The Devil's Gorge (and Beyond)!

Game Master Rynjin


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Male Human Monk 5 (Qinggong Master of Many Styles from the Sacred Mountain)/Fighter (Brawler) 3

Discuss.


Male Vanara Unchained Monk 9 HP: 94/94| AC: 29[31] FF: 25[27] Touch: 23[25]|Init: +4|Fort +12[+14], Ref +13(Imp. Evasion), Will +13[+15](+2 vs Enchantment)| Sense Motive +13, Perception +17(Scent)

"Dragon Pawnch!"


Male Human Dungeon Master 10/ Munchkin 10

Is that.... A teenager Gannondorf?!


Half-Orc Zweihander Sentinel 8; Hp: 95/105; AC 27 (FF 25, touch, 13), Saves +14, +8, +11; Init +1, Perc +6

I have the feeling we will have a very crazy party.


Male Human Monk 5 (Qinggong Master of Many Styles from the Sacred Mountain)/Fighter (Brawler) 3
Lemmy wrote:
Is that.... A teenager Gannondorf?!

Looks more like good ol' Dorf and Midna had a baby.


setting question:

How long ago was arcane magic forgotten? Are there still lingering legends of it?

I'm thinking of a character background of :

Dorla is an alchemist who always wanted to be a wizard. She has read every possible book that might explain how wizards used to be able to do magic. However, after all her research, all she has is one item that she thinks used to be magic. (perhaps an amulet that's out of charges?? I waant to come up with something interesting that respects the world we're in) It's her greatest treasure, and worn everywhere. She is adventuring because she hopes to learn more about magic.

I'm not expecting her to actually learn anything, by the way. It would just be background unless the GM choses otherwise.


Male Human Monk 5 (Qinggong Master of Many Styles from the Sacred Mountain)/Fighter (Brawler) 3

There are legends of powerful people able to do powerful feats with much greater ease than even the most powerful Psion, so yeah, that background works.

It actually fits in very well with the initial plot, since you're coming to the Devil's Gorge because of rumors of a valuable magical artifact you could sell, Gives her a very strong personal reason to come besides money.


Any information on languages available in this world? I need to pick 7 besides common.


Half-Orc Zweihander Sentinel 8; Hp: 95/105; AC 27 (FF 25, touch, 13), Saves +14, +8, +11; Init +1, Perc +6

KNowledge (technology) is a thing right?


Male Human Monk 5 (Qinggong Master of Many Styles from the Sacred Mountain)/Fighter (Brawler) 3

No, Kn. Engineering takes that role as per the Tech Guide rules.

Additionally, Kn. Engineering can be used for vehicle maintenance and repair.

Craft: Machinery is used to CREATE vehicles, and craft prosthetics and implants (Spellcraft was used in the Thundersacpe rules, but that's becase manite implants are magic there), and either that or Kn. Engineering can be used to hotwire vehicles.


Half-Orc Zweihander Sentinel 8; Hp: 95/105; AC 27 (FF 25, touch, 13), Saves +14, +8, +11; Init +1, Perc +6

Ok, I will be the intelligent half-orc LE who is expert in machines and literature and quote poetry while cutting his enemies in half.


Half-Orc Zweihander Sentinel 8; Hp: 95/105; AC 27 (FF 25, touch, 13), Saves +14, +8, +11; Init +1, Perc +6

What is lemmy going to play?


Half-Orc Zweihander Sentinel 8; Hp: 95/105; AC 27 (FF 25, touch, 13), Saves +14, +8, +11; Init +1, Perc +6

The guns from the technology guide sound cool, but at the time that you can afford 30,000 gp for a rail gun, what are 3d8 of damage?


Male Human Dungeon Master 10/ Munchkin 10
Ugash wrote:
What is lemmy going to play?

Good question. I have no idea.


