It may not have been a surprise, since if the girl really was a doppelganger, as seems to be the case, she was likely suspicious.
Also, 'gangers can Detect Thoughts at will...
Ok, so again just trying to understand RAW :
Technically, combatants are only "surprised" if they are unaware of each other, yes?
However, I have seen interpretations on forums in which my suddenly grabbing for her could have been considered a "surprise". Without Detect Thoughts, we could have both rolled something to see if she was surprised, or Ray could have just let her be surprised. Or like Mal said she could have been suspicious in general or suspicious of my story (based on Ray's high rolls), and ready for an attack, and thus definitely not surprised. In which case she could have taken an AoO, but only with whatever weapon she had in hand at the time.
Doc : even with Detect Thoughts at will, she would have 1)had to have started it at least 3 rounds before I grabbed her, 2)been focused on reading me instead of Leland, *and* 3)I would have gotten a Will save to avoid being read. And all that would only help if you also allow the broader meaning of "surprised".
Anyway, either way I'm not surprised since I started it, and I'm also not Flat-Footed (FF) any more because I started it.
Then we all rolled initiative, and until each person acts, they are FF. Except possibly me, since I started it.
So by RAW, she was aware of me and not surprised, but rolled lower Init and so remains FF until she acts, and thus couldn't have taken an AoO when I grabbed her.
Even with a broader meaning of surprise, she couldn't have taken an AoO unless she was expecting a fight (high Sense Motive rolls, Detect Thoughts, generally suspicious, etc.), which is entirely possible in this case.
But, since she had no weapon in hand, she couldn't have taken the AoO even if she could have. [Doc : don't think about that last part too much, or your head will explode... :)]
Is that about it?
P.S. - just using this as a test case to better understand the rules, I really don't care that it's Bukaru that got hit. Ray, if you want to stick with the story as-is, I'm fine with that.
My post was more a comment on Mal's "may not have been a surprise" -- pointing out another reason why it might not have been -- than in support of the AoO per se.
That said:
The third round is only 18 seconds (and starts after 12 seconds, if you want to figure information starts coming in during the third round). Since the 'ganger was on the porch, it saw the both of you coming ("Her eyes pop open when she sees Leland and Bukaru approaching.") I think it's entirely likely it would have lit off Detect Thoughts. Heck, if I-the-player could do that at will, I certainly would if I saw someone walking up to my house. And I'm not even an evil monster (shut up!)
Seems to me the exchange up to the grab would have taken more than 18 seconds, and since you were the one primarily talking with it, you would probably have been its focus.
With my Shadowlands cleric having only been the user of Detect Thoughts, I've not rolled a save against the spell so that didn't occur to me. Based on your observation, it seems Detect Thoughts wasn't used -- unless our illustrious GM rolled it for the both of you because he didn't want to give that clue away. (Nobody else was in sight and little girls don't cast Detect Thoughts as a rule...)
Anyway, I'd attributed its reaction against that decent Diplomacy roll to knowing what you were really thinking... but maybe not.
It was highly suspicious of the lie you told. It doubts that McCady would do anything to jeopardize his daughter, which he would be doing if he sent you to check up on her.
But given some thought I agree the AOO is dubious because she would need to transform to get her claws. I thought it was instantaneous, but it looks like given no other info it would take a standard action.
In summary you don't take damage. You can revise your action if you'd like. I'll make a post when I get home today.
Mal is up. And I'll try to clarify the map as well later.
Well...if it would *start* to transform as I grab it, then Leland and I still could have done everything we've already declared, which would involve a minimum of backtracking - how about that?
Won't be able to check again until tomorrow early AM.
"Ben's standards." Guffaw.
I'll have you know that as a rule, Ben only goes through the better class of windows. *haughty sniff*
He recommends those of saloons, banks, and the kind owned by men with beautiful but unhappy-in-their-marriages wives.
lol
Well done.
I've got guests today, so I apologize in advance for being slow to respond.
I'd be glad to help if I could, but it's been my understanding that Heal and Channel Energy don't affect mechanical things and constructs, that something more like Make Whole is required?
Ah. Except that the mechanical... erm... "ness" is just his visage. Gizmo is an eidolon.
Dunno if that matters, though.
Bukaru, given how the other favored class bonuses read, I think it's meant to be +1 point of healing for every 3 times you take that bonus.
Personally I think you would be better off taking a skill point or HP. You can go ahead and adjust that if you would like.
-Posted with Wayfinder
Ya it's just re-skinning for flavour. Mechanically healing works fine.
