Tharasiph |
I have found a question, is this how you intended for this to work please?
1 -
Slashing Grace (Other version) makes a weapon count as a one handed piercing weapon, thus making it eligible for a Swashbucklers Finesse and thus Dex to To Hit and gives Dex to Damage.
Your version says Deadly Agility only applies to a weapon that benefits from weapon finesse, which means i'd need to take your Slashing Grace and Deadly agility to be able to apply Dex to Damage to a Non-finessable slashing weapon i.e Cutlass.
2 -
Your feats SG and DA they say weapon wielded one-handed, does this mean that the feats apply to using a weapon in each hand and getting Dex to Damage for both? If so do they work as per TWF and strength and get Half Strength for of hand?
3-
Is Dervish Dance feat unchanged? As it is a Swashbuckler qualifies immediately for Dex to Damage and To Hit by just taking this feat.
4-
Also Languages Hiroguo, Sudland what is spoken please?
oyzar |
With the extra feat required I guess I won't get to use a katana unless I go for strength kensai... I don't think anyone will go for a dex based character with slashing weapon now (except for scimitar). Personally I feel weapon focus was already a heavy tax, but requiring one more on top of that is too much. It's your game though, if you want to discourage slashing weapons that's of course fine. They can still be used by strength based characters of course.
nate lange RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
@Yuria- swords will usually be enough. Just like in westerns everybody gets into pistol range instead of sniping each other with rifles, most of the action in this will be up close and personal. A ranged weapon might not be a terrible idea in case you get ambushed by Indians on a hill or something (but that would be the exception, not the rule).
@Ironclad- pretty much any kind of ranger should be ok as long as you give it suitable flavor. Pay attention to the background documents when thinking about favored enemies and terrains.
@Oyzar and Rungok- umm, I'm pretty sure I just saved your builds since the official paizo slashing grace feat specifically cannot be used with spell combat...
nate lange RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
@Tharasiph-
1) Correct. You can take deadly agility alone for any finesse-able weapon (rapier, curved blade, estoc, dueling sword, any light blade...) but to take it for other swords you need to take slashing grace first.
2) Deadly Agility does not say the weapon has to be wielded in one hand, it does say that the Dex bonus is halved in the off hand. Slashing Grace does currently say it only works while wielding a weapon one-handed but now that I think about it that doesn't seem necessary and I'm going to drop it.
3) Dervish Dance is unchanged although based on the precedent set by the published fencing/slashing grace feats I'm going to rule that it can't be used with spell combat or when using your off-hand for unarmed or natural attacks (because those things will count as occupying your hand).
4) Common is the language of Hiroguo, everyone starts with it. Sudish and Indian are both languages as well- if you make a Sudlander or an Indian you start with the appropriate language also.
oyzar |
Fencing grace and dervish dance are the only viable ways of going dex (for a magus at least) in normal pathfinder (fencing grace does work with spell combat). When I asked my question I was merely looking for options for making other weapons just as viable with a dex build. You seem to be heading the somewhat opposite direction though, instead of making more options viable, you are limiting the existing ones. Unless you change your ruling on fencing grace/dervish dance I probably won't be considering it. Four feats is just too much.
Edit: If deadly agility works I guess I'm wrong as it's possible to just pick up that instead of fencing grace and it even works with an Estoc.
I think I'll instead take advantage of the unique opportunity to play with a race that get a bonus to both strength and int. Now I just have to decide if I want to make a kensai with a bladebound katana or a more traditional magus with either a cutlass or a scimitar.
Edit2: Though, isn't this a jian? I guess either estoc or rapier is more fitting after all... While my character certainly won't be completely like him, it's nice to get some inspiration and a lot of his (adult) pictures fit. Edit3: Turns out it's actually a Chokuto, however the way I've seen it used is primarily for stabbing, which makes rapier or estoc fit very well. Would you allow to use a rapier or estoc as a chokuto rather than a Jian? I found this quote supporting my idea of using a rapier/estoc as a chokuto:
However, it is said that the sword was used with drawing and pushing cuts, but was primarily a thrusting weapon, similar to a rapier.
With both Raikiri (shocking grasp) and Katon gouka jutsu (fireball), it's mighty tempting to make my magus come from a ninja clan. That's where he got his powers from. Is that ok with you even though I obviously won't have any levels in ninja?
nate lange RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
Oyzar- right. Deadly Agility actually gives you way more options than fencing grace for the same cost. And, getting Dex to damage with slashing weapons does take one more feat than before but it spares you from taking a magic item that many GMs won't allow from a random splat book, and it allows you to use them for two weapon fighting or with spell combat which is a very big improvement over the official slashing grace.
Waliev- I tried with the modified Guided Hand, but with your current build I don't see a way to make it work.
oyzar |
Sorry for all the edits. Do you agree that it would fit to use a rapier or estoc to model the chokuto? There are a lot of pictures fit what I envision, but they are all wielding a chokuto. Though it is indeed largely used for thrusting. As mentioned in the by the sensei in the link above, it might not be practical for real world applications, but that's just because they didn't have lighting to add to it ;).
nate lange RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
Sigvald Derleth Waite |
Here's Tharasiphs dude.. not fully complete, missing a Personality and appearance, background still needs more.
