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Generally when you have more than one multiple such as a critical with a lance while mounted you add the multiples together then (X2 +X2 is X3) so the Paladin smite and litany would likely be triple damage not quadruple.
Still pretty dangerous to that evil person though.
I would like to point out, though, that the double damage dealt by a paladin smiting undead, a dragon, or an outsider applies only to smite damage. So Litany of Righteousness and Smite Evil don't even do the same thing.
A level 10 paladin's attack might do 2d6 + 20 (or something), which goes up to 2d6 + 30 while smiting. The first attack of the smite will do 2d6 + 40. This is what would be doubled by the spell.
They add together like falcar said.
You'd have weapon damage X2 smite damage X3.
If you crit with a 2x weapon it would be weapon damage x3 smite damage x4
with an 3x weapon it would be 4x weapon and 5 x smite
If you crit with a 4 x weapon... yeah. he's chunky salsa.
I hadn't seen that spell before. I think i just found a reason to stay in the inquisitor class.
Wait, wait. So you would do smite damage x3 and weapon damage x2?
Why wouldn't you do (weapon damage + smite damage*2)*2? (Thus 2*weapon damage + 4*smite damage)?
The bonus damage from smiting is tacked onto weapon damage (and multiplies on a crit, and all that fun stuff just like it was a bonus from something like strength), so would it not be multiplied as part of the weapon damage just like it was a crit?
I'm seeing it as doing this and critting would net you 8*weapon damage + smite damage*16 (4 for crit, 2 for first attack, and 2 for the spell).
Edit: Though I guess it'd be *10 since double quadruple is quintuple. But my point remains.
Basically, why is the bonus damage from a smite multiplied separately? Smite evil doesn't explicitly say anything is being multiplied at all, just that the 'bonus damage increases to 2 points of damage per level'.
You would take the doubled damage from the Litany first and then apply the Smite to it. The Litany doubles normal damage, it does not double smite, nor elemental enchants on weapons, etc.. etc.
Smite damage is a flat bonus and, as I pointed out before, is added in the same fashion a strength bonus is (multiplies on crits, for example). Why wouldn't it get multiplied? Nothing about the spell says it wouldn't.
Nothing in the spell says it would.... and that's what counts. The Litany doesn't let sorcerers get double damage on magic missile, or fireball, smite is essentially a magical effect for this purpose.You would take the doubled damage from the Litany first and then apply the Smite to it. The Litany doubles normal damage, it does not double smite, nor elemental enchants on weapons, etc.. etc.Smite damage is a flat bonus and, as I pointed out before, is added in the same fashion a strength bonus is (multiplies on crits, for example). Why wouldn't it get multiplied? Nothing about the spell says it wouldn't.
So, if I cast Litany of Righteousness and I attack an evil creature with a +5 scythe, does the +5 to damage not get multiplied?
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Yeah, I don't see anything in the smite evil description that says it adds to the critical multiplier—you just the paladin level (or twice the paladin level) to damage roll result.
I don't see a reason why Litany of Roghteousness wouldn't work; in fact, it seems purposely designed to be used in this way:
Assuming a 10th level Paladin who normally does 1d8+10 damage with a lance.
If doing Smite Evil: 1d8+20 (1d8+30 against a dragon)
SE & LoR: 2d8+40 (or 2d8+60)
SE, LoR, Mounted Charge: 3d8+60 (3d8+90)
SE, LoR, Mounted Charge, Critical: 5d8+100 (5d8+150).
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Nothing in the spell says it would.... and that's what counts. The Litany doesn't let sorcerers get double damage on magic missile, or fireball, smite is essentially a magical effect for this purpose.You would take the doubled damage from the Litany first and then apply the Smite to it. The Litany doubles normal damage, it does not double smite, nor elemental enchants on weapons, etc.. etc.Smite damage is a flat bonus and, as I pointed out before, is added in the same fashion a strength bonus is (multiplies on crits, for example). Why wouldn't it get multiplied? Nothing about the spell says it wouldn't.
SE isn't a flat damage increase like sneak attack or extra dice from energy damage that doesn't get multiplied; it gets multiplied like an enhancement bonus, strength bonus, etc.
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Exception: Precision damage (such as from a rogue's sneak attack class feature) and additional damage dice from special weapon qualities (such as flaming) are not multiplied when you score a critical hit.
Those are the only bonuses not multiplied on a critical hit. Assuming the way the spell is worded is meant to say 'you do double damage', this is all you need. Smite is doubled in this case. Since nothing about the spell implies smite doesn't get doubled, it does.