31 years old, with a bachelor's degree and I still had to Google the difference between stalactites and stalagmites.
A mnemonic I use to keep them straight is that the ones on the ground have it easy and can just sit there, but the ones hanging from the ceiling have to hang on tight. Thus stalactite.
Gonna be a bit busy today, guys. I'll try and get a map up tomorrow.
Oh, and, Doc, stay on your toes. I'm gonna have something for you soon.
Well Doc is riding, but he can ask Appie to stay on her toes if you'd like.
Heh... rooster teeth and pony toes...
And my apologies to all; I really thought this would just be a quick supply stop for everyone. I'd've never headed out if I'd known there was a dungeon crawl or (presumably significant) melee(s) coming.
Still, between crunch time at work and moving I was pretty busy for a good while, so maybe it was for the best. And y'all seem to have the situation well in hand. :o) Plus a hair-trigger pyromaniac alchemist in a fight in or near a wood-frame house probably would've been... "sub-optimal" anyway. :op
"What are you complaining about? We saved the town, didn't we?"
"The town is on fire!"
"But we saved it first."
LOLL! Thanks, Ben!
New map is now up at the top of the page here. It's going to be hard to see your characters a bit. Next time I'll removed the terrain. In fact I might do that soonish.
Grid Cartographer is a pretty neat program.
EDIT: Map is edited to be easier to read.
I'll have a post up tonight beginning combat.
-Posted with Wayfinder
Sorry guys, have been away from a PC, will have a post up in the morning.
Hey guys, I'm going to be away on Saturday, just so you know.
And now they've firewalled RDP at work so it's no longer possible for me to post during the day. I'm strictly "read-only" until I get home. Sorry, all. :o(
Gonna be busy today. If I don't post tonight, it should definitely be tomorrow night.
Sorry about the delay, kids. I wish I had a particularly great excuse, but I honestly just forgot. Again sorry. Bigger post when I get home.
-Posted with Wayfinder
Post for Loveless coming tomorrow.
... two Hobgoblins laughing as they beat a deep gnome with their fists.
Those hobgoblins should be so incredibly grateful Doc isn't there. >:o(
Post coming tomorrow. Been super busy.
-Posted with Wayfinder
Ray, I seem to have lost the link to the goblin cave map - could you please re-post? Thanks!
Top of the page, Buckster.
Wow that's a tiny little link!
Posts coming in tomorrow. I have guests arriving soon.
I must admit Bukaru is having a hard time accepting that Gizmo is a living thing (player understanding not withstanding).
The first time I healed it, it was after a a player-to-player discussion, and I just went ahead and did it, against *Bukaru's* better judgement.
But honestly, Bukaru is only concerned with the living, and will have to be talked into healing this...thing...made of gears and smoke and sparks, that doesn't possibly look like it could be "alive". And it won't be easy...
I think there's going to have to be some PC-to-PC discussion before Bukaru will heal Gizmo anymore. So for the time being she will only trigger her Channel Energy when some of the PC's get hurt.
Sorry, not trying to be intentionally difficult, just true-to-character.
In the end, it won't really matter. I'm going to be using life-link non-stop, so you can just heal Leland when the need arises and if that's a channel, then Gizmo will get healed as well.
I'm going to be volunteering at a convention this weekend, so my posting is going to be spotty. Things should be back to normal by Monday.
-Posted with Wayfinder
The Convention was brutal. I'm still pretty tired. I will have posts moving you forward tomorrow.
The Doc is such a charmer. XD Not that he isn't right, of course.
I've got a couple of busy days coming up starting tomorrow, so feel free to DMPC Ben if I don't manage to post.
I’m thinking of DM’ing a PbP game using Savage Worlds (Deluxe edition, or "SWD"). In the interests of full disclosure, while I’ve been playing and DM’ing FRP games for more than a couple of decades, I’m new to both PbP and SW. I’ve also never DM’ed a PbP game before, so the initial set-up may take me a little longer than usual.
But, I can guarantee at least one long post a day, for 5 out of 7 days a week. And depending on the day of the week, I can check several times a day and give short replies. I would ask that you be able to commit to posting at least once every other day, once a day if at all possible.
If you’ve never used SW before, I wouldn’t let that stop you. It has all the basic concepts of any FRP system (roll some dice to get a total over some target value to succeed at the task), and while some of its details can take a little getting used to, the basic concepts are not that hard. Both Loveless and I had never used it before, and picked it up pretty quickly. I have several short documents I’ve created while learning it myself that may help, and those of us who do know it can help those who don’t. See THIS PDF for a very concise 16-page summary of how SW works.