Human Swashbuckler Noble Fencer archetype, I envision him to be a mobile swordsmaster and part time face.
Most of it is there though, he will be using european gear kinda..
Can I use a Cutlass as compared to a Scimitar for purposes of Dervish Dance (if not i'll fix the various places that shall need fixing).
Feel free to point out anything else you find, if your up to looking in it's 90% complete state.
nate lange RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
nate lange RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
He hasn't posted yet but the other player that I know for sure is playing told me he's planning to build a swashbuckler. I don't know exactly how he's going to build but it seems a safe bet he's going to be a one handed Dex swordsman. There are obviously a fair number of variations on that basic idea but I just wanted to give everyone who's in that vein a heads up. I'll remind him to post something as soon as he can.
nate lange RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
"The Lucky Halfling" |
I'm looking to throw my hat into the ring with a tielfing Fighter, no fancy archetypes or anything. The character will hail from a proud tiefling family and carry the demeanor of a samurai who basks in intimidating his enemies. With that in mind, he will wield a katana as his sword of choice in a two-handed style while wearing his o-yorai armor which is crafted with a faceplate that appears to be a oni, depicting his lineage despite his almost human appearance. If you have no issues with it, I think I would like to make use of fire ink to give him tattoos depicting his life and giving an ominous glow from beneath his armor.
I'll work on expanding his background, appearance, and mechanics if you have no issues with the idea.
nate lange RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
nate lange RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
Wow, this slowed down quick... If there's not another surge of interest by this weekend I'll probably end up closing recruitment early...
@Yumiko- I don't mind someone starting as a cleric or whatever and then becoming a swords(wo)man a little bit later in life. If your cleric abilities still work, make sure your god is one who will be cool with your new career.
oyzar |
My magus is coming along nicely... Crunch is pretty much done. Though I've been too busy to work on it today :/.
I must say I'm amazed at the feat taxes in pathfinder though. Moonlight Stalker Feint require 4 feats and another to make it worthwhile (on top of he heavy restrictions in use). They really don't want martials to have nice things :p. Moonlight Stalker require darkvision or low-light vision though. I was thinking to use the alternate trait dimdweller to pick up darkvision, which replaces skilled. Is that still ok?
I decided to go with bladebound kensai. Is it still fine to get Estoc for that? Also, I'm curious if I can get +1 Keen or I would have to stick with +2 (and get Keen from arcane pool)?
The trait ancestral weapon would be very fitting fluffwise with bladebound, but I don't think it would work to change the material of the weapon.
@Yumiko: I believe we are using the standard pantheon with adaptations to Asia culture. So you can still pick one of the core deities and benefit from all the material related related to it, but you might have to flavor shift some things.
"The Lucky Halfling" |
I'm still here. Taking some time to work through mechanics and check out pictures for inspiration. I'm kind of seeing him wearing black armor highlighted through the seams by his tattoos.
Do you have any issues with paying 40 gp per hand sized tattoo for permanent tattoos that glow like a torch? This would be using fire ink.
nate lange RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
@Yumiko- Oyzar is correct. You can pick any published paizo god (the Archives of Nethys website has the list); some of them are already Asian in name/flavor, others aren't... You can pick any to use the mechanics from and then just alter the flavor as necessary to fit the setting.
@Oyzar- bladebound cannot choose the estoc... The sidebar that describes the blade specifically states that it has to be "a one-handed slashing weapon, a rapier, or a sword-cane." Also, I'm not sure if you're talking about the half-elf "ancestral weapon" alternate racial ability or the 'heirloom weapon' equipment trait... Either way I don't think it works quite like you're thinking...
Loup Blanc |
Actually, he's probably talking about this trait, which is a really good one and also quite thematic for this game. I took it myself for my character, since he's come from a long line of swordsmen who trace their lineage back to an ancestor who was a great swordsmith.
Also, I've settled on my bodyguard type. I think that style of swordplay and character concept are a lot more unique and different, and will hopefully add some interesting stuff rather than just "brutal swordsman who enjoys killing." The build also came together a lot better and supported stuff outside of combat, so that's good.
nate lange RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
@Halfling- that sounds ok I guess, just bear in mind that unless you have permanent fire resistance you'll always be dealing with the sickening effects.
@Loup- thanks, I totally forgot about that one. And the bodyguard thing sounds like an interesting option.
@Oyzar- (assuming Loup is correct) the weapon you get from that would be completely separate from your black blade.
@Davian- sorry to hear that. Happy gaming.
nate lange RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
Loup Blanc |
Alright, I've got my character mechanically finished out, other than mundane gear. I think it's all in order with the rules and all, but if anything seems amiss let me know and I'll fix it. Backstory and personality and all that is on the way!
