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Dain's Kingmaker Campaign: Provinces - Ariarh

Game Master dain120475

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This Discussion Thread is for the treasure, BP - and other technical details of the province page.

Female Aasimar Druid 7 (Noble)

I just sent you a bunch of emails regarding my cohort which I would like answered as soon as possible, please. Plus, the cohort has golden brown hair so it's not really brown as you described it in your intro post. It's more golden/tawny.

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Bonuses for your Cohort

She may use “war paint” to paint runes on an animal. If she so paints these runes – any animal that has the rune painted on it can enjoy the following bonus.

These bonuses are a “Supernatural Ability” – and stack with any other bonus. They last as long as the pain is on the animal – but she can only have one rune active of each type at a time.

Level 1

Rune of “Skill Focus” – she can apply a rune that gives a +3 to one skill that the beast is proficient in.

Level 3

Rune of “Saves” – she can apply a rune that grants a +1 Bonus to all Saving Throws.

Level 6

Rune of “Armor” – she can apply a rune that grants a +1 Bonus to AC.

Level 9

Rune of “Vitality” – bonus of +1 Hit Point per level.

Level 12

Rune of “Striking” – bonus of +1 to all attack rolls.

Level 15

Rune of “Damage” – bonus of +1 to damage.

Again – any beast may enjoy one of these bonuses a day – or all of these bonuses a day – but no more then one type of rune may be used at a time. They can be refreshed each day in the morning with her prayers.

Please note - your Cohort is the only one that has such bonuses - this is a direct result of your posting; and also because Isani does not gain the advantage of a Cohort. Of course - you can paint runes on more then one beast - but only one rune of each type a day. In other words - you could (theoretically) give Dior a Rune of Vitality - and your own wolf a Rune of Striking - if you were high enough level - but you couldn't give Dior a Rune of Vitality and your wolf a Rune of Vitality as well. Please let me know if you have any questions...

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After Satoru-Nobu has completed his Dojo - he will be sharing the following skill set to any who apply to his "training academy".

It should be noted that most of his best work comes from the use of a Katana - if a sword smith could make him one - he will be of great use to you.

His sheet will be done as soon as possible.

New Feats for Baronies

Soichi Sword Style: This is a style of sword fighting learned and taught by the Soichi line. It involves the katana specifically, and is only effective with that blade.

Bonus: The person who uses a katana, if they use it with both hands, may elect to use their Dexterity Bonus – instead their usual Strength bonus multiplied by 1.5. This style allows the katana to be used as either a “Slashing” or “Piercing” weapon for all feats and abilities that require “Slashing” or “Piercing” as part of a prerequisite.

Requirements: Must be proficient with a katana. Must have the Feat Weapon Finesse. Cannot apply Strength modifier to damage when using the katana. Must use the katana with two hands; and gain only Dexterity modifier to damage – not Dexterity modifier multiplied by 1.5. Cannot use a shield while using this Sword Style.

New Skill Synergy Bonuses for Baronies

Profession: Yojimbo – Yojimbo – literally “Bodyguard. Unlike a standard bodyguard – the Yojimbo learns a particular weapon and uses it very well to protect their master.

Bonus: If you have 5 ranks in Profession: Yojimbo you may add a +1 to Hit and Initiative while wielding your “weapon of choice”. This weapon can be any weapon that conforms to the right style (i.e. – if your weapon of choice is a short sword – any type of short sword will do, provided you are using it).

Special: This can be taken multiple times – if you elect to take it up to 10 ranks – it grants you another “weapon of choice” – and so on.

NOTE: If you are dual wielding your “weapon of choice” – you gain the bonus to both attacks. However – you still only gain a +1 to your initiative while using your weapon. This bonus to Hit AND Initiative is lost the moment you stop using your "Weapon of Choice".

I sent this to Waiph -

First - all you need to do is worry about your Economy Roll; yes.

That is a 1 time action done once a month.

Your Council Members do have actions - and are already taking them. Specifically - they are using their actions to allow you to have an Economy of +20 - instead of something far lower...

Remember - you basically have an entire list of Cohorts - via Council Members. That's a big freebie - so, yeah - just saying.

Next - you do NOT have to roll weekly actions.

You may make 1 "Skill Check" per week to help your barony/nation. This check is specifically anything you can think of creatively - but you can choose the person best suited for the task and "Take 20".

If you want the members of your Council to "Aid" him - they can do so normally, but they have to formally roll an "Aid Check". But if taking a 20 doesn't do it, then you have other issues :)

So - theoretically your Council could help your economy - but not the once a month Econ roll. One member of your Council could attempt to get a special deal set up for smuggling to get some extra gold - that is something you'll need to be creative about, though. But sense you get to take a natural 20 - the limit is pretty much your creativity (and of course some basic secret modifiers. For example - while a paladin may have a better chance at Diplomacy then a Barbarian to set up a contact - if he tries to set up a black market contact - he will have pretty stiff penalties which a barbarian may not have).

Remember - you can only use one skill check a week - basically roll your Economy Roll - see how many BP you get.

Then - subtract Consumption.

Then - collect the taxes for your citizens.

Then - Total your Coin plus BP and then subtract the tax for the nation.

Then - proceed to build!

So - again -

Economy Check
1d20 + 20 ⇒ (17) + 20 = 37

Okay - so I get X BP - then subtract my consumption (C). Then multiply this number by 4,000 to get my total Build Point Gold (BPG) then add to taxes earned (T): then multiply this figure by the tax rate for the capital (20%) - and I'll have my total gold?

Formula: (BP - C) x 4,000 = BPG. (BPG + T) x .80 = Total Gold.

