OGGM's Sins of the Saviors (Inactive)

Game Master Old Guy GM

The threat to Varisia, in the form of an army of giants led by a stone giant wizard named Mokmurian, is over. Our heroes slew the evil giant in his lair in the fortress of Jorgenfist. But a greater threat now looms...


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Pretty busy today, will roll this monster encounter tomorrow.


Female Half-Orc Evoker 10/Cyphermage 6; Init. +2; Perception +12; Darkvision; Arcane Sight; Fly 40 ft.; AC 23 (+3 Dex*, +1 armour, +1 Deflection, +1 natural, +3 Mage Armour, +4 Shield); HP 91/104; Fort +9, Ref +8, Will +16

Given that the Return of the Runelords AP is scheduled to start coming out in August this year... who all here would like to commit to playing in it as a group, provided OGGM is willing to DM?
I mean, we have a great team here, and we've come this far. :)


F/R/W: +25/+23/+22 AC/T/FF: 33/19/26; CMD: 36; Perc: +22; Init: +9; Max HP: 179; Current HP: 168; Temp 0;

I’d play.


Male Humanly Awesome 'n Totally Rockin' Paladin of Greatness

Sure! Heck, the name in and of itself sounds awesome!

Grand Lodge

I'm in.

Grand Lodge

Renovated site, renewed vigor for the game.


Sorry guys, I'm wearing two hats at work and really struggling for time. I'm still here.

Jurys' still out on this website change...

I'd run it, would you guys want to try and have this one finished by then?


Male Humanly Awesome 'n Totally Rockin' Paladin of Greatness

No worries, OG.

Yeah this new "facelift" is definitely a bit odd for me. Trying to navigate this thing has been a bit of a struggle for sure(for me at least).

Grand Lodge

Real life can get in the way of the most awesome of games. I wouldn't mind playing both at the same time, but maybe we should plan on having this one finished before we start the next.


Dax Thura wrote:
Real life can get in the way of the most awesome of games. I wouldn't mind playing both at the same time, but maybe we should plan on having this one finished before we start the next.

Hopefully this game qualifies Dax! ;)

I think it's doable to finish this one, or be really really close, despite the recent delays.


FYI, found out that we are finally getting someone to take one of our open spots at work, so I can go back to do just my job. That should allow me to get rolling. As always, I appreciate your patience!

And now we have a target - the new AP. Believe it or not, this book is nearly finished, or could be if you are satisfied with the pieces you will have for the runeforged weapons. Book Six has not been my favorite simply because of the way it is laid out. I made some significant adjustments for my RL group that I will use for you guys. It will play better.


Male Humanly Awesome 'n Totally Rockin' Paladin of Greatness

Cooooool. Sounds interesting.


So I couldn't find anything on the new AP, but I did see that Pathfinder 2nd ed is going into playtest on August 2nd. I am very interested to see what that is all about.


Male Humanly Awesome 'n Totally Rockin' Paladin of Greatness

Yeah I saw that myself. That is going to be interesting for sure. It's definitely going to be way different just from what little I've read so far.

10th level spells. 3 actions and 1 reaction. All that move/swift/standard and so forth business is all gone. Magic items that we always have to have is apparently going to get a makeover of some form.

And weirdly enough, Return of the Runelords is NOT the last AP. They'll have 1 more after that and THAT will be the last one for this edition. It would've been so perfect to bookend 1st edition with a Runelords AP.


Female Half-Orc Evoker 10/Cyphermage 6; Init. +2; Perception +12; Darkvision; Arcane Sight; Fly 40 ft.; AC 23 (+3 Dex*, +1 armour, +1 Deflection, +1 natural, +3 Mage Armour, +4 Shield); HP 91/104; Fort +9, Ref +8, Will +16

Oh, nooooo... A new edition?! 0_0


Lym Blackhand wrote:
Oh, nooooo... A new edition?! 0_0

Yes. I am a bit apprehensive if for no other reason than the vast library I already own. That said, I am all for running that for this group in August, possibly with the new AP as well. They are supposed to be releasing more information over the next months, so we can make a more informed decision.


