Kingmaker AP - War of the Red River! (Inactive)

Game Master Haldhin

Running the Kingmaker Adventure Path - Part 2
(Shared Resources Link)


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V: 56/56, W: 74/74, Temp HP 18, AC 17*, Fort +11*, Ref +9, Will +10*, Rage 23/23 , Power 9/9, Psi 7/7, Active Effects: Bull Strength

Looks great to me.

I think it's not a great stretch of logic to guess that they have darkvision if they live underground.

We do have an inquisitor in the group, and this sort of thing is one of the primary abilities of the class. Maybe he could help make that leap of logic?


I agree, and it's not a huge concern. I'm just trying to make sure we're all on the same page.


Male (Oni-Spawn) Tiefling Inquisitor 3

Sounds fine to me. Temerith is going to dabble in a bunch of Knowledge skills, as many as I can, so I can use my Monster Lore on as many things as possible.


Male Elf Air Elementalist Spellbinder 3 (HP 14/ AC 13, T 12, FF 11/ F +1, R +3, W +3/ Init +2/ Perc +2)

DM:

Looking at that table it has some problems. Maybe I misunderstood it but the way I read it. You have to roll a 14 or better to know everything about a CR 1/4-1 monster. Now keep in mind Arumil's knowledge is a bit overpowered at this point, reason for that. Yet at lvl 2 his knowledge mod will be +12 (+13 for nature) for trained skills, monsters will normally be between CR 2-5. So the DC to know all about monsters will be DC 27-30, requiring a roll of at least 15-18.

Maybe its just me but that seems a bit high. If Arumil did not have his feat his mod would drop to +10 (+11) at lvl 2 and if he did not have a maxed Int it would drop another point, I never go below 18 (after racial mod) on a wizard. So it could very well have been +9 (+10). So that table makes it a high roll for a maxed wizard (15 or more) and a even higher roll for a normal PC wizard (18 or more). Seems kinda like their was no point to maxing him the way I did if the DCs are that high, personally at lvl 2 I think nothing should be DC 27 concerning knowledge.

Also keep in mind when it comes to knowledge there are no rerolls. You get one roll on a subject per level. So a low roll on anything means thats it, until next level I cant know anything more about it.

I would suggest a case by case. The first question should be how common are they, the more rare a monster the higher the DC, its suggested in the rules after all. A rare monster would be 15 + CR, a overly common monster 5 + CR, netheir rare or common 10 + CR, and very rare would be 20 + CR. If you make the roll you know everything about the monster, but not anything outside the norm of that monster. This leaves room for the DM without having a lvl 11 Arumil roll a nat 1 and still not be able to know everything about a CR 1 monster cause his total is 25 not 26.

Seems more reasonable to me. But its your game, Arumil just lives in it.

Sorry if its a bit long.


Arumil:

Not a problem. :)

Just so you know, I'm trying to find a consistent solution that doesn't make your character build worthless. I wouldn't want it to happen to one of my characters, and I certainly wouldn't do it to somebody else.

But we do have a disagreement about how the rule for the Knowledge skill is used for information about monsters (i.e. Monster Lore).

You said:

Quote:
You have to roll a 14 or better to know everything about a CR 1/4-1 monster.

According to rules as written (Source: d20pfsrd.com/skills/knowledge):

The Base DC for knowing something about a creature is generally 10+CR (but that can vary). To quote the rule: "A successful check allows you to remember a bit of useful information about that monster". If you exceed the DC by 5 points, you get another "piece" of information. Neither the "bit" nor the "piece" of information are explained any further, and are therefore left completely up to the DM's discretion.

I have read through this rule several times today, but I do not see any text that would lead me to conclude that a character who makes a skill check that meets/exceeds the Base DC learns "everything" about a creature.

I fully admit that I may be missing something though. Can you help me understand what you are reading that indicates a character meeting the Base DC on the knowledge check results in receiving all of the details on a particular creature?

Actual text of the rule from d20pfsrd.com: You can use this skill to identify monsters and their special powers or vulnerabilities. In general, the DC of such a check equals 10 + the monster’s CR. For common monsters, such as goblins, the DC of this check equals 5 + the monster’s CR. For particularly rare monsters, such as the tarrasque, the DC of this check equals 15 + the monster’s CR or more. A successful check allows you to remember a bit of useful information about that monster. For every 5 points by which your check result exceeds the DC, you recall another piece of useful information.


Male Elf Air Elementalist Spellbinder 3 (HP 14/ AC 13, T 12, FF 11/ F +1, R +3, W +3/ Init +2/ Perc +2)

DM:

I was referring to your table concerning the rolls. Core does not give you a clear answer as far as I know about exceeding the DC. Thats kinda the problem on their end.

