Epic Sixth Level Bronze Age Campaign

Game Master Cranefist

"EDIT: By the way, GM, I wasn't sure what to do as far as equipment. I went with masterwork weapons and a mithral breastplate--I'm pretty sure that falls within the WBL for 6th-level characters. If not, or if there's something special you want me to do, then let me know! This is Loup Blanc, by the way."

Equipment can be anything you want to purchase via wealth by level, provided it is listed in an official Paizo core rule book and fits within the tech level (no +2 shotguns).

Aw, there goes my dual shotguns plan... Guess I'll stick to sword and bow...

I'll check out what money I have versus gear.

Question:

Does my Bandit archetype power "ambush" make any sense in the way you want to run your encounters?

At 4th level, a bandit becomes fully practiced in the art of ambushing. When she acts in the surprise round, she can take a move action, standard action, and swift action during the surprise round, not just a move or standard action.

Main reason why I took the bandit archetype is to make the underhanded trait work. You need a concealed weapon for that and even with spring loaded sheaths it is a Swift Action which is not permitted in the surprise round.

Or you could rule that the combination of quick draw and spring loaded sheaths makes drawing a weapon or wand from the sheaths a free action. (I can hope, can't I?).

Even if you declare 3-4 actions simultaneously and roll dice / post numbers, the outcome of the ordeal isn't set until I narrate the end of the phase. There can still be a surprise round and dealing maximum damage or hitting and jogging off could still be useful.

Why don't you keep it for a fight or two and see how it plays. If you don't like it, you can change it then.

Good suggestion to keep it for a fight or two. Thanks.

Hey gang, I'm glad to be gaming with y'all!

I had a question too about how announcing multiple actions will work, practically. Do you expect something like this?

I enter Divine Fervor, charge the giant while swinging with my greatsword, and calling for Madness to flank with me. I keep fighting him until he's dropped, then move on to the next nearest foe...unless I see a companion in dire need, at which point I'll use Channel Energy to heal them a bit, and consider if I need to risk being hit by an AoO go over to them and attack their foe instead. (roll) (roll) (roll)

In terms of Madness, how much/little do you want me to control him? Do you want me to just tell you what he does...and you let me know if he surprises me? If so, maybe I'll actually create an alias for him as well.

Also if/when it comes up, Madness has Tenacious Bodyguard so always acts in surprise rounds.

One more question. I'm wondering how much of Oneidros' equipment he'd have with him at a public festival. His main weapon will be his greatsword, and if it's culturally acceptable for a warrior-priest to carry one with him, he probably has it on his back most of the time...but if it's a culture where that'll rub people the wrong way, let me know.

One more question. I'm wondering how much of Oneidros' equipment he'd have with him at a public festival. His main weapon will be his greatsword, and if it's culturally acceptable for a warrior-priest to carry one with him, he probably has it on his back most of the time...but if it's a culture where that'll rub people the wrong way, let me know.

As a priest, you can get away with all kinds of weird s#*#. No one is going to tell you not to carry a sword so long as you have a reputation for miracles, and in an E6 world, you do.

As far as taking actions, what you posted above is perfectly acceptable. I'll narrate it out after you post it and you can add back in after that.

We will see how it works - beware, combat has started.

How does everyone feel about how that combat went? I've not run a message board game before and certainly not played with these sort of house rules.

I thought it went ok and I think as we get a feel for what we can expect with each post, we will get better at it.

You will notice that there is an advantage in being the defender, because the aggressor has to list his intention and go for it, while the defender can read the action and make a counter action. That's ok. I don't mind it.

Anyone have anything they would like to critique or suggest?

I think it went pretty well, overall. I admit it'll take some getting used to, but it's not that weird.

It'd be nice to be able to have a better idea of what goes on each round, because I was worried about having to write a ton of contingency plans depending on what's going on. For Niko it's not too bad, he only has a few viable options most of the time, but I imagine it could get hectic for the others, who have more options going on.

However, I have to say I'd prefer it if I'd actively noticed the men leave rather than just not seeing them afterwards. If they Stealthed out, that's fine, but even so, a Perception check would've been nice--along with a chance to, perhaps, give chase? Though their escape makes sense, all things considered, and I'm not complaining.