Female Half-Orc Evoker 10/Cyphermage 6; Init. +2; Perception +12; Darkvision; Arcane Sight; Fly 40 ft.; AC 23 (+3 Dex*, +1 armour, +1 Deflection, +1 natural, +3 Mage Armour, +4 Shield); HP 91/104; Fort +9, Ref +8, Will +16

;_; I can't afford to buy a new ruleset.....


Male Humanly Awesome 'n Totally Rockin' Paladin of Greatness

I'm right there with you, OG. You ain't kidding about the library. I went from AD&D 1st edition to 2nd edition to 3.0 to 3.5 to Pathfinder which = a whole mess of books. The majority, though, we've gotten rid of. Now it's pretty much dominated with Pathfinder and MAN that is a lot of books.


Female Half-Orc Evoker 10/Cyphermage 6; Init. +2; Perception +12; Darkvision; Arcane Sight; Fly 40 ft.; AC 23 (+3 Dex*, +1 armour, +1 Deflection, +1 natural, +3 Mage Armour, +4 Shield); HP 91/104; Fort +9, Ref +8, Will +16

I still have all of my 3.5 stuff, and from time to time I look through it. There were some great ideas there. ^_^
A year or two ago, I even added to it; there was a volume of The Book of Nine Swords going cheap.

I haven't got rid of my 4e stuff either, but I have three books of 4e to 37 books' worth of 3.5 material... ^_^;

Meanwhile, I have 25 Pathfinder books, over thirty if you count the comics, but several of those are thin paperbacks.


Female Half-Orc Evoker 10/Cyphermage 6; Init. +2; Perception +12; Darkvision; Arcane Sight; Fly 40 ft.; AC 23 (+3 Dex*, +1 armour, +1 Deflection, +1 natural, +3 Mage Armour, +4 Shield); HP 91/104; Fort +9, Ref +8, Will +16

Speaking of the Pathfinder comic books -- who here has read Worldscape and has an opinion on the Fighter and Ranger archetypes they presented therein?


Male Humanly Awesome 'n Totally Rockin' Paladin of Greatness

I really do love 3.5. I thought it was awesome. Unfortunately those are the majority of books I got rid of. But man they had some great stuff. I always wanted to run a monk from the Book of Exalted Deeds under the "Voluntary Poverty". I always thought that was awesome. It would probably need to be tweaked a bit nowadays but it's still pretty cool. Mainly because I wouldn't have to deal with collecting a whole bunch of magic stuff. While necessary, it does get tiresome. Because there's just SO MANY.

Had the Book of Nine. Don't remember much about it but we did have it.

Never read Worldscape.


Female Half-Orc Evoker 10/Cyphermage 6; Init. +2; Perception +12; Darkvision; Arcane Sight; Fly 40 ft.; AC 23 (+3 Dex*, +1 armour, +1 Deflection, +1 natural, +3 Mage Armour, +4 Shield); HP 91/104; Fort +9, Ref +8, Will +16

I never got the Book of Exalted Deeds. I got the Book of Vile Darkness and got rid of it quite soon -- sold it to a member of my RL group at a loss, just to be rid of it. After that, I did not feel like getting another book that clung too closely to one particular alignment...

The Book of Nine is really sweet if you enjoy the kind of cooky wuxia stuff popularised by anime and martial arts movies. The premise was flawed in my opinion, though; the idea that a Fighter-class is boring because it doesn't have an arsenal of spells. The Fighter has feats in plentitude, the way other classes can only dream of. That allows for a lot of power in itself, never mind what happens when you add magical and/or psionic items. ;)


The only reason I got into Pathfinder was how much I liked 3.5. I got rid of my entire library of it as soon as the PF Beta came out. I took a very short look at Vile Darkness and never bought it. I don't believe that sort of thing has any place in a game. I'm not prudish about things, but that book went too far for me.