One of the things I really like about SW is that you can custom-design your own PC by picking whatever Attributes (PF’s “Abilities”), Skills, and Edges (PF’s “Feats”) you want. Do not worry about party “roles” – pick whatever you want your character to *be*, first. You can reasonably have an armored, sword-wielding magic-user who’s good at picking locks! However, if you’re totally new to SW I can give you a few simple “gotta have” recommendations for any PC.
You can be any race you want, from any system or story you like. If you’re not human, at least one Edge AND Hindrance must go towards “defining” your race in some reasonable way (humans may get an extra Edge to compensate, I haven't decided yet). See SWD for some examples of what I mean, and please run your concept by me first (a description of the race, its Edge and Hindrance).
The SWD standard Arcane Powers (Magic, Miracles, and Psionics only) are available. Powers from the Fantasy Companion and Shaintar are allowed as well, if you have access to those. I have a couple of house rules which should make Powers more useful, and intend to add Power-based house rules as we go (always to your advantage). If you're not familiar with SW, their spell list may seem very short, but it provides the functionality of many dozens of PF's spells.
I have several SW house rules already, which you should be aware of before you create your PC, especially if you know SW well.
I’m thinking of a world where each “major” race (Dwarf, Elf, Hobbit, Human) evolved on its own continent, and about 100 years prior to the game, ocean-going ships became reliable and not only did all the races discover each other, but they discovered an “uninhabited” continent (well, there *are* Goblins and Orcs on it, but they don’t *really* count now, do they), and everyone’s been colonizing different parts of it (think North and South America in the 1500-1600’s being colonized by the English, French, and Spanish).
The technology level is that of right around the U.S. Civil war – steam engines, steam locomotives, and single-shot guns. It takes a few rounds to reload any gun, so bows and crossbows are still more deadly in the long run (and I'm adding an Edge to reduce reload times). This means science is firmly established, ocean navigation is not hit-or-miss anymore, and there are telescopes, microscopes, hot-air balloons, steam (paddle-wheel) boats for rivers, printing presses and mass-distribution of newspapers. There's no practical electricity of any kind (telegraph, light bulbs, phonograph, etc.).
So on the coasts of this new continent, civilization is fairly well established, but probably not with ALL the modern conveniences of the "home" continents ("London" would have THE latest and greatest stuff and the highest quality-of-living [think Sherlock Holmes], but while early "New York" would be the height of civilization on this continent, it's still far behind "London"). A few railways connect the big cities on the coasts, and go a little ways inward, but the vast part of the center of the continent is "uncivilized". Besides Orcs, there's all kinds of beasties and humanoids that evolved only on this continent that the PC's wouldn't be familiar with.
The PC’s would meet on a (steam-powered, screw-propeller) ship taking you to the “new world”, for whatever reason you decide for your PC. The party forms as you find like-minded people (or at least, ones that annoy you the least) during the month-long voyage. For whatever reasons you decide, you each intend on exploring the uncharted territories of the “new world” (as opposed to staying in the coastal colony cities). The game would start with you getting off the boat and preparing for your journey.
Anyone interested? I'd like to get at least 4 players (up to 6 or 8), and am asking y'all before the "general public" because I like your style.
The setting seems interesting, and I've wanted to try SW for a while, but I don't have a lot of time to learn a new ruleset. I'd be willing to give it a try if you don't mind a lot of newb questions, and spelling necessary rules out pretty explicitly (or handling the rolls yourself).
If that's okay, I'll think up something for a character. A little more information on the setting would be good, though (though I don't want to clog up this thread). Steam and gaslights! The Age of Exploration! Good stuff.
Goodness, that sounds amazing. I'm in the same boat as Ben (coupled with I'm also currently learning the Star Wars Edge of the Empire ruleset), though. I have no experience at all with Savage Worlds. It also has kind of a lot of books, and I'm not exactly sure where to start.
Ben - no problems. Once you've got a PC concept, describe it and we can figure out the stats and such.
Mal - The free PDF already mentioned really contains almost all you'd need as a starting PC to understand the system and create a PC. The only other source you'd need is Savage Worlds Deluxe, $10 either PDF or softcover.
Anyone wanting to "cast spells" would definitely need the Deluxe book.
P.S. ADDED LATER - just to be clear, "Deluxe" is the name of the latest version of the system. There's just the one core book, "Savage Worlds Deluxe".