Eighteen posts in, several of them mine, and I've already cloven through a baddie's skull and gotten to really like this game!

I really like this game so far! Nice interactions and good posts from all of you. Now I only need to get Yasmin over her urge to move as fast away from the bar as possible ;-).

Regarding the combat, I see one major thing I like and several that I don't. We will see how it evolves.

The good
The complete combat is handled in just five posts, instead of four posts per round.
The i go - you go feeling is gone

The room for improvement
It is hard to imagine what is really going on, for instance:

Yasmin, the two men around you attempt to manhandle you out of the bar, and you become entangled, losing your move action during the first real round, but are able to break free of their grip.

The way I read this was that I had suddenly lost them and was not threatened by them anymore; therefore the attempt at my wand came as a surprise. Not complaining, just thinking that Yasmin would not have gone for the wand if they where that close. Turned out well though.

Knowing in advance what the actions of the opponents are makes the combat very predictable. Suggestion: place the opponent's attacks and damage rolls under a spoiler. That way it is clear that the damage was already rolled (which is always good if you roll 3 crits in a row).

The thing I am unsure of
Their stat block. On one hand i probably would have known that it would take more then one successful sneak attack to kill them (1d6+2d8 vs 18hp). One the other hand it makes combat more of a numbers game.

Other
I was not wearing my armor, so AC was only 14. However I also think that the attempt on my wand was a disarm attempt and therefore went against CMD (=18), correct?

Skill checks: some skills are always "active" in my opinion (perception / sense motive / knowledges), however I do not think it makes sense to make all these checks in each post I make. Can I suggest that the DM rolls these checks when they come up? And that the standard is take 10, unless I am in a combat situation?

Turned out to be a slightly longer post than I intended. Major thing to take away: I enjoy myself immensely with you all!

Last remark: please do not hesitate to post anything you would like me to change in the way I run Yasmin. I will at least consider every comment.

Thanks for the suggestions everyone. I'm trying to formulate a little better system for combat.

I've been a player in two games, and both crumbled due to how long combat too.

Five players roll initiative, then the winner takes two days to take his turn. The second player gives up looking for a day. The third player can't take his turn until he gets a question answered. Half of everyone misses.

By the time you get through it, you forgot what the game was about.

As far as posting statistical numbers, this is my policy. You can't completely trust them. I can roll contested sense motive checks vs. bluff and if I win, the enemy has the capacity to pretend he has more or less hit points to disguise his ability. AC is generally always given though. For me, personally, it fosters immersion because it is a clear gauge of how hard it is to hit someone. If you have ever done any boxing, you might realize that the difficulty to hit a guy is something you can feel out within seconds. If I play coy with giving you, the player, that knowledge about an NPC you can't imagine how well the enemy is moving or how armored he is as well. It is all in relation to your character's stats.

To warn you, you might have to accept that I'm going to take some liberties with describing outcomes to you, in order to keep the pace of play a little quicker. Feel free to do the same, so long as it is in the spirit of the narrative.

Big compliment: You strive to improve your game while also listening to your players.

Warning: I was editing my previous post when you where posting yours., you might not have read it all.

And as long as the game improves and you are not railroading us I do not care with taking liberties. The story is more important then the rules.

Yasmin, I will roll any contested stealth checks that come up for you. If you want to search for something, you should tell me. That doesn't mean you should say you are making a perception roll every post, just when you are looking for something.

With knowledge, you can ask me if you know about something, and make a roll, representing your character thinking it over, but I don't want to constantly write a lot of background into every post. To split the difference with you, I will try to be more descriptive, especially with named NPCs.

I'm still adjusting to the whole system of Play By Post. I like the spirit of experimenting on how to make combat flow. It may take me a while to find the right rhythm of how to post, and what contingencies to put in. I could imagine that sometimes trying to see 3 rounds into the future will be tricky...but I don't have any judgement yet on whether or not it's a good adaptation. For now I'm merely curious.

On that note, my latest post is an experiment: breaking out 4 short (or longer) sections, to represent several distinct conversations had as we walk.

