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Downer Vol. 2 has been pushed back to next summer.
What the hell!? How does a book originally scheduled to come out in November 2007 get pushed back to Summer of 2008? All I can think of is a book created for 3.5 but now pushed back b/c of 4th edition stats...which would obviously make no sense for a comic :)
Sales for the first book have taken longer to get where we want them than we'd anticipated, and a big reason is because the book didn't get much penetration into the book trade. I think I can get both of them in at once the second time around, but plans like that take longer to hatch thanks to solicitation deadlines, etc. Also, releasing a fan-driven book like this around the summer convention season means that we can cover our costs more easily through direct sales at Origins, Gen Con, etc.
Sales for the first book have taken longer to get where we want them than we'd anticipated, and a big reason is because the book didn't get much penetration into the book trade. I think I can get both of them in at once the second time around, but plans like that take longer to hatch thanks to solicitation deadlines, etc. Also, releasing a fan-driven book like this around the summer convention season means that we can cover our costs more easily through direct sales at Origins, Gen Con, etc.
Thanks for the explanation, Erik. Maybe I shouldn't have assumed everyone was a rabid Downer fan like I was. I sure hope Zogonia did well for you. That was 1 of the best D&D comics I've ever read, and I started w/ Fineous Fingers back in the day. Anyway, at least I have all the original Downer strips from Dungeon, so I'm not on pins and needles w/ a cliffhanger ending (cough*Halo 2*cough). I'd just like Kyle to profit more from his great strip.
Bummer, I was all set to add this to my current order so I could finish up the story. Sure, I've got my issues of Dungeon (not sure if my back issues go back to where Book 1 leaves off) but it was so much better to read the story as one cohesive lump instead of the monthly 2-page episodes (or, in the case now, flipping through issue after issue to read the 2 pages.) Oh well, maybe I'll put this on the B-day list for the missus to get me.
- Chris Shadowens
Will Paizo have a booth at the Essen SPIEL games fair and trade exhibition (aka. Essen Internationalen Spieltage) in the city of Essen here in Germany in October? If so, it might be an incentive for European fans to pick up the print comics directly, instead of having to order them in the USA and to pay steep shipping and handling costs.
We're unlikely to have a booth at Essen, though we may send a few folks.
We work hard to minimize shipping costs—I think you'll find that for books like this, shipping will only be a few dollars.
It is definitely not June 2008.Wait, what? First Volume 2 gets pushed back several times to summer 2008, and now suddely it's expected for June 2009?? What is going on there? Please tell me this is an April Fool's jopke. I've had Volume 2 and several other items on preorder for months now.
Even if the Volume 2 contains a metric ton of extras when/if it ever sees print, pushing it back another year could mean that by the time it comes out, most people except the most hardcore Downer fans may have forgotten all about "that odd comic with the drow guy that ran in DUNGEON magazine". June 2009 is nearly two years after the final pages of Downer in DUNGEON #350 came out. That's not striking the iron while it's hot.
I sincerely hope this delay does not mean something has happened to Kyle Stanley Hunter or that there's legal hassle with Wizards of the Coast. :(
Christina
Erik's already responded to this, I know, and it's what I suspected: they're just not selling enough of these to warrant printing the 2nd volume (yet). I feel your pain. I quoted your post b/c it's very similar to what I had been turning around in my own mind to post; but you beat me to it.
You're especially right about the problem of the longer they wait to publish it, the longer Downer fades from our collective memories. Sad, really. I truly loved that strip. I'd always go straight to the comics when a new Dungeon or Dragon magazine came in the mail. Guess people like us are in the minority...
But I can't get mad at Paizo. They took a risk at reprinting the comics, and not enough people snapped them up to sink money into any more. At least at this time. My fantasy scenario is that WOTC lets Kyle do more Downer strips (maybe a prequel story), and that drums up interest in the printings for the last story line. Or, similarly, Kyle does a similar strip and it appears in Pathfinder :)
Have you thought about doing something similar to Order of the Stick: publish a once a week online strip, build up your fanbase and then try to sell these volumes as a prequel sort of thing? I dug Downer, but it's been a while since I read it. If I wasn't a Dungeon subscriber way back when, I'd have never heard about it.
You've got to build a new base of fans. And online has worked pretty well for Scott Kurtz, OotS, Penny Arcade, etc.
Something I forgot to ask.
If the cost for a respectable print run of the 2nd volume is scaring you off the project right now, what about a print-on-demand option? That way you're not out a big chunk of money up front, and it's less important to sell a book in mass numbers (though always the goal, of course). I'm assuming the book is "done" as far as layout goes, but maybe that's a false assumption. Still, the POD option is something I'll throw against the cyberwall and see if it sticks...
Guys,
Don't get too worried about this just yet. We want to find a way to print the second book, and it's _much_ more an issue of all of us focusing WAY more on stuff like Pathfinder and revamping the company in the face of the end of the magazines and the change in editions than on solving this particular problem.
There is no reason to give up hope that this book will get made. We just haven't figured it out yet.
Guys,
Don't get too worried about this just yet. We want to find a way to print the second book, and it's _much_ more an issue of all of us focusing WAY more on stuff like Pathfinder and revamping the company in the face of the end of the magazines and the change in editions than on solving this particular problem.
There is no reason to give up hope that this book will get made. We just haven't figured it out yet.
Ok, Erik, thanks for the candid reply. I'll keep the faith...
Sooo...any word on when in June this is going out?
You may have noticed that it now says June *2009*. As Erik said above, we really want to do this book, but we haven't got a reasonable way to justify it based on sales of the first volume. So that year is there to give us time to come up with some alternate ideas.
Downer was one of the largest inspirations of my D&D campaign and I sorely miss it. While it was always nice to get DMing ideas from classic modules and the works of the great authors in Dungeon, Downer always reminded me of two very important ideas in DMing. 1) Every NPC can be memorable and 2) Keep the action going. I was playing in groups that weren't really catering to my explorer mentality and I remember Downer as a breath of fresh, creative air. It was always the first thing I would read in Dungeon (after of course the Map of Mystery) and I still see ideas from it subconsciously pop up in my adventures from time to time. While visions of ethergaunts danced in my head, my mind turned away from dragons and giants, and before it knew it, I was enraptured with illithids, spectral lyricists, and of course devils. I digress, Downer is really important to me. I trust you guys; Paizo has done the best work I've ever seen in D&D. So, please, please, please do Downer right. For me?
- The King in Tie-dye
P.S. Guys, if you see Kyle (who is assume is hiding out in the Underdark somewhere) tell him thanks. From one monster enthusiast to another.
I just got Downer vol 1 on a discount. Boy that was a fun read. The plot is a lot clearer and the jokes come off better in this format than in the original magazine. I was looking to get vol 2 and am disappointed it's never going to happen.
I guess it's partly my own fault for not getting that book when it first came out. Lesson learned.
Any more word on this? Anything?You might notice we've taken the product listing down entirely.
Sorry—unless something amazing happens to propel Downer into the public spotlight, this collection just isn't likely to happen.
Since your volume 1 sales (I'm guessing) weren't solid enough to do volume 2, why not a limited printing of volume 2? Charge more to balance the smaller print run. There's got to be enough of us that want this to make this viable.
Either that or make an exception to your "we will not do POD printing".
See, I'm not too demanding ;-)
