I see that there are five main languages spoken in Katapesh. I'm wondering if that's going to have any effect on the Legacy of Fire campaign, for groups with characters from diverse racial backgrounds.

Is it assumed that the Legacy of Fire adventure path will take place mostly in Common, i.e., that every group member speaks at least Common, and that most NPC's will also speak Common?

For example, if a player makes a Keleshite character with no intelligence bonus, does the character only speak Kellish? That would make his life a bit difficult if nobody else in the group speaks that tongue. :)

Or does everyone get Common as a bonus language in addition to their race's main language (if it's not Common)?

I see that there are five main languages spoken in Katapesh. I'm wondering if that's going to have any effect on the Legacy of Fire campaign, for groups with characters from diverse racial backgrounds.

Is it assumed that the Legacy of Fire adventure path will take place mostly in Common, i.e., that every group member speaks at least Common, and that most NPC's will also speak Common?

For example, if a player makes a Keleshite character with no intelligence bonus, does the character only speak Kellish? That would make his life a bit difficult if nobody else in the group speaks that tongue. :)

Or does everyone get Common as a bonus language in addition to their race's main language (if it's not Common)?

All PCs should get Common as a free language in any game, I think, unless the GM and players particularly WANT to play a game where the characters can't understand each other.

As for Katapesh, Common is certainly the assumed language. Some of the NPCs speak Kelish or Osiriani, but no more so than the NPCs in the Varisia regions spoke Varisian or Shoanti.

A character who speaks only Common should be fine in Legacy of Fire.

Thank you very much for the quick reply. :)

So everyone will speak at the very least Common. :)

It's one big-ass bazaar with a nation attached. Not making common standard would be Bad For Trade. And that's about the worst atrocity you can commit in Katapesh - be Bad For Trade.

I also can't help pointing out that it's probably fairly safe to simply give each cultural heritage the (or at least a) relevant language in addition to Common - it's not like speaking Orc is somehow a compelling mechanical balance for the half-orc race. If you have Katapeshi characters, let 'em all speak Common and Kelesh. If you've got a Vudran, let her speak Common and Vudran. The Taldane can suffer with just Common, while the Garundi tribesman gets Common and a local tribal language (which no one else in the campaign will ever speak anyway). Seems pretty simple to me!

I also can't help pointing out that it's probably fairly safe to simply give each cultural heritage the (or at least a) relevant language in addition to Common - it's not like speaking Orc is somehow a compelling mechanical balance for the half-orc race. If you have Katapeshi characters, let 'em all speak Common and Kelesh. If you've got a Vudran, let her speak Common and Vudran. The Taldane can suffer with just Common, while the Garundi tribesman gets Common and a local tribal language (which no one else in the campaign will ever speak anyway). Seems pretty simple to me!

I believe the Garundi speak Osiriani, it's the Mwangi people who speak in the clicks and stuff.

The Taldane can suffer with just Common

They wouldn't want it any other way, after all, Common is nothing else but Taldane (or Chelaxian, depending on who you ask).

I usually grant every PC Common and his racial and/or regional language.

I'm having a lot of fun with language barriers -- in the trade centers, everyone speaks Common, but the scout PC (originally hired by the others as a guide) speaks only Kelish. When he hired on, he used his 3 words in the Common tongue: "Common? No problem! Common!" [Big grin]

For this AP, I'm saying Common is Kelish. So anyone who speaks Common is speaking Kelish.

For this AP, I'm saying Common is Kelish. So anyone who speaks Common is speaking Kelish.

That is much more to my taste.

Saying that Common is spoken by practically everyone, no matter what county you are in, just feels too homogenizing IMHO ("Lost in the middle of the Mwangi expanse? NO PROBLEM: everybody speaks Mwangi/Osirioni AND Common, it says so right there in the Player's Guide!"). Given how easy it is to learn a new language in D&D/PRPG (buying a Linguistics rank), even a PC with low INT who started out not knowing a local language (only communicating thru 1 or 2 other PCs), can trivially pick up the local 'commmon' language... Or have a great role-play opportunity - Not being fluent in the local Common just means you can demand Linguistics rolls, with simple concepts having lower DCs.

I think for Paizo, though, keeping everything to a "Common" baseline just is smoother for the entire player-base - after all, "natives" of US & UK (the main market) are generally quite mono-lingual in their outlook, and it's probably easier on DMs to not worry about language issues at all and simply say 95% of NPCs speak Common. The game-world that implies IS certainly very homogenized, but it's easy enough for those of use who care about such things to remove standard Common proficiency, and replace it with whatever local language the character would have learned growing up.

