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Well, for better or worse, I voted.
All I know is that I am going to be SOOOOOO glad that the annoying commercials (radio and tv), the annoying picketers, the annoying bumper stickers, and the REALLY annoying phone calls will finally come to an end.
See? There is some good that will come of this...
EDIT: And free Starbucks coffee.
Well, for better or worse, I voted.
All I know is that I am going to be SOOOOOO glad that the annoying commercials (radio and tv), the annoying picketers, the annoying bumper stickers, and the REALLY annoying phone calls will finally come to an end.
See? There is some good that will come of this...
EDIT: And free Starbucks coffee.
You lucky dog, living the high life in a swing state where people give a rat's ass about your vote.
I voted. I doubt my state (Misery... err, Missouri) will actually turn out how I want it to (supposed to be a very close McCain win) but I hope things will go well nationally.
I don't know, man. I live in St. Louis and the line to vote wrapped around the block. I heard there's like a 75% voter turn out. We'll see, though, cause it'll be real real close.
Voting was cool. People handed out water and chips and fruit and granola bars, there was a guy making burgers, a crazy black lady playing "Celebrate" and dancing in the street, lots of little kids running around. I don't think it's like that every time though.
Well, for better or worse, I voted.
All I know is that I am going to be SOOOOOO glad that the annoying commercials (radio and tv), the annoying picketers, the annoying bumper stickers, and the REALLY annoying phone calls will finally come to an end.
See? There is some good that will come of this...
EDIT: And free Starbucks coffee.
yes all the annoying campaign stuff is over but I swear this morning I heard the first X-mas commercial on the radio!
Looking again at our trusty CGEOVIG, we read that supporters of prop 8 such as Ron Prentice, President of California Family Council, argue that prop 8 does not take away any rights for domestic partnerships. This is a false analogy because marriage is different from domestic partnership. Marriage has much stronger protections than domestic partnership. The fact as stated in the CGEOVIG is that "California statutes clearly identify nine real differences between marriage and domestic partnerships."(Rachael Salcido,Associate Professor of Law McGeorge School of Law).
Out of curiosity, I looked this up. The differences are listed with some commentary here
Nine differences have been identified:...
THEN SAYLER REPLIED:I'm sure there's more to it than that but if there isn't why change the constitution and waste a lot of the taxpayer's money if it's not necessary?
Just out of curiosity, are you saying McCain is probably a political creationist, or are you talking about Palin? And seriously what abuse of power are we dealing with? And if you live in the UK you can't even vote here so Nyah Nyah nah Nyah nahServed the dyslexic right for typing straight into the text box. Creationist, that e makes all the Difference ;)So you just vote for the lesser of 2 evils.......again.......I'm not really sure who that is!The one who isn't the greater.
The Greater evil is pretty easy to point out, it uses the politics of fear, engaged in censorship, has beem shown to abuse power already and is probably a politicial crationist ;)
ofcause i am biased.
Um I can't tell which candidate you are refering too, I can pretty much apply those to both candidates if you give me a little time and I honestly have no idea what a crationist is, so I'm going to go look it up.
EDIT: Crationist isn't in the dictionary, is it a political term?
I know. No influence with out representation i say, but does anyone ask me?
I was aiming that at palin, who lets face it is the person who is likely to be president for most of the term, thanks to McCains age. I don't know about McCain, but his church is on the sharp end of the evangelicial right and does beleive in creationism. Palin is actively involved in a church which promotes witchhunting and beleives in creationism, so you know, i have my worries.
As for abuse of power. With palin its well document, from attempts to remove books from libraries to use power to persue personal vendetta as governer of alaska.
I voted this morning and got my sticker(no free coffee, though-maybe I'll stop at starbuck's later).
Strange that both of my neighborhood polling places are at religious institutions(one is a temple and the other a church).
Anyway, I will be proudly wearing my sticker all day. I have a strange feeling of participation in responsible grownup stuff even though I am still very cynical about politics. At least now I can b@&~$ in good conscience!
To all Paizonians who vote(d) : It's good to know ya!
yes all the annoying campaign stuff is over but I swear this morning I heard the first X-mas commercial on the radio!
One of the local radio stations here has gone to "All Christmas Music" mode as of November 1st. They'll continue until January 1st; they do it every year.
You think they could've waited until the freakin' turkey was carved!
yes all the annoying campaign stuff is over but I swear this morning I heard the first X-mas commercial on the radio!
