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We're Not Staying Mum(my) Any Longer

Tuesday, October 20, 2015

During PaizoCon 2015, we stood onstage with designer Liz Spain and revealed that the next Pathfinder Adventure Card Game Adventure Path would be Mummy's Mask. And we said that we'd be releasing it in February. As it turns out, we're right an even 50 percent of the time.

Since the announcement, we've received a lot of feedback from customers, retailers, and distributors that our release schedule is outpacing all but our most enthusiastic players. People are still playing Skull & Shackles, or even Rise of the Runelords, and they aren't ready for a new set yet. So we've decided to delay Mummy's Mask until we feel the market is ready. That may mean July, and it may mean October, but it definitely doesn't mean February. When we commit to a firm date, we'll let you know. But fear not—it will come.

But wait a minute, you say—what if you are one of our most enthusiastic players? No worries. There's going to be plenty to keep you busy. We'll continue to release Class Decks: In the first five months of 2016, you can expect to see the Oracle, Alchemist, Inquisitor, Witch, and Gunslinger decks. We're even increasing the number of newly designed boons in some of those decks. (Hint: Damiel gets a pet giant slug.)


Yikes!

So great! That's a whole lot of new characters and boons, but what are you going to do with them? Where are the new scenarios to play through? If you've played through Rise of the Runelords (maybe a couple times), completed Skull & Shackles, and sailed through Season of the Shackles, you're probably just waiting for us to release the end of Wrath of the Righteous and Season of the Righteous... and you need MORE!

Well, we have just the thing. We're pleased to announce the next Pathfinder Society Adventure Card Guild season:

Season of the Runelords

Imagine that you decided to release a game based on a system you created, and you wanted the most sweeping story to go with it. Some full-on epic thing. It's no accident that the Rise of the Runelords base set was one of the biggest sellers in Paizo's history—that story is really, really good. It's chock full of giants and dragons and ogres and all manner of malevolent things.

So we're going back to the well. A whole lot of you own Runelords, and we want that to be something you can play for a long, long time. We're making a brand-new, epic Season of the Runelords, spanning the entire length of the story. But we might mix things up a little bit. Okay, a whole lot. Because you can only burn down Sandpoint Cathedral so many times. (Ten, fifteen times, tops.)

And hey, remember this ol' horsey-monster? And this bad mamma-jamma?


The original Odd Couple.

Remember how we never actually used them as villains for a scenario? Well, we've got plans for them. Big, big plans.

This will also harmonize with Obsidian's release of the PACG digital game, which (surprise!) will start with Rise of the Runelords. So we've been looking back at Runelords to see where we can improve it a little bit for the digital version. Nips and tucks, mostly. But we think you'll like what you see. And it'll tie in nicely with what we do in the Adventure Card Guild.

Season of the Runelords will begin early next year. It'll be glorious! Come play!

Mike Selinker and Tanis O'Connor
Adventure Card Game Designers

Note for Adventure Card Guild Fans: We've designed a fifth scenario in Season of the Righteous Adventure 5, so 5D will come out this week, 5E next week, and Adventure 6 will begin one week later than originally planned, during the first week of November.

More Paizo Blog.
Tags: Adventure Card Guild Class Decks Pathfinder Adventure Card Game Pathfinder Society Rise of the Runelords
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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Card Game, Cards, Companion, Maps, Modules, Pawns, Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Pathfinder Comics Subscriber

Please mark a tally in the camp of customers ready for Mummy's Mask in early 2016. I know it may not change things back to the original intended release schedule but a PaizoCon release would be nice to see.


Pathfinder Card Game, Class Deck Subscriber

I hope the extra time allows for further refinement. Rise of the Runelords was a 10 out of 10 for my gaming group but Skulls and Shackles not so much. The added challenges seemed overkill at times. My gaming group hasn't started Wrath yet (we just finished Adventure Deck 5 in Skulls and Shackles this past weekend) but it sounds to be in the same vein as Skulls. Perhaps a way to scale difficulty for each gaming group tastes could be introduced in Mummy's Mask?

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16

I personally think this is genius. There are a lot of Runelords sets out there, and this will breathe some new life into them. I'm personally excited to play through a few of my organized play characters!