Feedback welcome as always.

My overall feedback is that I'm intrigued by what's begun, and find y'all's characters and roleplaying compelling. I think this'll be a good time.

BTW, this is my character sheet. It's my first Pathfinders one, and I used a template I found on here.

I'm enjoying it as an easy, live-updatable, sheet that calculates everything from my current HP to my encumbrance to (with a single click, now that I've configured it) how all my stats and bonuses change when I enter my Holy Fervor. I'm intending to keep it current as to Oneidros' state.

If it's not clear to any of you (especially Cranefist!) please ask. I found it had a slight learning curve but I'm now a fan.

Oneidros, yes, I saw your sheet the other day. It took me a second to find the buttons but it is pretty clear. I'm trying to find a way to lower your stats... (j/k).

Everyone

Next fight I want to change the rules a little. I was over ambitious with the 3 rounds of moves. You guys are pretty quick to post and seem to post daily, so we can do one round per turn around the table.

I do not want to penalize those of you that put points into raising your initiative modifiers, but I see initiative as the main problem in keeping it going.

This is the solution I'd like to use.

Initiative is based on posting order. If you want to act first, act first. If an NPC is classified as hostile, I will continue to post his AC at least, and always his Initiative modifier.

If any NPCs fighting against the party have a higher initiative bonus that any PCs, all NPCs with a higher bonus get an extra standard or move action on their first turn, and first turn only, to represent their superior timing.

Likewise, if any PCs have higher initiative bonuses than all NPCs fighting them, they get an extra standard or move action on their first turn.

If you suffer enough damage that you are dropped before you get your first turn due to people posting ahead of you, you are out, no matter your modifier.

If you come up into a situation with a bunch of hostile rogues, I would encourage you to kill them, especially the fast looking ones, quickly.

It will be up to each of you to make sure that me and all other posters have taken one turn before you post your next one. While you might not be ready for an action, you can always post story elements.

If 24 hours passes from the time of your last action, you get another action, even if everyone hasn't gone yet.

Is this acceptable to you all?

That combat system sounds pretty good to me, Cranefist. Several games I've been in use a similar idea. I think it'll work especially well in a game with few players like this one (I know we're looking for a fourth, but considering so many PbPs have 6+ players, it seems kinda small).

I'm leaving for a weekend trip with my wife. My posting will be less seldom, but I'm most likely going to be on at some point. Enjoy continuing to RP.

Have a good trip!

As far as the combat system, like I said, I'm new to PBP and happy to experiment. The system you described sounds practical in terms of keeping things going. In terms of supporting various character styles, I'd imagine that surprise rounds & attacking first in the round are particularly important for Yasmin, since it'll allow her her sneak attack damage. (For Oneidros it doesn't matter so much, but he's not a rogue, and already has a low (+2) Init mod.)

Oh and you did say you're kidding...but in seriousness if you have any issue with Oneidros' choice of magic items please do let me know, I'm not at all attached. (Otherwise, hey, just wait til he goes into Holy Fervor and gets +4 to STR, DEX, and CHA!) ;-)

I can always feint to get my sneak attack damage ;-)

To be honest I don't like the idea of first post, first action that much because it puts to much emphasis on player action instead of character action.

Are you familiar with the "block initiative system"?

On your trip: enjoy and do not worry about posting.

Oh, and on the skill checks:

I am very happy if you roll my skill checks when called for. First time for me playing a skill monkey on PbP, getting used to it.

I will announce when I am actively making use of a skill, and you can then decide whether a skill check is in order (and roll it)

In my opinion there are also some skills that are always "active":
Perception, Sense motive and Knowledge come to mind here. I do not want to roll every post for these either, but please keep in mind that Yasmin is rather paranoid at this point in her life and will doubt everything she sees.

I have chosen to not go the overly paranoid way with the other players because that would detract from all our experience. I assumed nobody would mind that bit of metagaming.

Although it always seems very strange to me how a few strangers become very good companions after they just met in a bar...

To be fair, I helped to save your life (or tried to). And Oneidros bought us booze. It's a good way to set up friendships when you're... ♫ADVENTURERS!!!♪

LOL

I agree Elan!

