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I never thought a second deck of face cards would of been planned since the audience seems to be limited to Pathfinder subscribers. Maybe I'll be proved wrong. Overall I've been very impressed by the item cards, still have many gaps to fill on the item lists.
I think that the only thing making them look like they are related to the pathfinder adventures is the art (which lisa originally said is mostly reused, not sure if that is still the case?) But since they don't have any background on them, they con be used for vanilla mooks with appropriate descriptions
BlkTemplar
(Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Roleplaying Game, Campaign Setting, Companion, Battles Case Subscriber)
How many sets of Face Cards do I need to buy? ;-)Any chance there is a set planned for the Pathfinder Bestiary? Would be awesome to have cards for most of the creatures a group might encounter.If the Face Cards do well, Monster Cards could conceivably eventually follow.
Ditto! Monster cards would be awesome!
Sean
I am REALLY looking forward to getting my hands on these. I love my Friends & Foes set, but I need MORE CARDS. Does anyone know if Paizo is planning on doing any further sets after this? I certainly hope so, and will buy any that that decide to produce.
There aren't any more on the 2010 calendar, but if these first two sets both do well, there could be more in 2011...
i hope that they do well. one problem that i see with them is that while i have 4 sets of adventure gear 1 and 2,and 3 sets of the weapons locker, and at least one of most of the others, the face cards dont lend themselves well to owning multiple packs of them (not that i i havent used them extensively yet)
i wil buy them as long as they are produced.
i use them for my 4th edition greyhawk campaign.
i would love monster cards also. those i could see having multiple decks. attach them to the top of my dm screen, and remove the pictures as the monster is killed. so, the first set like basics: goblins, orcs, kobalds, etc. a deck of nothing but dragons (because those would be like the face books, once the characters kill the dragon, the face is discarded, never to be seen again.)
i would love that, have enough cards to have a full encounter.
thank you paizo. i love game mastery!!
Our official schedule says "late April":
Don't miss the note at the top of the that page—dates shown are when we expect things in our warehouse; retail release dates are generally two to three weeks later. So I'd look for the Enemies deck to hit stores in mid-May.
Looking at the reviews of this, I noticed both complain about quality of the card stock, did you guys use a new printer for this set?
There are 2 sets that were affected by the company that prints the cards switching machines, to one that was calibrated differently. Lisa said in the other thread that they asked the company to use the old machine.
They actually feel like the backs aren't coated at all (or are barely coated), plus the edges are showing damage like what a magic card looks like after it gets wet.
These honestly seem bad enough to return to the printer. Glad it is a short-term problem, as I fear these particular cards aren't going to hold up to use.
There are 2 sets that were affected by the company that prints the cards switching machinesWhat's the other set or can you post a link to the other discussion?
Kingmaker item cards :
Not a problem, glad to have it back to the previous.
However, this morning I compared the two decks (Kingmaker and Enemies) - they are very different. Kingmaker was even a step up in quality in my opinion. I noticed these things:
Wow. The ratings have really scared me off of buying a product I've been looking forward to. Any chance that they'll re-print these with better quality?
Nope, this set will never be reprinted. In general, we don't reprint anything unless we consider it to be an evergreen or we grossly underestimated the demand, such as with the recently released Adventurer's Armory which sold out by its release date. So if you want these cards, you will have to buy them while they are in print.
-Lisa
Nope, this set will never be reprinted. In general, we don't reprint anything unless we consider it to be an evergreen or we grossly underestimated the demand, such as with the recently released Adventurer's Armory which sold out by its release date. So if you want these cards, you will have to buy them while they are in print.
-Lisa
You normally don’t reprint anything? Even the PFRPG books? (With the exception of Adventurer Armory) That’s a bit disappointing, in the case of errata that needs to be fixed. If you don’t reprint, it would never be corrected. It would be one thing if the errata is minor, but if there is a lot of mistakes found over a period of time, it would be nice to get a reprinting so you wouldn’t have to always refer to an errata pdf.