Female Half-Orc Evoker 10/Cyphermage 6; Init. +2; Perception +12; Darkvision; Arcane Sight; Fly 40 ft.; AC 23 (+3 Dex*, +1 armour, +1 Deflection, +1 natural, +3 Mage Armour, +4 Shield); HP 91/104; Fort +9, Ref +8, Will +16

I agree, but I didn't know how bad it was before I actually read it. That book was squick and abomination from cover to cover.


Male Humanly Awesome 'n Totally Rockin' Paladin of Greatness
Old Guy GM wrote:
The only reason I got into Pathfinder was how much I liked 3.5. I got rid of my entire library of it as soon as the PF Beta came out.

Yeah. Same here. And that's why we got rid of the majority of our books. While 3.5 was awesome, PF added to it and made it that much greater.

Old Guy GM wrote:
I took a very short look at Vile Darkness and never bought it. I don't believe that sort of thing has any place in a game. I'm not prudish about things, but that book went too far for me.

As per Vile Darkness, I really don't remember that one at all. It's possible we may have had it(we had a lot of 'em) but I just don't remember it. My guess would be we didn't have it because if it's as bad as y'all say it is, odds are I would've remembered it because that kind of horribleness seems to NEVER leave my memory, unfortunately.

Grand Lodge

This is part of the reason that I buy more and more books digitally now. I don't mean that as a complaint, but that is my reality when it comes to gaming these days.
I went from second edition to 3/3.5 to pathfinder myself, with a small dip into 4th edition (good enough system, but don't call it D&D) and I feel like its time for a second edition of pathfinder. I think that a successful game needs another edition about once a decade. .


Unfortunately, am not able to restrain myself to just digital or hardcopy, and end up with both.

I agree with Dax, ten years is a good interval, just PLEASE don't make my collection a waste.

And Javell, here we thought Pathfinder was a huge improvement over 3.5, it's why we went all in.


Male Humanly Awesome 'n Totally Rockin' Paladin of Greatness

Did Praxim's arrows drop this chick? With that kind of damage, I'm thinking it's pretty much curtains for her.

And just think, Thordak was sooooo close to being called 'Mistress'. Ah well, there's always next time I guess. ;)


Male Humanly Awesome 'n Totally Rockin' Paladin of Greatness
Old Guy GM wrote:

Unfortunately, am not able to restrain myself to just digital or hardcopy, and end up with both.

I agree with Dax, ten years is a good interval, just PLEASE don't make my collection a waste.

And Javell, here we thought Pathfinder was a huge improvement over 3.5, it's why we went all in.

True. Too true.


Praxim jumped the gun. This is still round 3 and she hasn't gone yet.

Side note: PF 2.0 actions explained here


Podcast live playthrough with Jason Buhlman here


Female Half-Orc Evoker 10/Cyphermage 6; Init. +2; Perception +12; Darkvision; Arcane Sight; Fly 40 ft.; AC 23 (+3 Dex*, +1 armour, +1 Deflection, +1 natural, +3 Mage Armour, +4 Shield); HP 91/104; Fort +9, Ref +8, Will +16

Any news yet on which classes they're going to use?


Male Humanly Awesome 'n Totally Rockin' Paladin of Greatness

They're going to keep the core classes. But they're going to add alchemist as part of Core. And Goblin as well as part of the Core races.

Goblin alchemist will be the new Iconic to go with the original crew.


Female Half-Orc Evoker 10/Cyphermage 6; Init. +2; Perception +12; Darkvision; Arcane Sight; Fly 40 ft.; AC 23 (+3 Dex*, +1 armour, +1 Deflection, +1 natural, +3 Mage Armour, +4 Shield); HP 91/104; Fort +9, Ref +8, Will +16

I have a Goblin character, who has been a lot of fun. But he's an Abjurer who's worked his way up to Craft Construct. ^_^ I like that Goblins are going to become iconic characters; they're pretty much the breakout monsters of Pathfinder.

Heh... Damiel won't be happy to hear this bit of news, though, will he? :D

It's a shame about all the new classes Paizo made, though. :( Farewell, beloved Brawler... Adieu, sweet Magus.

