration check, while an Engineer does not have a Caster Level, he is able to make the following roll to avoid being distracted from working on his inventions in combat: D20 + Engineer class level + Intelligence Modifier. Exception to rule:
Calculating Saving Throws for Inventions.
Bonus Invention Points at any given level:
Engineers, Constructs, Living Constructs, Warforged, and Effigies An Engineer can build his inventions into any construct, living construct, warforged (which are living constructs), or Effigies, so long as he has the appropriate class ability (see Craft Effigy or Imbue Living Construct geniuses below). To do so the Engineer uses up one of his inventions and builds it directly into the subject. He spends all required invention points as normal. The subject may not have an invention larger than its size built into it. It can carry only 1 invention of equal size, or multiple smaller inventions. Constructs and Effigies will not use their inventions on their own, and thus must be commanded to do so. Warforged and living constructs are self aware and thus are able to use inventions on their own, simply by thinking about it. Even though the subject may not have class levels in Engineer, all of these creature types are able to use the Engineer's inventions without having to make the normal use magical or use psionic device check for characters without Engineer class levels attempting to use inventions not built with the Simplified Invention feat. Invention points spent this way are used up permanently until the Engineer brings in the subject and follows the normal rules for swapping, or removing inventions to regain the invention points. (Needless to say some intelligent Warforged or Living Constructs are not to happy about giving up inventions once they've been built into them).
Genius: Geniuses
Feats that can be taken as Geniuses: Note that the following feats are specific towards the Engineer class. He may choose these with normal feat slots as well. -New Feat type: [Invention Feat]
Combat Engineer [General]
Compartmentalized Inventions [Invention feat]
Extra Invention [General]
Extra Theory [General]
Miniaturize Inventions [Invention Feat]
Simplified Inventions [Invention Feat]
Supersize Inventions [Invention Feat]
Enlarge Function [Invention Feat]
Extend Function [Invention Feat]
Maximize Function [Invention Feat]
Quicken Function [Invention Feat]
Widen Function [Invention Feat]
Other feats that can be taken: Combat Genius: You can learn any one combat feat. (You can only take the Genius once) Skilled Genius: You can take the Skill Focus feat. (You may select this Genius multiple times, each time applying it to a new skill). Item Creation Feats: You may take any item creation feats for which you meet the prerequisites for. Even though you do not have a Caster level, for the purposes of meeting the prerequisites for these feats you may treat your Engineer class level as your caster level. (This Genius may be selected multiple times, each time, adding a new Item Creation feat to your list) Genius - Research Specialties: (each of these Geniuses may only be selected once) Arcane Researcher: You are well versed in researching and examining arcane spells and lore, and thus translating their effects into written theories for you has become more easy. Whenever you attempt a Knowledge Arcana check to turn an arcane spell into a Theory you receive a +4 bonus to the roll. Divine Researcher: You are well versed in researching and examining divine spells and lore, and thus translating their effects into written theories for you has become more easy. Whenever you attempt a Knowledge Religion check to turn a Divine spell into a Theory you receive a +4 bonus to the roll. Meta-Psychological Researcher: You are well versed in researching and examining psionic powers and lore, and thus translating their effects into written theories for you has become more easy. Whenever you attempt a Knowledge Psionics check to turn an Psionic Power into a Theory you receive a +4 bonus to the roll. Other Geniuses & Optional Class Features: Quick Disable (Ex): It takes an Engineer with this ability half the normal amount of time to disable a trap using the Disable Device skill (minimum 1 round). Smart Combatant (Ex): You may choose to substitute your Intelligence modifier for your Strength or Dexterity modifier when you are attacking with a melee or ranged weapon. Smart and Deadly (Ex): Choose one list or group of weapons from those listed under the Fighter's weapon training class feature. You may add your intelligence modifier as a bonus to all damage rolls made with any weapon from that group. This bonus to damage may not exceed your Engineer class level. Smart Defense (Ex): You may add your Intelligence modifier to your armor class. This bonus may not exceed your Engineer Class level. If you are in a situation that would deny you your dexterity bonus, you lose the bonus to AC from your Intelligence modifier as well. Craft Effigy (Ex): With this Genius an Engineer can create constructs known as Effigies (see complete Arcane, page 151 for details and the template). Unlike other creatures the Engineer need not possess the craft construct feat to complete this task, nor does he need the feat or ranks in knowledge (architecture and engineering) to repair an effigy he creates. For the purposes of this ability the Engineer treats his class level as his caster level for the purposes of determining the maximum Hit Dice of an effigy that he can create.