One of the local radio stations here has gone to "All Christmas Music" mode as of November 1st. They'll continue until January 1st; they do it every year.
You think they could've waited until the freakin' turkey was carved!
aacckk! Poke out my eardrums with a roto-rooter!!
As for abuse of power. With palin its well document, from attempts to remove books from libraries to use power to persue personal vendetta as governer of alaska.
No it's not, in fact both of those statements are actually blatently false. All she asked the Librarian was if there was a process to remove them, she never actually attempted to remove any books. That's from the librarian herself. And as for the personal vendetta, as recently as two days ago an ethics oversight comitee found her clear of any wrong doings in the firing that I'm sure you're refering to as the peursuit of personal vendetta. Which is funny cause didn't I hear that a senator from alaska was found guilty of ethics violations, which is funny because she ran against the republican party saying it was corrupt in alaska.
Or by well documented do you mean that there are internet rumors, cause in that case it's well documented that Obama isn't a naturally born citizen of the united states, was at one time and is now a secret muslim, and wants to kill grandchildren because voting for abortion rights is the same thing as killing grandchildren.
yes all the annoying campaign stuff is over but I swear this morning I heard the first X-mas commercial on the radio!
One of the local radio stations here has gone to "All Christmas Music" mode as of November 1st. They'll continue until January 1st; they do it every year.
You think they could've waited until the freakin' turkey was carved!
Yeah we get that too in FL and the office manager in our building loves it. So I have to hear christmas music every day when I turn in shipping documents.
As for abuse of power. With palin its well document, from attempts to remove books from libraries to use power to persue personal vendetta as governer of alaska.
No it's not, in fact both of those statements are actually blatently false. All she asked the Librarian was if there was a process to remove them, she never actually attempted to remove any books. That's from the librarian herself. And as for the personal vendetta, as recently as two days ago an ethics oversight comitee found her clear of any wrong doings in the firing that I'm sure you're refering to as the peursuit of personal vendetta. Which is funny cause didn't I hear that a senator from alaska was found guilty of ethics violations, which is funny because she ran against the republican party saying it was corrupt in alaska.
Or by well documented do you mean that there are internet rumors, cause in that case it's well documented that Obama isn't a naturally born citizen of the united states, was at one time and is now a secret muslim, and wants to kill grandchildren because voting for abortion rights is the same thing as killing grandchildren.
Don't be too hard on the fellow. He lives in another country and probably doesn't have access to as many different sides of reporting as are available in the states (left, right, centralist, wacko-left, nut-job right, etc).
Also I thought the killing grandchildren thing was due to his voting against protecting children born during botched abortions.
As for abuse of power. With palin its well document, from attempts to remove books from libraries to use power to persue personal vendetta as governer of alaska.
No it's not, in fact both of those statements are actually blatently false. All she asked the Librarian was if there was a process to remove them, she never actually attempted to remove any books. That's from the librarian herself. And as for the personal vendetta, as recently as two days ago an ethics oversight comitee found her clear of any wrong doings in the firing that I'm sure you're refering to as the peursuit of personal vendetta. Which is funny cause didn't I hear that a senator from alaska was found guilty of ethics violations, which is funny because she ran against the republican party saying it was corrupt in alaska.
Or by well documented do you mean that there are internet rumors, cause in that case it's well documented that Obama isn't a naturally born citizen of the united states, was at one time and is now a secret muslim, and wants to kill grandchildren because voting for abortion rights is the same thing as killing grandchildren.
It's also a little misleading to say she was found clear of any wrongdoing. The first committee didn't punish her, but they did state that she overstepped her bounds and behaved in a manner unbecoming of a governor. After she was upset with that result, the campaign sponsored their own separate committee that then said she was scot-free.
I'm about to vote for the first time, and while I haven't made it to the polls yet, i know what I'm voting for.
Obama gets my presidential vote. I'm a fan. Don't hate.
I'm seriously considering voting for my current governor, John Huntsman. He's a smart man who stays clearly in the middle of most partisan disputes. And, he's an environmentalist. I like my national parks and I'm not a fan of pollution.
I'm going to vote to increase taxes to help our local Aviary and Zoo. I volunteered at the Aviary for a little while, and the place is great but definitely needs a budget increase. And I'm willing to pay 21 cents a month or whatever it is to help them out.
I sincerely wish I could vote against Utah's treasured State Senator, Chris Buttars. Seriously, look this guy up. He's one reason I'm ashamed to live where I do. He gives "conservatives" a very bad name.