Speaking of Goblins, who here already knew about the Green Knight? Paz might make an extremely interesting iconic character. ;)


Male Humanly Awesome 'n Totally Rockin' Paladin of Greatness

Is Damiel the actual Pathfinder Iconic? Because I've never heard of him. Or did someone just make that up from the community?

Yeah I'm hoping they wind up bringing those back in some form. Not really a Magus fan(but just because I'm not that much into arcane) but I really want to play a Brawler. Just recently looked at it here in detail and man they look cool!

An Oread Brawler named "Punchy"! Ha! Totally love it! (Yes, yes, I do amuse myself). *shrugs* :)

And I've never heard of the Green Knight. Although reading up on it looks like it could be quite funny. He would be a great iconic. His backstory is greatness.

Grand Lodge

Damiel is an iconic.


Male Humanly Awesome 'n Totally Rockin' Paladin of Greatness

Ah, gotcha.


Female Half-Orc Evoker 10/Cyphermage 6; Init. +2; Perception +12; Darkvision; Arcane Sight; Fly 40 ft.; AC 23 (+3 Dex*, +1 armour, +1 Deflection, +1 natural, +3 Mage Armour, +4 Shield); HP 91/104; Fort +9, Ref +8, Will +16

Heck, if they made a comic about Paz, I'd buy it. ^_^

And yeah, Damiel is the iconic Alchemist. He's in the artwork starting with the APG.


Other than the classes they've mentioned already (the core ones), it's way too early to say goodbye to all the others. This is thing is just launching as a playtest, after all.


I strongly recommend listening to the podcast if you are curious about some the changes. there's a lot of bits on what's new in the two sessions.


Male Humanly Awesome 'n Totally Rockin' Paladin of Greatness
Lym Blackhand wrote:

Heck, if they made a comic about Paz, I'd buy it. ^_^

And yeah, Damiel is the iconic Alchemist. He's in the artwork starting with the APG.

Oh, okay. Like the APG but just not into any of those classes. I do play a witch(which is very rare for me) on these boards but that's the extent of it. A cavalier is something I might roll with at some point later on but that - to me anyway - is fairly niche.

Yeah I can't imagine them not coming back with some of the other classes built per 2nd edition. There are a lot of good ones. It'll just be in another book. :)


Female Half-Orc Evoker 10/Cyphermage 6; Init. +2; Perception +12; Darkvision; Arcane Sight; Fly 40 ft.; AC 23 (+3 Dex*, +1 armour, +1 Deflection, +1 natural, +3 Mage Armour, +4 Shield); HP 91/104; Fort +9, Ref +8, Will +16

There are so many good ones! :D

It took me a while to realize the Medium was basically a retooled version of 3.5's Binder. That was a combination of a D'oh-moment nd a really fun day for me. ^_^ I especially liked that Pathfinder fot rid the demons from the Ars Goethia... Those ruined what would otherwise have been a fun class -- for me.

The Mesmerist looks interesting, but not to play -- for me. It's all about bending other creatures' will to yours, and Enchantment is my go-to choice for opposition schools when I play a specialist Wizard.


Male Humanly Awesome 'n Totally Rockin' Paladin of Greatness

Yeah Mediums and Mesmerist are all greek to me. I just flat can't get into 'em. Again, probably has a lot to do with the fact I'm just not that into arcane. Mediums look REALLY involved and glancing at Mesmerist on d20... yeah no. :P

And I know a lot of 3.5 but I gotta confess, I've never heard of the Binder. Or this: Ars Goethia. Both of those don't ring a bell in any way shape or form. What book was the Binder in?

By the way, I googled a couple of 3.5 books the other day and I noticed you can get the entire book as a pdf. Simply click on it and read. Seems odd to me but Exalted Deeds was there. (It's actually one of the few 3.5 books I do still own). And AD&D 2nd ed. Core rulebook. 1st edition Core rulebook. Those 2 as well. That's all I checked on though. Pretty crazy.


Male Humanly Awesome 'n Totally Rockin' Paladin of Greatness
Lym Blackhand wrote:
Keep in mind each square is 10 ft.

Now we are talking about the ENTIRE square, right? Because I've been taking it like there are four 5' 'smaller' squares in each of the big squares. That is correct, right? Like 4 of us could actually fit in one of those big ol' squares?