It'll also let my wife not be mad at me for spending insane amounts of money on cards for at least the first half or so of 2016, so that's a personal help as well.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

I actually just bought Runelords, and all the expansions, through the sale. I told my friends to prepare for some serious RotRLPFACG Organized Play action!

And, then my venture lt, who runs the ACG said, nope, Runelords doesn't count for Organized play.

I was a sad panda, but figured, well, we'll still play it, and maybe do Mummy's Mask when it comes out.

Then, like just a few hours later, this post! I'm so crazy ecstatic happy right now!!


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I'm sure that the subscription model is to blame for some of this blowback, But the thought that an auto manufacturer would hold back producing their latest model because I am not ready to part with my older model just seems bizarre (and entitled) to me

I hope this move works for you all. It remains to be seen if such a delay will lose the game the momentum it has built up with its faithful gaming groups.

The industry is becoming more and more saturated. Hard to tell if the same people telling you guys to hold off will be exactly the same ones that have moved onto other systems by the time you do actually release.


Pathfinder Card Game Subscriber

Mixed emotions for me. We should finish W0tR in the next few weeks but the break will give us time to play other games while we wait for Mummy's Mask.

Sovereign Court

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Card Game, Class Deck Subscriber; Pathfinder Legends Subscriber

Season of the Runelords? Awesome! I'm glad something's being released during the delay, and something that most PACG fans probably either have, or have access to.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Card Game, Class Deck Subscriber

I was looking forward to Mummy's Mask, but you know what? I'm also looking forward to the extra time to play some of the class deck characters I haven't tried yet. Not to mention, I've only played the adventure paths, not the seasons, so that's three more playthroughs I have ahead of me, plus running some of my RotE and S&S characters through the advanced WorD class decks. There's plenty to keep me busy!


Sounds like more time to play Apocrypha! Of course, it doesn't come out until April-ish, but that would have been about 2-3 adventure decks into Mummy's Mask.

Maybe a PaizoCon release in May? Now THAT would be true fan service!

Scarab Sages

Pathfinder Card Game Subscriber

This is great news. While I would still probably purchase two (or 1.75) sets a year, I am hoping that this gives additional time to refine sets before release. I'm also jazzed about the addition of more differentiated cards in the class decks, which is also a great improvement.

Adventure Card Game Designer

3 people marked this as a favorite.
Agradeleous wrote:
I hope the extra time allows for further refinement.

Well, we're certainly not going to mothball it while we wait. We are always pulling things out and fine-tuning them. If you give a game designer more time, they will take more time.

Chad has an interesting point about Wrath of the Righteous: We were designing set 6 of Wrath before anyone had actually finished set 6 of Rise of the Runelords. Mummy's Mask is the first time we've gotten to sit back and watch you guys play things all the way through. So we're definitely taking advantage of that time.

Troymk1 wrote:
I'm sure that the subscription model is to blame for some of this blowback

The thing that is most responsible for this "blowback," as you call it, is what we are told over and over again: Everything we make is really cool and people want time to play it. So we decided to listen to them.

MAJBrown22 wrote:
Maybe a PaizoCon release in May? Now THAT would be true fan service!

We considered that, but Paizo wanted to do summer/fall instead. If it takes that long, mummies for Halloween is okay by us.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Card Game, Class Deck, Maps, Modules, Pawns, Roleplaying Game, Tales Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Legends Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

I can appreciate there's a whole bunch of competing commercial/community/distributor/publisher/.... whatever else interests to juggle. So in the spirit of adding to that - I'd really like it if you could look at the viability for print-on-demand supplements for stuff like this.

The organised play stuff has some digital component (I don't even know how much, since I stopped looking into it once I learnt that, although I understand it isn't huge). For me, I'd buy all of them if there was a way to purchase an entire season and get scenario cards, a few pages of supplementary rules (if there are any) and anything else I need without needing to download and print out anything.

I realise it's quaint bordering on weird, but I have zero interest in digital gaming. That's always been true for RPGs but it turns out it's even-more-true for card/board games.