Week 1: Use my Leader's Diplomacy to befriend the GM
Week 2: Use my Magister's Knowledge: Local check to find out why our GM is so weird.
Week 3: Use my Spymaster's Perception Check to figure out what the GM is planning on doing to me next.
Week 4: Use my General's Intimidate Skill to make the GM back off!

Meanwhile - when I have this information, I will use the BP I earned to start building my new buildings.

So - hope that format helps.


Female Aasimar Druid 7 (Noble)

First Month

Economy check: 1d20 + 20 ⇒ (19) + 20 = 39

Good job Ry - what is your current tax rate? I believe you said 5%?

This means that with 3,000 citizens (currently) you have earned the following -

7 BP - 2 Consumption - for a total of 5 BP. Then multiply this by 4,000 GP to get a total for your BGP.

BGP (20,000) + (T = 750 GP). This gives you a total of 20,750 GP.

HOWEVER - as your Grand Council decided to have national Taxes for Saravale a total 20%.

This means you earned a total of 16,600 - sending Saravale a total of 4,150 GP.

This means that for month 1 you just earned 4 BP; and I believe you may have some other BP you did not use...

For Month 2 you are free to add the buildings you have built in month one to your Economy Roll again. But the buildings you made in month 2, you cannot add them until month 3 - and so on.

Remember - the tax sent to Saravale will last a total of 3 months - or two more rolls.

Now is the time for you to put up your weekly questions. Simply tell me who you want to use the skill check in your council - and we shall see what happens.

Female Aasimar Druid 7 (Noble)

National Taxes for Saravale was agreed on 15% and would be adjusted after 3 months.

Grr... okay - then in that case your total Gold for BP and other misc. sundries was - 17637.5 or 17,638 GP earned for BP to spend.

Now all you need do is toss up your weekly natural 20's - made by the appropriate person - to gain your answers to any skill you want a natural 20 in.

Hey - I erred on the coin you should have earned for taxes.

You should have actually earned a total of 2,250 GP in taxes. Since we already did the math and said you had only 750 in taxes - go ahead and add a total of 1,500 to your current treasury for this month.

Sorry - my bad.

I realise the taxable workers in my province is 750 families (1/4 of 3000 citizens) and you multiplied that figure by 3 for 3 months, but are we actually paying 3 months of tax in advance to the capital? Please clarify.

Vandora Province wrote:
I realise the taxable workers in my province is 750 families (1/4 of 3000 citizens) and you multiplied that figure by 3 for 3 months, but are we actually paying 3 months of tax in advance to the capital? Please clarify.

Two things -

1. You do not pay the tax for three months in advance. You pay the current taxes for your population each month. Remember - each month that you build something you will have more citizens, and more taxes earned.

I erred in how much taxes you should have collected - that was why your taxes were so low. I suggested your Taxes would equal 750 Gold - that was because my math was wrong. Actually - your taxes would be 2,250 gold.

However - I made so many mistakes in how much you owe Saravale this month that I pretty much just said "Eh - leave it alone - but give her the extra 1,500 gold she should have earned". So basically you have already sent the taxes to Saravale - and you now have an additional 1,500 GP in your treasury, because it was my bad.

2. Your town icon is SO CUTE!

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Week 1 : Discuss and get advice from the Treasurer on the appropriate levels of taxation for the people and businesses of Vandora.

Diplomacy with Phinneas Higonbothom: Take 20 for total of 35

"Phinneas, I trust in your business acumen and knowledge of equitable law. I seek advice of the tax I should levy on my people and the businesses established in Vandora. I have currently placed a tentative rate of 5% on the workers of the province. As yet I have no levy for the businesses in my lands. I look to you to give me honest word on the best levy to charge in order to run my lands effectively and keep my people content."
Week 2 : Get an account from the Warden of the state of the militia.

Diplomacy with Satoru: Take 20 for total of 35

"Satoru, I seek an account of the city guards you are organising for Vandora. How many guards have you employed and do they have the necessary weapons and gear? How goes their training? Do we have enough soldiers?"

Once Ariarh can get an idea of what the state of her militia is then she can write a letter to Delain in Western Brevoy and request weapons, armor and alike to purchase through their trade agreement. And then send a letter to her father, Riordan Kane, in hopes of purchasing mounts for her soldiers.
Week 3 : Clarify treaty with Fey

Pan's Diplomacy with the Fey: Take 20 for total of 28

Ariarh will ask her Grand Diplomat, Pan the Faun, to travel into the Fairy's Nest (where he hails from) and speak to the Fey on her behalf to seek a treaty or alliance so they can exist peacefully side by side. Ariarh will ask Pan to pass along her promise that she will not touch their land or destroy their home in exchange for allowing her people safe passage through or no harm to her people or foreign ambassadors on their borders.
Week 4 : Check lands/borders and determine if there are threats of any kind and decide how to resolve the problems.

Diplomacy with Kyras Starym: Take 20 for total of 35

Ariarh will speak with her Marshall and have him and his patrol guards take stock of what creatures and/or threats exist across her barony (currently 2 hexes) -- she will ask Kyras to compile a report, naming the creatures/plants discovered and possible threats and solutions.

"Kyras, I need you and your patrol to ride out and take a look at my lands for there has been trouble in the past with dangerous Fey, Undead creatures, a large fell crow and angry treants. I will not allow my people to be put in danger, especially from those we are unaware of. I will need to know what you discover and solutions to eliminate or reduce the threat. This is an information gathering mission and I do not want you or your men to engage any said creature if you come across them. Have you enough men to patrol the forests of our province?"
Ariarh is awaiting the arrival of her four hatchling griffons her father has dispatched. She will rear and train them in hopes of utilising them for reconnaissance and air patrols. She will write to her parents again, advising them of her barony and hopes.

Dain: I have created avatars and a simple profile for all my Council members. You have their sheets. Over the next few days I will put up their combat stats, feats, traits etc. But least they have an id on the board for now.

This will take me some time as I am a bit sick - but you should have your answers soon :)

I should add - that though Ry is very successful at being diplomatic with her peeps - having her peeps use skills may have been a bit more practical.

So - for example - in question 4 when you wanted to seek out threats and Solutions - you might have used your Marshal's Survival Roll to check out the terrain for such threats; knowledge: Nature to deduce what kind of elements are in the threats; Perception to "Scout out" the threats - that sort of thing.

As it is now - your peeps will go about their business and do the best that they can. Don't worry - I will take care of the nuances for them this month - but for next month, just keep those details in mind and don't worry - you're doing fine :)

Edit: Just saw your avatars! Completely blow away! Very good stuff - some excellent news will be coming with your answer tonight :)

Sorry about that -- Still learning the ropes and I continue to make mistakes. I will be mindful of that in the future. Thank you.

And thanks re the avatars. :)

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Phinneas is happy to meet with you.

”Well madam – the fact of it is – your entire tax system is simply terrible… er… that is to say… there is plenty of room or improvement,” he quickly amends.

”First – you need to divide your barony property into three things: business, civil service and residential… he says – and you believe that he will be suddenly granting you a rather long, complex and very confusing mathematical formula to calculate money.

Instead – he came up with something different.

For all Profession totals for collecting coin via taxes – Phinneas is able to bump your Profession scores from 15 to 25. Good times – very easy – and so glad I don’t have to worry about showing you the 2 pages of notes that I wrote up, then I decided not to use. Whew, right?

Phineas suggests that he can give this information to the entire nation – but it will take 1 month before this form of “special tax” is fully able to be distributed to the nation; if you wish it.

Week 2

”Ah – thank you sire,” he says bowing low.

”I should say I am not well pleased with your current military standing. They are – in my opinion – very poorly organized.”

He ponders a moment…

”Before I can best answer the question on how to organize your military forces; the fact is that I need to know what style of military you want.”

His desire is to know what kind of fighter you want. If you prefer a “Strength” Based fighter – he will advise you on the best weapons, armor, and gear. In your case he would recommend a “Dexterity Based Fighter”, however. Not only because samurai in his clan can use Dexterity with katana, - but also because if you create soldiers with levels in “Ranger” – then they would have excellent ability at “Stealth, Acrobatics, and Ranged Weapons” as well as “Weapon Finesse Weapons”. If you wanted “Knights in shining armor” – a Strength based fighter is better. He leaves the decision up to you – but once he knows – he will advise you better – you can answer as a follow-up as a “Free Action” for this month.

Week 3

Pan will take the entire month to return. When he does – he informs you of the following conditions of the treaty – if you are willing.

One: You must leave one “hex” on your barony forested; no road, no farms on it as your side of the treaty.

Two: You will be able to gain the following advantage at this time. Friendship! Any magical gear that has a “nature” element to it (Druidic Robes, wands with Nature Spells, or Fey subtypes, or that use Druid Spells – and so on) – will be for sale at a flat rate of 25% off to your barony.

Week 4

”Begging your pardon ma’am – we believe that we can surround the forest with scouts – but based on the history you’ve brought up – there may be some sort of magical or mysterious variable within the forest itself; we won’t know how big the forest is, not really – unless we travel within it. And if we do that – well, there’s no knowing how big that forest may be… you know, because of the magic. Again – we can ride patrols around the forest to watch for any predatory assaults, and will do so – but if I may make a suggestion for next month?

”When Pan returns – see if he can amend your contract so that Fey Folk who live in the forest can give you tips on if any of them bad guys invade. If you he’s as good a diplomat as you are ma’am – I think he can make sure the police the forest for us, and grant us warning directly without any cost to our own resources. To finalize that negotiation will likely take about week of your time next month – but I think it could be worth it – if you send your diplomat again,” he says with a curt, though polite, bow.

As an aside - your Council feels strongly and unanimously that both your Town Icon picture is almost as cute as your little wolf pic :)

Satoru bows and adds another comment -

"Ah - apologies, sire - I forgot! All of my own folk have sworn absolute loyalty and to live and die for your seed! Of course," he says somewhat apologetically "This number is small - and of them only 25 of them are vassals that can move to a field as proper soldiers."

He seems a bit embarrassed at this news -

"They are called, Yojimbo. But they shall serve you loyally and to the death - if need be," he says with a low bow.

"Do not fear - in these matters, I shall attend to all particular details..." he responds.

Week 2 continued ...

With Satoru (Free Action):

"Satoru, with the abundant forests surrounding the Temple of the Elk I believe that a "dexterity based fighter" is more suitable for my needs and those of my people."

"And regarding your 25 strong and loyal vassals, the Yojimbo, I would be honoured to have them serve me and my lands. I will in turn provide them with a home and a community they can be proud of."

Dain, regarding the first condition of the treaty with the Fey, the one “hex” on my barony which must remain forested; no road, no farms on it to show good faith on my side of the treaty, can this be the hex which contains the Fairy Nest itself? I did mention that (though not quite definitively) in my conversation with Pan the Faun before he journeyed back into the Fey forest.

To Kyras,

"I shall have a word to Pan regarding your practical solution for policing of the forests within our province. Next month, I will certainly have him return to the Fairy Nest with my agreement not to develop the land on which they have made their homes and put forward a mutual protection policy. Thank you, Kyras."

Can you clearly state/clarify what Phinneas will be doing for me and the province re taxation. You kind of lost me in your explanation in ooc. Thanks.

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Satoru bows low.

Hai Kane-sama,” he says.

”Sire – if you would permit me? I would see the commission for this project in the form of the weapon of our people – the katana. Such a weapon is very useful – and would do much to aid us; for it allows the use of finesse style attacks, and – as it is not a mere “hacking” weapon, but slicing – when the dojo we are constructing is finished – we can expect to have our students be able to apply what talents they have with Dexterity to hit – as well as damaging their enemy.”

He pauses – considering.

”As you have a contact in the northlands who can produce these weapons – I would ask that he produce therefore 400 such blades – and wakizashis as well. Further – I would also ask that he produce 400 compound bows – and 5,000 arrow. As for armor? For now – studded leather, accompanied by the dastana should be enough for our warriors. I would ask for an additional 400 of those sets of armor for your men.”

This is a costly venture – but if you are willing; remember – you will be getting a large discount. If you buy more then these numbers – you may also elect to begin training Kae’s scouting forces at Satoru’s dojo – at cost, of course; and provide him with these arms and armor – at the usual rates. As you are getting them at discount – this will allow you the chance to make a profit on them.

Fairy Nest Question

I totally forgot about that – but have been hoisted by my own lack of memory! Actually – it not only can be – but it makes sense that it should be. Indeed – if you leave the Fairy Nest untouched – that will work for your trade contract – no problem.

Kyras bows low before you, and prepares for his next activities.

Yeah – as for Phineas? Well – to be fair, I started writing out this really long and complex system of tax laws – granting you extra bonuses for the type of building, and sub-dividing bonuses by way of if the building was “residential”, “commercial” or “civic service” – then I started re-reading my own math and was like “Argh! No – this is too complex for me and I’m writing it - it will only confuse things. Let’s just keep it easy and simple.

So yeah – instead of having your citizens earn 15 GP a week – now they earn 25 a week – or 100 GP a month per household – instead of 60 a month per household. When you reach 1,600 citizens you will actually be able to collect around 2,000 GP at only 5% taxes. If you take the standard 10% taxes – you can even earn 1 BP a month due to nothing but taxes – once you have that many citizens and raise the taxes.

With the compound bows Satoru is requiring, what is he specifically after: longbow composite or shortbow composite?

And I cannot find the cost of the Dastana in the Pathfinder SRD, but found reference to the cost of them in the D&D Arms and Equipment Guide. That states the cost as 25gp. Is this correct?

If we first look at the total "raw" cost of the weapons and armor Satoru is asking for:

if it includes longbow composite, the total is 94,250gp
with shorbow, composite, the total is 84,250 gp.

Then factor in the Trade Agreement with the Esserians and the bulk amount purchased, Ariarh would get 50% discount with the longbow order and 40% discount with the shortbow amount order.

Then the cost will end up being:

with longbow composite order: 94,250gp less 50% (47,125 gp)= 47,125 gp
with shorbow composite order: 84,250gp less 40% (33,700 gp)= 50,550 gp

Are my calculations correct?

[Cost break-down:
Studded leather = 400@25gp
Dastana= 400@25gp
5000 arrows = 250gp
Longbow, composite = 400@100gp or Shortbow, composite = 400@75gp]

Vandora Province wrote:

With the compound bows Satoru is requiring, what is he specifically after: longbow composite or shortbow composite?

And I cannot find the cost of the Dastana in the Pathfinder SRD, but found reference to the cost of them in the D&D Arms and Equipment Guide. That states the cost as 25gp. Is this correct?

The cost of the Dastana should be about 20 GP, I thought. It adds +1 to AC - however; the real benefit is that it can be stacked on top Studded Leather with no penalty. Therefore, a character with Studded Leather and Dastana has a base of 14 to AC - not counting his Dexterity bonus; and is still considered wearing "light armor" for all special bonuses granted to people in "light armor".

Longbow would be preferable to shortbow; but that decision is up to you. Longbow being more expensive - but having better range.

Finally - Satoru has his heart in the right place - but that is pretty expensive!

Recommendation: Consult with one of your merchants (via treasurer for basic cost analysis) or throughout the neighboring realms (via Diplomat for specific skills outside your nation) to find out if you could sell this gear to anyone first. That way - if you can sell it, you'll find out how to offset costs, and possibly make a profit on it.

How many city guards does Ariarh have under Satoru? He said he has 25 vassals who are willing to serve and die for her, but I am unsure if this is the entirety of her city forces.

And to clarify, Ariarh does not have to purchase 400 sets of all these things if she chooses not to, right?

Well the first question is a bit complicated, but not too much.

Currently – there is a big difference between Satoru’s vassals and city guards.

First – the vassals. His vassals would equate to (roughly) a 25 point buy character – level 1 Yojimbo style ronnin – or another version of the samurai class. They are all specifically his vassals, which means they have already “passed the test” of loyalty needed, and have already sworn (to his satisfaction) loyalty to him. He has sworn loyalty to you – so where he goes, they go.

You are – in effect – a [url=]Daimyo[/ur]. And Satoru is a [url=]Hatamoto. Because all of this Japanese culture stuff will probably make your head explode: a “Daimyo” is like a “Noble Lord” – and a “hatamoto” would be like a very important knight – not just regular knights, but ones with very specific and special rights that rank and file minor noble knights wouldn’t get.

FYI - if you read the links; pay most attention the "Edo" period, that's the period I am utilizing. However - it's pretty complex reading about Japanese history. It's interesting if you want to learn about how I'm running the majority of the "samurai" culture - but you don't really need to read it, it's just interesting reading generally. But I don't want you to worry if it is a lot of extra stressful reading. It's all good either way.

His vassals are from his people mainly – and some folk from Osirion that he trusts. As such – whenever you deal with a vassal – you gain a +4 to all Diplomacy Rolls with them. Further – if any enemy attempts to try to manipulate a vassal using a skill check to subvert you – they suffer a -4 penalty, on top of all standard penalties.

Part of the responsibility of a lord is that he/she must provide their vassals with an income to live. Saturo is responsible for providing for the vassals with his own income. His income is provided for by you. Typically – a lord (in this case: you) would pay provide the vassals with their starting equipment via weapons/armor and (if applicable) a mount.

This is something Satoru must take care of from the money you give him – he’ll have to figure it out.

However – he wants to expand your guard to be more then 25 vassals. He prefers to have a company of about 200 – 300 vassals; mainly because that’s pretty fracking sweet. But it’s only a recommendation. Such things cost money, and you may not have it now. Vassals are more expensive – a standard vassal earning about 100 GP a month (again – he is paying for his 25 vassals out of his own pocket – and their equipment – also out of his own pocket).

This take us to city guards.

Like Kae – you can have as many guards as you wish. They are much cheaper and lower quality than “vassals”. A city guard typically has an 18 point buy – and 1 level in a starting class. They generally earn about 14 GP a week – but if they are full time guards that would translate into roughly 50 GP a month (which is reasonable) per guard; plus their base equipment.

As such – you determine how many guards you want. Having 100 of these guards will probably cost you about 500 GP a month – and 50 GP for starting gear. Relatively cheap, though not very good.

Remember, though – you a massive amount of “free money” to use for just this sort of thing; with the money you have for “Sundries” – you could probably afford to equip 100 vassals – plus yearly pay – and about 200 guards – Plus equipment. As a bonus – if you pay for a whole year up front – your peeps will only need to have to be paid for 10 months – not 12; so it’s more expensive up front, but easier on your math and account later.

If you bought them all up front – it would cost you 10,000 GP for 100 vassals – 10,000 GP for 200 guards not counting their equipment – for the entire year.

You may not want to do that now – you may want to hold off on the vassals completely and pay only 6 months for the city guards (if you pay 6 months in advance, you get one month free – so you’re really only paying 5).

In other words – if you picked 200 guards – paid them for 5 months – you’d only have to pay them 5,000 GP plus their equipment (which you pick; but you have to pay for it).

The only thing I’d need from you is a quick breakdown on how you want your guard. Ranger, fighter, whatever – and how you want the points spread. Once you do that for one guy – it is assumed they are all like that – unless you do what Kae did – and create “specialty troops” – which you can do, but is a bit more time consuming.


1. Encourage your Treasurer to find buyer’s for weapons – act as the middleman and start making some profit from business deals.

2. Don’t worry about vassals for now – they are better; but more expensive. Get some cheap guards – pay for them for about 6 months – see where your money is from there.

3. Do what you can to “promote” your town. Try a little PR to get people to come to the town. Who knows – it may help. You do have some unique things in your town to offer…

4. Start asking questions that you are personally interested in through the right channels. You want griffons? What can you do to make it happen faster? You want to know what the deal is with the misty woods? Do what you can to ask through the right channels. Who was that mysterious and completely normal woodsmen who helps you? Well – ask your council to find out! They may give you the right answers. Is there anything a Druid can do to improve her “income” level? Ask the right people – you never know – there are a few things you can do; just pick the right skill. What the hell is up with the mysterious swamp – and the spider cave – and the guys from Ustalav – those questions have been driving you nuts for over year – isn’t there way you can just a quick “straight answer” without having to ask a million questions? Sure – just tell me what you want to know – and it will happen.

So – as they same – game’s to you :)

So now I have to design my city guards? In that I mean I have to stat them up? Sigh. This is becoming more a task than fun. I have enough characters to keep track of already. I will think about this.

Hmm... Well, I don't want you to be stressed. That was never my plan.

Perhaps I can give you a few suggestions for the city guards to make things a little easy. Remember, I won't do it all - but the suggestions may help you a bit.

First - Satoru's vassals are finished - I will send you a quick "sheet" on them soon, if you like. Or - if you don't want one - that is okay, too. I should add that they are all golden kobolds.

As for your city guards - I hoped it would be simple by saying you only have to worry about a general breakdown in an 18 point buy.

A quick suggestion might be:

If they'r standard humans (I assume they are for sake of ease) - this would give you a very basic break down. If they are Dex style fighters - I'd recommend the following:

Str: 12 - 2 points
Dex: 14 - 5 points +2 to Dex for being human
Con: 14 - 5 points
Int: 12 - 2 Points
Wis: 12 - 2 points
Cha: 12 - 2 points

I'd pick "Ranger" as your type of guard.

Then - I'd be a real jerk and say "mister GM - prepare to be screwed!"

I would have 200 of these guards.

100 of them would be "Urban Rangers". Their favorite terrain would be your barony (of course).

They would have the following "Class Skills" - 6 +1 for Int. +1 for Human:

Knowledge: Local

Non Class skills I would add

For feats I'd have "Weapon Finesse" - and I'd also give them "Deadly Aim" (humans have 2 feats). Favorite enemy would probably be "human"; as you probably have mostly humans in town for now to police.

For 50 more of your Rangers's - I'd make them personally responsible for the forest where the Fey live.

I'd do the same stats.
I wouldn't give them any archtype.
I'd keep all their skills - switching only:

Knowledge: Local - with Knowledge: Nature
and I'd swap Ride with Handle Animal (as they'll probably be on foot in the woods anyway).
Favorite enemy I'd swap to "Fey" - as you may run into "Evil Fey" in the woods.

Finally - I'd make a specialty group of "Outriders" to patrol and scout the far reaches - this is the last 50 of your guys, and will also need to buy them horses - so I wouldn't put too many of these guys - but enough that they can patrol in shifts.

I'd use the Trophy Hunter Ranger Archtype for this - because it is great for tracking - and it would give you access to firearms if these jokers ever made it second level - which would drive the GM nuts - but you could laugh and say "Hell, weren't you the one who designed these guys?" and I'd have to sit there and take it! :)

Meanwhile - I'd swamp "Weapon Finesse" with "Mounted Combat" for feats.
As for skills - I'd have the following class skills:

Handle Animal
Knowledge; Nature

And I'd take Diplomacy as well; in case you bumped into people on the road you want to play with nice with. But I did that with all your guards, so if they met people, they could at least be likable, despite their modest charisma.

For "Traits" they only have 2 - but in your case I'd give them all at least the "faith based trait: Indomitable Faith" - which gives them a +1 to Willpower saves - pretty handy.

As for gear? Well - I'd give all your guys scimitars and studded leather. I'd give your mounted men short bows for the first six months - petition the GM to bump them to level 2 after 6 months - then give them a musket and a long sword (sense they won't be using finesse weapons; and if they fight on foot - they'll want to have the potential for extra damage).

Anyway - that is just me. Of course - you'll have to pay for their equipment - but that can be done with not too much cost. As citizens - I'd say they all have half of their starting GP to buy equipment; you could supplement the rest.

Naturally, this still leaves you with the task of picking a second trait; and figuring out equipment (assuming you like this suggestion).

If you do - you are free to keep the men as they are.

And, as a bonus - you can stat out 3 "second level" officers at 25 point buy - one for each group. Of course - that's entirely up to you, though; and you don't have to do it. Also - you may have other ideas - like picking up half-elf instead of human for some of the Fey scouts - and dropping the extra feat and skill point; replacing them with something else.

These are only suggestions; but I don't want you to be stressed, and as it seems like I am having little to do in the pirate game, I think I'll have more free time in this game now.

Please let me know what you think, by the way; and - if you can - if you're available for a Skype chat. No pressure, just haven't talked to you in a bit.

Okay - have a good night!

I have no idea where you think I have all this gold to do all these things when Satoru wants me to spend more than I have in my treasury for 400 sets of everything! I have paid him 6000gp on top of the 1000gp for his wage for the year ... and now I have to find more gold for all his grand schemes which I haven't signed off on. I may not purchase all 400 sets of everything -- my call after all, for I have other people to pay and taxes etc as well as the need to build so my province doesn't stay a shanty town.

I need to work some math magic because I need to materialise my own gold mine at this rate. I cannot spend money I do not have basically.

This whole thing will take me time and right now I don't have much of it. Thanks for the info above -- it goes along with some of my own ideas but I will tweak it to suit my needs.

These days we spend more time on the math and very little time using said characters in any real social setting. I don't like that - it's not my thing or my idea of fun (but you already know this about me).

p.s. Re Satoru's vassals - please send the information/sheets when you're ready.

I do appreciate the help you have given me, however. I don't mean to sound like some whiny child with my frustrations. Thank you, Dain.

Now, with the current set up of how you want us to do only four skill checks a month, I don't know how or where to fit in trying to persuade/invite the apemen to make Vandora their home if they so choose.

It seems the current structure is strict and inflexible (at least in my opinion) with playing out anything that does not involve the one task per week in the barony creation.

Ariarh would not delegate this out to anybody because the apes are not trusting folk and they know her but not her councilmen. So, it makes sense that she approach them personally.

Please clarify what I can do in game at any time given this foray into barony creations because honestly I have no clue.

I started writing a response - it was long, so I decided to just put it in an private message. I hope that is okay.

That is okay. I'll keep an eye out for the pm. Thanks.

Got your pm and read it.

I will be considering Satoru's request for armor and weaponry etc but not at the amount he is requesting because it seems rather ridiculous and also the other baronies may not be relying on/recruiting dex-based fighters nor requiring dastanas and other eastern weaponry, so trying to sell them after spending money I do not have seems like a gamble Ariarh would not take, especially with limited funds. She may need to rp this out further with her Treasurer but even now I have no idea what tax rates he has suggested I'd take on because you said it was too complicated and long to rp so I'm stuck with the simple 5% on residents and I believe Ariarh negotiated 10% of Phinneas' own income for the first three months (then to go up to 15%) to set up shop in her barony. So what rate for businesses and civil services?

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Well - remember; Satoru was just offering a suggestion. It is very expensive, in the long run it would be wise - but he would agree; not if you don't have the funds. Right now - that cannot happen; so it's good.

He would be happy if he could get those things for his own vassals, but understands if you cannot do it. Naturally - he would pay for the equipment out of his own funds.

For himself, though - he would like a "masterwork" katana; masterwork Dastana and a masterwork breastplate - all of which he will pay for.


Okay - regarding the tax rate - this was supposed to be easy; but I seem o have made things complicated.

While it was true I had devised a very complex tax rate - I ended up throwing out the entire system because I felt it was too complex and wanted to just make it easy. The mentioning of the "civil services" verse "residential/Commercial" was supposed to give you a taste of the complication - but I had not done it.

Instead - what I did was much more simple (I thought). Currently - whatever you tax your citizens - you assume that you they are a family of four (divide your population by 4) - and you have one primary "wage earner".

I assumed that he would "Take 10" on Profession and with a base profession check - gain a 15 - earning him 15 GP a week - or 60 GP a week per family.

Instead - to keep it easy - I now it make so instead of "Taking 10" they can "Take 20".

This means that all of your "wage earners" now earn 25 GP a week - and 100 GP a month.

Whatever tax rate you set is multiplied NOW by - "Wage Earners for the Barony" x "100 GP" per month and not "60 GP" a month.

So if you had 4,000 citizens - that is 1,000 wage earners.

They used to earn 60,000 GP a month - now they would earn 100,000 GP a month.

That means if you taxed 10% that month - you'd earn 10,000 GP in taxes, as opposed to 6,000 GP in taxes.

So - again - all your treasurer did was ensure that each "wage earner" took home 100 GP a month instead of 60.

So when you find the amount of wage earners - multiply them 100 GP a month - and when you set your "Tax Rate" for your barony - you basically can earn more money at no penalty to you.

So that's pretty much all he did - just make sure that the wage earners now earn 100 GP a month, and not 60.

Again - I apologize for the confusion - I hope this makes it more clear.

The vassals sheet should be coming soon.

I don't care about the residential tax payer right now (as I've charged them 5%). I have that worked out. I'm concerned about what rate to charge business and civil services.

1. You wouldn't charge civil services anything - you're already paying them - that would be like giving them a 100 gold a month, then taxing them 10% - you may as well just give them 90 GP a month.

2. Businesses are completely different. You aren't taxing them at all - in any way. You haven't currently set any specific or special Tax Rates for business - but you haven't allowed or created any special businesses.

For example - if you created or allowed the creation of a Casino - you could do what "Alaric" did - which was to tell DeVille "Hey - you want a Casino? Fine - you can have it - but you have to pay me a "Gaming Liscense of 20,000 GP - plus 10% of the House Take each month".

That's an example of how you can make money from businesses.

As to what kind of businesses you have in the community?

Well - I hate to do this because it feels like I am basically telling players what to do; but - for example:

A. Create a stable -
B. Have Ariarh - a known horse rancher, and expert in horses create a "race track" - then stage bets on horse racing, and make profit that way.
C. Or - encourage someone else to do it - and give them the land for it: but tell them you expect them to treat the horse well; and that you will be taking a commission on their races each month. That way you don't have to pay for the horses - and you don't have to pay for the BP for a "race track" (assuming there is one) - you could just make money each month based on how successful the horse races are.

Another example is that you are a Druid. Druids understand the land, and the earth.

Okay - so maybe you could create a druidic order or shrine - or something to that effect which would allow your druidic acolytes to bless the farms and earn extra yield on any farmland.

Another example is that you are right next to an obviously sacred and important site. You could advertise that via the fact that you border this sacred site - and encourage diplomats and pilgrims who wish to see it to visit. You could encourage your treasurer to build them modest "Hotels" and tell him that you want to take a percentage of his earnings per month - just grant him the land: he has to invest in it - and earns the majority of the coin - but you will get a piece of it for free.

Another example is encourage someone to build a bathhouse - or a Senet House - but tell them to operate you'll have to sell them a liquor license - at cost - which needs to be renewed each year.

There are many more example I could think of - but this is not my barony - and I do not want to tell you what to do. I was merely giving you suggestions. Naturally - you don't have to do any of those things.

But if Alaric can generate 20,000 GP in a week from DeVille (granted it was for a yearly license - plus monthly earnings) - you could be making money too, if you wanted. It is literally a matter of how creative you want to be.

Your only caveat is you can only do 4 of these things per month - I put this stipulation in place because I presumed you and Kae would be doing exactly that - and didn't want things to go crazy. I didn't intend for you to use a "weekly action" to convince the apemen to move in with you because I thought that was a given, and though I don't mind RP'ing it out - I thought these weekly decisions would be the ways to really be working and shaking things up.

Again - the only real limitation is how creative you want to be - it is your barony, after all. I'm not telling you what to do - or how to run it - that's completely up to you. If the above suggestions work for you - the only trick is to use the right person to make them work.

Your treasurer should handle the "Financial details" - your ambassador could handle details with foreign dignitaries (or you could) - your High Priest (or Isani) could be handling stuff with druids or the sacred site - your spymaster could be setting up underground black market operations - or, he could be running a legitimate operation you approve of - and make sure it makes money legally and nicely.

I really don't know what more I can suggest then these options at this time. I feel like I am telling you what to do in the game - and I don't like that. I don't know if you understood my intention on what you could do - I hope this makes things more clear on your options.

Meanwhile - I sincerely hope this helps - and now I am going back to finishing the vassals which you should be getting soon.

I'm still working on the statting of guards and officers and I should get something to you by later today my time or tonight (if I'm running behind schedule).

There's no pressure. This is supposed to be a fun thing - if there is too much; don't worry about it.

Alternatively you could be making little characters for your Druid acolytes and "Grove workers" - or you could make stats for a group of peeps to follow Ry around singing praise songs to her :)

I will be sending you a private message by the way... but it has nothing to do with this game...

I like the idea of Druid acolytes and grove workers. I could make them as well if you're patient with me. Can I also make a druid high priest/priestess? If so, would they be level 3 unlike the acolytes at level 1?

Well - that all depends! Certainly your officers would be level 3 to start - but; you town gains XP - and as the town gains XP.

When your town grows - it actually gains XP - so by the end of the year; she may be higher level.

And who knows - why stop there? You may want to make a cowgirl to run a racetrack - or; you may need a specialist to help your baby griffons grow up strong and healthy - but more on that later.

This may be helpful toward that end...

Good for baby eggs.

I have the last 50 of my rangers to stat.

But I must say that I do not believe Ariarh as a druid would agree to the archetype 'Trophy Hunter' even if it instills advantages re tracking to her rangers. I will think of something else.