I guess I just dont understand why you would know somethings weakness and special abilities but not know minor things like its senses. Not really hard to figure out something has darkvision after all, they live in a dark lightless cave.

I know of some homebrew rules that split the stat block up into offense, defense, and special abilites per 5 over with everything else at the base DC (10+CR).

I pointed out before the problem with high DCs, by lvl 5 something like knowledge about a CR 1 should be nothing, you should not be lvl 11 and due to a bad roll still not know about something like a CR 1 monster. Because the forum dice roller tends to be evil, dont want to be without enough info cause of bad rolls. Part of the reason why I overpowered his knowledge skills.

Anyways as always your call.


Male Elf Air Elementalist Spellbinder 3 (HP 14/ AC 13, T 12, FF 11/ F +1, R +3, W +3/ Init +2/ Perc +2)

Being the weakest of the group Arumil will want to be as far from the action as he can get. ;)

Prepared ghost sound and dancing lights, I was thinking of using it for misdirection in the cave as needed. Other then that Arumil is pretty much decked out for war, spell wise. Just thought I would let you guys know.


Male Human Cleric 7 (HP 51/51 ;AC16,T11,FF15; F+8,R+5,W+11; Init +1; Perc +4){Effects:none}

Yeah, that's kind of why Bydar thought putting the casters in the center might be wise. Keeps the 'soft targets' from being nailed from ahead or behind.


HP: 40/40 AC: 17:13:14 Saves:6:5:5 Init: 2, Dip+11 Per: +11 SenMot +9

I don't think, I'm a soft target,
or is it the "He must protect she" instinct.


Male Elf Air Elementalist Spellbinder 3 (HP 14/ AC 13, T 12, FF 11/ F +1, R +3, W +3/ Init +2/ Perc +2)

Well it depends, if their is only one entrance/exit. Then no need to have casters in the center, also need to keep in mind being a easy group target in that formation.

Would prefer a stealthy scout, easy to ambush targets like that. Just some thoughts.


Male Human Cleric 7 (HP 51/51 ;AC16,T11,FF15; F+8,R+5,W+11; Init +1; Perc +4){Effects:none}
Bridgette Etna Asta Valerius wrote:

I don't think, I'm a soft target,

or is it the "He must protect she" instinct.

ACK ! That was a typo. I meant for Bydar to ask her if she wanted to take POINT. Too late to edit it now :(

I was thinking
Bridgette taking front
Temerith second
Bydar or Arumil next
and then Raxus at the rear.


Male (Oni-Spawn) Tiefling Inquisitor 3

I'm okay with that. Temerith is a little squishy to start out with. d8 HP and medium armor without a shield is kinda scary at low levels.


HP: 40/40 AC: 17:13:14 Saves:6:5:5 Init: 2, Dip+11 Per: +11 SenMot +9

I think it's a bit better to let the typo stand as it adds some RP potential.


V: 56/56, W: 74/74, Temp HP 18, AC 17*, Fort +11*, Ref +9, Will +10*, Rage 23/23 , Power 9/9, Psi 7/7, Active Effects: Bull Strength

Raxus definitely has a 'he must protect she' mindset, but it'll probably come out in actions at some point rather than conversation.


Male Human Cleric 7 (HP 51/51 ;AC16,T11,FF15; F+8,R+5,W+11; Init +1; Perc +4){Effects:none}

Well, Bydar doesn't have it but certainly wouldn't blame anyone who did.


Male (Oni-Spawn) Tiefling Inquisitor 3

Temerith is not really the sneaky type, so the concept of the light drawing attention hasn't even occured to him.

There are a handful of party members who will be much more capable of doing things if they can actually see what's going on, as far as he's aware, so that's why he did it.


Male Elf Air Elementalist Spellbinder 3 (HP 14/ AC 13, T 12, FF 11/ F +1, R +3, W +3/ Init +2/ Perc +2)

Geez evil dice x3


Male Human Cleric 7 (HP 51/51 ;AC16,T11,FF15; F+8,R+5,W+11; Init +1; Perc +4){Effects:none}

Dice aren't liking crossbows either


Male Elf Air Elementalist Spellbinder 3 (HP 14/ AC 13, T 12, FF 11/ F +1, R +3, W +3/ Init +2/ Perc +2)

Bah dice.

Anyways how does everyone do that green text with the rolls. Did I miss the memo?


