ELDRED CROFTER |
I'm still fried from juggling two roles and three-four projects. Given that Aku is getting focused on end of Uni I may still this opportunity to take a small breather.
Heinrich Cornelius Agrippa |
Traveling all day tomorrow, I'll try and get a post up tomorrow evening.
DM Aku |
Might be my fault because I forgot to change the map but the celestial cannot be reached by a normal attack unless you are large or using a reach weapon.
With the barrier finally broken, the celestial flies just out of range of melee attacks 5ft, but still in range for larger creatures or reach weapons.
With that, Cedric attack didn't hit.
You can change it for a spell or any other action if you want.Lord Cedric Barca |
He couldn't escape. I put up for you how couterspell magic works. Unless he could still fly back with the barrier in tact. You only make a caster level check using dispel magic if you don't have the same spell prepared to give up. If you do it is just countered. Hence Sidious used dispel magic to counter dispel magic
Lord Cedric Barca |
So I couldn't find any official RAW ruling or anything. Found a handful of people saying the same thing I am if you have the same spell prepared there is no check it just happens. It gets a bit fuzzy if you are readying to dispel using dispel magic then yes that requires a role. In this case though Sidious Identified the spell in a previous round and prepared to Counterspell it just so happens the spell being cast was dispell magic witch he had so boom dispelled no check. Works pretty much like if you put dispel magic in a ring of couterspells to protect you from being debuffed.
Lord Cedric Barca |
Yeah I would say it doesn't come up very often. There are lots of threads titled dispel magic vs "insert other spell" but only two that I came across that mentioned using dispel against dispel. Weird situation indeed.
Heinrich Cornelius Agrippa |
At a conference all day today, probably nothing from me again until tomorrow.
Johan Hale |
So, does the barrier prevent flight? did the critter take a 5' step away?
Lord Cedric Barca |
I think Cedric finished it off. I couldn't flee and only had 35hp left after the previous round before Cedric just hit it two more times. It also took 18 more points from the previous round.
Johan Hale |
Why can't he flee? I know the horn/seal prevents teleportation etc but does it also prevent flying? If it can hover it could just 5' step back or up. Since it beat us all on initiative it would do so before Cedric's death blow - only creatures with reach would have hit it that round
DM Aku |
The sanctum is sealed with magic that prevents any good outsider from just entering the place.
At the first round, he used dispel and entered the place, but he failed to dispel and flee.
--
And yes, he could have 5ft stepped and gotten out of reach, in fact he kinda did that.
But since Cedric had already posted his action and based on the enemy stats I posted he already posted the results as well, I thought better not to bog things down. We would need to re-do things and then it would cause more trouble than it was really worth.
You know, I’m trying to get more smooth combats. ;P
Lord Cedric Barca |
I posted assuming he was up against a barrier as you stated. I assumed since his dispel attempt was thwarted he couldn't move back that is why I posted what I did.
Heinrich Cornelius Agrippa |
Hey guys, beginning tomorrow I'll be in Mexico celebrating my 10 year anniversary. I should have access to Wifi and a laptop for posting daily, but if I slip up you know why.
ELDRED CROFTER |
Okay all. I've been in a depressive slump for about 10 days now coming out of a gruelling work cycle. Just bear with me for the rest of this week and I should be good. Bot as needed please
DM Aku |
Hello guys.
I have one more test later today (they changed the date from saturday to today), and possible a special exam on Tuesday (Since I’m sure I won’t be able to score the all points I need to pass on the subject.), then I’m done and back to my normal schedule.
I apologize again for the delay and thank you for your patience.
Heinrich Cornelius Agrippa |
I'll be travelling home all day tomorrow and so might or might not be able to make a post (depending on the airport wifi in Cancun). Everything should be back to normal Friday.
DM Aku |
You know, I've been trying to not be an annoying nagging grumpy kind of DM, but let me be such on one particular point.
Please, avoid create a new gameplay post for only posting an OOC commentary.
If you don't want to post any in game action, post the OOC in discussion.
Thanks.
ELDRED CROFTER |
I needed some time away - I was dealing with issues of my own so its all good.
