Toramin Gearsmith |
I'm still here! I just wanted to give Rilka and Dalton a chance to respond before I did. Perhaps, Rilka doesn't plan to check until the end of the month.
Three scenarios work for me. It is not the long form narrative I was hoping for, but it is within the set of things I think I can enjoy. I'm definitely looking forward to moving forward with this campaign.
One point I want to push back on is the issue of the sand-box.
"Clearly the heavy sandbox theme isn't working for you guys, so I am going to make action more directed. I am still heavily against railroading, so I will not give you suggested actions on how to handle problems (unless you ask for NPC advice, at which time they would give you their insights). I think this problem has occurred because I made the conclusion that you would appreciate a much more open-choice/sandbox mission based on your actions in Akropash, but clearly that was been a failure."
I happen to enjoy sandboxes if there is ample player-engagement. Many of the complaints we have had is not that you have asked us to direct ourselves, but that our actions seem meaningless (or were described that way by the DM). Nobody is asking for railroading. In fact sometimes it feels like there is a railroad we should be on and we are fumbling in the dark looking for the tracks. What we would very much like going forward is that our successes and our failures get woven into something that keeps the narrative going forward in an engaging way.
We don't want you to tell us what to do.
We don't always want our things to succeed, but most things should feel consequential. Successes and failures should help us imagine that we are experiencing important junctures in our characters' lives.
For example, telling us that our actions are having big impacts behind the scenes and then never showing us those impacts is frustrating.
DM Omen |
If we're sticking with redoing events in Grastle Hollow can we get an in-depth recap of what it is we need to accomplish to not create a paradox?
Sure! So the thing about this kind of time travel is that nobody (that you know) is really an expert on it. Nareth seems to have the most experience, and from what you learned from him you know that the only thing that will guarantee bad things happening is if you meet your time remnants. Other than that, you don't know of anything that will cause bad stuff to happen.
You also suspect, based on your experience in this frame of time before, that you accomplished those three events that I listed above.
I happen to enjoy sandboxes if there is ample player-engagement. Many of the complaints we have had is not that you have asked us to direct ourselves, but that our actions seem meaningless (or were described that way by the DM). Nobody is asking for railroading. In fact sometimes it feels like there is a railroad we should be on and we are fumbling in the dark looking for the tracks. What we would very much like going forward is that our successes and our failures get woven into something that keeps the narrative going forward in an engaging way.
We don't want you to tell us what to do.
We don't always want our things to succeed, but most things should feel consequential. Successes and failures should help us imagine that we are experiencing important junctures in our characters' lives.
For example, telling us that our actions are having big impacts behind the scenes and then never showing us those impacts is frustrating.
Right, so to handle this I'm going to take a more 'Kingmaker' style approach. That is, you will see a statistical, quantifiable result when you make a decision. You can measure things with numbers. I think that should help alleviate that problem.
Dalton Barrowwheel |
Numbers are great, but it is qualitative effect that needs to be observed. If you had told us all our work dead-ended because a mysterious 40 beat our 38 "diligence" or whatever, it doesn't mean much. On the other hand, if the town turned against us because we were revealed to be meddlers and lost the contest of public opinion, that would be fine.
Toramin Gearsmith |
Totally, Dalton!
I'm much more interested in narrative pay-out.
As far as sub-systems go, Bjorkus has been telling me he is loving the social combat stuff from Ultimate Intrigue when he has run it as a DM.
DM Omen |
Oh absolutely, I've never been one for "Your social influence check was lower so you lose". It would definitely pan out in a much more qualitative sense.
I haven't looked at those rules yet, but I'm always open to new ideas. Is the content openly available on the web?
Also as an FYI, my laptop just bit the dust so I'll be phone-only for a while.
Rilka Featherfeet |
I’m here! I checked the boards on the 21st or 22nd last month, so just missed your return DM Omen.
The three bullet points you outlined are good scenes for capping our Grastle Hollow adventures.
Toramin Gearsmith |
Before our last hiatus, I had the sense that you thought Bjorkus and I posted too much, and should let Rilka and Dalton take the lead posting wise. Is this a fair assessment? I don't want to step on your toes so quickly, but I do want to, you know, post.