Took me a while to figure it out too. :) Put it in the first dice tag with "=text" immediately after the word "dice". Here is an example:

-> {dice=Attack roll]d20+7[/dice]

-> Attack roll: 1d20 + 7 ⇒ (8) + 7 = 15


Male (Oni-Spawn) Tiefling Inquisitor 3

Yeah, I sorta figured that out from another PbP game. I was like "hey, how do I-oooooooooooohhhhhhhh. Nifty."

Also, almost just barely brute-forced my Knowledge check. It hurts!


V: 56/56, W: 74/74, Temp HP 18, AC 17*, Fort +11*, Ref +9, Will +10*, Rage 23/23 , Power 9/9, Psi 7/7, Active Effects: Bull Strength

I had a character in another game who had a number of voices in his head. I used to use Italicized ooc text and green text: 0 = 0 to represent their internal monologues. I just made the dice roll look like emoticons matching that voice's reactions.

No one in the game could figure out how i did it for quite a while. :)

I always thought it would be fun to play a Modron in a Planescape game that spoke in green text, and include the dice math in his speech, like he was actually just speaking math out out, doing calculations all the time, even having him say his numbers out loud as part of his combat subroutine

[dice=..."Initiating attack sequence alpha...]1d20+7[/dice] ...Damage analysis...: 1d8 + 5 ⇒ (8) + 5 = 13...results fall within accepted parameters. Repeat sequence.: 0 = 0


Male Elf Air Elementalist Spellbinder 3 (HP 14/ AC 13, T 12, FF 11/ F +1, R +3, W +3/ Init +2/ Perc +2)

Testing.

Pimp Slap: 1d20 + 5 ⇒ (10) + 5 = 15

Oh yeah figures I get a decent roll when I am joking. >.>


V: 56/56, W: 74/74, Temp HP 18, AC 17*, Fort +11*, Ref +9, Will +10*, Rage 23/23 , Power 9/9, Psi 7/7, Active Effects: Bull Strength

DM, can you put the Shared Info folder in the campaign description, rather than the campaign info tab? That way we can access the link from the gameplay thread.


@ Raxus: Yes, I'll do so today.

In other news, Varnius and Gua Zhen have been informed via PM that I am removing them from the game.

Is the group content to continue with the five active players we currently have, or should I look back through the recruitment thread for more characters?


Male Elf Air Elementalist Spellbinder 3 (HP 14/ AC 13, T 12, FF 11/ F +1, R +3, W +3/ Init +2/ Perc +2)

Well five is fine and we have the vitals I think. Not to mention we are all around the same activity level so things dont slow down. ;)


Male Human Cleric 7 (HP 51/51 ;AC16,T11,FF15; F+8,R+5,W+11; Init +1; Perc +4){Effects:none}

I'm torn. Five is probably enough, but on the other hand, there are lots of folks out there who seem chomping at the bit to play Kingmaker and it might be nice to offer at least one a chance.

If we DO go recruiting, my suggestion would be for a stealthy scout type of some port. It appears to be the only thing we really lack.


Male (Oni-Spawn) Tiefling Inquisitor 3

I would not be averse to grabbing someone else, but the group we have now should work well, too.

Bydar's right, though, lots of people would love to get in on this.


Male Elf Air Elementalist Spellbinder 3 (HP 14/ AC 13, T 12, FF 11/ F +1, R +3, W +3/ Init +2/ Perc +2)

The only thing I am worried about is activity, I really hate it when the game gets held up by one person. Its far to common for my taste. This game has been going pretty fast and I want to keep it that way. ;)


HP: 40/40 AC: 17:13:14 Saves:6:5:5 Init: 2, Dip+11 Per: +11 SenMot +9

To recruit or not recruit that is the question?

given the current group and it's posting rate I think is fine,
as for the scout part, I can do it since I have high perception and do like having stealth when needed.


V: 56/56, W: 74/74, Temp HP 18, AC 17*, Fort +11*, Ref +9, Will +10*, Rage 23/23 , Power 9/9, Psi 7/7, Active Effects: Bull Strength

Sounds good to me. All we're really missing is a trapspringer/lockpicker.

We can probably make due with high perception, a couple Skeleton Keys and occasional summoned creatures to trigger traps.

Eventually we can get our hands on an adamantine hacksaw and chisel. Better than any lock picks.


Apologies for not updating last night. Internet was down for me, and my 7 mo old was cranky. Will do my best to update asap.


