"It'll be a challenge to be sure," Akorian notes, "But we can handle it. We've faced Hellknights in the tight confines of Westcrown's sewers. And we rescued Arael from an entire escort of armigers on their way to Citadel Rivad. We can do this. We just need time to prepare and a bit of manufactured luck on our part."
Just checking in to see if you need more info or anything. Carry on.
Set, does your mother-in-law have power yet? Also Zara does well to worry about how darkness-light stacking/interference works. I'm not sure I've quite figured it out.
still no home net access..it seems the main server has been fried..posting from work but access limited so posting may be a bit spotty until things are back to normal
"4 bags and 2 sunrods should be sufficient..the best thing about the rods is they don't go out if you drop one and its easy to pop them in a bag if you want to mask the light."
...Also Zara does well to worry about how darkness-light stacking/interference works. I'm not sure I've quite figured it out.
Here's the rules interpretation as I've managed to understand it...
Spoiler:
Tieflings can inherently generate darkness as a spell-like ability once per day out to a 20-foot radius on any object they touch. That means they target someone at range with it unless they're willing to throw the object that's generating the darkness. Meanwhile, the darkness spell itself states it causes the illumination level in an area to drop one step...from bright light to normal light, from normal light to dim light, or from dim light to darkness.
Now, in a dark area, a sunrod sheds normal light in a 30-foot radius and then dim light in an additional 30-foot radius beyond that. A hooded lantern does pretty much the same thing. The only advantage to a sunrod is that it's not flammable and doesn't require fuel.
Once you overlap these two effects, the net result is that a darkness spell will reduce the light by one category. So, the immediate area around a sunrod or lantern (i.e., the 30-foot radius) will drop to dim light rather than normal light. Dim light grants concealment (20% miss chance) to everyone. And, beyond the 30-foot radius, the light from a sunrod or lantern would drop from dim light to darkness, which grants total concealment (50% miss chance), which is the same as invisibility, which means you'll have to somehow determine what square an opponent occupies before you can target them...and, even then, there's a 50% chance your attack will miss because you can't see them clearly.
This situation gets magnified if we use torches or light spells. Both only provide normal light in a 20-foot radius and dim light out to 40-feet. So, if a tiefling generated darkness on top of us, it would limit our vision to just 20-feet in front of us...and, anything we encountered would still get concealment and a 20% miss chance. Meanwhile, the tieflings won't be bothered with the concealment problem at all...not even from long-range. So, they can sit back and pop us with missile fire without ever having to engage us head-on. And, we won't be able to see them, much less target them unless we hurry forward or corner them somewhere so we can at least get them within the radius of dim light from a sunrod, lantern, or torch. Alternatively, we could cast light on an object that we would then throw in their general direction, but a spellcaster can only have one light spell going at any given time. If he or she attempts to cast another one, the first one winks out.
So, our best bet is to definitely bring along lots of light sources, maybe even a few we can throw ahead of us. And, be ready to charge down any tieflings that present themselves so they can't do hit-and-run tactics on us.
"I have a feeling we'll need more than a few sunrods ... several each, maybe. If we don't use them here, we can always use them against the shadow-creatures, they seem to fear light."
"Marius?" he calls out to the big warrior, "I've done what I can to use my contacts and learn everything possible about the tactics these tieflings might employ against us. But I'm putting my faith in you to plan this raid for us. We've all got talents or information we can provide. Just tell us where best to apply them..."
It's obvious based on his conversations with both Waifrin and Marius that he's intentionally deferring to the warrior in this instance.
Set, does your mother-in-law have power yet? Also Zara does well to worry about how darkness-light stacking/interference works. I'm not sure I've quite figured it out.
All is well, her, her gabby parrot, and the mysterious rodent-in-a-glass-tank that I didn't see are all back in their native environment. :) The nature of darkness appears to reduce ambient light levels by 1 category, and new non-magical light brought into the area doesn't increase light.
Thanks, Neil. So if 50 tieflings jump you and half use their darkness ....
It gets so dark that it goes back around and becomes light again?
Or possibly the universe explodes and we are all accelerated to Warp Eight. Depends on whether or not you are supposed to carry the two...
Dabbler(This IS the internet you know ... Alegedly human Expert (IT) 5/Ninja 3/Witch 7)
now I wish I'd taken control light as a power instead ...
"So, cousin, I propose we sneak into some buildings, secure them and watch the tieflings if we can for a day or two at least. If we can find a way to surprise them, then we do that - if we can, attack from two directions, or else drive them into a trap."
now I wish I'd taken control light as a power instead ... and posting in quick succession in several threads seems to have caused me some identity confusion too!
"So, cousin, I propose we sneak into some buildings, secure them and watch the tieflings if we can for a day or two at least. If we can find a way to surprise them, then we do that - if we can, attack from two directions, or else drive them into a trap."
In another thread, Wellard said posting might be slow for him. His home internet is down. TO keep things moving ...
Marius grunts. "This map is good, thanks, Sclavos. But it doesn't tell us everything we need to know. Waifrin is right, we should scout the ground over there before making a plan of attack."