ELDRED CROFTER |
We're really playing with the big boys now... look at what Johan was able to do.
This is where my game mastery falls flat. Once I get beyond 7th-8th level I get fuzzy on the true potential of what can and should be accomplished.
Johan Hale |
I'm not sure how much Johan actually accomplished...more push pieces around the board really.
But I hear you! In all my years playing this game I think I've played/GMed games past 8th like, three times.
Heinrich Cornelius Agrippa |
In 3.5 I played a bard to level 18 in a homebrew campaign. It was my most favorite character ever. With the same awesome GM in another homebrew I played a monk to level 15...the monk died fighting giants and I moved away soon after.
In pathfinder the highest I've played is around level 12??? GM wise I have some characters in an Iron Gods game at level 8.
DM Aku |
@Eldred.
Yes, you are up as well.
@Cedric.
I like to change things a bit on the monsters a but out there, you see, for these hound of tindalos, you still get half damage even if you save, with the caveat that even failing, it can't be used more than once per day on a particular target.
Nevertheless, thanks for the input.
Lord Cedric Barca |
ah I see. You are free to change things as you see fit as a GM but you need to be award of the abilities you are messing with and how powerful they are. It is a gaze attack and follows universal monster rules of Gaze.
So there are 6 hounds that all blinked in. Our Hell Hounds are just flat out destroyed on Round 1. They don't know to avert their eyes. So on round 1 they would of had to save on all of them as all the hounds were in 30' of the Hell hounds. Now if they make a few of the Saves they may survive, but not if you change the monster in that way. It is fine to beef them up but you shouldn't change mechanics that like gaze that are incredibly strong.
For example Johan is within 30' of 5 of them now. He has not averted his eyes as we didn't know to based on or Knowledge roles. So he is effected by all there gazes. By the way your are changing things.
Ripping Gaze: 6d6 ⇒ (4, 6, 1, 1, 3, 5) = 20
Ripping Gaze: 6d6 ⇒ (2, 3, 5, 2, 6, 1) = 19
Ripping Gaze: 6d6 ⇒ (4, 6, 2, 6, 5, 6) = 29
Ripping Gaze: 6d6 ⇒ (4, 1, 4, 3, 2, 6) = 20
Ripping Gaze: 6d6 ⇒ (5, 5, 1, 1, 5, 5) = 22
Now lets roll some saves:
Saves: 1d20 + 11 ⇒ (7) + 11 = 18
Saves: 1d20 + 11 ⇒ (19) + 11 = 30
Saves: 1d20 + 11 ⇒ (14) + 11 = 25
Saves: 1d20 + 11 ⇒ (19) + 11 = 30
Saves: 1d20 + 11 ⇒ (9) + 11 = 20
So here we were lucky and made 5 of the saves but he still takes 20+9+14+10+11= 64 damage and can still be effected by one of them next round or if it gazes at him on it's turn.
This is one of those things when you PM'd us back asking us what you can do or have done that is good and bad. Changing this as you see fit is bad. Gaze is way to powerful of an ability for saves not to negate.
Aku Warashi |
So,just to entertain the conversation:
You are considering that Ripping Gaze is an automatic Area attack, when nothing in the attack description says that.
Ripping Gaze (Su)
5d6 slashing damage, 30 feet, Fortitude DC 18 negates. A creature that succeeds on its save is immune to that hound’s gaze for 24 hours. Damage caused by a ripping gaze can be defeated by damage reduction, but it bypasses DR/magic and slashing. The save DC is Charisma-based.
Unless explicit worded, assuming it’s an area attack is a ruling you did as DM, I choose to use as single attack.
Raising the damage, DC, and others things: Well, you guys are pretty beefy, and holed in a place with several minions/monsters to help. Do you want me to put easy targets, so by the end of the day you can complain it’s too easy? And that there’s no challenge into the game?
--
Anyways,
I change things, I’m still going to change things.
I don’t see an occasion where I overdid and tpked, or let the party to failure.
--
And since we came to this, I'll ask once more. bigger, and easier to read.
STOP METAGAMING!
You know, going into the website and looking the monster atributes to decide how you'll play is metagame.