Edit: Also, wouldn’t that make it extremely difficult to find the books later on if no reprints are ever done? I know with almost all novels, they are printed quite a few times even over a couple years.
Nope, this set will never be reprinted. In general, we don't reprint anything unless we consider it to be an evergreen or we grossly underestimated the demand, such as with the recently released Adventurer's Armory which sold out by its release date. So if you want these cards, you will have to buy them while they are in print.
-Lisa
You normally don’t reprint anything? Even the PFRPG books? (With the exception of Adventurer Armory) That’s a bit disappointing, in the case of errata that needs to be fixed. If you don’t reprint, it would never be corrected. It would be one thing if the errata is minor, but if there is a lot of mistakes found over a period of time, it would be nice to get a reprinting so you wouldn’t have to always refer to an errata pdf.
Edit: Also, wouldn’t that make it extremely difficult to find the books later on if no reprints are ever done? I know with almost all novels, they are printed quite a few times even over a couple years.
The PFRPG core books are considered "evergreen", so they get reprinted as needed, incorporating errata each time. APs, setting sourcebooks, and gaming aids do not receive reprints except in isolated cases.
Wow. The ratings have really scared me off of buying a product I've been looking forward to. Any chance that they'll re-print these with better quality?
Don't let the ratings scare you off too much.
There is an obvious quality difference, but that doesn't make it bad quality. It is just below usual Paizo quality.
The PFRPG core books are considered "evergreen", so they get reprinted as needed, incorporating errata each time. APs, setting sourcebooks, and gaming aids do not receive reprints except in isolated cases.Nope, this set will never be reprinted. In general, we don't reprint anything unless we consider it to be an evergreen or we grossly underestimated the demand, such as with the recently released Adventurer's Armory which sold out by its release date. So if you want these cards, you will have to buy them while they are in print.
-Lisa
You normally don’t reprint anything? Even the PFRPG books? (With the exception of Adventurer Armory) That’s a bit disappointing, in the case of errata that needs to be fixed. If you don’t reprint, it would never be corrected. It would be one thing if the errata is minor, but if there is a lot of mistakes found over a period of time, it would be nice to get a reprinting so you wouldn’t have to always refer to an errata pdf.
Edit: Also, wouldn’t that make it extremely difficult to find the books later on if no reprints are ever done? I know with almost all novels, they are printed quite a few times even over a couple years.
Ok, thank you. I guess I should have clarified what 'evergreen' was before assuming.
Although I will admit it is a bit disappointing still for the sourcebooks as they can get their share of mistakes as well. Also, never mind them being hard to find in only a short while (because of only one printing).
With the Adventurer's Armory, it is fortunate there is a reprint, because from reading the official thread for the book, Sean has corrected quite a few mistakes that were in the book through posts. I do hope the next printing the book shows the corrections Sean brought up in his posts.
As for other books, I would rather just wait for another printing, where I would hope the 2nd printing would be errated. But with how the rules are apparently set up in normally no more than one printing, that would not happen.
Although I will admit it is a bit disappointing still for the sourcebooks as they can get their share of mistakes as well. Also, never mind them being hard to find in only a short while (because of only one printing).
With the Adventurer's Armory, it is fortunate there is a reprint, because from reading the official thread for the book, Sean has corrected quite a few mistakes that were in the book through posts. I do hope the next printing the book shows the corrections Sean brought up in his posts.
As for other books, I would rather just wait for another printing, where I would hope the 2nd printing would be errated.
We've been doing this for a while and generally have a really good idea of how many copies we need to print. We print enough to cover subscribers, a certain amount for distribution to book and hobby stores, and some more for our online store. In almost every case, that means we still have print copies available from our online store six months to a year after the book's release (though most books tend to be down to a small number of copies in our warehouse after a year or two). Which is good, because we'd rather a book sell out in a reasonable amount of time than have to sit on copies for years that aren't selling.