The fact there's any PDF component means I havent even looked at it. If there were a physical way to get more, I'd buy it all sight unseen.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Maps Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber
Steve Geddes wrote:

I can appreciate there's a whole bunch of competing commercial/community/distributor/publisher/.... whatever else interests to juggle. So in the spirit of adding to that - I'd really like it if you could look at the viability for print-on-demand supplements for stuff like this.

The organised play stuff has some digital component (I don't even know how much, since I stopped looking into it once I learnt that, although I understand it isn't huge). For me, I'd buy all of them if there was a way to purchase an entire season and get scenario cards, a few pages of supplementary rules (if there are any) and anything else I need without needing to download and print out anything.

I realise it's quaint bordering on weird, but I have zero interest in digital gaming. That's always been true for RPGs but it turns out it's even-more-true for card/board games.

The fact there's any PDF component means I havent even looked at it. If there were a physical way to get more, I'd buy it all sight unseen.

The only "digital" component of the Organized Play are the scenario PDFs. Each scenario is one page (sometimes 2 if it introduces tons of extra cards you're meant to use for it) that you generally print out before playing. Everything else is done using the existing cards. Calling printing out a single page of a PDF in order to play a scenario "digital" is a bit of a stretch. Give it a shot by buying the first adventure of Season of the Shackles or Season of the Righteous -- I think you'll actually be pleasantly surprised by how more awesome the scenarios are when they have a full page to work with versus a tiny card (notably the story bits are greatly expanded, and there's more room for interesting scenario powers). And if the fact that the PDFs introduce new cards bothers you, there's already a Print on Demand for Season of the Shackles that gives you all of those cards in physical format on DriveThruCards.

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Skizzerz definitely has the right of it here. There's no real "digital" component to it at all. Definitely give a chance to the first few scenarios of the Season of the Shackles, and look on drivethrucards.com at the Season of the Shackles add-on pack, which fills in all those extra cards (and gives you a TON of new villain and henchman options to play around with in your own scenarios!)


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Card Game, Class Deck, Maps, Modules, Pawns, Roleplaying Game, Tales Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Legends Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

I accept it's a bit of a stretch. (I'd even concede irrational, I suspect) but it's nonetheless true. It's the same with PFS scenarios - I'd buy them if someone printed them out for me but not to print out myself.

I'll probably get around to getting them one day (I'm glad there's a POD option for the cards at least). Nonetheless, silly as it sounds to people without computer-phobia, anything involving a download is a barrier to me (and it might be easy to provide a one-click, POD solution via the paizo.com store, I don't know).

Even the fact it's not all available through paizo direct is an issue, to be frank. I've had poor service from drivethrurpg before.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

There's also registering your characters and reporting sessions, which is done here on the site.

Paizo's setup makes it reasonably easy to download your PDF purchases. You might want to see if your friends will print them for you if not messing with PDFs is that big an issue. (It really is hard for me to relate, being a guy who makes documents for folks to download. :)


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Card Game, Class Deck, Maps, Modules, Pawns, Roleplaying Game, Tales Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Legends Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

It's a complicated thing and I didnt mean to derail with my particular foible. I appreciate the suggestions/reassurances though. Thanks. :)

Silver Crusade

My first response to this was disappointment. But then I remembered that I have only played past AD 2 on Rise of the Runelords. I started my 10th OP character tonight (Rooboo ftw!), but my highest one has played 1 scenario in Adventure 4 of Shackles. I've got lots of play left to do! I DO like getting shiny new cards in the mail, but the class decks should satisfy that. Plus, I'm running the Mummy's Mask RPG AP, and I'm really looking forward to seeing an AP I know well converted to cards, to better understand the process. By July or October, I'll have another book or two run to help my comparison. So I say bring on the Runelords


Pathfinder Card Game, Class Deck Subscriber

How will Season of the Runelords interact with the base set store promotion? I know most stores already have a Runelords set, but not all of them.


4 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Card Game Subscriber

So the real translation I get from this announcement is, "people are not buying Wrath of the Righteous and its Adventure Decks as fast as its being released, so therefor we're putting Mummy's mask on hold."

My friends and I have been playing PACG from the start. Since RotR, each time a new Adventure Deck is released my group completes it before the next is available.