My gf and I showed up at the polls at 6:30 and voted at 7:10. There were around 100 people there, none of whom I knew. I live in a small rural community that used to be all semi-related, not anymore. We had 8 pages of things to vote on. I didn't care for the campaigers out front though. "Use your brain, vote McCain." Really? Cause you hicks are gonna sway me, right?
Voting was cool. People handed out water and chips and fruit and granola bars, there was a guy making burgers, a crazy black lady playing "Celebrate" and dancing in the street, lots of little kids running around. I don't think it's like that every time though.
Hey! I'm in a swing state! What about me? Where's my guy making burgers? My granola? my crazy black lady dancing in the street? Here in CO, it's just a bunch of morons waving signs at me and calling my house with prerecorded babble. I did get my Starbucks, though ... apparently Ben and Jerry's is giving out freebies, too, but going all the way to Boulder to get it would defeat the purpose.
It's also a little misleading to say she was found clear of any wrongdoing. The first committee didn't punish her, but they did state that she overstepped her bounds and behaved in a manner unbecoming of a governor. After she was upset with that result, the campaign sponsored their own separate committee that then said she was scot-free.
And that is also misleading. She asked the commitee, who actually has responsibility it was to deal with these matters, to look into it after it became apparent that she was not going to go get a fair shake, when the chairman of the commitee started saying things like, "There is going to be an October surprise." That was set in motion before the first committee published their findings.
So it is incorrect to say that after the findings were made public (unless you are including the "october surprise" comment) the campaign set up "their own" separate committee. The other committee is a standing one in Alaska. You can argue that it might not be unbiased, but let's at least get the facts straight otherwise.
Kvantum
(Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Roleplaying Game, Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules Subscriber)
I voted. I doubt my state (Misery... err, Missouri) will actually turn out how I want it to (supposed to be a very close McCain win) but I hope things will go well nationally.I don't know, man. I live in St. Louis and the line to vote wrapped around the block. I heard there's like a 75% voter turn out. We'll see, though, cause it'll be real real close.
Voting was cool. People handed out water and chips and fruit and granola bars, there was a guy making burgers, a crazy black lady playing "Celebrate" and dancing in the street, lots of little kids running around. I don't think it's like that every time though.
Well, I'm about as far away from STL as you can get while still being in the same state. (far NW, 90 miles north of KC). It was weird, there was no line at all for last names A-G, very litte for H-N, and an hour+ wait for O-Z.
I doubt many of the people in this town were going to vote Obama, though I heard several jokes about Chicago politics ("Vote early, vote often!" being the general rule there for decades.) I really don't know if that's good or bad in this case.
I voted today. Obama, plus a bunch of Progressives who were on my ballot (Vermonter, here).
Everyone who can't decide who to vote for, remember two things:
1) If you make less than $150,000 a year, a vote for Obama is better for your wallet. Of course, if you're a millionaire, go ahead and vote for McCain. I can't blame you for wanting more money :)
2) You can always write in yourself for president, or someone else you think would be qualified. I know in my (relatively small) town, I always write in my uncle for at least one local position. For one, I think he'd do a pretty good job, but mostly it's fun to see his name in the vote listings, showing that he got 1 or 2 votes compared to the hundreds/thousands everyone else got.
1) If you make less than $150,000 a year, a vote for Obama is better for your wallet. Of course, if you're a millionaire, go ahead and vote for McCain. I can't blame you for wanting more money :)
I thought it was $250,000 or was that for a family? Wasn't it $200,000 for a single person? Wow, it has dropped 25% in the span of a month. I hate to see how low it will end up being by the time he actually takes office.
And of course there is a pretty big gap between $150,000 and $1,000,000 (a million), but let's not let numbers confuse us.
I voted today. Obama, plus a bunch of Progressives who were on my ballot (Vermonter, here).
Everyone who can't decide who to vote for, remember two things:
1) If you make less than $150,000 a year, a vote for Obama is better for your wallet. Of course, if you're a millionaire, go ahead and vote for McCain. I can't blame you for wanting more money :)
2) You can always write in yourself for president, or someone else you think would be qualified. I know in my (relatively small) town, I always write in my uncle for at least one local position. For one, I think he'd do a pretty good job, but mostly it's fun to see his name in the vote listings, showing that he got 1 or 2 votes compared to the hundreds/thousands everyone else got.