And given that it's cheaper to do a larger print run than two smaller print runs, it's more cost-effective for us to print enough for that sellthrough duration than to make a small print run that sells out in 6 months, then do another small print run and pester retailers to restock an item that's 6 months old.
So, except for evergreen products (primarily the Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook and the Bestiary, which keep selling steady numbers every month) and the rare exception (like Adventurer's Armory, which sold out right away), we don't plan to do reprints.
I mean, we still have copies of Pathfinder AP #2 in our warehouse, and that's almost three years old. And that was a good seller.
Also, understand that even if we don't plan a reprint, we still note significant errata, so if there's a question, we can answer it (the discovery and comment ends up in the book's product page).
Also, understand that even if we don't plan a reprint, we still note significant errata, so if there's a question, we can answer it (the discovery and comment ends up in the book's product page).
You do Sean, but Paizo could do a better job at this. For most of your products, except for mostly the 'Evergreen' products, your erratas are posts in the forums, which can be annoying to track down, very annoying, and has been a complaint of mine and my only complaint against Paizo since post Dragon/Dungeon days.
To me this is a Major complaint, and at one time I actually thought about not buying your products anymore due to lack of support for an easy method in tracking down erratas, but the overall quality of your products stopped that from happening, but it was a close call.
We've been doing this for a while and generally have a really good idea of how many copies we need to print. We print enough to cover subscribers, a certain amount for distribution to book and hobby stores, and some more for our online store. In almost every case, that means we still have print copies available from our online store six months to a year after the book's release (though most books tend to be down to a small number of copies in our warehouse after a year or two). Which is good, because we'd rather a book sell out in a reasonable amount of time than have to sit on copies for years that aren't selling.And given that it's cheaper to do a larger print run than two smaller print runs, it's more cost-effective for us to print enough for that sellthrough duration than to make a small print run that sells out in 6 months, then do another small print run and pester retailers to restock an item that's 6 months old.
So, except for evergreen products (primarily the Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook and the Bestiary, which keep selling steady numbers every month) and the rare exception (like Adventurer's Armory, which sold out right away), we don't plan to do reprints.
I mean, we still have copies of Pathfinder AP #2 in our warehouse, and that's almost three years old. And that was a good seller.
Also, understand that even if we don't plan a reprint, we...
*Nods*
Thanks Sean. Yes, what you said makes sense, and I do know when you buy things in bulk (i.e. making larger print runs), it is more cost effective.
I guess it’s just the finality of the “we don’t plan to do reprints” that hit me a bit. As long as you can still get a hold of supplements easily enough (at a reasonable price) several years down the road, I am ok with it.
And as for the errata side, would you at least put out an errata pdf for the book if mistakes were found? Instead of having to do a search on the product thread for the book and sift through all the posts by yourself (or someone else in Paizo) that mention corrections or clarifications?
And since there will be a reprint for Adventurer’s Armory, will the new printing show the errata you have brought up in the product thread?
To me this is a Major complaint, and at one time I actually thought about not buying your products anymore due to lack of support for an easy method in tracking down erratas, but the overall quality of your products stopped that from happening, but it was a close call.
I'm in that camp as well. I really hope that within the next year or so, rules products start getting a link to a convenient PDF of errata notes. Sifting through the boards to find errata just isn't practical with the board setup.
One option might be for the boards to start allowing editing of older posts, so that the top post on a product's support page can contain the "blessed" errata for that product.
The quality of the products overall is superb, though.
I'm probably more frustrated than anyone about the pace at which we're able to get errata out and organized (and a rules FAQ as well). Alas, priorities have to be priorities, and in this case, those priorities mean getting our current schedule ON schedule. In fact, we stand a VERY good chance of getting mostly on schedule in a few short weeks (when our printer deadline for Gen Con hits).
