Zen Archer Synergy


Rules Questions

Scarab Sages

I have been playing a Zen Archer recently and have come upon a topic for which I would like some developer guidance. I know this particular topic has been a question for a long time from the research I have done, but I have seen so many conflicting responses on every side of the debate.

Here is the question:
While under the effect of Enlarge Person, would the arrows do 1d8 damage? Or, would they do 2d6 damage? As per the Core Rulebook, damage is based on the bow. However, the text for Enlarge Person states:
"Any enlarged item that leaves an enlarged creature’s possession (including a projectile or thrown weapon) instantly returns to its normal size. This means that thrown and projectile weapons deal their normal damage. Magical properties of enlarged items are not increased by this spell."

This also contradicts what is said by Reduce Person:
"Melee and projectile weapons deal less damage. Other magical properties are not affected by this spell. Any reduced item that leaves the reduced creature’s possession (including a projectile or thrown weapon) instantly returns to its normal size. This means that thrown weapons deal their normal damage (projectiles deal damage based on the size of the weapon that fired them)."

So, 1d8 or 2d6? This also ties in with Gravity Bow, which says:
"Gravity bow significantly increases the weight and density of arrows or bolts fired from your bow or crossbow the instant before they strike their target and then return them to normal a few moments later. Any arrow fired from a bow or crossbow you are carrying when the spell is cast deals damage as if one size larger than it actually is. For instance, an arrow fired from a Medium longbow normally deals 1d8 points of damage, but it would instead deal 2d6 points of damage if fired from a gravity bow (see page 145 of the Core Rulebook for more information)."

Gravity Bow says it affects the arrows and states that the damage is based on the bow. Under the assumption that all damage from arrows is based on the bow that fired them, a person under the effects of both Gravity Bow and Enlarge Person should be doing 3d6 damage per arrow. This is without the need to purchase Large Arrows, because the arrows get enlarged with you and damage is based on the bow.

Is this correct?

Shadow Lodge

1. This belongs in the Rules Questions forum.
2. RAW, enlarge person explicitly states that projectile weapons don't deal increased damage.

It doesn't matter than reduce person contradicts that, or that they appear to be trying to set up a general rule that ranged weapons deal damage based on weapon size instead of ammo size, because enlarge person explicitly states how it works in this regards.

Perhaps the dev team should review these spells to get them working the same way, but that's irrelevant to the RAW.

Liberty's Edge

Large sized items are always available. So why don't you buy some large arrows and drop them after being enlarged. That seems to get around the weapon shrinkage problem.

Sczarni

This is certainly a "Frequently Asked Question", but it belongs in the Rules forum. If you use the Search function you'll find you are not alone in your confusion.

Grand Lodge

It sounds to me like a more precise statement of the rule is:

Damage is based on the type of bow, and on the smaller of the size of the bow and arrow.

Thus your large bow and arrow that shrinks to medium deals medium damage, while your small bow and arrow that returns to medium deals small damage, and your gravity bow, which is treated as one size larger, and grows it's arrows to one size larger as they hit, is consistent. :)

But yes, it sounds like the best solution is just to hand someone a quiver of large arrows before you get enlarged, then take them back after.

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