Half-Orc Zweihander Sentinel 8; Hp: 95/105; AC 27 (FF 25, touch, 13), Saves +14, +8, +11; Init +1, Perc +6

That, somehow, don't surprise me ^_^


Male Human Monk 5 (Qinggong Master of Many Styles from the Sacred Mountain)/Fighter (Brawler) 3
Ugash wrote:
The guns from the technology guide sound cool, but at the time that you can afford 30,000 gp for a rail gun, what are 3d8 of damage?

Yeah, it kinda sucks. 3d10, plus Dex if you're a Gunslinger. Even though it attacks in a line, and overcomes Hardness 3d10+Dex is not the greatest for a Ful-Round action.


Male Human Dungeon Master 10/ Munchkin 10
Ugash wrote:
That, somehow, don't surprise me ^_^

Well... The ideas I had involved homebrewing, spell-casting or both... So... I got nothing. Well, at least for now.


Half-Orc Zweihander Sentinel 8; Hp: 95/105; AC 27 (FF 25, touch, 13), Saves +14, +8, +11; Init +1, Perc +6
Rynjin wrote:
Ugash wrote:
The guns from the technology guide sound cool, but at the time that you can afford 30,000 gp for a rail gun, what are 3d8 of damage?
Yeah, it kinda sucks. 3d10, plus Dex if you're a Gunslinger. Even though it attacks in a line, and overcomes Hardness 3d10+Dex is not the greatest for a Ful-Round action.

But I want a steam-tech-punk real experience D:


Half-Orc Zweihander Sentinel 8; Hp: 95/105; AC 27 (FF 25, touch, 13), Saves +14, +8, +11; Init +1, Perc +6

I have to be honest, I love the fluff but the gun and tech rules are depressing.


Just checking on all the magic skills and knowledge skills:

knowledge: arcana is changed to psionics, still usefull
knowledge: engineering is also all knowledge about tech stuff
knowledge: nobility/planes/religions ???
knowledge: dungeoneering/local/history/geography are all unchanged?
spellcraft changed to psionics
use magic device ???

Also, is the (little bit of, not necessarily all correct) knowledge about how magic used to work that I want as part of my character's back story knowledge: history since knowledge: arcana has changed to knowledge:psionics?


Male Human Monk 5 (Qinggong Master of Many Styles from the Sacred Mountain)/Fighter (Brawler) 3

Kn. History would cover the ancient past, so yes.

I goofed a bit, Use Magic Device is used to hotwire cars, and I will say it essentially counts as Use Technological Device for activating the more esoteric tech stuff.

Kn. Nobility and Planes are entirely unchanged, Kn. Religion still applies for identifying Undead and current religions (what few there are), but identifying the symbols of the dead gods and whatnot are covered by Kn. History now.

@Nicos: Have you looked at the Thunderscape guns? I would also consider improving some of the Tech Guide things as well.

For example the Rail Gun, I could up the damage to 10d10 so it at least matches a Lightning Bolt in dice.


Half-Orc Zweihander Sentinel 8; Hp: 95/105; AC 27 (FF 25, touch, 13), Saves +14, +8, +11; Init +1, Perc +6

I looked at thunderscape and bought a shotgun, It is just that without being a gunslinger it is better to use a bow because the +6 damage from str.

I would like rules where (tech-)guns were deadly but you have to ration them because ammo is scarce or reloading takes time or something (I have the feeling we have talked about it in the past). Either way, my char will be primarily using a hammer and a chainsaw so nevermind.


Male Human Monk 5 (Qinggong Master of Many Styles from the Sacred Mountain)/Fighter (Brawler) 3

Well, the Tech guns DO have scarce ammo. Those Batteries are rare as shit, and each shot uses a charge.


Half-Orc Zweihander Sentinel 8; Hp: 95/105; AC 27 (FF 25, touch, 13), Saves +14, +8, +11; Init +1, Perc +6

To do little unless you are a gunslinger and spend some feats on it. The rules for cyber implants in the tech guide are also quite depressing, 4000 go for a cyberarm that does....nothing unless you two cyberarms D:?, there have to be better rules somewhere, perhaps in starwars rpg but I'm too lazy, better smash thing with a hammer.