Male human swashbuckler (veiled blade, whirling dervish) 7
NG Medium humanoid (human)
Initiative +12; Senses Perception +12
- - - - -
DEFENSE
- - - - -
Armor Class 22, touch 19, flat-footed 14 (+6 Dex, +2 armor, +1 natural, +2 dodge, +1 deflection)
Hit Points 71/71 (7d10+7)
Nonlethal Damage 0
Condition Normal
Fortitude +3, Reflex +12, Will +4
- - - - -
OFFENSE
- - - - -
Speed 30 feet
Melee Ire's Mastery +16/+11 (1d6+15/15-20)
Ranged Dagger +14/+9 (1d4+13/10 ft.)
Special Attacks Combat Expertise, Deeds
- - - - -
STATISTICS
- - - - -
Strength 10, Dexterity 22, Constitution 12, Intelligence 10, Wisdom 14, Charisma 16
Base Attack Bonus +7
Combat Maneuver Bonus +13
Combat Maneuver Defense 24
Feats Agile Maneuvers, Combat Expertise, Improved Disarm, Improved Initiative, Steadfast Personality, Swordplay Style
Traits Ancestral Weapon, Blade of Mercy, Threatening Defender
Trained Skills
Acrobatics +16 (7 ranks+3 class+6 Dex)
Bluff +13 (7 ranks+3 class+3 Cha)
Disguise +13 (7 ranks+3 class+3 Cha)
Knowledge (nobility) +10 (7 ranks+3 class) (Background)
Perception +12 (7 ranks+3 class+2 Wis)
Sense Motive +12 (7 ranks+3 class+2 Wis)
Sleight of Hand +16 (7 ranks+3 class+6 Dex) (Background)
Stealth +13 (7 ranks+6 Dex)
Languages Common
Equipment
Weapons
Ire's Mastery (+2 silver scimitar)
Daggers, 3
Armor and Clothing
+1 haramaki
Amulet of natural armor +1
Belt of incredible dexterity +2
Gauntlets of the skilled disarmer
Hat of disguise
Ring of protection +1
Other Gear
Masterwork backpack
--Fishing tackle
--Hammock
Money
470 gp, 9 sp
Vashiro Hitaki |
This is Wanderer82's submission. Started as a straight ranger, evolved into a ranger/rogue during the build process, definitely still accomplishes the swordsman role. Sadly, Paizo.com decided to eat my background and appearance, so I need to retype those, but I at least wanted to get my crunch before GM Lange for review.
nate lange RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
oyzar |
Aww, I was hoping you would let me have estoc since it was in your sword document. It's not a huge difference from rapier anyway (1.5 damage on average). But it would have been a bigger sword...
Loup is correct about the trait, I thought it would be fitting to combine it with black blade, seeing as black blade does mention it being inherited as one of the possible origins. I guess I have to pick another trait. There is no shortage of great traits to pick from.
I don't think you commented on the idea of my character coming from a clan of ninjas. Obviously the magic will be styled as ninjutsu. The secret arts passed down through generations to tame lightning and fire and to master their own chakra. If you have any suggestions on how such a clan would best fit in, it would be nice to know. It is your world after all.
Also, is replacing skilled with the human alternate racial trait dimdweller fine?
oyzar |
I'm still here, just reforming.
I do believe chakra energy is taboo among hiroguoren. They deal in chi/ki predominantly...?
Chakra is for heathens
I have no idea what that means...
Edit: The setting document, sorry for not reading it closely first. Chi or Ki is definitely more fitting then. I do want my character to be "Japanese" flavor, not Indian.
nate lange RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
@Oyzar- Wuliev is correct, chakras are an Indian belief, the Hiroguoren study and use chi (I know ki is the more Japanese rendering but for consistency we'll always use chi). I'm fine with flavoring magic as chi techniques. And if you want your background to include being from a ninja clan that's fine, just make sure you explain why you're no longer serving your clan (and how you see your relationship with them).
Wuliev the Indignant |
Can I eschew my Aasimar Inquisitor's mystical abilities' being simply his inherent nature manifesting as opposed to him following the path of some religious undertaking? His critical view of the piety of the known prevailing religions would help to explain his Heresy inquisition.
He's not irreligious or cynical at all, it's just he knows that there's a much more dubious side to the spiritual than what nominal believers in such and such a tradition might accept due to his existence and religious status as being touched by the divine. He's put up with believers asking him for favors his whole life when he's just a kid trying to get by and study what irks his relentless curiosity.
He was trained as a swordsman under a ruthless teacher.
His religious allegiance isn't necessarily tied to a specific deity, but his beliefs are rather a mix of stock buddhism, asian tradition, and some PF pantheon drizzled in. He's cynical towards the benefactor-ey perception of most deities simply due to both his firsthand experience with the supernatural, and his firsthand experience of having to deal with the perception of his race's duty to the religious.
nate lange RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
@Wuliev- your class is inherently religious, so you can't completely drop that and treat it like a racial class... That said, you don't have to practice a traditional western religion (which is largely what the pathfinder gods/faiths are. A religion based on, or just inspired by Buddhism, with elements of Taoism and/or Confucianism (or even Shintoism) would be fine.
nate lange RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |