GMDQ's Skull and Shackles (Inactive)

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Nice map, thanks. The break was okay. We have been playing long enough that it did feel a little odd to go that long without posting anything. Just about six months already!

On an unrelated note - I recall that you read at least some of Naomi Novik's Temeraire series. Her latest, Uprooted, is really good. It's standalone and not related to Temeraire. Really I'd recommend it to anyone in the mood for high fantasy (not a series, complete in one volume) with good characters and plenty of cool magic.

Thanks! Yes, I love the Temeraire novels. I almost bought Uprooted the other day, it looked good. I'll have to pick it up next time I see it.

I'll try to remember to look for that one at some point myself. I need new reading material!

Final ruling on how we can use Shocking Grasp is, of course, up to GMDQ. That said, what I've read indicates that spells are very constrained in their effects. My understanding of a spell like shocking grasp is that it does not create a mundane arc of electricity on your hand. Rather it creates an effect that does damage like electricity and may even look like electricity, but only within the constraints of the spell description. Even though you get an attack bonus if the target is wearing or carrying metal the electricity-effect doesn't conduct like mundane electricity.

That's all a long way of saying that the spell's range is Touch and its target is 'creature or object' (singular). So you can't hit something you can't reach and you can't hit more than one thing.

I'm sorry if I sound like a rules lawyer. I certainly don't want to discourage creative play. Longwinded explanations like the above help me resolve the tension in my head between the look and feel of magic and the limits of individual spells.

I want to imagine Lee raising a hand covered in jagged blue arcs that fill the cavern with the sound of snaps and crackles. I also think that Pathfinder wants to create a progression from here to spells like lightening bold and chain lightening that allow you to electrocute multiple targets.

Re: concealment and water: In certain circumstances, like say someone completely submerged in very murky water, I might say it provides concealment or soft cover, but this is not the case here. Water is not obscuring the visibility of your bodies, nor of your enemies (and it would make things a pain in the ass if it were).

Regarding shocking grasp and water. I could get anal and note water is in fact a lousy conductor -- although the salts in it are probably the opposite, of course, as the salt itself is what tends to have the moveable electrons.

It's something I'd have to think on a bit. I am partially inclined to agree with thermopyle on limiting spells per his interpretation, and partially inclined to want to reward creativity within reason.

I can say two things give me a stop:

One is that is that whatever effect would be used, it would be uncontrolled, because it is being affected by the environment, not the caster. This means say, if I rule shocking grasp could arc to nearby creatures in the water, this would include the caster and his allies.

The other is that this is a seafaring campaign. You will not always be fighting in water (I hope) but there will be a lot of water in your characters' future (unless you REALLY take things off the rails and decide to explore Sargava or something). It's one thing to say, on a one off ruling, "sure, this does this extra thing." It's another to effectively give a spell extra power in circumstances that can be easily and regularly repeated in this campaign's environment.

I would say if I were to allow an electricity-based spell to do more damage in saltwater or otherwise naturally occurring, mineral-heavy water, it would probably be limited to something similar to a splash effect, and could affect the caster and allies.

If we went this way, I could say something like shocking grasp could deal 1 point of "splash" damage to any one randomly chosen adjacent creature to the target, per die of damage the spell makes. "Adjacent creatures" can include allies and the caster himself. So if you deal 3d6 damage, 3 randomly chosen adjacent creatures take 1 point of damage. If there's only one adjacent creature, then that is the creature that gets "splashed." If the random choice making nails the same character twice they take the damage twice. If there's one adjacent creature and the spell deals 3d6 damage, that one adjacent creature takes 3 damage. If that one adjacent creature is the spellcaster himself, he's the one taking the damage.

I will also note that the spell's basic requirements need to be met--the environment cannot change the range, duration, etc. So a touch spell like shocking grasp must still be discharged with a touch and cannot be cast at range, etc.

Thoughts?

For my part regarding shocking grasp:

It's magic. Yes, it creates electricity. But magic need not heed physics. In pure water, the charge wouldn't conduct worth spit. In water with any sort of salts dissolved in it (e.g. seawater), different story. But as there isn't anything mentioned in either the spell description or the environmental rules specifically calling out changes to the spell, I aim for the simplest solution and say leave it alone.

Regarding concealment and water: I thought water blocked line of effect, not line of sight, under normal circumstances, but I haven't been able to find that rule. And that applied only to attacks from outside breaking the water's surface. Once you reach a certain depth, water limits vision (saw that rule here recently too), which would mean people are blasting blindly if you get too deep. But under normal circumstances, I don't recall concealment being involved. Obviously, certain creatures like squid can modify that plan.

On water: Visibility rules for water don't kick until at least 10 feet of water. You are in a room covered in about three feet of water so these things don't apply (deep enough for the grindys to swim but the humans to stand).

Putting it another way, you can usually see the bottom of a stream or a swimming pool, but if you're far enough from shore, you cannot see the bottom of the ocean.

And the rules actually specifically note: "It's hard to find cover or concealment to hide underwater (except along the sea floor)." This comment applies largely to underwater combat. I'd rule in murky water you can gain concealment if you are hiding totally submerged under the water. OTOH, if you're in murky water, probably other things are concealed from you too.

The rules do note that submerged creatures gain a cover bonus to attackers on land, but I am envisioning this as, for example, a fisherman on a dock trying to spear a fish that is swimming below. You guys are in a relatively shallow area where the water serves as difficult terrain for you (but, inconveniently, a place where your enemies can move swiftly), but doesn't do much else.

The only reason concealment came up in combat in this section of the game was first, due to lighting, and second, due to the squids' ink ability, where it was the ink creating the concealment.

I also lean toward keeping Shocking Grasp simple. Plus, the way our die roller works the splash damage would always hit Lee or one of us ;)

I'd be more upset about Lark missing his attacks if the grindylows weren't doing the same thing. Bets on who starts hitting first them or me?

So I spent a good portion of the weekend with KeefX (binge-watching Daredevil). He felt that the general sense of the group was moving toward sticking to electricity spells as written, and not trying to add environmental effects. I agree for the most part with the "spell is a spell is a spell and does not deviate from its description" for the most part. So that is how we will run things.

It occurs to me I need to come up with a better system for batch die-rolling for big mob fights. I think probably Ultimate Campaign has suggestions, but that would require research. ;)

I neglected for awhile updating XP totals (mind, I tend to err on the side of "level at an appropriate point in the story" -- and in fact leveled you to 3 a little early) but I have updated them now and will try to do better about that in future. Level 4 comes at 9,000 XP (roughly).

I hope y'all had fun watching Daredevil. I especially enjoyed Karen and Foggy's growth through season 2. Have you watched Jessica Jones? I really liked that one and I'm looking forward to season 2 as well as the Luke Cage show coming this fall.

I took a quick look at the Ultimate Campaign book and it appears to deal with combat between armies. It has rules for treating each army as a single entity with one attack roll. I didn't see anything for speeding up groups of enemies vs. PCs, but I only skimmed through a couple of sections.

I largely enjoyed Daredevil, although I have my issues with it. Generally speaking, I think most of the plot beats they hit are spot-on and the character development is fantastic--with the noted exception that Matt seemed to grow down rather than up by the end of S2, IMO. However, I really struggle with the pacing, and there are episodes I've fallen asleep in front of but still managed to hit all the plot points. The episodes seem to go "5 minutes amazing character development"-"15 minutes of way too lengthy, gorey fight scene"-"10 minutes of people mumbling in the dark"-"5 minutes awesome plot twist-"10 more minutes of people mumbling in the dark"-"10 minute, too lengthy, gorey fight scene"-"satisfyingly written 5 minute denouement and setup for next episode."

I really want to walk into a scene in Daredevil and shout "WHY ARE YOU ALL WHISPERING????!!!!???"

Karen and Foggy are definitely MVPs, and overall the cast, both character writing wise and the actors who play them, are frikking amazing. I liked Matt in S1 and didn't like him in S2, and everyone else is awesome. I'm excited about Foggy working for Hogarth, and worried for him at the same time, because yes, I have seen Jessica Jones. :) (And I loved it.)

I found Jessica Jones also a tad slow at times (I think another issue is 60 minutes episodes are just too long) but overall better paced, and less plagued by people mumbling in the dark for a third of the episode. It was fantastic, and another show with incredible cast and characters.

Looking forward to Luke Cage 2, although I'd trade it for Jessica Jones Season 2 in a heartbeat.

I'll have to watch all that stuff at some point. Sounds like a nice change from the main parts of the Marvel Cinematic Universe :)

I should have mentioned earlier - I'm traveling this afternoon and tomorrow. Feel free to bot Lark if needed. I should be able to post again by Sunday. Sorry about the late notice!

I'm on the road this weekend.
I'll check in when I can.
I'm returning Sunday evening, so if Lee or Muffin needs to be botted between then and now please feel free to do so.

Sorry for my own delay; as you might be able to tell we're about to get into a big scene so I wanted to be sure everyone was close to being on board before we took off. I should have said that sooner, however. :)

I have returned.
My tour of the south was everything I had hoped it could be.

GMDQ - no worries, please take all the time you want before feeding us to gigantic grindylows and their queen ;)

Keefx - welcome back!

Folks, I have a big day ahead and will post the enemies' turn hopefully tonight. Sorry for any delays.

No problem. I'm willing to wait to be skewered for a few more hours :)

No issues.
Talk to you soon.

Regarding Lark being stuck in the Whale's jaws: I assumed the Whale would get a free "chewing" attack. If that's not correct and Lark should be stabbing its tongue instead please let me know ;)

OK, I just went and read the Swallow Whole rules. If that's what Lark is facing then I'm happy I tried the escape.

Yes, he has swallow whole, and yes, you may try to escape. I should have noted, you have the option of trying to physically attack as well.

Because I am a lovely person and you should be grateful for your beneficent GM ;) I am reminding you all Rosie has spears she picked up to throw, and you have only been giving her move actions. The range is 20 ft.

Observation: I am apparently quite competent when there are boss fights. But doomed to die to a mook someday. At least if the die-roller acts like this in the future.

Is dying to a mook better or worse than being digested by an oversized fish? ;)

Well, it was certainly a dramatic fight. I really thought Lark was gonna die a couple times.

If Thren can pull it off in the end, that's all good! I'm thinking keen/improved crit/crit mastery may be a good way to go.

Before that: Weapon Focus, then Fencing Grace for Dex to damage. I can't compete with the damage of Lee or Lark as it is :)

Lee's a one-hit wonder.

All,

I am going to be on the road until the 19th or so. I will have some access to computers, but not like usual.

Feel free to bot Lee and Muffin as needed.

-K

Well, that actually puts me in a dilemma, as, without trying to spoil anything, we are about to hit the end of the first book (believe it or not, the Whale fight isn't the climax). I really don't want to move to the final event without all players fully available.

Do you guys want to RP an extended "campfire scene" and just RP and chat with the NPCs and the like for a bit?

Move forward where possible?

Or take a break until around June 22 (I pick that date because I'm going away June 19-21).

Maybe a campfire scene? Perhaps that's a lot of work for you, GMDQ?

If y'all want to take a break that's fine with me too.

A campfire scene would not be a lot of work for me -- all I've got to do is RP the NPCs which, after wrangling a couple of rather complicated combats, would be a nice relaxing way for me to play.

I'd need you and Lathiira particularly to be willing to help keep the conversation going. But I'm totally game for that option.

I acknowledge we might run out of conversation until we get back, but there's still some good opportunity here we can have fun with.

If it's not too difficult, I think the campfire is a fine idea.
I'm not going to be completely out of touch. Just sporadic.

Campfire scene is good for me too. Let's us interact with our allies, don't have to stress over remembering all the die rolls, plan *puts money in the curse jar*, and whatnot.

I'm back from my trip but need to settle down before I get fully into the game again. However:

Since you guys have brought up leadership ICly, I thought I should note:

Should things go the way the AP intends, one of you will eventually end up being captain of your crew. (In case you never paid attention to the details in your player's guide or the flavor text on the AP, the whole point of the AP is you get your own ship and crew, with the PCs being the senior officers.)

You should probably talk amongst yourselves, both in and out of character, about who you would like that to be.

If you don't pick one, the NPCs will elect one of you, and I'll have to figure out how that would work.

No, absolutely not, under any circumstances, will an NPC become captain, and certainly not the throwaway Rahadoumi NPC I decided to let live on a whim to help fill out officer numbers on the Man's Promise.

I can allude to some of this IC once I am able to post but this is the kind of thing that should actually be transparent to you, I thought I should bring it up to enable player discussion.

Lark as potential captain... this is what I get for being slow to post, right? ;)

Yes, this is what happens when you're last when KeefX and I say 'one two three NOT IT!' LOL

Are you ready to move on, or do you want to have more discussion?

I'm ready to go on.

Forward! Onward to victory! And so on and so forth.

I'm ready.

I'll be away Sunday-Wednesday. Things may be slow during that time, but I'll be available to post regularly through tomorrow.

Enjoy your holiday weekend! I'll be working my normal schedule.

Happy 4th, y'all!

I am back! Let me know how your characters proceed.

Welcome back!

Did I lose all of you?

Come on guys, it's not as bad as it seems... :) Remember I have never thrown anything at you you couldn't handle.

And if things go horribly awry, that's what the battle scar system is for. :)

Sorry. Will post tonight after I've gotten some sleep. I'm teaching about a dozen people how to set mods every night all on my own and I'm too wiped to be pithy or shoot people or anything just yet.

Everyone's probably just speechless at what I've dragged them into ;)