My take on the Golarion world is indeed that "Common"/Taldane, Osirioni, and Kelesh "compete" for role of local 'common' language wherever they are most dominant... I'd even allow Hallit or Skald to take that role in the far North, so at the Icestair/Crown of the World, most of the Tian traders/military-beaurocrats might speak only Tian and Hallit or Skald, because practically everybody they interact with is either Hallit/Skald or speaks those languages fluently (since they passed thru much Kellid/Ulfen territory to find the Stairs in the first place). But like I mentioned, this requires DMs/PCs to "think about" language issues more so than just giving "Common" a free ride.

I'd say the 'everyone speaks Common' rule applies to 'special' characters only. That is, PCs and story-crucial NPCs. Katapeshi peasants and elves who've never left the forest don't need to speak Common.

I think it would depend on the group. One group might love it, while one group might think it is a big pain in the ass.
I guess, ergo, Paizo's gotta go with the default "common tongue" trope, and let the tower of babel people come up with their own deal.

I think it would depend on the group. One group might love it, while one group might think it is a big pain in the ass.

I guess, ergo, Paizo's gotta go with the default "common tongue" trope, and let the tower of babel people come up with their own deal.

I am thinking of eliminating Common in my next campaign. Being a language student and professional, I feel it is highly unrealistic that everyone knows the same language. Even in a globalized world like the 21st century, you do not have to travel far from England to find natives not wanting to speak what many refer to as the global language.

Being Norwegian, I know Norwegian and Swedish and Danish (but not due to buying skill ranks or intelligence, the languages are very similar). In addition, I speak English almost fluently and could probably communicate very briefly in German. I have studied English in college for four years to reach this level, while D&D characters only have to use a skill point in order to master it fluently.

The thing to watch out for if you eliminate Common is hurting PC communication. If you ditch Common, I heartily suggest picking another language for all of the PCs to know as a bonus language. PCs have to be able to communicate between each other, because the PLAYERS have to be able to communicate with each other.

I am thinking of eliminating Common in my next campaign. Being a language student and professional, I feel it is highly unrealistic that everyone knows the same language. Even in a globalized world like the 21st century, you do not have to travel far from England to find natives not wanting to speak what many refer to as the global language.
It is also far to easy to learn languages. The rogue in my campaign always picks up a couple of new languages every level. He probably knows 9 or 10 languages now.

Being Norwegian, I know Norwegian and Swedish and Danish (but not due to buying skill ranks or intelligence, the languages are very similar). In addition, I speak English almost fluently and could probably communicate very briefly in German. I have studied English in college for four years to reach this level, while D&D characters only have to use a skill point in order to master it fluently.

This is actually something I did in my own campaign world. While a great idea originally, I eventually changed it to facilitate better communication between players and with NPCs. But I still do not have "common," instead what I use is "Trader's Tongue" (the closest earth equivalent would be "pidgin") which, while allowing basic communication, does not allow for deep discussions on any subject - but it is enough to get basic ideas across.

You could have elven be a sort of "common tongue" a la Latin...

You could have elven be a sort of "common tongue" a la Latin...

ahh lingua franca...

Heathansson wrote:

You could have elven be a sort of "common tongue" a la Latin...

ahh lingua franca...

Oooh, that's a pretty good idea as well =)

You could have elven be a sort of "common tongue" a la Latin...

It would be the natural "language of record" when talking about important things like frilly pink tutus or lavender-scented scones.

The natural "language of record" when talking about silly stuff like bashing heads and driving your enemies before you would be orcish, of course.

Someone who doesn't take Kelish in this campaign is just min/maxing or asking for it, IMO. My take is as soon as you head out of the giant city per se, everything happens in the Kelish language in the countryside (especially near camps, villages, nomadic Badawi tribes, etc.)

Tell yourself this: if you're the DM, and a PC creeps up to a gnoll village to listen to what they say, what language would you have the gnoll use?

Same goes for an orc village, halfling village, etc.

Keleshites speak Kelish... and I don't call the D&D default Common tongue "Common," but "Taldane", which grounds the characters in a deeper history and an appreciation of the Grand Taldor Empire!!! :P

The thing to watch out for if you eliminate Common is hurting PC communication. If you ditch Common, I heartily suggest picking another language for all of the PCs to know as a bonus language. PCs have to be able to communicate between each other, because the PLAYERS have to be able to communicate with each other.

I was thinking of giving them the regional language as a bonus language. I'll see how it plays out. As my next campaign will probably be based around the PFS-scenarios, I am envisioning a lot of different nationalities and faction. But as long as picking up a new language only costs a skill point or two, it shouldn't be a problem.

For this AP, I'm saying Common is Kelish. So anyone who speaks Common is speaking Kelish.

That's what I decided for our LoF campaign. North continent = Common is Taldane; South Continent = Common is Kelish

For this AP, I'm saying Common is Kelish. So anyone who speaks Common is speaking Kelish.

I did the same thing. Interestingly, there is now only one party member who speaks Taldan.