Rilka Featherfeet |
That is devastating news. Take care of yourself and give yourself as much time as you need.
We'll continue on in the meantime.
Rilka Featherfeet |
I vote for museum heist. I think Toramin and Dalton put some ideas about how to proceed with that a few weeks back in the Discussion thread.
Rilka Featherfeet |
I was waiting for the others to respond to Rilka. Posting the information we know about the heist at the Museum of Rhombodazzle would be helpful. We know Villichi was supposedly there. A guard was killed, or is that a rumor?
We’ll have to spend some time visiting the museum to formulate a plan, look for magical traps, etc.
Dalton Barrowwheel |
I will get a post up tomorrow.
Toramin Gearsmith |
Reports of my recovery were greatly exaggerated. Still alive though. Haha. Will post when I can.
DM Omen |
I have added a link in the campaign header to the main room of the Nivi museum.
The green doors are ones that are open, and all lead to other art exhibits. The red doors are ones that are closed to the public, the one on the east side being for workers and the one on the west for security. There are two doors to the museum, both on the southern wall. In the southeastern corner is a desk where there is always somebody working, and who you can ask questions of. The white trees are the whirring trees, the main exhibit of this room. There is also a large statue of a die with seven dots on it in the center room, Nivi Rhombodazzle's holy symbol. On the north central wall is The Revelation.
Feel free to ask any questions!
Rilka Featherfeet |
Thanks for updating us! I’m doing well. I hope everyone is too.
The reason Rilka is asking about submitting artwork, is on the off chance we could place some magic contraption that could help us gain access to The Revelation. I don’t off the top of my head know what effect I’m hoping it to have, or even if it would be mechanically possible. Maybe Rilka could shrink down to Tiny and hide, allowing her to open the doors from the inside? As I said, it is very nebulous at this time. We definitely should be using the discussion board for brainstorming solutions to stealing the Revelation if we aren’t going to do it in character.
Dalton Barrowwheel |
I know we hit some major bumps in the road, and I'm growing a little concerned that we still haven't addressed the problems well enough based on the pace.
Not sure what you're getting at. Rilka has the chance for a special mission which she is particularly suited for. We knew this before she set out for it. No bad surprises so far.
Rilka Featherfeet |
I was thinking Rilka would impersonate Aundo and fight Markal when he attacks. She’d ask Bjokrus (better stealth than Toramin) to be in the area for assistance should Markal be too tough to take down. The idea is to knock him out there and leave him dead in the museum...though now I wonder if any of the guards will take credit for killing him. Or if nobody does, what a mystery for some enterprising gnome to discover.
Toramin Gearsmith |
Rilka, Bjorkus cast Heroism on you. Yours rolls should be slightly better.
Rilka Featherfeet |
Toramin, thanks for the reminder! So with the +2 morale bonus from heroism that would make the attacks 11 and 2.
Rilka Featherfeet |
Do you have any other ideas for “stealing” the Revelation? Proposals don’t need to be in character, in the gameplay thread. Besides the time-forwarding suggestion, another possibility is digging a chamber under the city and teleporting it there. Oh, I think I made that point in the Gameplay thread.
I think using sleep and other non-lethal measures against the guards is the way to go. Silence and tanglefoot bags? Maybe have a fight with one or two so Markal’s death isn’t so suspicious...
Am I forgetting anything?
Dalton Barrowwheel |
Sorry, post is up.
Oh, we've bent the frame of time well out of shape already!
Toramin Gearsmith |
If the floors are stone, then Ymir + Dalton's stone shape could get us in and out.
Is this the last thing that we must do in this time loop? I'm looking forward to not being stuck in something where the outcome is already known.
Toramin Gearsmith |
How about this for a plan:
Ymir guides us to the nearest underground tunnel
Dalton stone shapes an opening.
An invisible Rilka with a silenced pebble, courtesy of Ianna, goes in and grabs it.
We leave the dead body?
Dalton reshapes the floor.
Dalton Barrowwheel |
How about this for a plan:
Ymir guides us to the nearest underground tunnel
Dalton stone shapes an opening.
An invisible Rilka with a silenced pebble, courtesy of Ianna, goes in and grabs it.
We leave the dead body?
Dalton reshapes the floor.
Simple and effective enough!