Imbue Living Construct (Ex): Any Living Construct or Warforged, here after referred to as “the subject”, may be augmented by the Engineer with invention points. To do so the Engineer uses up one or more of his inventions, building it into the living construct or warforged, thus allowing him to invest that many invention points into the subject. An subject can only carry as many inventions as its size will allow. Thus a medium sized warforged can only have 1 medium sized invention built into it, or it can carry up to 2 small sized inventions. Unlike characters who do not possess levels in Engineer, living constructs and warforged who have inventions built into them (not trying to use a separate external invention), can simply activate them through thought, and do not need to make the standard use magical or use psionic device to avoid having the invention malfunction.
Trap Sense (Ex): By taking this Genius an Engineer gains an intuitive sense that alerts him to danger from traps, giving her a +1 bonus on Reflex saves made to avoid traps and a +1 dodge bonus to AC against attacks made by traps. These bonuses rise by +1 for every 3 class levels gained after taking this genius. Trap sense bonuses gained from multiple classes stack. Trap Spotter (Ex): Whenever an Engineer with this genius comes within 10 feet of a trap, he receives an immediate Perception skill check to notice the trap. This check should be made in secret by the GM. Other Standard Class Features Item of Power (Su): At 4th level the Engineer can build for himself an Item of Power. This item can either take the form of a weapon or armor, and it is treated as having a +1 enhancement bonus to either attack and damage rolls if its a weapon, or provides and additional +1 bonus to AC if tis a piece of armor. For every four levels gained thereafter this items bonus continues to increase by an additional +1 at 8th, 12th, 16th, and 20th level. This item is not magical, and functions within an anti-magic field, but it is treated as having the listed bonus for the purposes of overcoming damage reduction or striking a creature that would require the listed bonus.
Decode Item (Ex): At 5th level and higher, an Engineer can more easily figure out what makes magical and/or psionic items tick. When making a use magical or use psionic device check, an Engineer can take 10 even if distracted or threatened. Enhancement Bonus (Su): At 6th level the Engineer gains the ability to enhance the item of power that he gained at 4th level. He can add any one special ability to his weapon or armor that does not exceed a +1 enhancement bonus.
Advanced Geinuses
Advanced Research Degree's: Master of Arcane Theory
Master of Divine Theory
Master of Meta-Psychological Theory
Other Advanced Geniuses Bonus Feat (Ex): An Engineer can use any of his Advanced Geniuses to gain any bonus feats that he qualifies for. Chief Engineer (Ex):
Construct Body Guards (Ex):
Disable Construct (Ex):
Push Technology's Limit (Ex):
Airship
Airship: Colossal vehicle; Airworthiness +6; Ship handling
Giant Robot
Living Construct
Pocket Dimension
The size of the plane is equal to how many invention points you invest into it. For every 17 invention points used, you are treated as having cast the spell once. Conjuration (Creation)
You create a finite plane with limited access: A demiplane. Demiplanes created by this spell are very small, very minor planes. You can only cast this spell while on the Etheral plane. When you cast this spell a local density fluctuation precipitates the creation of a demiplane. At first the fledgling plane grows at the rate of 1 foot in radius per day to an initial maximum radius of 180 feet as it rapidly draws substance from the surrounding ethereal vapors and protomatter.
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Anthony Kane,
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Any comments at all... The only feed back I've had so far with this is from a friend of mine who is also a DM and that was over IM Chat. He didn't see much wrong with it, but then again, he was just skimming through it. I would really appreciate some feed back. Thanks
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Abussou,
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Hi Anthony, I am impressed with the amount of thought behind the creation of this class. Saying that, it strikes me as being too complex. Between 'Invention', 'Invention Points', 'Theory Level' and 'Theories Known', there seems to be a lot of bookkeeping. Maintaining a running tally of Invention Points spread over numerous inventions could be troublesome in higher levels. Also, despite being a fairly elegant system, it seems out of place with the mechanics used to run/create other characters. For instance, no other classes use a dual dynamic as the Engineer does with the Invention/Theory points. The class also has features and abilities of 5 separate classes, making it very versatile.