Male Human Dungeon Master 10/ Munchkin 10

I thought maybe I'd use a Pally, but I'm not sure how much of a pain alignment and the Paladin code would be... And I don't know of any cool spell-less archetype for Paladins... Also, 2 skill points hurt.

So... Back to square one.

:P


Male Goblin Vivisectionist Trap Breaker 10

Picking out items is like...the hardest part.


Male Goblin Vivisectionist Trap Breaker 10
Lemmy wrote:

I thought maybe I'd use a Pally, but I'm not sure how much of a pain alignment and the Paladin code would be... And I don't know of any cool spell-less archetype for Paladins... Also, 2 skill points hurt.

So... Back to square one.

:P

Rynjyn won't shaft you on alignment/paladin code and I'm sure bumping it up to 4 skill points wouldnt be an issue.

Thunderscape actually doesn't have folks lose their powers period. It just says that "Hey, dont be surprised if you get smited evil."


Male Human Monk 5 (Qinggong Master of Many Styles from the Sacred Mountain)/Fighter (Brawler) 3
Lemmy wrote:

I thought maybe I'd use a Pally, but I'm not sure how much of a pain alignment and the Paladin code would be... And I don't know of any cool spell-less archetype for Paladins... Also, 2 skill points hurt.

So... Back to square one.

:P

I will allow all Paladins to use the Gifted Blade Power List as the Duergar archetype that does the same. Or take the whole archetype if you want (they Smite Aberrations and such instead of Evil). Additionally, all 2+Int non-Int casters (including normal Sorcerers) get 2 skills per level.

And remember, I'm not exactly a hardass when it comes to Alignment and such. I will insist you pick a Code, either the default Paladin Code or another one, and stick to it, but will make sure you're held to the SPIRIT of the Code, rather than the strict letter.


Male Human Monk 5 (Qinggong Master of Many Styles from the Sacred Mountain)/Fighter (Brawler) 3
Ugash wrote:
To do little unless you are a gunslinger and spend some feats on it. The rules for cyber implants in the tech guide are also quite depressing, 4000 go for a cyberarm that does....nothing unless you two cyberarms D:?, there have to be better rules somewhere, perhaps in starwars rpg but I'm too lazy, better smash thing with a hammer.

Check the Manite implants in Thunderscape. They are MUCH cheaper, and much more varied in function. A basic mechanical prosthetic is 250 gp, though it likewise does nothing (though can act as a platform for other Manite Implants, such as an Integrated Weapon. A Minor implant worth 500 gp, for example, is a Finger Gun, which you can have a number of up to your max number of fingers and acts as a concealed weapon).

There's a whole class, the Golemoid based around such implants.

You are, however, limited by your Con score for how many Manite Implants you can have as a non-Golemoid (or Golemoid-like archetype).


Half-Orc Zweihander Sentinel 8; Hp: 95/105; AC 27 (FF 25, touch, 13), Saves +14, +8, +11; Init +1, Perc +6

I did, I bought a couple of things already.


Rather nitpicky rules clarification: By the rules, I get 2+int formulas at level 1, then one more per level. I assume that each formula must be of a level I can use at that character level. However, at level 4 and level 8 I have added 2 more intelligence, so int has gone up one at each of these levels. Because int changes are retroactive, at levels 4 and 8 I get an extra formula in my book. Are these limited to level 1, or can they be at the higher level I can use at that time?

Also, I'm using favored class bonuses to get extra formulas in my book. However, it looks like I can't do this at levels 1 to 3, because the favored class bonus formula must be one level less than the highest I can use. Is this correct?


Male Human Monk 5 (Qinggong Master of Many Styles from the Sacred Mountain)/Fighter (Brawler) 3

Int changes are not retroactive on spells in your spellbook, only on things like skill ranks.

The second bit is correct, yes.

I would not bother with that Favored Class Bonus. Like Wizards, Alchemists can just spend a little cash to put more spells in their Formula book.


OK, I didn't know that option was available in this world. Where can I find the costs of purchased formulas?