I voted McCain because the last thing we need is another super majority. The last 8 years have proved that having majority control is a bad thing and having a super majority is even worse. Both of the candidates economic policies were terrible, under-funded, and un-realistic while neither of them had come up with a realistic plan to deal with the Wall St./banking bailout.
1) If you make less than $150,000 a year, a vote for Obama is better for your wallet. Of course, if you're a millionaire, go ahead and vote for McCain. I can't blame you for wanting more money :)I thought it was $250,000 or was that for a family? Wasn't it $200,000 for a single person? Wow, it has dropped 25% in the span of a month. I hate to see how low it will end up being by the time he actually takes office.
And of course there is a pretty big gap between $150,000 and $1,000,000 (a million), but let's not let numbers confuse us.
four legs good,
two legs....better!
Too be fair to both Candidates, almost no one has a good plan on how to fix the banking/housing mess. I think the problem just spiraled out of control for all involved, even the best and brightest on wall street or in washington.
That's true but that shouldn't stop them from taking it into consideration for their economic plans. This issue dominated the last two debates and neither of them had bothered to update their economic policies. They weren't even attempting to address the issue which I think is their biggest failure.
And of course there is a pretty big gap between $150,000 and $1,000,000 (a million), but let's not let numbers confuse us.
What are you talking about, I have 850,000 in my wallet. Are you seriously saying that people don't use 850,000 as nose blowing tissue?
I don't think people realize how easy it is for your income to come in at over 150,000. My father owns a small business that has been in business for 20 years, right now we have about 1/4 of our usual business and after 9/11 we barely squeeked by without filing for bankrupcy. Yet my father would be in that bracket that will take a tax increase.
I personally have a problem with progressive tax policies. They reward failure and punish saving or success. It basically encourages people in the lowest bracket to waste their money when they get it. But its paired non-sensically with the words progressive, as if to encourage people thinking that it's better. And despite the fact that what it really does is encourage stagnation and widen the lower middle class bracket. but hey, that's just my opinion. feel free to consider my father a strugling small business owner a millionare and feel good when our shop has to let go of an employee to afford the increased tax burdens of the democratic majority.
the last thing we need is another super majority. The last 8 years have proved that having majority control is a bad thing and having a super majority is even worse.
So agreed.
EDIT: well according to CNNs election predictor I think Obama will win by nearly 100 electoral votes. I knew I thought Obama would win, but wow, according to the state breakdown he wins by a landslide by my estimate.
And of course there is a pretty big gap between $150,000 and $1,000,000 (a million), but let's not let numbers confuse us.What are you talking about, I have 850,000 in my wallet. Are you seriously saying that people don't use 850,000 as nose blowing tissue?
I don't think people realize how easy it is for your income to come in at over 150,000. My father owns a small business that has been in business for 20 years, right now we have about 1/4 of our usual business and after 9/11 we barely squeeked by without filing for bankrupcy. Yet my father would be in that bracket that will take a tax increase.
I personally have a problem with progressive tax policies. They reward failure and punish saving or success. It basically encourages people in the lowest bracket to waste their money when they get it. But its paired non-sensically with the words progressive, as if to encourage people thinking that it's better. And despite the fact that what it really does is encourage stagnation and widen the lower middle class bracket. but hey, that's just my opinion. feel free to consider my father a strugling small business owner a millionare and feel good when our shop has to let go of an employee to afford the increased tax burdens of the democratic majority.
lkl,
Actually, he wouldn't unless he was taking the entire business profits as his personal income. It's personal income over $250k, not business income. This is one of the inaccuracies people seem to believe on both sides about their opponents.EDIT: Link to factcheck.org on this subject.
the last thing we need is another super majority. The last 8 years have proved that having majority control is a bad thing and having a super majority is even worse.So agreed.
EDIT: well according to CNNs election predictor I think Obama will win by nearly 100 electoral votes. I knew I thought Obama would win, but wow, according to the state breakdown he wins by a landslide by my estimate.
Yeah, I think it's going to a blowout by Obama. Probably the second biggest in my lifetime behind Reagan-Mondale.
Modera
(Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Roleplaying Game, Campaign Setting, Companion Subscriber)
So you just vote for the lesser of 2 evils.......again.......like every friggin' election since I was old enough to vote.......This sucks, I'm goin' to Canada....naa, it's cold there!