Yasmin, I want to see if I can get you to understand where I'm coming from on initiative so that you don't see it as too gamist. The initiative rule contained within is again, slightly different than before.

First: you are playing your character. Your decisions are her decisions. When you said that she was going to a rooftop, you made that happen because you are playing her. I wouldn't play your turn for you and say, "actually she will have increased visibility from the roof top, especially to anyone that can see through illusions, as climbing won't give her any cover to use her stealth. She would ACTUALLY use stealth and proceed into the nearby building and out the window on the far side, get a disguise, and then work back through the crowd."

Even if I thought that, which I really don't, you get to pick her actions. You wanted her to go to the roof - so she did.

That's actually pretty realistic for combat in my opinion. The decision to act is the decider of initiative in real life, not some combination of luck and dexterity.

Look at this video here: Kick Boxing.

The first kick after they touch gloves, it wasn't because the kicker was faster, more agile, or lucky. It was because he made the decision to act, and his decision to act first, a mental activity anyone could do depending on their willpower and courage, forced the other guy to take to defense.

So my point is this - if you say, out of no where, "Yasmin attacks," it is not gamist or out of character or on the player anymore than usual. It is in fact MORE LIKE real life that she is going first because the will to act is the biggest determining factor in action.

What is not realistic is having every character thinking he is Bruce Lee.

"I attack."

"Ok, roll initiative."

"What?"

Later -

"How did you beat him?"

"Easy... I waited for him to start and then I finished."

Which takes me to my solution regarding the game: I don't want you to be penalized for having a high initiative. The actual effect of a high initiative score in Pathfinder is that at any point doing a fight, if we count up actions taken so far, you are more likely to have taken the same number of actions as your opponent, or one more.

In exchange for losing the high probability that you will get to act first each time against slower opponents, because I may just say, "He attacks with a spell, make a save," with no initiative being rolled - the players or NPCs with the highest initiative modifiers can take an extra partial action if:

A: They did not act first.

B: They are still alive on their first turn.

This extra partial action represents the character's incredible speed and timing, however they only get it once because it is a partial edge that the opponent can adapt to.

I know that was a little all over the place, but what I would like to know is if:

This can satisfy your feeling that acting in posting order is not actually a breach of character autonomy and that the extra partial action, which could be an attack or spell after you have moved (very effective) satisfies your feeling that resources put into having a good initiative score were worth it.

Cranefist,

Thanks for taking the time to react to my apprehension.

I am not quite sold on your method, but am very happy to wait to see how it goes in an actual combat. And be sure that this discussion did not reduce the fun I am having in any way. Instead I really appreciate that you really listen to your players.

Now I just hope that this discussion about initiative did not trigger the next combat like Oneidros did the last time the discussion thread was about initiative ;-).

I think this initiative should work reasonably well, at least for the time being. Let's just make a pact to let Yasmin go first in the first round, so she can get that sneak attack going on! I have monster initiative (+10), but no abilities that rely on that (short of attacking, which is something I'm good at doing).

Thanks Nikomedos,

No pact is necessary, I can feint or flank to get my sneak damage in.

Let's just try the system before we start fixing it (looks in mirror)

Cranefist,

This really feels like an epic campaign! Thanks for running it!

Cranefist,

This really feels like an epic campaign! Thanks for running it!

No problem. I'm enjoying it. :)

Seconding Yasmin's comment! Also, I know that Niko isn't working along with Yasmin here, but he's not the type to lay low in this situation--he's the hero type who wants to help out and find out what's going on and how to stop it.

It's always the same with men, they act first and think later ;-)

Finally updated Nikomedos' gear--he's now got a +1 longsword and a belt of giant strength, those being the two main differences (also a +1 breastplate which I forgot to account for in his profile). A couple of utility items, and also a horse!

BTW, GM Cranefist, do you want me to account for Niko's exact gear and wealth, or is it okay to just say he has general adventuring gear and we can determine at a later time whether or not he'd have something? I'm happy to account for each and every item, it'll just take a bit.

EDIT: I realize my actions in gameplay may seem a little reckless and/or insane. Don't worry--I have a plan!