If you read it as 'the target takes double damage' (which implied figuring up damage, then doubling it), then everything gets doubled. I'm sure we can all agree that is not the way it was meant to be interpreted though.
If you were a lvl 10 paladin with a +2 greatsword 22 str and power attack you would hit for 2d6+23 damage. If you smote evil on a generic bad guy you add 10 damage. If you smote evil undead drafon etc it adds 20 damage.
If you add litany of the rightious
Vs generic evil 4d6+46 se adds 20 damage
Vs the extra evil evils 4d6+46 se does 30 damage.
Se is multiplied or added on anything that multiplies normally in an attack such as crits.
The above char with a lance the litany etc charging an evil dragon will do 4d8+92 I think with 40 smite damage...a crit would be a shower of dragon bits.
x3 from lance, x2 from litany. (1d8 + 23 + 20) x 4. That's 4d8 + 172. Before a crit. If you can get this set up on an evil dragon, you deserve to win.
My thing would be; be an undead scourge. Always do this to undead.
Edit: Just for lulz; crit is x3, so (1d8 + 23 + 20) x 7 = 7d8 + 301.
So I was wondering if double damage stacked. Say I play a Paladin, and turn one I cast smite evil but don't attack (first attack deals double damage)
Bolded part is wrong, and probably the source of your confusion.
They add together like falcar said.
You'd have weapon damage X2 smite damage X3.
Wrong.
You're not gaining anything from doing so. Doubling essentially means adding an additional dice on top of your first dose, that's why two doublings mean triple damage, not quadruple. you don't get to add twice your base, you simply add to to it twice.
Super double wrong. Go sit in the corner. While you're there, you might want to read up on your core rulebook. There's a section on how doubling works.
Nothing in the spell says it would.... and that's what counts. The Litany doesn't let sorcerers get double damage on magic missile, or fireball, smite is essentially a magical effect for this purpose.
G*$ d&%n it Lazar, read the rulebook!
A level 10 paladin's attack might do 2d6 + 20 (or something), which goes up to 2d6 + 30 while smiting. The first attack of the smite will do 2d6 + 40 (against an undead etc). This is what would be doubled by the spell.
Correct.
Smite Evil adds a bonus equal to the Paladin's level - or 2 point per Paladin level for first smite against undead. This is a flat bonus to damage, and as per the doubling rules, this is doubled, along with dice, strength, power attack, enhancement bonus etc, on a crit, lance charge, litany of Righteousness etc.
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Also, damage done and damage taken aren't the same thing.
If you double a double it's a triple (not quadruple) in the game system, but only if it's the same thing, like crit damage.
But adding double paladin level to damage is a different thing to a crit.
If your normal damage is 1d8+4, and as a lvl 6 paladin you smite for 1d8+10. If you crit that's 2d8+20.
If it was a dragon, undead or outsider, then your first smite each round does 1d8+16, doubled to 2d8+32 on a crit.
If the target was incorporeal, then whatever you rolled would be halved. say you rolled for 41 damage, it would be halved to 20. If the target took x3 damage from you, then the damage it took would triple, so 20 would become 60.
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Also, damage done and damage taken aren't the same thing.
If you double a double it's a triple (not quadruple) in the game system, but only if it's the same thing, like crit damage.
But adding double paladin level to damage is a different thing to a crit.
If your normal damage is 1d8+4, and as a lvl 6 paladin you smite for 1d8+10. If you crit that's 2d8+20.
If it was a dragon, undead or outsider, then your first smite each round does 1d8+16, doubled to 2d8+32 on a crit.
If the target was incorporeal, then whatever you rolled would be halved. say you rolled for 41 damage, it would be halved to 20. If the target took x3 damage from you, then the damage it took would triple, so 20 would become 60.
Point of order, you would triple before you halved, so it would potentially be 123 damaged halved to 61. :)
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They add together like falcar said.
You'd have weapon damage X2 smite damage X3.
If you crit with a 2x weapon it would be weapon damage x3 smite damage x4
with an 3x weapon it would be 4x weapon and 5 x smite
If you crit with a 4 x weapon... yeah. he's chunky salsa.
I hadn't seen that spell before. I think i just found a reason to stay in the inquisitor class.
The inquisitor don't have the aura class feature.
If the target is evil, it takes double damage from attacks made by creatures with a good aura (from a class feature or as a creature with the good subtype).