Also, in purchasing starting gear, am I permitted to have at half cost the things that I can craft without even rolling (i.e. my Craft:Alchemy crafting item skill is higher than their DC)? These would be things that I have the other prerequisites like necessary formulas in my book.


Male Human Monk 5 (Qinggong Master of Many Styles from the Sacred Mountain)/Fighter (Brawler) 3

They're the same as for a Wizard, in the magic rules:

0 5 gp
1 10 gp
2 40 gp
3 90 gp
4 160 gp
5 250 gp
6 360 gp
7 490 gp
8 640 gp
9 810 gp

And yes, pre-game crafting is allowed as long as you can make the check on a 10 or less.


+2 mithral chain shirt OK?


Male Human Monk 5 (Qinggong Master of Many Styles from the Sacred Mountain)/Fighter (Brawler) 3

Yes.


I'm almost done with my character, but I have a scary amount of unspent money from WBL (almost 10000gp), so I'm going to come back to it tomorrow.


Ah, now my financial situation makes sense. I was using my usual rule of thumb that 1/3 wealth goes to weapons, 1/3 armor (or protective items), and 1/3 to other stuff. In this situation, there's not all the stat boosting items and things to buy. And, most of the other stuff to buy I am instead crafting.


Is there a way I can have a little pet robot that flies? If Dorla wants badly to be a wizard and lives in a technological world without much magic, a little robot she can think of almost like a familiar would be great. I don't know how the mechanics could work; perhaps the little robot could carry light objects (like bring people infusions) or help solve problems like bringing a rope up a cliff and tying it so we can climb? No attacks, though. I can definately spend a feat on this, as well as substantial money if needed to make it work.


Half-Orc Zweihander Sentinel 8; Hp: 95/105; AC 27 (FF 25, touch, 13), Saves +14, +8, +11; Init +1, Perc +6

THe closest thing I could found was the feat combo skill focus + Eldritch Heritage (arcane) + companion figurine


Yeah, I'm pretty sure that my idea can't be implemented by the published rules. However, Rynjin is homebrewing the world far enough from published sources that I was hoping there was something he considered reasonable for this. I mean, it just makes so much _sense_ for the character concept, without being much of a mechanical advantage. Plus I have invested rather heavily in machine/technology related skills.

Thank you for looking.


Male Human Monk 5 (Qinggong Master of Many Styles from the Sacred Mountain)/Fighter (Brawler) 3

There are a few options already extant:

1.) Get a Familiar (as via the Tumor Familiar Discovery) and take Improved Familiar, where you can get a Clockwork Familiar or Arbiter Inevitable.

2.) Be a Psionic character and get a Psicrystal which would need minimal refluffing for what you want.

3.) Take Craft Construct and create something along the lines of the above Clockwork Familiar, and/or commission it (which costs 14, 500 gp to buy, and 7500 gp to craft...but Construct prices have always been hella steep to me, so I would likely drop the price quite a bit, probably down to something in the 2500 gp range to craft, and 5000 to purchase).

4.) Be a Steamwright. They have MULTIPLE devices like this.

Two of the four are essentially class features, with Psicrystal Affinity being a Feat exclusive to someone with a Manifester Level (1st only required), and the second being almost the entire point of the class, so I'm hesitant to homebrew something that gives a class feature on the cheap, but options are available to you.


Male Goblin Vivisectionist Trap Breaker 10

Rynjin I need a gold dump for 18,000 gold. Can I get a steam motorcycle?


oooh, that clockwork familiar is exactly what I was looking for, only much more powerful! I missed that because I was looking over books, instead of the internet. I don't qualify to construct it because it requires caster level 12 and knowing the geas-quest spell, and I do really want to stay an alchemist, so it looks like I need to go with option 1. (I also wasn't aware that improved familiar worked with tumor familiar). I'll do that.

Can we please just not mention 'tumor' again in connection to my new friend? YUCK!