Male Elf Air Elementalist Spellbinder 3 (HP 14/ AC 13, T 12, FF 11/ F +1, R +3, W +3/ Init +2/ Perc +2)

Ah just checked out ISB and I want to make a Noqual. Sadly I doubt I ever will. xP


After reading the comments and thinking about the current group, I've decided to add one more person. I've contacted somebody who was interested before, and he's agreed to join us. He posts (on average) at least once/day, so he won't slow down the pace of the game. He's also an experienced PbP role-player, so he should fit in well.

We're working on his character now. He'll probably join up with the current group later next week (or so).


Male (Oni-Spawn) Tiefling Inquisitor 3

Sounds legit.

Make sure that he's aware that he doesn't NEED to play a sneaky rogue-y type if he doesn't feel like it, sometimes brute-forcing problems is more fun, after all! :)


Male Human Cleric 7 (HP 51/51 ;AC16,T11,FF15; F+8,R+5,W+11; Init +1; Perc +4){Effects:none}

He definitely needs to enjoy whatever he plays :)


Male Elf Air Elementalist Spellbinder 3 (HP 14/ AC 13, T 12, FF 11/ F +1, R +3, W +3/ Init +2/ Perc +2)

Who does not like playing a thieving sly trapsmith. <3


V: 56/56, W: 74/74, Temp HP 18, AC 17*, Fort +11*, Ref +9, Will +10*, Rage 23/23 , Power 9/9, Psi 7/7, Active Effects: Bull Strength

After wizards, they're my favorite. I don't particularly like Pathfinder's rogue though. Most of my sly trap-smiths these days are alchemists. I really like the Crypt Breaker archetype.


Male Elf Air Elementalist Spellbinder 3 (HP 14/ AC 13, T 12, FF 11/ F +1, R +3, W +3/ Init +2/ Perc +2)

Anyone who can make that perception just take 20. xP


V: 56/56, W: 74/74, Temp HP 18, AC 17*, Fort +11*, Ref +9, Will +10*, Rage 23/23 , Power 9/9, Psi 7/7, Active Effects: Bull Strength

Taking 20 is one of those things that requires conscious effort. I think this is a passive check. Basically, we don't know there's something we would need to take 20 on, so we can't.

I suppose we could just say we are moving extremely slowly and quietly to allow us to take 20, but that would make all this take a long time.

When I play rogues I tend to make my scouting protocol "ahead of the party, taking 20 on perception and stealth, moving forward and motioning them forward every time I've cleared 50 feet".

Based on the rules, doing it this way takes about 10 minutes per 50 feet, but is as safe as it can get.

In this situation, I don't think we want to go that slow.


Male Elf Air Elementalist Spellbinder 3 (HP 14/ AC 13, T 12, FF 11/ F +1, R +3, W +3/ Init +2/ Perc +2)

Easy for you to say, I am the squshy one.

Btw anyone else having a problems with their alaises and such?


Male (Oni-Spawn) Tiefling Inquisitor 3

What kind of problems?


Male Elf Air Elementalist Spellbinder 3 (HP 14/ AC 13, T 12, FF 11/ F +1, R +3, W +3/ Init +2/ Perc +2)

Nvm seems the forums were just being a pain again. I was unable to see my compaigns or any alias profile of mine. Fine now.


Male Elf Air Elementalist Spellbinder 3 (HP 14/ AC 13, T 12, FF 11/ F +1, R +3, W +3/ Init +2/ Perc +2)

@Raxus
Charging towards the mite tunnel would not work due to the caltrops but he charged towards the cave fisher so the only thing on the floor in that area is bugs.


Male Human Cleric 7 (HP 51/51 ;AC16,T11,FF15; F+8,R+5,W+11; Init +1; Perc +4){Effects:none}

I just need to throw my crossbow away


Male (Oni-Spawn) Tiefling Inquisitor 3

I know that feeling, Bydar. In my Carrion Crown game, my Oracle spends most of his time whiffing with his morningstar. Haldhin will vouch for it!


V: 56/56, W: 74/74, Temp HP 18, AC 17*, Fort +11*, Ref +9, Will +10*, Rage 23/23 , Power 9/9, Psi 7/7, Active Effects: Bull Strength

Ah. That makes sense. I hadn't seen the map yet. I thought the caltrops were in the path to the fisher.


HP: 40/40 AC: 17:13:14 Saves:6:5:5 Init: 2, Dip+11 Per: +11 SenMot +9

Caltrops can be a pain, in the butt.


Male (Oni-Spawn) Tiefling Inquisitor 3

I am currently observing what it was that you did there.


Male Elf Air Elementalist Spellbinder 3 (HP 14/ AC 13, T 12, FF 11/ F +1, R +3, W +3/ Init +2/ Perc +2)

Is there a reason why Bridgette and Raxus have not posted actions?

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