This spell is fairly useless for a inquisitor. It would be useful for a good cleric.
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Let's use simple numbers.
10 level paladin that do 1d8+10 with his base attack.
When he use smite evil he do 1d8+10+his level (10)*1= 1d8+10+10, i.e. 1d8+20 (if the target is evil)
If the target is a evil dragon, undead or a outsider with the evil subtype the damage on the fist hit would be 1d8+10+his level (10)*2= 1d8+10+20, i.e. 1d8+30
With Litany of Righteousness the target "If the target is evil, it takes double damage from attacks made by creatures with a good aura (from a class feature or as a creature with the good subtype)."
It is not a critical, it is a flat doubling. You take all the damned damage you rolled, included sneak attack damage, precision damage, bane bonus and cazzi a mazzi and double it.
It work for damage from spells, weapons or other abilities, as long as the creature making the attack has an aura of good.
If it click right it is a extremely powerful spell.
I am not sure if that was the way in which it was intended to work, but the text is clear and RAW it work that way.
It is not a critical, it is a flat doubling. You take all the damned damage you rolled, included sneak attack damage, precision damage, bane bonus and cazzi a mazzi and double it.I am not sure if that was the way in which it was intended to work, but the text is clear and RAW it work that way.
WROOOOOOONGGGG!!!!!
The rules for multiplying damage, unchanged since 2003, on page 179 of the PF Core Rulebook are not and have never been, by wording or intent, limited to critical hits.
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It is not a critical, it is a flat doubling. You take all the damned damage you rolled, included sneak attack damage, precision damage, bane bonus and cazzi a mazzi and double it.I am not sure if that was the way in which it was intended to work, but the text is clear and RAW it work that way.
WROOOOOOONGGGG!!!!!
The rules for multiplying damage, unchanged since 2003, on page 179 of the PF Core Rulebook are not and have never been, by wording or intent, limited to critical hits.
So you roll half dices for the extra damage dealt by an empowered spell? When you apply energy damage against a creature vulnerable to it?
If a Arcane trickster use
Surprise Spells: At 10th level, an arcane trickster can add her sneak attack damage to any spell that deals damage, if the targets are flat-footed. This additional damage only applies to spells that deal hit point damage, and the additional damage is of the same type as the spell. If the spell allows a saving throw to negate or halve the damage, it also negates or halves the sneak attack damage.
on a scorching ray spell against a white dragon, the sneak attack damge isn't multiplied, even if it is fire damage?
The spell give a specific effect, it double the damage dealt by creatures with the Good aura against the target. You are citing a general rule. Specific supersede general.
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It is not a critical, it is a flat doubling. You take all the damned damage you rolled, included sneak attack damage, precision damage, bane bonus and cazzi a mazzi and double it.I am not sure if that was the way in which it was intended to work, but the text is clear and RAW it work that way.
WROOOOOOONGGGG!!!!!
The rules for multiplying damage, unchanged since 2003, on page 179 of the PF Core Rulebook are not and have never been, by wording or intent, limited to critical hits.
If you roll damage, then double it, then double it again, by rule you only triple it.
But what you double to work out your damage modifier doesn't stop you doing full double damage as the result of a damage roll. 'Working out your damage modifier' is a different thing to 'rolling the damage twice', or even 'roll the damage then double the result'.
When you double your paladin level to workout the damage modifier versus dragon/undead/outsider, this is done before you roll. when you hit, if you crit with a x2 weapon, roll the damage twice and add it up to get the damage done.
Wrong
Well thats what i get for listening to the OP....
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You technically don't double the paladin level, you raise it from 1 to 2. mathematically its the same, but since its not called out as a doubling it appears to be a static bonus, and is thus multiplied.
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You technically don't double the paladin level, you raise it from 1 to 2. mathematically its the same, but since its not called out as a doubling it appears to be a static bonus, and is thus multiplied.
Exactly. Smite evil do 2 hp of damage multiplied by the paladin level on the first strike against a Evil dragon undead or outsider with the evil subtype. You aren't multiplying the attack damage, you are changing the way in which you calculate the added static damage.
Reading it as a multipler mean that the strength bonus damage for using a weapon with two hands is a multiplier (x150%) and when you score a critical you should multiply the base bonus, not the bonus damage for using a weapon with two hands.
Applying it that way a fighter with a strength of 18 using a two handed sword will get +6 damage for his strength, but only +10 if he score a critical instead of +12.