Male Human Monk 5 (Qinggong Master of Many Styles from the Sacred Mountain)/Fighter (Brawler) 3
Scavion wrote:
Rynjin I need a gold dump for 18,000 gold. Can I get a steam motorcycle?

If you can find the actual COST for a Thunder Cycle in the Thunderscape book, then go for it because I can't find it.

If you can't find it, we'll simplify it.

Engine costs (from the book):

Basic Steam Engine: 1000 gp, must be refueled daily.

Advanced Steam Engine: 4000 gp, must be refueled weekly.

Perpetual Steam Engine: 16000 gp, never needs refueling.

I'm gonna say a motobike frame is relatively cheap. Say 250 gp for something incredibly basic (handlebars, wheels, frame, AC of 10, no weapons, etc.).

Dorla wrote:
oooh, that clockwork familiar is exactly what I was looking for, only much more powerful! I missed that because I was looking over books, instead of the internet. I don't qualify to construct it because it requires caster level 12 and knowing the geas-quest spell

That just adds a +10 to the DC required to craft it, so if you can make that DC 30 you're gold.


Male Human Monk 5 (Qinggong Master of Many Styles from the Sacred Mountain)/Fighter (Brawler) 3

Quick question for starting, do yoou want to already know each other, just coincidentally arrive, or some mix (some of you know the others, others do not)?


OK, if I can avoid tumor familiar, I want to. By your house rules, what feats do I need and what skills do I apply to make a clockwork familiar?

(My craft:alchemy to create items is 26, if that helps)

Does a clockwork familiar that I craft work just like one that is actually a familiar from tumor familiar discovery and improved familiar, or is one that I make in this way just a pet?


Rynjin wrote:
Quick question for starting, do yoou want to already know each other, just coincidentally arrive, or some mix (some of you know the others, others do not)?

I'm fine either way.


Male Human Monk 5 (Qinggong Master of Many Styles from the Sacred Mountain)/Fighter (Brawler) 3

One that you craft would be the basic, out of the bestiary, Clockwork Familiar, with none of the special Familiar rules like Share Spells (or Extracts in your case), Alertness, a higher Int score, its own skill ranks, and so on. However, for additional cost you would also be able to add additional features.

Feats needed: Craft Construct
Skill needed: Craft (Whatever), in your case Alchemy (technically it's Craft: Clockwork but it's a pain in the ass to separate out each individual gradation of the Craft skill. As-is you need Craft: Clockwork for this and something like Craft: Robots for robots and so on and so forth...we'll just go with the simplest route, especially since I've essentially given you a free Discovery that does the same thing already in letting you craft constructs at all).

Is that 26 your BONUS to Craft, or is that your Take 10?


Rynjin wrote:

One that you craft would be the basic, out of the bestiary, Clockwork Familiar, with none of the special Familiar rules like Share Spells (or Extracts in your case), Alertness, a higher Int score, its own skill ranks, and so on. However, for additional cost you would also be able to add additional features.

Feats needed: Craft Construct
Skill needed: Craft (Whatever), in your case Alchemy (technically it's Craft: Clockwork but it's a pain in the ass to separate out each individual gradation of the Craft skill. As-is you need Craft: Clockwork for this and something like Craft: Robots for robots and so on and so forth...we'll just go with the simplest route, especially since I've essentially given you a free Discovery that does the same thing already in letting you craft constructs at all).

Is that 26 your BONUS to Craft, or is that your Take 10?

My pcgen character sheet has two numbers on it: Craft(alchemy) is 18, craft(alchemy)(create item) is 26. However, it looks like that create item bonus is only for _alchemical items_, so doesn't apply here. I guess that means if I take ten, I have a 28, which is less than 30. So maybe this won't work. However, I can make it if I purchase an alchemists' lab, which isn't a problem. I also have a bonus of +18 to craft(machinery) because I interpreted something you said earlier to mean I needed it to be able to create vehicles and prosthetics.

Going this way costs 3 feats, right? Craft construct has as prerequisites two other crafting feats, craft magic arms and armor and craft wondrous item.

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