I understand some groups may not be able to meet up often enough to stay caught up with the releases and they lag behind, or maybe they just enjoy a slower pace, but a decision to slow releases based on these slower groups makes no sense to me.

I'm always ready to buy the next base set and all decks to come with it, as are all your dedicated fans, so what does make sense to me is supporting those who have continued to support you most over the years by giving us what we want to buy as soon as you can / it's ready.

Troymk1 said wrote:
The industry is becoming more and more saturated. Hard to tell if the same people telling you guys to hold off will be exactly the same ones that have moved onto other systems by the time you do actually release.

Couldn't agree more with Troymk1. Your dedicated fans who are waiting for the new set are ready to buy it now, and have supported you more than those still on the earlier sets.

So I guess Mummy's Mask in February simply isn't profitable enough because there aren't enough people who are ready to buy it on release.

A sad announcement/blog for the serious PACG fans like myself, and the rest of you guys.


Speaking about the digital game, was it ever announced exactly which platforms would be supported? The only thing I could find was 'tablets', which I assume means Android and iOS. But these days there are more and more win8/10 tablets releasedd, and personally I'd prefer a Windows version (Steam!), but I'll buy the android version as well and pray that my tablet is good enough to handle the game smoothly and/or that my phone won't make things way too small.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

It's really great that there are enthusiastic purchasers and players like Junon and Troymk1, but it sounds like there aren't enough of you to support the current release schedule all the way through the entire sales channel. It might not be a problem with Paizo's pre-order customers, but it could be an issue for brick-and-mortar stores and online retailers. Inventory takes up money and space (that can be devoted to other products that are selling), so they have the same concerns that Paizo has. There's significant cost savings on bigger print runs (or bulk purchases), but the savings are lost if you have to warehouse the inventory for too long, heavily discount it to sell it, or worse never sell it at all.


Junon wrote:
I understand some groups may not be able to meet up often enough to stay caught up with the releases and they lag behind, or maybe they just enjoy a slower pace, but a decision to slow releases based on these slower groups makes no sense to me.

Regardless, Paizo is saying that their distribution chain is telling them that you are the exception. There isn't enough demand for their existing three sets to make room for a fourth at the moment. This matches what I've seen at the game stores I frequent, which have bits and pieces of all three sitting on the shelf that sell through rather slowly. That's the same space the next set would need to use. Waiting for things to (hopefully) clear out and for the people who recently bought sets to be ready to buy another is a better plan.

Personally, I agree with this decision. One set a year is plenty. That's a lot of adventure-like game to get through and a lot of money spent to buy it, assuming you've gotten enough play from one set to want to buy another. My roommate and I still aren't through Skull and Shackles, and our larger Guild group isn't through Season of the Shackles or anywhere near completing Season of the Righteous. It could be a while before I'm ready to buy another set.

Switching topics:

hakko504 wrote:
Speaking about the digital game, was it ever announced exactly which platforms would be supported?

iOS and Android, according to the announcement they made back at PAX Prime. (I also have a Windows convertible tablet, so I've tuned out on the digital game for now.)

RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 16

Yay for class decks. Though, I do wish the magus got some love.


Sad... This is such a great game, it has almost replaced all other games in our group, but obviously we are an exception. Now it seems like soon we'll have to look elsewhere...

(Yes, we played the first two base sets twice and now are in the middle of the third. And we also played through the Season of the Shackles but were not impressed - almost no real challenge for us there. Maybe we have to think of a good way to scale the difficulty level...)


Pathfinder Card Game Subscriber

This is fine by me. The time delay don't matter much.

I play RotR in a Group, we are currently playing deck 4.
Solo play with 3 character is what I do most of the time. I have played through RotR 3 times.
SS once, found the ship-hopping-from-location-to-location rule silly. Won't play that ever again.
My favorite is WotR. Better story, and finally difficult enough to make it a real challenge.
I play the Seasons as well. Better than the original stories because of more space to tell the story. Season of the Righteous is best since the story is a parallell story to the original story.

So I'm really looking forward to a season using Cards fro RotR, with a more fleshed out story. Also looking forward to more Class Decks.

I buy everything related to this game, so keep it coming. I recommend buying the Iconic Heroes boxes. Great to play with the minis and there are special cards for each hero included.

Grand Lodge

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Card Game, Class Deck, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber

I hope that with Season of the Runelords, more resources are spent in promoting the Organized Play in game stores. Posters and flyers (even if the flyers were in PDF format) would be fantastic. Something that the stores could put up and people would ask. I had to come up with my own. Skull and Shackles had a poster but nothing for Season of the Shackles. And I know my stores never got posters for Wrath of the Righteous.

I think this is a good idea. The people here that are disappointed because they've burned through the content are the exception. More people out there don't put aside other games to just do PACG. And when they haven't finished one set and another comes out and immediately goes on the shelf, they probably won't pick up the next one until they've finished the others. Stores have product sit on the shelves for that reason.

I think that Paizo needs to do a better job promoting the Class decks and Organized Play. Maybe even printing up the first scenario of Season of the Runelords and sending it to the stores that have signed up for PACG and the free base sets. Brochures would help.


My biggest's disappointment of the gaming year. The only positive thing is estimated time for ios game.

In my country (France) no organised play, horrible traduction and communication from local company does not help the game (S&S is still not ready here so i have buy classdecks, s&s and Wrath in English)


13 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Card Game Subscriber

If, like me, you obsessively search the Paizo forums for all things PACG related, you'd have noticed that there were more than a few people that cancelled subscriptions with the end of Wrath of the Righteous. And often, the reason they gave was that it was coming out faster than they could play through it, so they didn't need Mummy's Mask.

So, I don't think it is simply "not enough people bought Wrath" as it is "we have indicators that we might be competing with ourselves too much." And that is probably one of the trickiest things to manage about a product like this. It sounds like there are still a significant number of people that haven't played everything yet. And those people can right now still choose from 3 adventure paths. If Mummy's Mask came out in February, they'd be able to choose from 4. And that means less Mummy's Mask would sell. So you have to find that sweet spot of release cycle where you are releasing often enough but not too often. I don't envy Paizo trying to figure that out.

And, yes, while those that have grabbed up nearly everything PACG that existed have technically "supported" Paizo more than those that have bought more selectively, you can't just serve that most dedicated group. I'm sure Paizo has the option to say "Well, less people will buy Mummy's Mask, so we'll print less." That would probably mean the price would go up. Which would drive even a portion of the most dedicated buyers away.

I'm going to cut to the chase here and admit something: I love the Pathfinder Adventure Card Game. I want it to last forever and ever and ever and ever. I want my young kids to all play this with me in a few years. And that means, what I want to happen with PACG is whatever is best for PACG, not simply what is best for me. Or, put another way, what is best for me is that PACG thrives. If that means the releases come out slower than I play them, so be it. If that means there is some super secret promo card that I can't get my hands on, so be it. If that means releases come out faster than I can personally afford them, so be it. As long as the game itself continues to sell well enough to justify releasing more products for it, I'm fine, because that is all I really want.

Now, I do have two issues with this announcement.

#1: You do realize I just got done taking all the sleeves off RotR? I'd been gradually transferring them to WotR, planning to keep just two sets sleeved at a time.

#2: With RotR being part of organized play, I feel a strong desire to try and pick up a complete second printing of it so it(including DriveThru errata) will match the class decks well.


Pathfinder Card Game, Class Deck Subscriber

Disappointment, then some (hopefully) rational thought, and then satisfaction...

I think that this shift provides some interesting opportunities.

The challenge, I think, will be in keeping things at a suitable pace to maintain the interest of all groups. There's a middle ground to be had, but there's simply no way to satisfy everybody (too fast for some, too slow for others). Organized play and the digital option work for many, but not necessarily for all, so a holistic plan will also have to consider how to maintain a moderate pace for those that play within other gaming structures. Granted, OP seasons are applicable to non-OP play, so they are definitely part of the solution.

Simply adding a Season of the Runelords will only work over the next year, so I'll be interested in seeing how Paizo maintains a sufficient pace over the long haul.

I'm looking forward to the continued release of class decks and how the additional characters provide new challenges and party dynamics.

This particular portion...

Mike Selinker and Tanis O'Connor wrote:

And hey, remember this ol' horsey-monster? And this bad mamma-jamma?

...

Remember how we never actually used them as villains for a scenario? Well, we've got plans for them. Big, big plans.

...makes me wonder.

Is it possible that we'll see additional decks released as part of these big plans? An entire alternate AP might be released as a single 110-card deck (or maybe just a 54-card deck), including cards of all deck levels for the new AP. Such decks might also include additional characters, possibly bringing in characters from other base sets. Who hasn't wanted to see how a Seltyiel or a Balazar or an Oloch might be adjusted for Rise of the Runelords; or how Kyra and Amiri might fare in Skull & Shackles? These would be characters whose base powers, hands, and skills (not to mention roles) would be specific to the alternate base sets. This alone could, I think, keep things fresh for players who have already gone through an AP, perhaps multiple times, with the base set and character add-on deck (and class decks). Also, such an option would allow for the longer term sustainment of base decks over years, perhaps seeing an alternate AP for a single base set released over multiple years. In this way, players might continue Rise of the Runelords over five (or more!) years with new and different challenges rather than simply facing the same scenarios with different characters.

While my excitement for the game and seeing new stuff isn't necessarily happy that base set releases will be slowed, my wallet thanks you. I'm tired of the wife giving me the evil eye each time I buy something new and exciting. Granted, I just got into the game over the summer and have since bought everything for all three sets, minus one adventure deck (so perhaps the evil eye has been for buying everything over such a short period of time).

Adventure Card Game Designer

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We certainly did not believe this announcement would be met with universal enthusiasm from our friends on the Paizo forums. What we're trying to communicate is that I get stopped a couple dozen times a convention by someone who says something like this:
"Mike, I love the Pathfinder game! We buy everything for it!"
"Cool. What are you playing?"
"Well, we're just about to start Skull & Shackles..."

And that matters quite a bit. We care a lot about our games reaching lots of people. And if a whole lot of people say "Y'know, I can skip Mummy's Mask because I haven't even started this Wrath set I bought"—even if PACG is the game they play most often—that's a huge deal to us.

Who knows whether delaying six months or so is the right decision? It might be and it might not. But it's a risk to add a big product to the channel when the channel is suggesting we should let our recent products sell through first. So we decided not to take that risk, and then by doing so incur the risk of people wandering away. We shall see.

Meantime, we are planning to do some fun things. We'll drop more info about those when we're ready.


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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Modules Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

What i really wish for are some errata card sheets similar to those made for RotRL.

I guess the FAQ for Skull& Shackles are more or less complete so it would be really nice.

And hopefully for Wrath also somewhat later.

Scarab Sages

Pathfinder Card Game Subscriber
Hawkmoon269 wrote:
If that means there is some super secret promo card that I can't get my hands on, so be it.

Oh, please no...I love the promo cards to death, almost all of them. I know it sounds silly, but having those rare, light-hearted cards thrown in to the box to try and find & use in interesting ways really makes the game for me. I was so super-psyched when Tarlin pulled Improvised Dinosaur with a Temptation of Arms...it was the pivotal turning point at which I no longer believed Wrath was total suckitude.


Parody wrote:

Switching topics:

hakko504 wrote:
Speaking about the digital game, was it ever announced exactly which platforms would be supported?
iOS and Android, according to the announcement they made back at PAX Prime. (I also have a Windows convertible tablet, so I've tuned out on the digital game for now.)

Thank you. That's what I thought/hoped, but I couldn't find any details.

Back to the discussion of whether it was right or not to wait with Mummy's Mask.
Right now Rise of the Runelords is my most played game of the last two years. I've completed the AP twice with my wife, we're playing it for the third time right now, and we'll probably do at least one more run through to make sure we've tried all the characters from the base set & Character add-on plus some of the most interesting ones from the Class decks. The first time was with one character each and the following with 2 characters each (Amiri/Merisel, Sajan/Lini/Ezren/Seelah, Seoni/Lem/Valeros/Wu Shen). And to be honest, we're having so much fun that I haven't even begun to think about getting another set yet. I did however sign up for Apocrypha, so we'll probably move on to that. We may get either Wrath or Mummy to have two campaigns running concurrently (ApCG & PACG) but that depend a bit on timing. But I digress a bit. The point is that for us, your previous schedule of releasing one game just a month or two after the previous one was finished is a certain way of making us skip some installations. Since we love the game, we wanted to explore every possibility given to us in the form of different combinations of characters, and with our current schedule of ~2 games per week, it takes more than a year to do that. So for us, releasing too fast means you're competing with yourself.


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I was initially bummed when I saw it was delayed, but then I saw a comment about getting all the cards for Runelords for 50% off because of the sale that's going on right now... and that's tipped my hand. Er... purse. Wallet.

I actually don't own Runelords because I started with OP. Now that the next season is Runelords, makes sense for me to get it! :D

This is my favourite card/board game EVER, thank you for everything that you guys do!

Adventure Card Game Designer

Rebel Song wrote:
This is my favourite card/board game EVER, thank you for everything that you guys do!

You are welcome! We want to keep doing that sort of everything for as long as we can.

Pathfinder ACG Developer

Before I joined the team last year (holy cow it's been a year!), I had a group that was playing through RotR and another that was just starting S&S. Because I then focused on WotR (and MM and SotR and...), we actually aborted our S&S run and _never got back to S&S_. Thankfully, I met a 3rd group to play through Season of the Shackles with (we're 4 ADs done), but our release schedule has been so aggressive that even I haven't been able to play it as thoroughly as I'd like!

I do hope that we're able to cater to our most ardent fans with the new Season of the Runelords and the heightened ability to replay sets with the class decks.

For instance, do you think that Runelords and Wrath are going to play the same if you're playing from the Alchemist and Gunslinger class decks and you've tossed all their boons into the box? That is a replay begging to happen!

Adventure Card Game Designer

2 people marked this as a favorite.

Mmmm, Gunslinger deck in Runelords. Sign me up.


Pathfinder Card Game, Class Deck Subscriber
Mike Selinker wrote:
And that matters quite a bit. We care a lot about our games reaching lots of people. And if a whole lot of people say "Y'know, I can skip Mummy's Mask because I haven't even started this Wrath set I bought"—even if PACG is the game they play most often—that's a huge deal to us.

PACG and the only boardgame me and my wife currently play. So while I'm disappointed by Mummy's Mask being delayed, I also take note that we have a whole Season of the Righteous to play through, and Bloodlust Corsairs, and, presumably, whatever Welby Bumpus has in store for the Wrath box set. So, taken in light of other things (video games to play, tv shows to watch, books to read (& also write) we have enough. PACG is still my favorite boardgame, but even I was feeling a little fatigue in the middle of Wrath (though, truthfully, it was because we were stomping nearly every bane without needing to roll)


Mike Selinker wrote:


Who knows whether delaying six months or so is the right decision? It might be and it might not. But it's a risk to add a big product to the channel when the channel is suggesting we should let our recent products sell through first. So we decided not to take that risk, and then by doing so incur the risk of people wandering away. We shall see.
.

Right!

Mike I think you took umbrage at my use of the word blowback. I meant it in the sense of feedback that was negative, or diminished what your current plans were for the product.

You have certainly garnered more information than I on the state of the franchise, and I will happily accede to your greater knowledge. But I do hold to my right to having an honest reaction, and that reaction was something like bewilderment.

If the distributors are giving you that feedback, that adds a lot more weight to the situation than does some internet whingers ( good Aussie word for you there )

To add to Hawk's comments, I only posted my reaction because I do care about the longevity of the game. It currently fills a niche for me as an eminately solitaire experience that is 'thinky' but doesn't need to be left out for days to weeks like most other such products would need to be.

I'm hoping your plans pay off for you!


I'd be interested to know whether they considered sticking with a gap of only 3 months, but going back to every-other month for adventures within an AP.

October feels like a really long way off, but i can't say I'm too worried about a bit of an extra break. We're lagging slightly with Wrath (only done 1 group out of 2 through AP 5, picking up 6 from the shop tomorrow) and have yet to start Shield of Rannick, Bloodlust Corsairs (have i got that title right?) or Season of the Righteous, or make any use of a wave-2 class deck.