Other points
- The Inventions are not magic based, therefor not subject to spell/power resistance, they cannot be counter spelled, and will function within an anti-magic/psionic field. Then why do they automatically fail any check to overcome spell resistance? - Intelligence is litterally the be all, end all stat for this class, all others are dump stats. If I have this correct; as is possible now, a genius level Engineer with 20 Int, at lvl 5 with the 'Smart Combatant', and 'Smart Defence' Feats would have +7 to Hit (+2BAB + 5 (Smart Combatant)) and +5 to AC. And that is without creating an item that provides 'Fox's Cunning.' - What would happen if a Invention that produces an 'Anti-Magic' shell, were to be hit by 'Dispel Magic'? Since the Invention is not a magical device, with an 'Anti-Magic' shell that cannot be dispelled, what magic could stop him? Final thoughts:
Scott |
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Anthony Kane,
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Quote:
Well thanks for the commentary, Scott. I'll try to address your comments and concerns as clearly as possible. I'll admit, that the Invention Point System does seem rather complex. I ran this by several people I know and once I explained the system and showed them how it works, its actually fairly simple, its just that the tables make it look deceivingly complex. Pretty much this class makes it the PCs responsibility to keep track of what each invention can do. And for the DM/GM its fairly easy to do a point audit, as you just tell the player to add up all invention points from all inventions, and that should equal his invention point pool. Honestly the Invention Point system that I settled on was the simplest and most flexible way to represent the rapid construction/deconstruction of equipment without having to develop a completely separate table for parts A-Z and how said parts could be combined to produce said effect. The other solution would be the artificer infusion method, but as stated previously, I wanted to move away from the “infusion” feel. This resulted in the class having a very build it/use it feel, not shove spell-a into glove-b and presto. The dual dynamic rules unfortunately are the unholy union of a spell point system, and a Psionic Strength point pool. If you look at the table and compare it to Psion in XPHB you'll see I stole the system directly from there. So its not as alien as one might think. As far as the bits and pieces of other classes here are my thoughts:
Quote:
-Fighter (Combat Feats, Int to AC and BAB bonus, Weapon Training) Combat Feats: The Engineer can only pick up one Fighter Combat feat through the Combat Genius. While you can get Int to AC as well as to hit and damage here as some counter points. You can only gain as much as your Engineer class level will allow. As far as weapon training goes, its only applicable to one group of weapons. That being said, due to their low BAB, and Low HP they are inherently not as good in combat as one might think. Quote:
-Rogue (Trap finding, Disable Device, Skill Bonuses) I wanted them to have the ability to disarm traps, and substitute for a Rogue if necessary. Their lack of a good reflex save though means that unlike the rogue, should they fail at disarming a trap, they might be in for a world of hurt. They can compensate for this by devoting multiple Genius's to trap sense but that takes away from other abilities they could use. Quote:
While the class does possess amazing versatility in this field this versatility does not come without its restrictions. With regards to spells and powers, it is specifically stated that the Engineer must first come to experience, learn, be subject to, or witness a said spell or powers effect before he can attempt to write it into a Theory. They can't just pick and choose off all the lists. The only list they have unlimited access to is the Artificer's Infusion list (which they default to). Also with Item creation, they suffer from only being able to create magical items at the minimum caster level. That means spell casters can still create far more powerful magical items, using item creation feats. Quote:
- Are there additional cost of creation? Are the basic costs of the same level of Item Creation feats used? It depends what you're asking this question in reference to. -Effigies, Constructs, Magical Items, yes. -Inventions, no, this is represented by invention points which are suppose to represent all the little mechanical components needed to make said invention work. Quote:
-The Inventions are not magic based, therefor not subject to spell/power resistance, they cannot be counter spelled, and will function within an anti-magic/psionic field. Then why do they automatically fail any check to overcome spell resistance? (Sorry have to errata that) :) Quote:
- Intelligence is literally the be all, end all stat for this class, all others are dump stats. If I have this correct; as is possible now, a genius level Engineer with 20 Int, at lvl 5 with the 'Smart Combatant', and 'Smart Defence' Feats would have +7 to Hit (+2BAB + 5 (Smart Combatant)) and +5 to AC. And that is without creating an item that provides 'Fox's Cunning.' Once again this requires the devoting of 2 Geniuses to make you a decent combatant, and now you have to devote an invention to replicate “Fox's Cunning”. Compare these numbers with marital class of equal level, you'll see its not as unbalancing at you might think. That being said, the Engineer has to devote a lot of resources to just be as competent as a fighter of equal level. Quote:
- What would happen if a Invention that produces an 'Anti-Magic' shell, were to be hit by 'Dispel Magic'? Since the Invention is not a magical device, with an 'Anti-Magic' shell that cannot be dispelled, what magic could stop him? -One a Dispel Magic would fail, as the device is not magical. Does this give Engineer's an unfair advantage against said magic user, yes. But this is where said magic user should never have allowed himself to get into an Anti-Magic shell alone. Like any good magic user, summon minions at this level, have non spell casting classes backing you up, so when some little punk Engineer comes along with his Anti-magic field you simply look at your boys and say, “Get him.” Quote:
Final thoughts: Like most spell casting classes :) If you look at spell lists, spell casters are incredibly versatile and can replicate what other classes can do with spells or powers. A well built cleric, druid, wizard, even sorcerer can be just as deadly. For all the classes advantages it does suffer from some major draw backs with its “spell casting ability”.
But thank you for your comments and concerns. Mind you this is still Version 1.0. As it goes through some testing, and review it may be tweaked for balance/playability issues. AK |
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Nerple,
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The name of this class intrigued me, so figured I would make a few comments that I noticed. This comes with the disclaimer I have never played Eberron and thus I am not all to familiar with the Articifer class or the Warforged and I hate Psionics so I am was reading just from the typical Spellcasters perspective. - Engineer's Knowledge: This makes sense to me for a few of the knowledges (Engineering, Arcana, Religion), but not all of them. I don't see why an Engineer should have bonuses to Knowledge (Geography, Nature, Nobilty, etc) checks. - Trapfinding: I agree with the the bonus to Disable Device, but the perception bonus to trap finding (as well as Perception as a class skill) seems out of place. - Number of Inventions: This seems like an unneeded stat to keep track of. An engineer's power is already limited by the Invention Points category. And with the ability to combine several inventions into one to increase the number of inventions points allowed combined with the fact that one can only wield/wear a few inventions at a time it seems as if the number of inventions is a stat with too many ways to bypass. I'd drop the limit on inventions altogether, probably rename invention points to theory points (just to drop the invention moniker completely and streamline the naming convention) and have the players keep tabs on how many theory points they currently have invested. - Swapping Functions: The way I read the class this ability seems all too fast. I'd drop it entirely and merge it into rebuilding an invention and increase the time it takes to rebuild an invention by a lot. I would gather rebuilding an invention would be measured in hours, not rounds. With the fast speed of rebuilding or swapping now, it seems a skilled engineer could have a huge advantage over spellcasters because they have a limited number of spells per day while the engineer could constantly be swapping and rebuilding. - Geniuses: This is an extremely nitpicky entry granted, but figured I would include it. There seems no need to make each entry into a feat, they are fine enough as their own identity similar to Rogue Talents or Paladin Mercies. And for some reason the the calling of these geniuses strikes me as odd. When I think genius I think more of a sage type of character, perhaps rename them as ingenuities which seems more appropriate for an applied knowledge. - Compartmentalized Inventions: I like this idea, but in keeping with my comments with swapping functions and number of inventions, I'd allow these Compartmentalized Inventions to be quick changes but having each swap-in compartment still count toward invention point total (or at least a fraction of the total). I'd also be careful in making sure players describe how the compartments are built in the invention. - Extra Invention: In keeping with my comment that the number of inventions is an unneeded stat, I'd replace this with a genius that increases one's invention point total. -Optional Class Features: I agree with Abussou, I'd remove "Smart Combatant" and "Smart and Deadly". They seem to be a bit too much for too little of a cost. And it turns Intelligence into by far the most important ability into about the only ability score really