Because if those 5' 'smaller' squares are really 10', then I've pretty much moved my whole movement. Please let me know because I wanna be sure I got it right. Thanks.


Female Half-Orc Evoker 10/Cyphermage 6; Init. +2; Perception +12; Darkvision; Arcane Sight; Fly 40 ft.; AC 23 (+3 Dex*, +1 armour, +1 Deflection, +1 natural, +3 Mage Armour, +4 Shield); HP 91/104; Fort +9, Ref +8, Will +16
Javell DeLeon wrote:
Yeah Mediums and Mesmerist are all greek to me. I just flat can't get into 'em. Again, probably has a lot to do with the fact I'm just not that into arcane. Mediums look REALLY involved and glancing at Mesmerist on d20... yeah no. :P

That's fair. ^_^ Different strokes for different folks!

Javell DeLeon wrote:
And I know a lot of 3.5 but I gotta confess, I've never heard of the Binder. Or this: Ars Goethia. Both of those don't ring a bell in any way shape or form. What book was the Binder in?

The Binder is in the Tome of Magic. It's a decent class with some interesting ideas, but WotC ruined it for me by basing most of its spirits on entities from the Ars Goethia, which is a chapter on the summoning of and dealing with demons in the Key of Solomon, a pretty famous grimoire of our own dear planet Earth.

That just ... yeah, it goes against the grain for me. It's bad enough that the game designers thought it was cool to name the dukes of the Nine Hells after prominent demons from the Judaeo-Christian tradition, without naming the class features of a whole class after slightly more obscure demons.

Javell DeLeon wrote:
By the way, I googled a couple of 3.5 books the other day and I noticed you can get the entire book as a pdf. Simply click on it and read. Seems odd to me but Exalted Deeds was there. (It's actually one of the few 3.5 books I do still own). And AD&D 2nd ed. Core rulebook. 1st edition Core rulebook. Those 2 as well. That's all I checked on though. Pretty crazy.

Cool. A few years ago, I found a 1st edition PHB at one of the gaming stores I know; a special re-print for the Gary Gygax foundation. I snapped it up, and it is now a proud part of my collection. ^_^ Someday, if I find the opportunity and means, I'd like to add the 2nd ed. PHB, too.


Javell DeLeon wrote:
Lym Blackhand wrote:
Keep in mind each square is 10 ft.

Now we are talking about the ENTIRE square, right? Because I've been taking it like there are four 5' 'smaller' squares in each of the big squares. That is correct, right? Like 4 of us could actually fit in one of those big ol' squares?

Because if those 5' 'smaller' squares are really 10', then I've pretty much moved my whole movement. Please let me know because I wanna be sure I got it right. Thanks.

Each square on the map is 4 5' squares.


Male Humanly Awesome 'n Totally Rockin' Paladin of Greatness

Cool. That's what I was thinking but was curious. Thanks!


Male Humanly Awesome 'n Totally Rockin' Paladin of Greatness

Seeing how it appears we lost Zen - which stinks - I know someone who I think would be a good fit, barring they can fit it into their time.

Unless OG already has someone in mind of course. If that's the case then that's great!

But if not, I'll throw his name out here in the Discussion thread and get y'all's take.

Or pm you all. Whichever is preferred.


Javell, we can use a name if you have one.

For my own self-improvement as a GM: have these latest encounters felt ok? Challenging enough? Interesting enough? This last one with the succubus I thought was a bit simple, BUT you all prepared well (the archons) and didn't miss a single SR roll, so my feelings may be skewed a bit by good prep/rolls.


Female Half-Orc Evoker 10/Cyphermage 6; Init. +2; Perception +12; Darkvision; Arcane Sight; Fly 40 ft.; AC 23 (+3 Dex*, +1 armour, +1 Deflection, +1 natural, +3 Mage Armour, +4 Shield); HP 91/104; Fort +9, Ref +8, Will +16

I thought it went well. ^_^ And yes, we were well-prepared, but then we're a pretty veteran party right now.

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