When did we get off schedule? When we lost the magazine license 3 years ago. We knew the license was gone close to a year before it was going to end, and thus not only did we have to keep the magazines on schedule, we had to start ramping up for Pathfinder so that we could start that the VERY DAY the magazines ended. While we got our first AP out on time, the cost of double duty hurt and we've generally been a week or two behind schedule as a result.
Then, the game edition changed. And we ended up building our own reincarnation of the 3.5 rules to give us a stable rules set to work with. That pretty much threw the next three years into chaos as well.
So now, we're a half year after the release of the Pathfinder RPG, and for the first time in those three years, I'm actually starting to think that we'll for-reals get caught up on our schedule. Hiring more editors and developers has certainly helped. Getting more experienced at handling these new book products and game products has helped even more. But what's going to help the MOST is that now Paizo's more or less in charge of its own destiny. Not working with a license that can change or go obsolete means that we can stop trying to catch up or reinvent things every year, and that's going to be nice.
Because not only does that mean going back to working 40 to 50 hour weeks (rather than 60 to 80 hour weeks), it means we'll have time to actually perform maintenance on our product lines. The most important (to me) of which is getting errata and a rules FAQ up and running.
Don't expect this to magically appear the day after our Gen Con shipping deadline. But HOPEFULLY we'll be able to start working on that soon thereafter.
Personally, I won't believe it until it happens, given the chaos and mayhem that the past three years has hammered into my brain. But I've got a LOT of faith and hope that it will indeed happen soon, because it's really starting to feel like we're getting there.
Of course, replying to messagboards with super-long posts like this one won't really help us get back on schedule... so I better run and get back to work! :-)
I mean, we still have copies of Pathfinder AP #2 in our warehouse, and that's almost three years old. And that was a good seller.
Good example and bad example at the same time.... PF #2 is the only pathfinder that has gotten reprinted.
After it got reprinted it sat on the shelf :)
you can also read Vic's reasons for not reprinting
Don't let the ratings scare you off too much.
There is an obvious quality difference, but that doesn't make it bad quality. It is just below usual Paizo quality.
Honestly, I feel they are bad quality. I can pick up a pack of Bicycle cards at the local grocery store, 2 for $4, that uses a higher quality stock and finish than this most recent entry. They do not lie flat, and do not erase as well as other cards(that is, not well at all). Granted, I understand the difference in art, presentation, and overall value. However, considering the expected level of quality, and that you are paying $11(before sub) for these, I expected better.
As you can see I have MANY subscriptions. The reason why I have this many subscriptions is because Paizo generally puts out a high quality product, and I've been impressed by their attention to detail and quality of artwork in all of their product lines.
I was extremely disappointed by this set of cards when you consider they are the same price as previous sets of cards which have way more quality and value. Sadly, I feel ripped off by this deck. To the point where I was considering dropping this subscription. I've decided to wait and see if another deck of cards comes out displaying this poor of a quality in the future. If it does I will be dropping the subscription and waiting for reviews before buying again. Or maybe just forget about the card line altogether.
The artwork is very good, but the quality of the cards is so bad, I don't expect them to last very long before they show wear. Where they are die cut the edges bend downwards making them more difficult to handle. After a few uses I expect the edges to show some wear because of this as well.
I recommend everyone passing on this deck, and instead buy the Friend's and Foes deck which was done in a higher quality for the same price if you would like a deck of faces.
It's a shame about the poor quality of these cards; I was really looking forward to them. Is there any chance they might be reprinted and improved?
Not really. We'll do our best to make the cards to come improved, though, as Erik says above, but we have no plans at this time to reprint the Enemies face cards.
There will very definitely be more Face Cards in the future.
They will very definitely NOT be printed on the cardstock used for this set.
While I did write a 1-star review for these cards it is things like this that make me love paizo's Gamemastery line. You guys can admit when a mistake is made and correct it for future releases. That is good enough for me to trust you when the next set comes out that it will be up to the standards everyone expects. Good save!