Lord Cedric Barca |
I don't use meta game knowledge on how I play. I knew they had a gaze and it didn't stop Cedric from going in and fighting. I would challenge you to find a post where I used metagame knowledge. I have played book 2 up to summoning Vetra-Kali You know this I told you all this. I know what these hounds are. Seen them lots. You can search the forums. They attack is a Gaze attack hence covered under universal monster rules of Gaze so yep that is how it works if you don't close your eyes which make you immune but blind, or avert your gaze which gives you a 50/50 not to be effected then yeah if your are within the 30' you get hit by it. The monster can also choose to Gaze at you as a standard action.
I know how gaze attacks work and they all are all or nothing saves. I was pointing it because you failed to say so. If you are going to change stuff on the fly you should be aware of what your changing.
Heinrich Cornelius Agrippa |
The GM can do what he wants, he's the GM.
DM Aku |
@Cedric.
I agree with you to a certain point.
If I'm to change something that will affect how you play the game, and how your character will work, for example:
I'll change how attack works, I'll change how Skill points works, ect
Then, I really must at least, tell you guys what I’m changing before changing. If it's too big of a change, I might even put it up to a vote.
However, I haven't been doing this. I don't change rules on the fly to favor enemies or players.
I do change enemy’s abilities, and I use my own judgment how they will work.
Therefore, if I want ripping gaze to work that way, as a player, you should just roll with it. It's different from what you remember? It doesn't really matter, because the only thing you accomplish with that constant and insistent "follow what is written because it's written so" is to make the game less enjoyable for me and to the other players.
If I do use something work such as: The enemy moved and should have caused an AoO and I didn't give any reason why that AoO isn't caused, then you should alert me to the situation and we'll fix things asap.
Errors happens interpretation of rules are a hot topic on Paizo forums. If you see a clear mistake on my part, please tell me. If I change something (especially a monster ability), I don’t need to tell you what I've changed. Just roll with that’s happening in the game.
Lord Cedric Barca |
Changing abilities to how you see fit is a slippery slope. This one for instance is a Gaze attack. The rules for Gaze attacks are as they are because of how strong they are. You changing it in this way is way outside the scope of the game. Changes like this make in no fun for anyone as it feels the GM is trying to WIN. Instead of running and enjoyable game for the players.
I don't want to know what the monsters do. It is fun when they bad guys are new. That is kind of what makes Way of the Wicked good because you fight a lot of NPC's with levels of a class instead of just monsters.
Johan Hale |
Question: Does DR prevent bleed damage?
Follow-up question: The description for DR says it is bypassed by SU abilities, and the description for Infernal wounds describes as a SU ability, so even if DR normally blocks bleed damage, would it be bypassed in the case of the bearded devil?
Note: I haven't been tracking minions HP - I assume you would tell us if that last attack from hound #1 dropped Hexor?
Question: Johan's attacks are penetrating the hounds DR right? The lash is both a magic spell and a +2 weapon so I assume it cuts through DR/magic, but I thought I sure ask and make sure.
Heinrich Cornelius Agrippa |
The GM can do what he wants, he's the GM.
DM Aku |
Question: Does DR prevent bleed damage
If you do enough damage to bypass the DR, the bleed damage takes effect and it is not prevented by DR.
Follow-up question: The description for DR says it is bypassed by SU abilities, and the description for Infernal wounds describes as a SU ability, so even if DR normally blocks bleed damage, would it be bypassed in the case of the bearded devil?
See answer above.
Note: I haven't been tracking minions HP - I assume you would tell us if that last attack from hound #1 dropped Hexor?
I haven't been tracking it either.
Question: Johan's attacks are penetrating the hounds DR right? The lash is both a magic spell and a +2 weapon so I assume it cuts through DR/magic, but I thought I sure ask and make sure.
Yep, it's magic, so it bypass DR/Magic
DM Aku |
Guys, a head’s up.
I’ve been having some issues in the place I live for some time now.
My stuff keep ‘disappearing’ without apparent reason and the landlord isn’t really trying to help me with this.
I might be moving in the next couple of days, therefore no internet access at home for some days.
I’ll try to keep you guys updated and post a notice if/when I move out.