Two things:
1. We have the same problem in our recent election
2. It's going to be 18C this week... so not THAT cold
/Canuck Threadjack
I personally have a problem with progressive tax policies. They reward failure and punish saving or success. It basically encourages people in the lowest bracket to waste their money when they get it. But its paired non-sensically with the words progressive, as if to encourage people thinking that it's better. And despite the fact that what it really does is encourage stagnation and widen the lower middle class bracket. but hey, that's just my opinion. feel free to consider my father a strugling small business owner a millionare and feel good when our shop has to let go of an employee to afford the increased tax burdens of the democratic majority.
Progressive taxation protects the people who have to pay out a larger proportion of their incomes on the necessities of life. They keep a larger proportion of their incomes free of taxation...
or at least they would if social security taxes weren't so blantantly regressive. But that's an argument for another thread.
But there's nothing nonsensical about the word progressive and a rising rate in proportion to rising income. It simply gets progressively higher as income is higher. It's not labeled to try to spin it. It's merely descriptive.
I am from Australia- so like most of the world it is pretty important to me who you all vote for. Choose wisely.
We have compulsory voting here (well it is compulsory that you turn up to a polling booth and get your name crossed off - then you can choose to vote or leave). Which makes for a different dynamic. But the thing that amazes me is how in USA you have to line up for hours to vote. In my 6 or 7 federal and similar number of state elections I have never waited longer than about 5 minutes. Given you have a 2 year lead up and gazillions of dollars spent on the campaign I cant quite believe how there isnt a better system. Rather than having all those campaigns telling people it is important to vote- maybe just cut down the waiting time to under an hour. I reckon that would add 20% to your voter turn out right there.
Ahh well I suppose it means that if you actually do vote you really gotta want to vote.
You lucky dog, living the high life in a swing state where people give a rat's ass about your vote.Jealous?
If you'd like, I could call you every 47 minutes and tell you how you should vote. Of course how you should vote will change every 47 minutes...
When you put it like that...
We were hounded during the primaries because my wife was a registered independent (at the time, I was a registered Libertarian, but now I'm independent). It was obnoxious. We get a decent number of calls for the House race because it's theoretically competitive, but that's about it.
I pity people who live in the swing states - particularly PA, OH, and FL. I wonder how much the political ads have driven up TiVo purchases in those states...
I am from Australia- so like most of the world it is pretty important to me who you all vote for. Choose wisely.
We have compulsory voting here (well it is compulsory that you turn up to a polling booth and get your name crossed off - then you can choose to vote or leave). Which makes for a different dynamic. But the thing that amazes me is how in USA you have to line up for hours to vote. In my 6 or 7 federal and similar number of state elections I have never waited longer than about 5 minutes. Given you have a 2 year lead up and gazillions of dollars spent on the campaign I cant quite believe how there isnt a better system. Rather than having all those campaigns telling people it is important to vote- maybe just cut down the waiting time to under an hour. I reckon that would add 20% to your voter turn out right there.
Ahh well I suppose it means that if you actually do vote you really gotta want to vote.
My solution to getting more people to vote is make it a lottery and you have to vote to get your name in. "My choice might have lost, but I won some money!"
Democracy is based off of the ancient Athenan form of government. The Athenan people didn't get to vote for their leaders, though, they voted for who to ostracize. The most UNpopular candidate was banished from the town for 10 or more years.
I vote to bring back the "Ostraka" vote and at least improve society by removing the worst candidates, rather than voting for someone you don't like, simply because they aren't as bad as the other person.
JP
Car manufacturing is a demanding business, and you can´t go like "Folks always bought our cars, so they will in the future.",which seems to be the mindset of the manufacturers. [/threadjack]Stefan
I think American auto manufacturers depended on brand loyalty a bit too long. You actually still see a lot of it, particularly when you hear Nascar fans talk about their favorite teams and what engines they use, or when you hear about someone using their spouses car to get to work at the auto assembly plant... and taking a lot of flak because it's not the brand made at the plant.
But unlike soft drinks and brand loyalty/product identity, cars are expensive and, in the oil shocks of the 1970s, you saw Americans starting to learn how to shop for cars more critically. Brand loyalty has become a lot weaker, partly replaced by performance history or consumer-rating loyalty.
Democracy is based off of the ancient Athenan form of government. The Athenan people didn't get to vote for their leaders, though, they voted for who to ostracize. The most UNpopular candidate was banished from the town for 10 or more years.
I vote to bring back the "Ostraka" vote and at least improve society by removing the worst candidates, rather than voting for someone you don't like, simply because they aren't as bad as the other person.
JP
Wouldn't that lead to the same net effect? You end up with the least onerous candidate winning in either event. It's just the thought process that's different.