can you take 3 swift actions on your turn ?
or 2 move actions even if the move actions aren't used for moving e.g. controlling a spell with a move action ?
You can always trade down.
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No rule that I know allow you to get more swift actions. And nowhere is written that you can trade down actions.
Move Action: ... You can take a move action in place of a standard action.
Swift Action: A swift action consumes a very small amount of time, but represents a larger expenditure of effort and energy than a free action. You can perform only a single swift action per turn.
Immediate Action: An immediate action is very similar to a swift action, but can be performed at any time—even if it's not your turn.
Playing your way it would be possible to use a swift action in your turn and a immediate action off turn.
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You can make one of the following action combinations on any turn:
That's it.
D&D 4.0 works that way. Both move and standard actions can be converted to 'minor' actions (4.0's version of swift) and you can do it as much as you want. 2 minor and one move, 3 minor, 1 standard and 2 minor, etc.
I personally like this approach, one of the few things form 4.0 I do. I feel it helps better quantify just how long things are taking, without having to go into the GURPS system of 1 second rounds.
The problem with allowing more then one swift action a round is the power level jumps. Many actions that need to be limited to help keep the power level balanced are done so by making them a swift or immediate action.
If you could down grade you are allowing a full spell caster to get 3 spells cast per round.
EDIT - beat me by 50 seconds BBT. :)
If you could substitute there would be a real imbalance in the game.
Casters with quickened spells would be incredibly powerful (more so).
Powers like the Inquisitors would be unbalanced.
etc.
So just going to throw an example
you've got two flamming sphere's running, can you spend your std and your move action to move both ? or are you limited to only moving one per turn with your move action ?
That works Phasics since you can downgrade a standard to a move.
That works Phasics since you can downgrade a standard to a move.
Groovy
just considering a wizard using 2 Dazing (metamagic) lightning ball spells to use a double move to move 6-10 balls independently to daze targets from round to round. Like an orchestral conductor.
As stated, per RAW there is no substitution.
standards being able to perform moves does not carry over to a general rule.
conflating that with the idea that the standard/move/swift actions copnstitue a hierarchy which can be 'laterally' shifted to the 'next' category just doesn't conform with how the game is meant to actually meant to be balanced.
that said, the one substitution I DO allow is using a STANDARD for a Swift...
so if Mr Wizard only has a prepared Swift Action spell left, and has a Standard but doesn't have a Swift Action available, he can still cast it, and the same goes for other Swift Action options... potentailly that allows for 2 Swifts per Round, but I ahven't seen a problem there.
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in the PRD under Action types:
* only one swift action per round. if you use an immediate action out of turn, you cannot use a swift action on your next turn.
* You can always take a move action in place of a standard action.
this is RAW from PRD. Allowing multiple swift is a houserule that should be thinked twice based on the character asking for it.
I think a Move for a Swift is 3.5 if I remember correctly.
Nope, 3.5 also limited swift actions to 1 per turn.
To anyone who thinks trading standard/move actions for multiple swift actions in one turn is fine: Wait until your spellcasters start casting 3 spells per turn.
To anyone who thinks trading standard/move actions for multiple swift actions in one turn is fine: Wait until your spellcasters start casting 3 spells per turn.
Ah, that's why I don't allow demoting down to move actions.
Demoting a swift action into a standard, on the other hand, is something I'd have considerably less problems with.
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Demoting a swift action into a standard, on the other hand, is something I'd have considerably less problems with.
I allow this as well. You can come up with some in-game reasoning if you want to disallow it ("A swift action requires a level of mental effort you can only summon once per round, even if you have a standard remaining") but I haven't found that allowing a swift action in place of a standard to adversely affect the mechanics of the game at all.
I do generally say that a quickened spell cast as a standard action does provoke, though.
I do generally say that a quickened spell cast as a standard action does provoke, though.
Of course. Non-provoking is a feature of the swift action the quickened spell comes with, in my book.
I haven't found that allowing a swift action in place of a standard to adversely affect the mechanics of the game at all.
The only situations I can think of at the time are things like spellcasting in the Astral Plane. Since all spells and spell-likes are auto-quickened there, demoting Swift to Standard allows you to cast twice a round. Which would be utterly impossible otherwise (so much for Enhanced Magic).
I never thought of Immeadiate, Swift, Movement, and Standard actions as one less then another. I find it interesting folk are using "demote" as opposed to swap or in place of.
As said before, swapping movement for a swift is not allowed. As a houserule, I would consider swapping any other action for a swift action on a case by case basis. Some actions would seem more movement like, others more like a standard action.
Greg
In the case of movement and standard specifically, most people refer to it as demotion simply because standard can be swapped for movement, but not vice versa. This usually implies one is more powerful than the other.
I do agree that swift/immediate actions are in a bit more unique of a position, though. I can't really see any argument against being able to use a standard for a swift.