Spell Caster Mutliclassing and Skills

Maybe this has already been talked about, but with the big errata coming I thought this would be a good time to bring up a minor thing I find weird with the current rules. I think it is odd that the the Expert and Master multiclass spell casting feats require master and legendary in their associated spell tradition skill.

Hear me out: a level 20 Wizard can be only trained in Arcane and cast level/rank 10 spells with legendary proficiency, but a 20th level rogue with a wizard dedication must have legendary Arcane to cast 8th level/rank spells at master proficiency. That hurts my verisimilitude a bit, not enough to keep me from enjoying the game, but it does feel awkward at times. And it is especially awkward to me when multiclassing into a dedication where the spell casting comes from an intuitive source, like the sorcerer. One of the big fantasies of sorcerer is that the power is my own, and I don't need to study to use it. But if I'm a rogue who takes a sorcerer dedication, I now need to be master or legendary in my spell casting tradition to get more power.

If this is a nesseacry part of the game balance, I guess it is fine as is. But I wanted to bring it up during this transition time because removing these prerequisites is a small change and maybe others feel the same?

If I was able to change it, I'd probably split the prepared and spontaneous casting into separate groups. The spontaneous casters would not have the prerequisite skill proficiencies of their casting traditions for their multiclass spellcasting feats. The prepared casters are about learning (wizard and witch need to learn spells with intelligence, clerics and druids need to learn about their deity or nature) and would require the skill proficiencies for the spellcasting feats. But these classes would have their associated skill automatically increase like the inventor and crafting as, again, they are about their knowledge in their respective fields.

That might be too complicated a change, but I thought it might be worth considering.

It does seem strange and feel bad to have to spend skill boosts on a magic tradition skill as a tax for getting higher level spell slots. I'm not sure how to fix that.

I don't like the idea of having some classes require the skill boosts and others not - which actually is how some of the archetypes are currently. The multiclass ones all require skill rank improvements as prerequisites, but some of the other non-multiclass spellcasting archetypes do not. That is just really strange and feels even worse than having all of the archetypes fair about it.

It does seem strange and feel bad to have to spend skill boosts on a magic tradition skill as a tax for getting higher level spell slots. I'm not sure how to fix that.

I don't like the idea of having some classes require the skill boosts and others not - which actually is how some of the archetypes are currently. The multiclass ones all require skill rank improvements as prerequisites, but some of the other non-multiclass spellcasting archetypes do not. That is just really strange and feels even worse than having all of the archetypes fair about it.

I definitely see that. I'm wondering if it would be possible to throw out the skill prerequisites entirely. The dedications already give trained proficiency in the relevant skills, so you don't need to worry about the skill being completely untrained. Are the skill requirements really that important to balancing the spellcasting feats?

It is a weird situation where actually casters never need to advance their training in their tradition skill, but those who multiclass need to.

It makes perfect sense from the multiclass point of view. You need to study the occult to wield occult magic, etc.

But its always been weird how you can operate in your class relatively fine without ever going beyond trained.

Personally, what I find odd is that you can be a regular wizard, be trained in arcana and at level 19 still be an archwizard, but their fighter buddy needs to be legendary in order to get their thing.

Mind you, to me, I would rather this problem be solved by just giving every class a free autoscale on one of their core skills than anything else, but still.

Also, archetypes like Cathartic Mage give the same benefits, but without the skill requirement, and it's fine balancewise.

I've seen people talk about a core-skilling autoscaling recently, in relation to the coming revision.

I think it would be a neat feature to give out all round.

Casters naturally get their tradition skill.
Classes that already have an autoscaler keep those.
Fighters, Monks, Barbarians get Athletics or Acrobatics.
Rogues get Stealth or Thievery.

So on and so forth.

I've seen people talk about a core-skilling autoscaling recently, in relation to the coming revision.

I think it would be a neat feature to give out all round.

Casters naturally get their tradition skill.
Classes that already have an autoscaler keep those.
Fighters, Monks, Barbarians get Athletics or Acrobatics.
Rogues get Stealth or Thievery.

So on and so forth.

I wouldn't be against this.

Let's just hope the signature spells from the playtest don't return. xD

I love the idea of autoscaling skills for everyone! Especially if the class has a skill you need to keep maxed out anyways. If that was done, then the multiclass spellcasting requirements at least make sense. Though I'd be okay dropping them anyways as I don't think the skill requirements are at all necessary for balance.