needed. - Airship: Another nitpicky entry but nothing seems to cost XP to create in Pathfinder RPG, and would recommend changing the Airship to reflect such. - Enhancement Bonuses, etc: Another nitpicky entry, but I'd condense the entries so that the items of power and enhancement bonuses for both level up at the same time, similar to a Fighters Weapon Training or a Ranger's Favored Enemies. In the end, I love the class idea, I'll probably end up revising it to fit my campaign world and use it in my own campaigns. It does seem to need some streamlining though, when I copied all the text into Word and made the tables to condense everything, it still came out to 12 pages long which seems alot for one class. I have some reservations about the Advanced Geniuses (Mainly that some of the construction ones could be done even without taking the Advanced Genius), but no real suggestions at this time. |
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Anthony Kane,
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First thank you to anyone who gave comments. Its much appreciated. After looking over the class a bit longer I've come to realize it still needs some tweaking. Thankfully I have no released this into my campaign world... yet. Some points I'm going to address:
example wrote:
-I've pulled the Item(s) of Power. It was a nifty idea, but I think its contributing to the OP of the version 1.0 class. -Came up with an easier way to converter Meta-magic/Meta Psionic feats into feats the Engineer can use. -Restructured the Genius Progression. So I will have the "Beta" or ver 2.0 ready in a little while. I'll probably post it in a new thread just so it doesn't get lumped in with the ver 1.0 write up as that will just confuse people. If you have further questions or comments about this version of the class feel free to comment. I'll be happy to discuss further idea's related to this version of the class here. Otherwise just let the thread die off. Once again thanks for the comments and suggestions. AK |
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Eric Stipe,
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The one suggestion i'd make is to have the invention points only work once, then the character must wait until the next day to use them again... ie i build a fire ball gun, use it. then i can only reassign them the next day (like the wizard and spells). it'd stop people from spending every other round rebuilding an item to use it again.
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Urizen
(Pathfinder Roleplaying Game, Pathfinder Adventure Path, Pathfinder Chronicles, Pathfinder Companion Subscriber),
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Very creative. Nice to see something using the psionic points system rather than Vancian. I have to agree with the other posters that the bookkeeping may be a bit intimidating at first and could use some potential to streamline. Since these are inventions, will there be a table or percentile for chances of failure due to damage or malfunction. Given the intricate parts involved in disassembling and reassembling, there could be a chance for error. (Or is this where the concentration checks come in?) But there ought to be some factor for eventual wear and tear after continual usage. Maintenance costs? I'll have to re-read it again regarding the disassembling and reassembling of inventions on the fly; especially in combat. I'm trying to imagine it like in real life when I'm taking something apart and then replacing / fixing it hurriedly that it would take longer than six seconds (one round). I think what Abussou was trying to suggest that when first creating the character, perhaps the Engineer would default by specializing to duplicate arcane theories on sight. Then when a Genius slot is up for availability, he could pick up divine. Later on, pick up psionics. Etc. Keep it in the same aspect where you have your Master Theories / Researchers where he has to pick one of them to excel in (instead of all of them) one at a time. Construct Body Guard - Should be at least 2 levels lower, IMHO. Maybe you should have this to reflect more of the Leadership Feat? Also, being familiar with Eberron, are you using 'Warforged' just as a token type of construct out of convenience? I only ask since Warforged are sentient whereas constructs are not, so it can be possible at times for Warforged to not be 100% loyal. Also, since there's no magic involved, I'm unable to fathom how the Engineer could provide sentience to his creation. Does this make sense? Enlarge, Quicken, etc Functions. They should probably mirror their respective metamagics with regard to possible prerequisites. Otherwise, I do agree about the points expenditure differences (although I wonder if the point amounts should be greater in order to compete with respective vancian casters to keep the 'playing field' leveled. Otherwise, I think this is a pretty cool concept and I'll definitely keep an eye on how it progresses as you revise it to new versions. |
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