Nikomedos, no, don't worry about exact gear. I'm not that picky about it in games like this.

If you were first level and this was a dungeon crawl, I'd be picky, but someone in the group at this level could probably just conjure a crowbar if you needed it anyway.

Could you spoiler NPC dice rolls to check if they see through my bluff / disguise / stealth attempts? It is easier to state Yasmin's actions if I really do not know what the opposition knows.

I will roll your sense motive for you automatically against any use of bluff against you, and include what you learn in the flavor text. I may not actually list what I rolled on the dice.

If Abassi saw through your disguise, you would automatically be able to tell unless she disguised her revelation with a successful bluff check. This should make it easier for you to okay your character because your character does in fact know everything I'm writing.

She knows Abassi either didn't see through her disguise or is bluffing without an obvious enough tell.

Teralan, you are in.

Okay. I posted. I reeeeeeeeally hope I cast my spell right...

Teralan, in your post, can you state what you summoned and what you hope the bat can accomplish? Also, there is a post with Kallistos' defenses, so if your bat hits, you can roll damage.

In general, always post your damage, even if you aren't sure if you hit, so that the flow of combat is quick.

Wasn't planning to attack him with the bat *devious giggle*

The spell I ACTUALLY want to cast has an effective range of 160 ft.

Anyway, edited.

Teralan, good stuff.

A review of how we are handling initiative: your character goes when you post. You can post one round of actions, and then again once all 4 other players, including myself, have gone, or 24 hours after your last action. You can make additional posts to talk or RP in the middle of what you are doing, but can't go past that.

Your character doesn't have fly-by attack, so you aren't going to be able to have the bat carry you into harms way, cast the spell, and then all the way back out again safely. I may decide to let Kallistos take an action against you on his next turn.

Unless you have spring attack or a variation, try not to start and end your post with a description of movement, because forcing me to relate that the attack against you was before you moved away and spoke can break the flow of the interactions.

I will research tomorrow what the effect of targeting an artifact in the hands of someone protected by a Globe of Invulnerability. Your attack was a wise move. I hope it works.

Also, when combat resumes, the character or characters with the highest initiative modifiers on the winning side can take an additional partial action on their first turn if they didn't actually go first.

Gotcha. I had some idea on how performing actions worked, just by reading the first page of posts. But there was a good reason why my Recruiting thread was titled 'Cutting Teeth'.

Yeez, can't a person be offline for sleep and work these days?

I made a *very* quick battle map to help me visualize my actions. (What can I say, I'm used to playing with minis.)

It's a Google spreadsheet, editable by any and all. Feel free to use/modify/correct/ignore.

I made a *very* quick battle map to help me visualize my actions. (What can I say, I'm used to playing with minis.)

It's a Google spreadsheet, editable by any and all. Feel free to use/modify/correct/ignore.

That's about right. Thank you.

I want to propose a house rule. I'll only vote if the four of you tie. This is a main house rule I play with in my home games.

Any character can attempt any form of combat maneuver. Even without the feat, they only suffer an AoO if the attempt fails.

This will be useful in the forum game because it prevents you from needing to declare a combat maneuver and then wait for the AoO before carrying out your turn.

If you accept this rule and someone has a combat maneuver feat that they no longer want, you can switch out the feat.

Edit: Until this idea is voted down, consider it in effect. Your next actions can take advantage of it if you like.

Side note, I'm worried about you guys right now. You better bring your A - Game against this guy.

Correct me if I'm wrong; Wizards can only cast their spells once a day, correct? Cantrips are an exception, being allowed to cast them as many times as they please.

Yes. Each day at dawn you get to rememorize your spells. You have a book of spells and from them you select what you can do each day. For example, you might have the ability to cast 3 3rd level spells a day. Your 3rd level spells in your book might be dispel magic, lightning bolt, fly, and summon monster.

So you could pick, at the start of the day, any combination of those spells memorized, even some more than once.

Lightning bolt x2, dispel magic
Dispel magic x3
Lightning bolt, dispel magic, summon monster, but not fly

You should write a spoiler with your spell book and one with your current spells memorized, and keep it posted with each post.