Remember - that is only the name of the Archtype - you don't actually have them hunting for sport; you have them hunting the most dangerous game of all... LEGO!


Trophy Hunter also gives your guys muskets - or rifles. Both are good tools later in the game...

Just ask Brett!

The point is, don't worry about titles; it's all about how you play your character, or your people!

Which reminds me, I need to get your vassals statted out soon.

Well, I'll do that as soon as possible - hopefully later tonight.


I still don't like it -- neither would Ariarh. I will think of something else.

What about Ranger with the Musketeer Combat Style? It's an alternate archetype.

Vandora Province wrote:
What about Ranger with the Musketeer Combat Style? It's an alternate archetype.

I noticed that myself. It's okay - but if it was me - I might try Bounty Hunter.

It has a unique class feature which allows you to take in people with no penalty to non-lethal damage. So you can do Max damage, even though all you are doing is knocking someone out.

Pretty handy, I'd say.

Remember - the 3rd Party classes have a lot of variations, too. For example - you may want to cross-class normal ranger with Beastmaster (not the Ranger Archytpe Beastmaster - but the cool kind).

Okay - just a suggestion - now: I must go back to work!

Can I divide the outriders into Bounty Hunters and Beast Masters? I'm supposed to have 50 outriders -- I could have say, 10 Beastmasters and 40 Bounty Hunters, or some such proportion?

I did that with my second group of 50 straight rangers, but based on race -- I had 20 ape-men chimps (looking after/scouting the perimeter of the city/town from up in the trees) and 30 half-elves (overseeing the Fey forest and lands close by in case of travelling or emerging Evil Fey).

Wow, muskets cost a lot. I was not aware they were 1500gp each. (Just got the chance to look at the firearms section in the SRD.)

1. You can absolutely divide your company in the way you see best.

2. The apemen are a bit tricky - most of them can only be level 1; because they are considered "playable races" and few of them are statted out. But they do have some sweet advantages - even on level 1.

3. All firearms cost a lot - the advantage is that you only need to make a "touch attack" which means if an enemy has an AC of 22 because he is wearing +2 Plate Mail; he has no Dexterity bonus. That means his "touch attack AC" is only 10. That means a level 2 Ranger has a 65% chance to hit him with a musket, but only a 5% chance to hit him with a bow (this assumes that the Ranger has no Dexterity modifiers to his attack).

It should be noted that Gunslingers (and Trophy Hunters, for that matter) start the game with their own firearm; though Trophy Hunters don't get it to level 2 (your guards being level 2, that doesn't matter).

That is why I recommended you have some version of Gunslinger; so you can start with it.

There are other versions of "Gunslingers" just like the Ranger - including the "Holy Gun" (A paladin type gunslinger) and also you may be interest in the Teppou-Bushi - an Archtype of the Gunslinger, which may play well anyway with your golden kobolds.

The best thing is to probably cross-class Gunslinger with Ranger. Then you should be good to go.

Wait until you see what Brett is doing! Heh heh heh!

Okay, this is a run down of gold in my treasury:

Starting gold 32,000gp
Earned in Month 1 (after tax to Saravale): 20,638gp
Total of: 52,638gp
Consumption is 5bp to be paid in month 2: 20,000gp
Leaving 32,638gp.

Wages for Council of 10 for the year: 10,000gp
Living expenses/money given to Satoru: 6,000gp

Remaining gold in Treasury: 32,638gp - 16,000gp = 16,638gp + 6bp.

I had 2bp unused from first month and earned another 4bp.

So, I have 6bp to use on building.

Ry uses her 6 bp to build a Graveyard @ 1/2x4bp=2bp and a Monument (Belltower) @ 1/2x6bp=3bp. Total cost 5 bp with 1 bp remaining and placed back in treasury.

Month 2: Economy check : 1d20 + 24 ⇒ (17) + 24 = 41

Control DC: 32

9bp - 2consumption = 7bp x 4000= 28,000gp (BGP)
Population: 3000, that is 750 income earners
5% tax rate in Vandora

You told me that Phinneas bumped up my town's Profession from 15 to 25 but I have no idea what to do with this information as I can't figure out the taxation and rest of formula. Sent you a PM.

Addendum: You also mentioned that the tax we paid to the capital in the first month was for 3 months. So why are we paying the capital again in month 2?

I was trying to follow what Waiph did in Month 2 but his Control DC was 33 and I got confused as to why it changed.

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Excellent! You succeeded Brilliantly.

Now, with your standard rate of taxation being 25 gold pieces per week - that means that the end of the month; you have 750 "income earners".

Each week they earn 25 gold - each month their total gold is 4 weeks; or 100 gold.

With 750 of these people - and a tax rate of 5% - your town made 75,000 GP. However - you took 5% from them - for a total of" 3,750 in taxes.

Add that to your current 28,000 and you have earned (in coin) 31,750 gold.

Regarding your Addendum:

As to the taxes you paid last month - that was 15% (I think that was the number you all settled on; but I can't remember; you may actually be paying less, if so, please adjust the math for the following notes below) for the nation; for each month's earnings, for the first three months.

Month 1 you paid a lot; but you earned a lot.

Month 2 you earned less; but you pay 15% of what you just earned to the capital (roughly 15% of 31,750) - or in other words: 4763 Gold and 5 silver pieces. Again - that is if the tax rate was 15% - if not - things will be much more different.

This would leave you with a total of month earnings of : 26,987 gold pieces - and 5 Silver pieces. Roughly 4 BP in total; with some left-over gold pieces.

You will have to do the same again for month 3; however. But after that - you are free to revisit the National Council to reconfigure debt and taxation for the national levels.

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