And then there's Apocrypha some time in the spring - I know we've been told repeatedly it's not the same game (I think the analogy was an estranged sibling raised in a far more disturbing environment) but I can see it filling a similar slot in our gaming time.

Sovereign Court

Pathfinder Card Game, Class Deck Subscriber; Pathfinder Legends Subscriber
Mike Selinker wrote:
Mmmm, Gunslinger deck in Runelords. Sign me up.

I was actually more leaning towards Alchemist. A good amount of alchemicals in Runelords. I'be enjoyed playing Damiel there. Having an actual class deck for the bombs just makes it even better!


Definitely need that gap.

Runelords was so fun. Shackles less so, it wasn't as well balanced and there was one scenario (I forget which now) that we played at least eight times unsuccessfully! The same is proving to be true of Wrath- it's causing us to lose the desire to play. A little more playtest time would be great to make sure it really is balanced.

Plus, we'd quite like a chance to play something else occasionally! It's getting tiring playing PACG twice a week just to try and keep up (and failing- we're still on Deck 2).


Pathfinder Card Game, Class Deck Subscriber
MightyJim wrote:
I'd be interested to know whether they considered sticking with a gap of only 3 months, but going back to every-other month for adventures within an AP.

This would be the worst of both worlds for me. I'd much rather have them come out at a good clip with bigger breaks inbetween. Often, we have to employ a lot of patience to stretch 5 scenarios out across 4 weeks. I'd hate to go back to 5 scenarios in 8 weeks.

Adventure Card Game Designer

MightyJim wrote:
I'd be interested to know whether they considered sticking with a gap of only 3 months, but going back to every-other month for adventures within an AP.

We did, but that really disenfranchises our biggest fans. They hated it when we were starving them for content in the same Adventure Path. It's unlikely that we'll ever go back to that model, but you never know.

Adventure Card Game Designer

Troymk1 wrote:
Mike I think you took umbrage at my use of the word blowback. I meant it in the sense of feedback that was negative, or diminished what your current plans were for the product.

No umbrage taken! Game releases are often just guesswork, but we have a lot of data, and so it's a little more educated guesswork.

Scarab Sages

Pathfinder Card Game Subscriber

While the delay of the Mummy's Mask set was a bit disappointing (I love all things Osirion/Egyptian), the sanctioning of the Rise of the Runelords set for Organized Play definitely makes up for that news along with the upcoming class decks. So, as I wait for the start of Season of the Runelords, I will continue running my characters through Season of the Shackles and Season of the Righteous (as applicable). I was glad to hear though that this delay will allow for the polishing up of the new set.


Pathfinder Card Game Subscriber

All things considered, this feels like a smart move. I have to confess that I haven't even started WotR yet even though the final deck showed up on my doorstep this morning. I'm still running demo games of RotRL and while I'm making my way through SaS at home, we are still in the early stages of RotRL at our gaming group (my 3rd playthrough, their 1st).

Plus this gives you even MORE time to figure out how to do Kingmaker ;)

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Card Game, Class Deck, Companion, Modules, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Pathfinder Comics Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Season of the Runelords has lots of promise. Glad to hear that there will be more content to use with the first base set.

Also glad to hear that releases will be slowed somewhat. Have been playing since the beginning but my wife and I have only just started the Wrath of the Righteous box. We have played through RotRL and S&S with two sets of characters. We plan to do the same with WotR. The increased difficulty/complexity of scenarios has caused the play time to increase per scenario. Replaying failed scenarios happens much more frequently which adds to the time it takes to complete the adventure path.

In addition to our 2-player games, we have a 3-player RotRL game going with a friend and another 4-player game of RotRL and a 4-player of RotR. I also have a 2-player game of S&S going. These games are played infrequently with the most frequent being once a month.

At this time, we are now using all three of our boxes.

Would be interested to see some adventure 7+ content for the existing boxes. This could be in the form of decks (direct from Paizo or PoD from drviethroughcards) or PDFs. I think that this is space that can we explored for both home games and organized play.


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Card Game, Class Deck Subscriber

OK now I need to write my own AP and drivethru it! I hate you all.

Just kidding. Best game ever.

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