Do you have a separate discussion board going for this? I don't want to clutter up Ray's game with me babbling about a character.
I'm just a couple of hours from some medical tests (let's just say they end in "oscopy") that's probably going to keep me from doing anything again until some time tomorrow.
Then I have to research how to start a new PbP game on Paizo, so it *might* be until Sunday before I have a separate board up.
We can postpone further discussion until I announce the board's up, if further posting here would be a problem. Anyway, it might be nice for continuity if specific PC discussions were on the new board.
If Ray is agreeable, I can continue to answer specific questions here about the system or other preparations until then...
P.S. - the Deluxe book has more equipment, and full descriptions of the Edges (Feats) and such. While not essential to start with, it would be helpful to anyone, not just spellcasters.
Loveless asked (elsewhere) : "So are you going for fantasy in a quasi-modern setting (elves, wizards, dragons, psions, etc.) or a lower-key "it's like history but with additional races" (orcs, etc.) and e.g. telepaths, the rare superhero, psychics, in-tune priests, etc. for the magic users?" BTW, he hasn't said so here, but he's in!
I'm still somewhat making it up as I go along (the Indiana Jones school of DM'ing), but think of a "typical" D&D medieval world that's had an extra couple hundred years of scientific/technological advancement.
But most of that "hi-tech" is back on your home continents. Compare the luxuries and such of London and Paris in 1850 to the U.S. western settlers in covered wagons having to hand-build their homes at the same time - big difference!
Magic (of any sort) as a whole is not that common (maybe 1 person in 1000? 10,000?), but as PC's of course you might be on this adventure precisely because you do have the "gift"... Compared to PF it's definitely "low-magic" (you can't just walk into a shop and buy wands and such), but magic is still pretty powerful.
Sure, keep posting here. Not a problem with me. But opening a thread is pretty easy. First go to either discussion or recruitment at the top of the page. Then add a new thread. If you created the thread yourself then you have options at the top of the page to create a new campaign.
-Posted with Wayfinder
Off the top of my head I'm thinking either homesteader out to carve a piece of the "new world" for him/herself, or effete Old Money entrepreneur looking to fill near-empty personal coffers by starting a plantation (hopefully with cheap - or free - labor). It would be interesting to know what Loveless or Mal might be planning first, to see if we might stitch something together that dovetailed nicely.
It would be interesting to know what Loveless or Mal might be planning first, to see if we might stitch something together that dovetailed nicely.
Let me read the book tonight and I'll get back to you.
What I'm thinking - without having read it - is that given the position of technology, society's attempts to still be "proper", and the idea of a new world, I'm pretty inclined to make a scholarly character - intelligent and scientific. Possibly reckless? Definitely curious to a fault. I may delve into the realm of Psionics, depending on how the book paints it.
There's also weird science which allows you to do weird science fiction stuff, like say Alchemy.
In fact, I think I would like to play. I'm thinking of a either a pure wizard or dwarf fighter type.
-Posted with Wayfinder
BTW, he hasn't said so here, but he's in!
He hasn't said so here because they've tightened the firewall rules at work and Paizo is now strictly read-only there. :op
Yes, I'm in. Too many good people involved for me to let this one slip by.
It would be interesting to know what Loveless or Mal might be planning first, to see if we might stitch something together that dovetailed nicely.
I'm seeing this as an opportunity to cut loose and experiment. The very first thing that occurred to me was someone not sailing to The New World by choice (but not admitting it at first, of course). Like someone with a strong natural magic talent, but one s/he can't yet control. Spontaneous conflagrations when s/he gets mad, for example -- think a cross between Firestarter Charlie McGee and "You wouldn't like me when I'm angry" Bruce Banner. One too many buildings burned down in town, you see...
But I'm still kicking ideas around. "Dovetail" question: Anyone interested in a familiar or animal companion? I'm contemplating a riff on a character I ran on the "CB Simulator" (that's what they called real-time chat, really!) way back in the bad old Compuserve days. But it's more of a support role than a standalone PC.
And Bucky, will you literally be starting as we get off the boat, or will there be some intro/mingle time first?
Anyone interested in a familiar or animal companion? I'm contemplating a riff on a character I ran on the "CB Simulator" (that's what they called real-time chat, really!) way back in the bad old Compuserve days. But it's more of a support role than a standalone PC.
I'm tentatively interested in this idea. I'm currently running the entire gamut on character concepts. Let me know here or via PM what you have in mind?