"Let's go ahead and buy the gear we think we'll need. We can camp in a nearby house and watch the bastards for a few days."
LOL ninjaed by my own GM..that's almost exactly what i was going to say
"Just remember" Marius adds "no plan survives first contact with the enemy..we might have to..improvise so lets not get to wedded to any one train of thought[/ooc]
So does that mean you're off into the Dospera? What time of day will you try to cross? Does anyone have anything particular they want to do in preparation. Will you use the crossing that Waif and Akorian know or will you try another route?
If we aren't breaking curfew, is the Dospora hard to get into? Even if the gate to it is closed we could always go out of one of the other gates and enter the Dospora from outside the city.
"We need to find a back alley I think..then a nearby tavern we can use till near dusk..go over the wall just as it gets dark.. besides we have our new equipment to secure first.."
"I could take care of that I suppose," the elf offers readily. "It should not take me too much time to gather it all. I could go now and I believe I should be back in an hour or two."
Gates to the Dospera are closed at dusk and the walls are patrolled, but it's not too hard to cross anyway. There's a lot of wall for the dottari to cover. There's a popular night-time black market whose name escapes me right now that floats around the Dospera.
If you get caught there will be questions at best, or possibly a trip to the local hoosegow. Technically you shouldn't be breaking curfew or crossing the wall.
Regarding curfew -- reading the Westcrown description again, it seems the dottari are often pretty easy about it, often escorting you home or to an inn rather than hauling you off to jail. Of course a few coins or a pretty face can affect what tack the dottari take.
Crossing the wall at night would be more serious, but something overly testosteroned young men might try on a dare, so again there's a sliding scale of response. If you get caught crossing, I'd advise evaluating the situation before trying to buy your way out.
Waif's idea of going around the outside of the city is also quite feasible. No unseemly climbing and skulking about in shadows, but more wear on the old shoe-leather.
"The less confrontation with the dottari, the better. With every encounter we leave more and more individuals able to recognize us, if not by face, then by gear and fighting style. Going outside of the city walls and around seems preferable to risking yet another pointless dance with foes that tax our resources and will return to vex us again the next day." Zarabeta says, tossing nuts to her raven familiar, who is catching them out of the air.
"We will, of course, be fighting utterly in the dark, and unable to see our foes, if we attack them at night, as there is no amount of artificial light we can bring to bear against their magical darkness. Without the sun as our ally, we must prepare to fight them on their terms."
She's clearly thinking out loud at this point, "Perhaps fighting defensively would be an option, allowing them to make the first strike, so that we can at least have some idea of their position before we retaliate..." She looks to Marius, "Does this seem like a workable tactic?"
"We'd lose any element of surprise," Waifrin points out. "These tieflings are not few or stupid - if we take the defensive, they will pick their time and place and attack with overwhelming force. We might be able to lure them into a trap, once, but that's a risky tactic."
"How about nets?" Akorian offers, "If we can lure even one of them into a trap, maybe we can capture it in a net. That way, any darkness it conjures won't avail it very much. And, once we have it subdued, maybe we can interrogate it fully enough that we learn a better approach to attacking their lair?"
OK that’s it for me. .I’m away from work till Wednesday and unless my ISP is restored before then I won’t be posting. Please play me as a DMPC for combats and interactions
Your conversation seems to be dwindling. May I suggest someone draft a shopping list and buy supplies out of the common fund at Jerrick's, and that someone set the party's course for getting to the Bastards?
There are plenty of empty buildings in the Rego Dospera. If you would rather camp out in one farther away while you scout, that would be possible.
Unfortunately I will not be able to post for the next few days due to some work and family matters. Thom, you may use Raven as you see fit. I should be back in action come this weekend. Sorry guys.
Marius is happy with the decision to go over the outer wallrather than the patrolled inner ones.."Let's try and keep the Dottari from taking to overt an interest in us..hmm? Oh and don't worry about the light being dim..I have good eyes"
Marius has the trait that enables him to ignore the 20% miss chance in dim lighting conditions
Marius has the trait that enables him to ignore the 20% miss chance in dim lighting conditions
Handy! Between the sewers and this. Zarabeta has the trait that gives her Diplomacy as a class skill, which you'd never suspect from how well she gets along with people... :)
sunrods 12gp, tanglefoot 200 gp, nets 20 gp. You may adjust your purchases until we start the next combat. You'll need 4 days of food -- 12 gp.
Net Rules:
Spoiler:
Net: A net is used to entangle enemies. When you throw a net, you make a ranged touch attack against your target. A net's maximum range is 10 feet. If you hit, the target is entangled. An entangled creature takes a –2 penalty on attack rolls and a –4 penalty on Dexterity, can move at only half speed, and cannot charge or run. If you control the trailing rope by succeeding on an opposed Strength check while holding it, the entangled creature can move only within the limits that the rope allows. If the entangled creature attempts to cast a spell, it must make a concentration check with a DC of 15 + the spell's level or be unable to cast the spell.
An entangled creature can escape with a DC 20 Escape Artist check (a full-round action). The net has 5 hit points and can be burst with a DC 25 Strength check (also a full-round action). A net is useful only against creatures within one size category of you.
A net must be folded to be thrown effectively. The first time you throw your net in a fight, you make a normal ranged touch attack roll. After the net is unfolded, you take a –4 penalty on attack rolls with it. It takes 2 rounds for a proficient user to fold a net and twice that long for a nonproficient one to do so.
What do you do overnight? Do you go back to your boarding house?
Last chance to buy anything before you go into the Dospera. Or make other arrangements.
The next day you head out of the city in small groups. After meeting up out of sight of the gate you make your way along a narrow wooded lane to a gate into the realtively deserted Dospera.
It's not completely deserted. As you walk into the Dospera you catch glimpses of ragged people of various races. Humans, gnomes, halfings predominate. An elf, two dwarves, and a goblin also show up. Usually they are hidden or well distant from you and watching you in turn. Not one of them greets you or even waves.
Zarabeta remains the current location until the team is ready to move out, spells are changed appropriately and she's finally healed the last of the Torble damage!
As they walk into the Dospara, Zarabeta asks, "Should we be wearing our special hoods for this mission, to spread the 'masked revolutionary / hero of the people' notion?"
Uqabi has taken flight and is circling about 90 ft. over the party, lazily attempting to use any rising warmth from the morning sun to coast, rather than exert himself with too much flapping of the wings. He is not terribly clear on what they are looking for. Unless he sees figures acting 'suspiciously' (running around, waving weapons, etc.) he'll blithely overlook what Zarabeta might find alarming. The sight of abandoned food, or apparently unattended shiny baubles may distract him from his mission.
Marius checks his equipment..takes 2 off the tanglefoot bags and makes sure that they are easily accessible and pronounces himself ready. he is wary off anyone they meet in the Dospera but takes no overt action unless the party is threatened.He does tend to hover near the ladies..wanting to ensure their safety in this lawless place
"Let's mask ourselves when we get close," Waifrin suggests, making sure she has a sunrod or two. She moves confidently through the Dospora, as if she knows her way around.
Zarabeta takes a single tanglefoot bag and a single sunrod from the cache of gear procured for this endeavor. She clutches the five pound bag like a small bag of flour, unsure as to how to stow such a weighty item for quick access, while the sunrod she gently places into the top of her blouse, apparently unconcerned with propriety for the moment.
You make your way through the Dospera, lifting your feet to clear various debris, sidestepping to avoid patches of uprooted cobbles, once scrambling over three overturned carts which formed a rough, but broken down, barricade. In places the streets are bare; in others, choked with rubble.
Everywhere weeds and grass send tiny tendrils of life between the cobblestones. Vines shroud the facades of some buildings.
For a single block the street is swept clean and two large piles of ashes, the remains of bonfires, sit at either end.
Uqabi sees nothing to distract him, but a pair of raptors rising from an overgrown area sends him winging back to Zarabeta's shoulder for a few moments.
Do you want to go straight to one of the buildings on the map or somewhere else?
I think that was one option, the other was the Carpenters around B-1. Sorry about the mis-post above, I use tabbed browsing and sometimes a post written in one tab skips into another for unknown reasons. Only happens on Paizo's site though ...
Waifrin opens out the map before they come within sight of the area to check the details.
"Marius, were any of our family merchants? There's a 'Goddon' mentioned here on the map," she points it out curiously, it isn't a common name. "Maybe we should look into it, later."
She traces the areas.
"The tenement is closer to the temple, and is here. The carpenter's is further away, here. We're less likely to see much from there, but then it's more likely we'll go unobserved."
Marius thinks hard "I don't know Waif...I think my father mentioned once that wwe were not always nobility and that our rise came at about the time of Arodens fall..but what attention does a nine year old pay to such matters...it's been a century since anyone was recorded as living here isn't it?"
Zarabeta feeds Uqabi a grape, to distract him from the presence of the birds of prey. Hearing Waifrin and Marius speak of the possibility that their family once lived here, she is reminded that she is not the only one who has lost family to the devil-worshippers...
"Depends on whether we think we'll find the Bastards using a ruined tenement as a base of operations or a carpenter's shop," Akorian notes, having kept unusually quiet for most of the walk into the Dospera, "I'm sure most of these places have been looted long, long ago. So I doubt there's much to interest them at the carpenter's place...though, if it was built well by its original owner, it might be one of the few structures that's still reliably stable."
He scans the windows of the buildings, looking for any would-be lookouts...or, at least positions that might give a good enough view of the Dospera to make for a good location for posting a lookout. He also scans the approaches to the buildings for a sign that someone might have used one recently.
Perception check... 1d20 + 3 ⇒ (20) + 3 = 23
EDIT: Wow. That's surprisingly good for Akorian. However, I can't quite shake the feeling it would have been better to save that natural-20 for when we face some actual tieflings. ;-)
